13369 réponses à ce sujet

[SomeKindaEnigma]

"Different appearances for every character, in addition to the CE ones"

Ok sooooooo just so I understand this, I'm a CE preorder "owner" (already paid it in full) and while I get the Prothean with the CE, I do not get these alternate appearances unless I buy From Ashes seperately as well? Or?

[Bluko]

Calians wrote...

I wonder how many times this game will be pirated..

Probably a lot. Especially by those in their teens who likely don't have credit cards or much more then $60 in their wallets to buy the game to begin with. (Let's not pretend teens don't buy this game, cause they sure do.) And this is why these things are actually bad for business as some people will use this an excuse to obtain the game for free. Granted I do not agree with people do such, but honestly I finding it more difficult to say they shouldn't these days. The more you tighten your grip around  a handful of sand the more grains slip between your fingers.

I'll still be buying ME3 new. Just not the CE addition. (Kind of still jaded over stuff to be day 1 purchase.) Really the only CE addition I regret not having at this point is ME1. Maybe I'll regret not having the CE for ME3, but the more I see of ME3 the less I feel I made a poor choice. I've honestly been hoping to be proved wrong. Though if I do hear less then favorable things I may even wait for a price drop.

Oh well I suppose I can expect a plethora of people calling me a cheapskate (true, but better then ever being a brokeskate if you ask me) or worse... not a true fan. Obviously only true fans would buy related fiction material with no regard or concern to quality. Personally I think any would be true fans, if anyone can be called such a ridiculous thing, would actually worry about quality. But that's just me.

[AdmiralCheez]

GuyIncognito21 wrote...

That's the distinction the defenders of this policy don't seem to make.  You're treating this like a ticket that gives you free concessions at the movie theater, and to many of us it's a ticket that entitles you to see the last 10 minuts of the movie that you only get to see if you pay extra.

More like the really cool B-side of an album or a diector's cut of a movie, to be honest.

[neubourn]

SomeKindaEnigma wrote...

"Different appearances for every character, in addition to the CE ones"

Ok sooooooo just so I understand this, I'm a CE preorder "owner" (already paid it in full) and while I get the Prothean with the CE, I do not get these alternate appearances unless I buy From Ashes seperately as well? Or?

"IN ADDITION TO THE CE ONES"

IN ADDITION

IN ADDITION

IN ADDITION

pretty self explanatory right there, you will get them "in addition to the CE ones" 

(kind of what "addition" means...added)

[Draconis6666]

jkflipflopDAO wrote...

. . . or you can just stay here and take things down by a few millitorr. Let us know when you base out.

I don't have to go read the sites ive already done it, that doesn't change the fact that you dont understand that the gaming industry is no longer a small consumer base that hovers around forums and 3rd party news sites but is much larger and that that is now the minority even if it is the very vocal minority.

People who like things dont say anything generaly, people who dont complain endlessly and like to make people think that they are the majority and eveyrone thinks like they do because in many cases they cant bring themselves to believe that anyone could have a different opinon than theirs.

[Calians]

EB Games Australia (Gamestop) $108 Standard Edition. $128 for N7 Edition. Excuse me, wtf.

[Kraveal]

This is simply despicable and because of it I sadly wont see the finale of the Mass Effect series. I'm saddened by such greedy business tactics.

[Zu Long]

GuyIncognito21 wrote...

fropas wrote...

But they're not alienating consumers. . .you want the character? Pay for him--be the consumer you claim to be. Otherwise, you're essentially complaining about not getting a character that was only promised to CE consumers. Are you a ME3 CE consumer? No? Then how are you being alienated? 

They quite obviously are, or this thread wouldn't have grown 50 pages in the last 4 hours.

They promised exclusives to the CE, that's correct.  They didn't promise exclusives integral to the narrative the series has to tell.

That's the distinction the defenders of this policy don't seem to make.  You're treating this like a ticket that gives you free concessions at the movie theater, and to many of us it's a ticket that entitles you to see the last 10 minuts of the movie that you only get to see if you pay extra.

But its not. It's more like the directors commentary on the special edition DVD. Awesome? Possibly. Informative? Almost certainly. Necessary to enjoy the movie? Nah, not at all.

Edit: Ninja'd by AdmiralCheez.

Modifié par Zu Long, 23 février 2012 - 05:42 .

[DifferentD17]

Zu Long wrote...

The text about it being Prothean WAS removed. There was still a part about getting another squad member.

There wasn't anything about getting another squad member. It says characters that could mean Multiplayer characters it could mean characters on the normandy, it could mean anything. And since it was removed from every CE on pretty much every retailer why would anyone think it's still there?

[nitefyre410]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

I'm pretty sure the number of people boycotting because of this is lower than the number of people who preordered the N7 edition. Losing a few hundred sales is preferable to having to refund thousands of people ten dollars each. Hence, we're sh*tting ourselves if we expect them to make "From Ashes" free.

If they actually make it free for all new copies (and refunded the people who already purchased it), then I'll eat my words. My respect for Bioware/EA will increase tenfold. But let's not be stupid or get our hopes up.

 

Cheez Thank you...

Why is that concept so hard for people to understand its the lesser of two evils in this situation.

[MartinDN]

GuyIncognito21 wrote...

neubourn wrote...

But as soon as BW actually makes somethign WORTH getting a CE over, i.e. a prothy teammate and Eden Prime missions....wll....that just wont stand!!! How dare BW make GOOD content exclusive to a CE? The nerve of them!!!

Yeah, that's a complete misrepresentation of the argument.  The argument is not that the DLC is "good."  Undead Nightmare was a tremendous DLC for Red Dead Redemption.  Fallout has routinely had great DLC packages about which no one has complained.

The problem is that it's quite obvious here that this content was completed during the development cycle of the game, and that it's relevant to the core narrative of the game.

So it's DLC only in the sense that Bioware is selling it as such.

Indeed, reading the very early script you can tell the prothean was part of the original game, as was eden prime, it was NEVER mentioned to be DLC in anyway whatsoever. AKA It was in the original script.

If i was to hazard a guess id say they just took out the whole eden prime section and made it dlc. I really dont have any opinion on this matter, but to say it was made by a different team when it was in the script....

[slimgrin]

Bioware is trivializing their lore once again by offering a Prothean as DLC. The same Protheans who are and always have been a core element of the plot are now optional. Apparently they weren't important to begin with.

It's sh*t like this that baffles me when people say Bioware has good writing in their games. They just make it up as they go, willy nilly, with no forethought whatsoever. The only thing that concerns them is how they can woo new gamers.

[Shadowrun1177]

SomeKindaEnigma wrote...

"Different appearances for every character, in addition to the CE ones"

Ok sooooooo just so I understand this, I'm a CE preorder "owner" (already paid it in full) and while I get the Prothean with the CE, I do not get these alternate appearances unless I buy From Ashes seperately as well? Or?

No as a CE owner we get access to all of it as well as additional alternate outfits completely exclusive to the CE. We don't have to buy anything on day 1.

[Sargerus]

brfritos wrote...

Sargerus wrote...

Gibb_Shepard wrote...

I'm very proud of the internet. BW's greed is the biggest story on N4G at the moment. And with TB backing up a boycott, it's looking good.

-People whine on the internet over a news about 'X' game
-Game launches,sells very well
-People forget about the whining and move on with their lives
-Rinse and repeat


If you think this boycott will affect EA/Bioware, well you are VERY naive 

You know what? It will!

Like TB wisely said, who remeber BF3's Physical Warfare Pack case and because of fan pressure it was later maded available to all consumers who buyed the game?

Excuse me, but he's right, this DLC is offensive. We are talking about a Prothean, a race that is vital to the lore since game one, not some piece of armor or a weapon.
And now is cutted from the game and only available through a CE or buying alone as a DLC?
Even if he has no importance in the squad story, not huge impact in the war assets you have to build, no impact in Shepard's personal story, for god's sake, is a Prothean!

The race that supposelly build the Citadel, helped Shepard with the beacons and on Ilos and still have an impact on the story in ME3 and it's end.
And people say he don't have importance???

Is up to the consumers to draw a line and tell companies what they can or can't do.
I'm a hardcore fan of Mass Effect, I have the two games on disc, all the comics they released, but I will not buy ME3.
And yes, I was looking foward to it, but this is too much.

Is the same thing I buy a car but it comes without the doors and I need to pay them separately.
Like you know, they are not too important.

Read my post above 
I'm not gonna comment too much on the TB thing. I like his WTF is videos, but he likes to blow things like this way out of proportion to start a nerd war / **** storm. 

Modifié par Sargerus, 23 février 2012 - 05:43 .

[Yuoaman]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

I'm pretty sure the number of people boycotting because of this is lower than the number of people who preordered the N7 edition. Losing a few hundred sales is preferable to having to refund thousands of people ten dollars each. Hence, we're sh*tting ourselves if we expect them to make "From Ashes" free.

If they actually make it free for all new copies (and refunded the people who already purchased it), then I'll eat my words. My respect for Bioware/EA will increase tenfold. But let's not be stupid or get our hopes up.

I've already artificially elevated my hopes, I'm not reading the manual to find out how to undo this ****.

[AdmiralCheez]

@Bluko: Nah, it's cool. The only reason I got the N7 edition is because I know I'd wind up buying all the stuff in there separately, anyway. I'm a sucker for content.

However, I hardly buy more than two new games a year, if any.

[mrbauxjangles]

i feel everything you get in the collectors edition is worth the money you spend but i still dont agree on characters and missions being included in it and others being charged more for characters that should be in. weapons go ahead gives those out charcters and missions no

[Africancheesecube]

TheOptimist wrote...

GuyIncognito21 wrote...

TheOptimist wrote...
I rather think it's not.  Pirates find excuses to be pirates, because they're convinced that they're entitled to the fruits of others labor for free.

That's obviously and demonstrably not true, as evidenced by any number of game/movie/music makers who have found immense success by pledging to do right by their customers while asking the customers to do right by the makers.  Bands such as Radiohead and the Foo Fighters have all but begged their customers to pirate their works and people paid anyway.

Comedian Louis CK just released a standup special online, pledged that he wouldn't go after pirates, and asked people to buy it legitimately.  It became his most profitable show.

On Trent Reznor's site right now you can find links to torrent copies of his work.

There is, believe it or not, occasionally honor among thieves.  Piracy responds to the behavior of the industry.  Try to gank your customers and they will come after you.  Deal with people fairly and honestly and a lot of them are going to buy your game.

To just flatly say that the level of piracy remains the same no matter how bad you exploit your customers doesn't pass the straight face test.  It's an indefensible attempt to ignore what the market is telling you.

You see the same phenomenon in economics, called the Laffer Curve.  There comes a point as the tax rate increases that people stop paying taxes or leave, and tax revenue actually falls.

The same is true in any market.  Every person has a threshold of what they're willing to put up with in order to buy your product.  The more hoops people have to jump through and the more contempt you show them, the more likely they are to either refuse to buy your product or to pirate it.

Bioware and EA have decided they want to push that line, we'll see how it works out in the long run.

Just because many people WON'T pirate and still buy even when given the chance to pirate doesn't mean that stuff isn't still pirated.  Tons of people still pirate music that's available for a $1.30 on iTunes.  The Witcher 2, which gets held up as a great example of a game and company that supports and respects it's fanbase, has been pirated 4.5 Million times.  On the low side. 
http://www.geek.com/...times-20111130/

Now, is there an argument to be made that many of those pirating wouldn't have bought the game anyway? Sure.  But they still grabbed it for free, got some fun out of it, and laughed at the suckers who actually tried to support an anti-DRM company.  So you can defend pirates if you want.  But don't say it's only because Bioware and EA are meanies.  That's just a lie.

Games are going to get pirated on the pc and that's just a fact. We have no idea how many of those pirates went out and bought the game later on. I do know that companies who have a history of offending pc gamers get pirated more often and have less sales. Just look at Ubisoft. Now obviously bioware and ea aren't as bad as Ubisoft so the effects of their "being mean" will be lower. Although I do suspect more pc gamers are willing to pirate the game now than they were before.

[Yuoaman]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

GuyIncognito21 wrote...

That's the distinction the defenders of this policy don't seem to make.  You're treating this like a ticket that gives you free concessions at the movie theater, and to many of us it's a ticket that entitles you to see the last 10 minuts of the movie that you only get to see if you pay extra.

More like the really cool B-side of an album or a diector's cut of a movie, to be honest.

All B-Sides should include cool aliens with rad accents.

[TieRantaSaurusWrex]

Regardless if bioware/ea. Will make boatloads of money a boycott will. Still be counterproductive to their goal of making as much. Profit as possible

[GuyIncognito21]

TheOptimist wrote...
Just because many people WON'T pirate and still buy even when given the chance to pirate doesn't mean that stuff isn't still pirated.  Tons of people still pirate music that's available for a $1.30 on iTunes.  The Witcher 2, which gets held up as a great example of a game and company that supports and respects it's fanbase, has been pirated 4.5 Million times.  On the low side. 
http://www.geek.com/...times-20111130/

Now, is there an argument to be made that many of those pirating wouldn't have bought the game anyway? Sure.  But they still grabbed it for free, got some fun out of it, and laughed at the suckers who actually tried to support an anti-DRM company.  So you can defend pirates if you want.  But don't say it's only because Bioware and EA are meanies.  That's just a lie.

That's a straw man, and a misquote.  I explicitly said that people are going to pirate no matter what.  That's neither here nor there.  I was responding to your assertion that the behavior of the company has no real impact on whether people pirate things.

That's clearly not true.  Just think about it for a second.  If Bioware decided to charge $350 for a complete game instead of the $70 they're now asking, you don't think that would affect sales?  And you don't think some of the people who would be priced out at $350 (but will buy it at $70) would decide to pirate instead?  Of course they would!

So if you acknowledge that people respond to the price, then where's the disagreement?

When entertainment companies get antagonistic toward their customers, piracy goes up.  That should be beyond dispute.

Now whether this scheme is going to generate enough piracy to offset the extra money they're going to be able to leech out of people is another question.  It probably won't. 

But this isn't the last game Bioware is going to try and sell us, and reputation matters in this business.  While these unethical practices may benefit them in the short term, the damage to their reputation is going to harm them in the long run.

Modifié par GuyIncognito21, 23 février 2012 - 05:46 .

[Shatterhand1701]

Draconis6666 wrote...

jkflipflopDAO wrote...

. . . or you can just stay here and take things down by a few millitorr. Let us know when you base out.

I don't have to go read the sites ive already done it, that doesn't change the fact that you dont understand that the gaming industry is no longer a small consumer base that hovers around forums and 3rd party news sites but is much larger and that that is now the minority even if it is the very vocal minority.

People who like things dont say anything generaly, people who dont complain endlessly and like to make people think that they are the majority and eveyrone thinks like they do because in many cases they cant bring themselves to believe that anyone could have a different opinon than theirs.

I've been reading your posts tonight, and I must say that I like the cut of your jib, friend.  You've made some excellent points.  Thank you.

[neubourn]

MartinDN wrote...

GuyIncognito21 wrote...

neubourn wrote...

But as soon as BW actually makes somethign WORTH getting a CE over, i.e. a prothy teammate and Eden Prime missions....wll....that just wont stand!!! How dare BW make GOOD content exclusive to a CE? The nerve of them!!!

Yeah, that's a complete misrepresentation of the argument.  The argument is not that the DLC is "good."  Undead Nightmare was a tremendous DLC for Red Dead Redemption.  Fallout has routinely had great DLC packages about which no one has complained.

The problem is that it's quite obvious here that this content was completed during the development cycle of the game, and that it's relevant to the core narrative of the game.

So it's DLC only in the sense that Bioware is selling it as such.

Indeed, reading the very early script you can tell the prothean was part of the original game, as was eden prime, it was NEVER mentioned to be DLC in anyway whatsoever. AKA It was in the original script.

If i was to hazard a guess id say they just took out the whole eden prime section and made it dlc. I really dont have any opinion on this matter, but to say it was made by a different team when it was in the script....

This is how developers make games now....they develop them with DLC in mind. If you all seriously believe that DLC is always made months after your release, then you really have no clue about how games are made. Pretty much every developer makes their games with DLC in mind, and as such...they plan ahead...even during regular development. 

Sure, at one point, it was seen as a way to extend the life of a title, by offering content months after release, but as i said...nowadays, they pretty much all develop their game prepped for DLC. 

[Azure33]

I have been a fan of BioWare since the Baldurs Gate series, but I will no longer be purchasing their titles. With each passing title since Dragon Age their use of DLC in lieu of putting content in the original title has been growing. I have never agreed with the practice, but have been willing to put up with it until now. Having day 0 DLC that includes such an integral component of the Mass Effect narrative is a naked cash grab and a slap in the face to this long time fan. I can no longer in good conscience support a company that does business this way.

I am saddened that one of my all time favorite game developers has decided to go down this route. I will no longer be purchasing any BioWare titles and I will suggest that my friends and family do the same.

[AdmiralCheez]

Kraveal wrote...

This is simply despicable and because of it I sadly wont see the finale of the Mass Effect series. I'm saddened by such greedy business tactics.

I find Wal-Mart's business practices to be absolutely horrendous.

Guess who shops at Wal-Mart?

#ihaveneeds