13369 réponses à ce sujet

[Saiphas85]

Ignotis wrote...

TheOptimist wrote...

Takamori The Templar wrote...

But w/e let the company sink, just like TORtanic.
The old fans tried to advice , but they won't listen anyway.

Yeah, the TORtanic, look at how badly that flopped.

http://www.pcworld.c...es_records.html

Oh, right.  But I'm sure if they'd listened to YOUR infinite wisdom, they'd have shattered those records even MORE.

And they are constantly losing subscribers, most servers are a ghost town and the oceanic community is giving up what little hope it have.

Clearly doing well though.

I dont know what your talking about, I tend to see very active servers on most of the time, and infact the oceanic community is doing fine as far as I can tell.

[fropas]

NBegovich wrote...

 This is ridiculous, and what makes it worse is that BioWare hid the DLC from us. What a huge slap in the face that was going to be on day one! "We know you just bought this game for sixty dollars (or preordered it months ago) but guess what? We have even more game to sell you right now! For just one sixth of the game's cost!" Man, screw this. I'm not buying Mass Effect 3 until "From Ashes" is made available for free to everyone who at least bought the game new.

I think you're going to be waiting for a while. . .

[Draconis6666]

Chin Fish wrote...

Oh, but Valve's hats are optional. Having a hat doesn't add any new content. It doesn't give you an advantage over other players. You can even get it without purchasing it anyway.

But that's exactly what makes it so good. You don't have to feel obligated to buy it. You're not missing out on part of the game if you don't buy it. You get the same experience as everyone else, but for free! Maybe Valve even deserves a donation for giving you such a great game like Team Fortress 2 for free. You'd even get a nifty hat if you donated them $10.

But what about the DLC that does change content, like new maps and gameplay features? Those are available to anyone who plays the (free) game at no cost. The content you actually need is free. You can even make your own maps, if you want. In fact, Valve will pay YOU for them!

The optional things that do nothing, are just bonus. You don't need to feel obligated to purchase them. Unlike, for example, day 1 DLC containing new characters and weapons for one sixth of the initial game price, maybe released by Bioware. You have to buy that. You're missing out on the game if you don't. You're not playing the whole game.

Now let's compare your money worth buying the entire Mass Effect 3 game. Let's say the game is $60, and From Ashes, assuming it will be the only DLC released, is another $10. So that's $70 total. Let's look at Team Fortress 2 then. The initial price is free, and all 4 years of extra weapons and maps are also free. That's about infinitely cheaper than Bioware's games.

Do you know how much infinity is? It's not hard to imagine. Think of the highest number you can think of. How about one googulplex? That's ten to the one hundredth power to the tenth power. Maybe a centillion googulplexes? That's not bad. I could sit here typing up a centillion googulplexes, but my hard drive would fill up before I got anywhere close to being done. So now let's put this in perspective: A centillion googulplexes are the same distance from infinity as the number 1. In reference to infinity, 1 = 1 centillion googulplexes. Infinity is THAT high.

So, would anyone really, really think someone is being ENTITLED for thinking there is a bit unfairness between a company offering you prices infinitely higher than their competitors? Anyone?

by that measure charging $5 instead of $1 is just as bad because everything is the same distance from infinity.

[RiouHotaru]

Chin Fish wrote...

Oh, but Valve's hats are optional. Having a hat doesn't add any new content. It doesn't give you an advantage over other players. You can even get it without purchasing it anyway.

But that's exactly what makes it so good. You don't have to feel obligated to buy it. You're not missing out on part of the game if you don't buy it. You get the same experience as everyone else, but for free! Maybe Valve even deserves a donation for giving you such a great game like Team Fortress 2 for free. You'd even get a nifty hat if you donated them $10.

But what about the DLC that does change content, like new maps and gameplay features? Those are available to anyone who plays the (free) game at no cost. The content you actually need is free. You can even make your own maps, if you want. In fact, Valve will pay YOU for them!

The optional things that do nothing, are just bonus. You don't need to feel obligated to purchase them. Unlike, for example, day 1 DLC containing new characters and weapons for one sixth of the initial game price, maybe released by Bioware. You have to buy that. You're missing out on the game if you don't. You're not playing the whole game.

Now let's compare your money worth buying the entire Mass Effect 3 game. Let's say the game is $60, and From Ashes, assuming it will be the only DLC released, is another $10. So that's $70 total. Let's look at Team Fortress 2 then. The initial price is free, and all 4 years of extra weapons and maps are also free. That's about infinitely cheaper than Bioware's games.

Do you know how much infinity is? It's not hard to imagine. Think of the highest number you can think of. How about one googulplex? That's ten to the one hundredth power to the tenth power. Maybe a centillion googulplexes? That's not bad. I could sit here typing up a centillion googulplexes, but my hard drive would fill up before I got anywhere close to being done. So now let's put this in perspective: A centillion googulplexes are the same distance from infinity as the number 1. In reference to infinity, 1 = 1 centillion googulplexes. Infinity is THAT high.

So, would anyone really, really think someone is being ENTITLED for thinking there is a bit unfairness between a company offering you prices infinitely higher than their competitors? Anyone?

One problem with this example.  This assumes that folks are equally interested in TF2, and ME3.  If I like ME3 and not TF2, regardless of how "cheap" TF2 is, it doesn't matter because it fails to hold my interest.

I'll also point out the fact that TF2 has the cash-shop crate-n-key system going on, which DOES offer more than just hats.  And folks often sell hats for REAL CASH.

[mauro2222]

AlphaJarmel wrote...

DJBare wrote...

AlphaJarmel wrote...

Isn't this whole argument null until we get the game and see the impact it has? My understanding in the earlier drafts was that there was a VI instead of an actual Prothean. They might go that way in the game and if you want an actual person then you get the DLC.

They ignored an entire trial, I'm pretty sure they won't have a problem doing the same with the prothean if they feel they have a valid reason.

Lol fair enough.

Indeed

[Draconis6666]

Saiphas85 wrote...

Ignotis wrote...

TheOptimist wrote...

Takamori The Templar wrote...

But w/e let the company sink, just like TORtanic.
The old fans tried to advice , but they won't listen anyway.

Yeah, the TORtanic, look at how badly that flopped.

http://www.pcworld.c...es_records.html

Oh, right.  But I'm sure if they'd listened to YOUR infinite wisdom, they'd have shattered those records even MORE.

And they are constantly losing subscribers, most servers are a ghost town and the oceanic community is giving up what little hope it have.

Clearly doing well though.

I dont know what your talking about, I tend to see very active servers on most of the time, and infact the oceanic community is doing fine as far as I can tell.

You must play a different game because all I hear daily is my wife ****ing that she cant do quests because there are too many people running around in the area she is trying to do them in.

[Valcutio]

Well, on the brightside atleast we don't have to buy an action figure to get this DLC.

Still shady.

[nitefyre410]

Draconis6666 wrote...

Farbautisonn wrote...

nitefyre410 wrote....

Oh yeah and Blizzard...

"Its done when we say its done and it will be released with we say it ready."

Remeber Starcraft 2... that took 10 years.

-But it was well worth the wait.

And when it was done they decided to charge you for it 3 times by spliting it into 3 games!

 

and you are also getting 3 seperate complete games  not  1/3 of a game, 1/3 of a game and 1/3 of a game.   To make 1 whole game.

When you complete  Starcraft 2 you can walk away from it and say that was a complete statisfying experience.

This is off topic  though...

Modifié par nitefyre410, 23 février 2012 - 03:12 .

[gabe2gg]

Daywalker315 wrote...

gabe2gg wrote...

Cirocco wrote...

Copy of the Email I just sent to contact@bioware.com

Dear Bioware.

You seem to know who I am, you've sent me enough email over the years. I am one of your long time customers, I've bought Baldurs Gate 1 and 2 and the expansions, Neverwinter Nights and the content packs for it, Dragon Age and the DLC's for it, Mass Effect one and two and the DLC's, and many other games you've developed.

As someone with a disability I am on a tight budget, if I intend to purchase new games when they first come out then I have to specifically set aside money to pay for them, they are expensive items in my budget, I had set aside the money to pay for Mass Effect 3 and I had pre-orrded the game via Amazon, in the past I have purchased Collectors Editions of games, as a writer and artist I enjoyed looking at the Art Books that came with those games and the other physical items that where included, the cosmetic content that was unlockable in the game was a bonus but not really my reason for purchasing collectors editions.

Today it came to light that you are planning to release a downloadable content pack on the day of release of Mass Effect 3, the same pack is apparently included as part of the Collectors Edition, and is seeming much more than simply the cosmetic extras that are normal practise in a Collectors Edition, and that you intend to charge extra for this already produced content that you included in the Collectors Edition.

In response to our concerns you have made this statement in your forum.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://social.biowar...index/9403705/1

"As most of you know, yesterday there was a leak that revealed the upcoming DLC “ME3:From Ashes” on the
Xbox LIVE Marketplace. This leak took place before we were prepared to make an announcement about the details of that pack (slated for this Friday).

There has been a lot of discussion about the DLC offering but we wanted to clarify a few things...

- “From Ashes” includes the Prothean squad mate, an adventure on Eden Prime, a new weapon, and an alternate
appearance for every squad mate. Note that these alternate appearances are in addition to the ones already advertised in the CE.

- The Collectors Edition has been advertised from the beginning as containing a bonus character/mission, but we were not at liberty to provide the details. The Prothean is optional content that is certainly designed to appeal to long-time fans, which is why he is part of the CE offering (the version many fans would be likely to purchase). Mass Effect 3 is a complete – and a huge game - right out of the box.

- The content in “From Ashes” was developed by a separate team (after the core game was finished) and not completed until well after the main game went into certification.

- The Collectors Edition has been sold out in most places for some time now, and is becoming very hard to find (many players prefer not to purchase the digital version). As such, we wanted to make this content available so that SE buyers could also incorporate the Prothean into their game.

We’ll be releasing someimages and video about this pack in the coming days.

As always, we are extremely thankful for all of your support. We pulled out all of the stops to make Mass Effect 3 the best game ever, and we can't wait for you all to experience it.

Mike"
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In effect you are telling us that this was late game development and developed separately, in order to justify charging money for it on the day of release. This is contradicted by the fact that this was known about almost a year ago. This can be demonstrated by this post from that time .. http://social.biowar...3/index/7551111
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"In the N7 Collector's Edition "Features" caption there's this:

Get the ultimate Mass Effect 3 experience with the N7 Collector's Edition! This exclusive and limited package includes:

• Exclusive N7 fabric patch
• Art book, 70 pages
• Dark Horse ME Series 3 issue 1, with alternate cover art

A full collection of in-game content that can’t be found anywhere else!

• N7 arsenal pack – N7 Sniper Rifle, Shotgun, Pistol and SMG
• Squad-mate alternate appearance pack
• Normandy mechdog companion
• Shepard casual appearance– N7 hoodie
• Exclusive extended soundtrack
• Exclusive 4x6 lithograph
• Day 1 DLC – the Prothean (Adventure/Character)
• XBL Normandy Avatar
• Exclusive forum, social avatars, badges and perks

So.....
Reactions? Thoughts?"
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

and the reply from you ..

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Sorry, that was a mistake from old text. It is being removed. Hate to be a killjoy.

Oh wait... no I don't. smilie
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So , this was obviously not late game content that was developed separately when you had some time to spare after the Game had gone gold, this was something you had planned to be released on day one and charge extra for, with lore and storyline relevant content that your most loyal customers, who had played the previous two games, would most want, and planned for some considerable time in what seems to be a very cynical corporate decision to get extra money from your most loyal customers for something that should and could have been included in the game itself or offered as a code to those who bought the new version of the game instead of buying second hand.


I dislike companies that cynically try and milk extra cash from the cows (Before you joined up with EA I think we used to be referred to as the community, now we seem to be cows with $ signs painted on the sides), for things that could easily have been included as part of the, already very expensive, game, and I *reallly* dislike companies that blatantly lie to their customers or trick their own employees into making false statements by withholding information from them.

On reflection, despite my desire to see the conclusion of this saga, I have regrettably cancelled my order and will almost certainly no longer buy any future products from your company, entangled as you have become with the cynical Corporate practices of Electronic Arts, something you and they explicitly promised would not happen, when the merger happened we as a community where told that EA would treat Bioware differently, this has obviously not been the case.

If you are wondering if there is anything that can be done to retain my business, I would consider purchasing the game if you release the DLC freely, as something that should have been in the game already, this is the only way you can regain my custom and go slightly towards regaining my trust in you as a company separate from EA.

Yours Regretfully.

A customer since the beginning of your Company.

atleast someone sees the light.

OP, just because they said a year ago that you'd get a Prothean squad mate with a collector's edition doesn't mean that the actual CONTENT was done then. Character model, all dialogue, Eden Prime mission design and dialogue, and so on. I fully believe that the main game on the discs was completed and sent for certification before the final touches were made to the DLC content. Sure, it's probably been worked on for a while but it's likely it's one of the last things that got fully completed and polished since it wasn't needed until much nearer to launch, rather than 6 weeks or so before launch for certification.

So, in short, KNOWING about DLC and actually having it completed are two entirely different things, so your argument isn't as strong as you seem to think it is. If it were me, I'd certainly wait to finish up the DLC until after the main game and not waste resources and time on something that doesn't have to be done for a month or so after the deadline for the rest of the game. Then again, that makes way too much sense, so I'm sure most people here won't agree.

even so, this DLC that releases the same day of the game should be free. I would understand if it was a month after but why cant this be included for free like the DLC for ME2? What is Bioware doing?

[Shatterhand1701]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

Shatterhand1701 wrote...

Daywalker315 wrote...

Time Victim wrote...

Eden Prime and more alternate costumes? I'm getting giddy over here.

Yeah, me too. Lost in the shuffle of all this bickering about nonsense is the fact that we get to go back to Eden Prime with Prothy, more alternate costumes, and a new gun. I'm already thinking up all the possibilities.

THIS.

I'd much rather expel emotional energy being excited about this new content than expressing butthurt over having the choice whether ot not to buy $10 worth of optional content.

Optional content that is important to the lore and story of the game. Sorry but that's not acceptable. EA/Bioware have gone too far on this one.

So, you've seen the content, then?  You've played it and know the impact it has on the final game?  Or are you just using an opinion to back up an absolute?

Don't get me wrong; the Protheans are definitely important to the overall lore within the Mass Effect "universe", but as to whether the mission(s) played and the dialogue spoken in the DLC are actually vital to the outcome of ME3's story, you have no basis in fact one way or another.

[Farbautisonn]

Sargerus wrote...

Duke Nukem Forever took 14 years of development. Just sayin' 

.- And Im pretty sure that for the Duke fanbois, that was worth the wait too 

[ArkkAngel007]

_symphony wrote...

nevar00 wrote...

I gave this some more thought, and honestly I'm just still really disappointed with these guys.  I figured I'd vent in one last post (before going back to my ME 2 playthrough, ironically enough).

Those who are saying a Prothean is not important aren't fooling anyone, and I find it hard to beleive they are even fooling themselves.  The fact that there is a living Prothean: that alone is massive enough to warrant being in the game.  Protheans have been a massive part of the lore and backstory of the Mass Effect universe and of each of the games; for them to write this off as minor enough to be a small DLC is rediculous.  

Now of course you could play through the game with the Prothean.  Just like you could have Mass Effect 1 without Wrex, Star Wars without Darth Vader, Batman without Joker, Watchmen without Rorschach, and King Henry IV without Falstaff.  You could remove a lot of fluff from a lot of games, movies, and books.  That doesn't mean you should.  Having a Prothean as DLC just hugely undermines the significance of the species built up in the past two games. 

Now I really find it hard to believe that they thought of throwing in a Prothean at the last minute and decided to use it as DLC as opposed to altering the finished product, but regardless that shouldn't matter.  Pack it with the new copies of the game.  I mean really, did they write the story and then think to themselves "oh I know, let's have a Prothean as a downloadable character!"  Did they really think a living Prothean could be written in such a way that it could be taken to be as insignificant enough to warrant its position as a DLC character?  Please.  Nobody complained about Kasumi, nobody complained about Zaeed.  They weren't that special.  They weren't that important.  They were fun to have but you were not missing a large chunk of the story and lore without them.  Yes, I realize that you can complete the story without the Prothean: this does not make him insignificant.  The fact that he's a living member of a thought-to-be extinct race in significant enough.  And if he isn't significant enough to warrant a position on the main game, then I really have to question the competency of Bioware's ME 3 writing staff.

That said I doubt I'll cancel my CE preorder.  Partially because I still want to see the series to the end... and partially because I paid for it over BestBuy online with a pre-paid credit card and I'm not even sure if I could get my money back now without a huge hassle.  But if this is what it has come to, I'll be sure that ME 3 will be the last Bioware product I buy.

exactly this.

Yep, that's a really good argument.  Thanks for taking your time to write that up.

[OdanUrr]

Is it too much to ask for the perfect game and the perfect launch?

[Ignotis]

Amuses me that they attack the hat shop.

Here's why hats are justifiable

Valve released a polished game, very fun in fact, for considerably less than the industry standard. 20$ less. This is a multiplayer game as well, so far more playability than that of a singleplayer game. Bioware is selling a singleplayer game that is arguably worse than its predecessors for 59.99, and on the exact same day of launch charging you 10$ for a patch.

-Valve makes it cheaper, has weekends where its nearly free, has free weekends, makes it free

-Here's the main thing. Valve PATCHES their game, constantly. This is a foreign concept in the activision and EA world. You don't receive patches in bioware games even though you should for throwing down a large sum of money for a few hours of gameplay. You get DLC. In TF2 you get whole new game modes, maps, content, taunts, art, weapons, and they believe this is a expectation on their behalf to the consumer. So to compare microtransaction hats on a already very charitable game that is well supported to day one CONTENT dlc for a singleplayer game with a already inflated price doesn't work.

[Dexter111]

El Ejcovero wrote...

Look, some of us don't want armor and weapons to make the game easier. But taking content out of the main game to sell as DLC or a bonus for CE is ripping off the CE buyers and those buying the DLC, because:

This is wrong.

You're right that is wrong, you forgot something...

[nitefyre410]

Farbautisonn wrote...

Sargerus wrote...

Duke Nukem Forever took 14 years of development. Just sayin' 

.- And Im pretty sure that for the Duke fanbois, that was worth the wait too 

 

off topic but   Gearbox said that next Duke  they are going make up for the mess that  4ever was...

Speaking of Gearbox... OMG  Borderlands 2...  Gunzerker...DO WANT .

[TheOptimist]

Draconis6666 wrote...

Saiphas85 wrote...

Ignotis wrote...

TheOptimist wrote...

Takamori The Templar wrote...

But w/e let the company sink, just like TORtanic.
The old fans tried to advice , but they won't listen anyway.

Yeah, the TORtanic, look at how badly that flopped.

http://www.pcworld.c...es_records.html

Oh, right.  But I'm sure if they'd listened to YOUR infinite wisdom, they'd have shattered those records even MORE.

And they are constantly losing subscribers, most servers are a ghost town and the oceanic community is giving up what little hope it have.

Clearly doing well though.

I dont know what your talking about, I tend to see very active servers on most of the time, and infact the oceanic community is doing fine as far as I can tell.

You must play a different game because all I hear daily is my wife ****ing that she cant do quests because there are too many people running around in the area she is trying to do them in.

Indeed, I was on yesterday and it didn't look like any ghost town I've ever heard of.

[hetfool]

I'm just dissapointed to learn that a Prothean Squadmate is inconsequential to the primary story ... What a joke! The Protheans ARE the story!

[Ignotis]

Draconis6666 wrote...

Saiphas85 wrote...

Ignotis wrote...

TheOptimist wrote...

Takamori The Templar wrote...

But w/e let the company sink, just like TORtanic.
The old fans tried to advice , but they won't listen anyway.

Yeah, the TORtanic, look at how badly that flopped.

http://www.pcworld.c...es_records.html

Oh, right.  But I'm sure if they'd listened to YOUR infinite wisdom, they'd have shattered those records even MORE.

And they are constantly losing subscribers, most servers are a ghost town and the oceanic community is giving up what little hope it have.

Clearly doing well though.

I dont know what your talking about, I tend to see very active servers on most of the time, and infact the oceanic community is doing fine as far as I can tell.

You must play a different game because all I hear daily is my wife ****ing that she cant do quests because there are too many people running around in the area she is trying to do them in.

She is a very rare exception in one of the few servers that isn't dead. The forums testify to this, im sure at any given time of the day there is "I waited 2-6 hours for a group and/or it didn't happen" thread. And outside of the 1-15 leveling area every region following is a ghost town.

[Calians]

Dexter111 wrote...

El Ejcovero wrote...

Look, some of us don't want armor and weapons to make the game easier. But taking content out of the main game to sell as DLC or a bonus for CE is ripping off the CE buyers and those buying the DLC, because:

This is wrong.

You're right that is wrong, you forgot something...

lmao, you beat me to the picture

[TwistedComplex]

Oh boy another masterpiece from DLCwEAre

[HighFlyingDwarf]

Yuoaman wrote...

HighFlyingDwarf wrote...

TheOptimist wrote...

Takamori The Templar wrote...

But w/e let the company sink, just like TORtanic.
The old fans tried to advice , but they won't listen anyway.

Yeah, the TORtanic, look at how badly that flopped.

http://www.pcworld.c...es_records.html

Oh, right.  But I'm sure if they'd listened to YOUR infinite wisdom, they'd have shattered those records even MORE.

TORtanic sunk after that article was posted, that's before they went to the 1.1 patch

I'm going to need more than your word... like statistics and actual data.

My word on what? That subscriber numbers are going down?

Clearly I can't prove that since I don't have the data at hand, but watch this whilst I go and take a look for it.

 

[RiouHotaru]

Dexter111 wrote...

El Ejcovero wrote...

Look, some of us don't want armor and weapons to make the game easier. But taking content out of the main game to sell as DLC or a bonus for CE is ripping off the CE buyers and those buying the DLC, because:

This is wrong.

You're right that is wrong, you forgot something...

You keep posting these images...and yet you KEEP being wrong...

[Sargerus]

hetfool wrote...

I'm just dissapointed to learn that a Prothean Squadmate is inconsequential to the primary story ... What a joke! The Protheans ARE the story!

ORLY? And here i thought the story was about Commander Shepard fighting evil alien machines from outer space

[Shatterhand1701]

Calians wrote...

Dexter111 wrote...

El Ejcovero wrote...

Look, some of us don't want armor and weapons to make the game easier. But taking content out of the main game to sell as DLC or a bonus for CE is ripping off the CE buyers and those buying the DLC, because:

This is wrong.

You're right that is wrong, you forgot something...

lmao, you beat me to the picture

While I think it's a rather extreme interpretation of the concept, I have to admit this made me laugh my ass off.  Well played.