13369 réponses à ce sujet

[jkflipflopDAO]

Shatterhand1701 wrote...

Draconis6666 wrote...

jkflipflopDAO wrote...

. . . or you can just stay here and take things down by a few millitorr. Let us know when you base out.

I don't have to go read the sites ive already done it, that doesn't change the fact that you dont understand that the gaming industry is no longer a small consumer base that hovers around forums and 3rd party news sites but is much larger and that that is now the minority even if it is the very vocal minority.

People who like things dont say anything generaly, people who dont complain endlessly and like to make people think that they are the majority and eveyrone thinks like they do because in many cases they cant bring themselves to believe that anyone could have a different opinon than theirs.

I've been reading your posts tonight, and I must say that I like the cut of your jib, friend.  You've made some excellent points.  Thank you.

Not a single one I've read. That says something about your jib, I'm afraid.

[RiouHotaru]

Evilelf007 wrote...

RiouHotaru wrote...

 Guys.


Guys.


Here's an idea.

Rather than the Prothean either having to be plot-critical or completely irrelevant.  How about this idea?


What if he's somewhere inbetween?  You know, a character who isn't plot critical, but whose interactions reveal interesting lore and depth, which doesn't detract from the experience should you miss out.  You know...


Like Shale?

You mean, not be plot relevent but end up being a very insightful character instead, to shed some light on things you otherwise wouldn't have known, but in no way changes how things ultimately play out?

That's exactly what I expect to be honest.

Same here! 

[fropas]

GuyIncognito21 wrote...

fropas wrote...

But they're not alienating consumers. . .you want the character? Pay for him--be the consumer you claim to be. Otherwise, you're essentially complaining about not getting a character that was only promised to CE consumers. Are you a ME3 CE consumer? No? Then how are you being alienated? 

They quite obviously are, or this thread wouldn't have grown 50 pages in the last 4 hours.

They promised exclusives to the CE, that's correct.  They didn't promise exclusives integral to the narrative the series has to tell.

That's the distinction the defenders of this policy don't seem to make.  You're treating this like a ticket that gives you free concessions at the movie theater, and to many of us it's a ticket that entitles you to see the last 10 minuts of the movie that you only get to see if you pay extra.

But my CE is a ticket that gives me access to more content than a SE is entitled to. Why else would I pay more money for it? I bought the CE because I want EVERYTHING the game has to offer, and yes this includes the extra "chapters/scenes" that the author edited out because he didn't think they were necessary to the canonical SE experience.

I'm sorry you feel alienated, but you were never paying for the "Full" content on the disc. I get more skins than you. I get more armor (Gamestop preorder). I get a robodog. I get a prothy. I get to pay 20$ more (at gamestop) for those things. I don't see why you are entitled to the same things I am when you aren't willing to pay. . .I just don't understand why I shouldn't get more. I paid for it--you didn't.

[Draconis6666]

GuyIncognito21 wrote...



Yeah, that's a complete misrepresentation of the argument.  The argument is not that the DLC is "good."  Undead Nightmare was a tremendous DLC for Red Dead Redemption.  Fallout has routinely had great DLC packages about which no one has complained.

The problem is that it's quite obvious here that this content was completed during the development cycle of the game, and that it's relevant to the core narrative of the game.

So it's DLC only in the sense that Bioware is selling it as such.

A sequel to a book or movie is additional content.  The middle chapter of the book should be in it from the beginning.  You can't just hack everything to bits and pretend it's all "bonus" content, not without showing an immense amount of contempt for your consumers anyway.

 

Except you have no proof that either of those are true which is why the entire argument fails on its end before it even begins. It's relevance to the core narrative of the game is subjective to your opinion and does not make it fact, even if you had a clue what is actualy included in the DLC in relation to the game or what it adds/subtracts. Nor do you have proof that itw as completed during the development cycle of the game beyond your theorycrafting that it must have been because there are audio files and it was in a leaked script which if anything just speaks to a general lack of understanding about the production process behind making games.

I think if alot of the people complaining about how it was "obviously" finished during the development cycle actualy took the time to learn about how games are made and the different processes they go through and how many times ideas are cut, re added, re cut, redesigned  sidelinded and picked back up even just in the pre-production phase well before anything even goes to be worked on you would have a much different view on the issue.

[Colintastic]

Digifi wrote...

Wait, let me get this straight...we've known for months that the Prothean character existed. CE buyers paid $25 more for that DLC and some trinkets. Since the DLC is $10 the trinkets must be $15 which sounds about right for what the production cost of those trinkets probably are. Either way, CE buyers paid for this DLC, and now a bunch of you are saying you shouldn't have to? If Bioware really knew how to troll they would have made Prothy a CE exclusive. Then we'd see a bunch of threads titled "I'll buy Prothy's freedom! Petition Bioware to make Prothy a DLC everyone can buy!"

/signed

[Zu Long]

DifferentD17 wrote...

Zu Long wrote...

The text about it being Prothean WAS removed. There was still a part about getting another squad member.

There wasn't anything about getting another squad member. It says characters that could mean Multiplayer characters it could mean characters on the normandy, it could mean anything. And since it was removed from every CE on pretty much every retailer why would anyone think it's still there?

Uh...it wasn't removed. That line about additional mission and characters stayed up on their Collectors edition page the entire time. I very specifically remember looking at it. Given that the CE was announced before Multiplayer was, I don't know why you would have assumed it was anything other than what it said- additional mission and characters. If you weren't certain, there were a number of places to ask, including twitter. Or the forum. Or by pming one of the Bioware reps.

[SomeKindaEnigma]

neubourn wrote...

SomeKindaEnigma wrote...

"Different appearances for every character, in addition to the CE ones"

Ok sooooooo just so I understand this, I'm a CE preorder "owner" (already paid it in full) and while I get the Prothean with the CE, I do not get these alternate appearances unless I buy From Ashes seperately as well? Or?

"IN ADDITION TO THE CE ONES"

IN ADDITION

IN ADDITION

IN ADDITION

pretty self explanatory right there, you will get them "in addition to the CE ones" 

(kind of what "addition" means...added)

Someone should go back up and re-read my post before trying to be an internet-d-bag and attempt to insult my intelligence.  Let me break this down so you and anyone else as feeble-minded as yourself can properly comprehend.  

CE comes with alternate appearances already (specifically for Ashley, Kaidan, James, and Liara).
CE comes with From Ashes.
From Ashes comes with alternate appearance for every character (EVERY is somewhat different from the four listed above, am I right?)

So I am simply making the assumption that the alternate appearances are NOT the ones already included in the CE.  Do you understand these simple english sentences or do I need to break it down even further for your ignorant self?

[AdmiralCheez]

Yeah, (minor spoiler) the Prothean is basically like Shale.

[Empiro]

RiouHotaru wrote...

Evilelf007 wrote...

RiouHotaru wrote...

 Guys.


Guys.


Here's an idea.

Rather than the Prothean either having to be plot-critical or completely irrelevant.  How about this idea?


What if he's somewhere inbetween?  You know, a character who isn't plot critical, but whose interactions reveal interesting lore and depth, which doesn't detract from the experience should you miss out.  You know...


Like Shale?

You mean, not be plot relevent but end up being a very insightful character instead, to shed some light on things you otherwise wouldn't have known, but in no way changes how things ultimately play out?

That's exactly what I expect to be honest.

Same here! 

You mean like how Shale was free to everyone who bought the game new? Oh wait...

[DifferentD17]

So is the only reason they included multiplayer was so that would be the online pass and prothy would be DLC? So we are basically going to be paying $10 for multiplayer, since alot of fans don't care about multiplayer.

[nevar00]

nitefyre410 wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

I'm pretty sure the number of people boycotting because of this is lower than the number of people who preordered the N7 edition. Losing a few hundred sales is preferable to having to refund thousands of people ten dollars each. Hence, we're sh*tting ourselves if we expect them to make "From Ashes" free.

If they actually make it free for all new copies (and refunded the people who already purchased it), then I'll eat my words. My respect for Bioware/EA will increase tenfold. But let's not be stupid or get our hopes up.

 

Cheez Thank you...

Why is that concept so hard for people to understand its the lesser of two evils in this situation.

Who said anything about refunding money?  There's easily more than $20 worth of equipment included in the CE.  And if they made this character free for all new copies of the game it'd technically still be included... it just would have been included anyway.  Unless they said it was exclusive, I forget.  I say this as someone who preordered the CE.

And honestly I really have no idea what the hell they were thinking.  Did they really think a Prothean was not important enough to be anything more than a DLC character?  Or are they just that greedy?  What they should've done (too late to do now) would have been to put the Prothean in the game like he belongs (or just out completely) and have a unimportant story and lore-wise Zaheed/Kasumi-type character as the downloadable guy instead. 

Modifié par nevar00, 23 février 2012 - 05:49 .

[fropas]

Calians wrote...

EB Games Australia (Gamestop) $108 Standard Edition. $128 for N7 Edition. Excuse me, wtf.

Holy hell! that's a lot of money. Glad I live in the states.

[Draconis6666]

jkflipflopDAO wrote...

Not a single one I've read. That says something about your jib, I'm afraid.

The fact that you ran out of logical arguments after two posts and turned to insults says something about yours as well.

[nitefyre410]

Zu Long wrote...

GuyIncognito21 wrote...

fropas wrote...

But they're not alienating consumers. . .you want the character? Pay for him--be the consumer you claim to be. Otherwise, you're essentially complaining about not getting a character that was only promised to CE consumers. Are you a ME3 CE consumer? No? Then how are you being alienated? 

They quite obviously are, or this thread wouldn't have grown 50 pages in the last 4 hours.

They promised exclusives to the CE, that's correct.  They didn't promise exclusives integral to the narrative the series has to tell.

That's the distinction the defenders of this policy don't seem to make.  You're treating this like a ticket that gives you free concessions at the movie theater, and to many of us it's a ticket that entitles you to see the last 10 minuts of the movie that you only get to see if you pay extra.

But its not. It's more like the directors commentary on the special edition DVD. Awesome? Possibly. Informative? Almost certainly. Necessary to enjoy the movie? Nah, not at all.

Edit: Ninja'd by AdmiralCheez.

 

True  a better example

You got to eat you order nice  say  Steak and Seafoad dinner .. you are hungry and have been looking forward this , food comes out... Seafood is cooked but the Steak is a frozen block of  nice red 100% USDA  approved beef. Only way it would any more fresh if they walked   the cow to  you mowing.  

Yeah  can still eat   but you paid for a Surf and Turf not just a surf you going to send the meal back right? 

[AdmiralCheez]

Colintastic wrote...

Digifi wrote...

Wait, let me get this straight...we've known for months that the Prothean character existed. CE buyers paid $25 more for that DLC and some trinkets. Since the DLC is $10 the trinkets must be $15 which sounds about right for what the production cost of those trinkets probably are. Either way, CE buyers paid for this DLC, and now a bunch of you are saying you shouldn't have to? If Bioware really knew how to troll they would have made Prothy a CE exclusive. Then we'd see a bunch of threads titled "I'll buy Prothy's freedom! Petition Bioware to make Prothy a DLC everyone can buy!"

/signed

Also this.

[Yuoaman]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Yeah, (minor spoiler) the Prothean is basically like Shale.

Not enough spoilers.

[Shatterhand1701]

jkflipflopDAO wrote...

Shatterhand1701 wrote...

Draconis6666 wrote...

jkflipflopDAO wrote...

. . . or you can just stay here and take things down by a few millitorr. Let us know when you base out.

I don't have to go read the sites ive already done it, that doesn't change the fact that you dont understand that the gaming industry is no longer a small consumer base that hovers around forums and 3rd party news sites but is much larger and that that is now the minority even if it is the very vocal minority.

People who like things dont say anything generaly, people who dont complain endlessly and like to make people think that they are the majority and eveyrone thinks like they do because in many cases they cant bring themselves to believe that anyone could have a different opinon than theirs.

I've been reading your posts tonight, and I must say that I like the cut of your jib, friend.  You've made some excellent points.  Thank you.

Not a single one I've read. That says something about your jib, I'm afraid.

Then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

[Evilelf007]

Just because he's a Prothean doesn't mean he is in any way essential to anything! How can a guy who's been completely out of touch of the entire galaxy from a race that completely failed to stop the reapers be suddenly essential now? He will have lore and history not before available, but he will not be vital to anything...

You guys just feel that because he's a Prothean, a member of the race that all of Mass Effect's tech was supposedly based off of (which it wasn't really, it's all based off of Reaper tech), he MUST be important. Get that idea out of your head right now... as he will be more for the fun of the idea more than essential to anything at all. You will be sorely disappointed if that is your expectation.

[HTTP 404]

Somewhere a turian councilor refuting "a yes the DLC conspiracy, we have dismi.....ASSUMING DIRECT CONTROL!"





meanwhile on the BSN board...."DLC we have to pay extra for? pre-order cancelled!"

[Kreidian]

GuyIncognito21 wrote...
The problem is that it's quite obvious here that this content was completed during the development cycle of the game, and that it's relevant to the core narrative of the game.

"Quite Obvious" is it?
Meaning you have no proof of this, but you are so convinced of your assumptions that it must be "quite obvious" how things work.

Granted you clearly have no understanding of how a development cycle actually works, otherwise it would be "quite obvious" that it was not, in fact, developed as part of the main game.

You also assume that this DLC willbe so relevant to the core narrative of the game that you simply can't play the game without it! Despite the fact that you have not played the DLC and could not possibly know that.

Niether of these assumptions have any basis whatsoever in fact. And yet somehow we are to believe it's true simply because you assure us that this is all "quite obvious".

/strawman

[Calians]

fropas wrote...

Calians wrote...

EB Games Australia (Gamestop) $108 Standard Edition. $128 for N7 Edition. Excuse me, wtf.

Holy hell! that's a lot of money. Glad I live in the states.

i know and somehow i overlooked it while i pre-ordered it...dayyumm

[nitefyre410]

nevar00 wrote...

nitefyre410 wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

I'm pretty sure the number of people boycotting because of this is lower than the number of people who preordered the N7 edition. Losing a few hundred sales is preferable to having to refund thousands of people ten dollars each. Hence, we're sh*tting ourselves if we expect them to make "From Ashes" free.

If they actually make it free for all new copies (and refunded the people who already purchased it), then I'll eat my words. My respect for Bioware/EA will increase tenfold. But let's not be stupid or get our hopes up.

 

*Edit*   Crap  getting tired   did rnot ead all of that...  Edit*

Who said anything about refunding money?  There's easily more than $20 worth of equipment included in the CE.  And if they made this character free for all new copies of the game it'd technically still be included... it just would have been included anyway.  I say this as someone who preordered the CE.

And honestly I really have no idea what the hell they were thinking.  Did they really think a Prothean was not important enough to be anything more than a DLC character?  Or are they just that greedy?  What they should've done (too late to do now) would have been to put the Prothean in the game like he belongs (or just out completely) and have a unimportant story and lore-wise Zaheed/Kasumi-type character as the downloadable guy instead. 

[Unit-Alpha]

This is my last preorder/day 1 purchase from both Bioware and EA. Bioware has sold out completely. I won't purchase EA games until they are under $10 from now on out.

DLC is fine. Day 1 DLC is okay. Day 1 DLC that was content cut from the game is barely acceptable.

But Day 1 DLC using content cut from the game that is an important part of the story is insane.

Modifié par Unit-Alpha, 23 février 2012 - 05:53 .

[Meesherbeans]

Digifi wrote...

Wait, let me get this straight...we've known for months that the Prothean character existed. CE buyers paid $25 more for that DLC and some trinkets. Since the DLC is $10 the trinkets must be $15 which sounds about right for what the production cost of those trinkets probably are. Either way, CE buyers paid for this DLC, and now a bunch of you are saying you shouldn't have to? If Bioware really knew how to troll they would have made Prothy a CE exclusive. Then we'd see a bunch of threads titled "I'll buy Prothy's freedom! Petition Bioware to make Prothy a DLC everyone can buy!"

Took the words right out of my mouth. I have nothing more to add other than:

/signed