262 réponses à ce sujet

[Hyrist]

D.Kain wrote...

Making awesome points here for making all biotic powers depend on barrier. 

Please don't twist my words.

I'm explaining WHY enemies have resistances to these low-risk abilities, not explaining your justifications for a complete reworking of powers in the game.

There's no need for barriers to be tied to powers. The only reason why "Barriers" exist as shields in this game is to give various damage types for a rock/paper/sissors approach. They could just as easily be consitered just a diferent frequency of shields.

Powers are controlled by resistance, damage, and cooldown. Don't break that formula.

[Chriss0978]

gunsagogo wrote...


true, but that normally only works with bronze. In silver and gold nearly all units have shields or barriers, and compared to stasis (which affects everything except atlas) its severely underpowered. completely agree with you on the nova

I admit that on Silver and Gold Singularity's effectiveness diminishes, but if you strip away their defences before using Singularity it will continue being useful, not as much, but it does. As Hyrist said, Stasis is the best power against Cerberus troops, maybe it won't be so good against other enemies, and on those enemies Singularity might shine. We are facing severe lack of information on this subject, because of that it's hard to compare powers.

[LostRequiem]

Is this topic a joke? Biotics are insanely superior to everyone else at the moment.

If Biotics get some kind of buff, please, buff everything else to an absolutely absurd degree.

[Hyrist]

Chriss0978 wrote...

Said 40% penalty can be negated if you spec Nova right as well. Then you could use just 1 Nova and keep half your shields for the same damage. Of course, it can be said that you lose the 40% bonus damage you could have, but then it would, just like the changes the OP wants, make Nova way too good.

I agree, Singularity is far from useless, and in the correct situations can do a lot more than Nova with no risks at all.

No, the calculation's dont work that way.

The deduction comes after bonuses.  So even if you boost everything, you still need to Nova twice for the full damage a single, non divided Nova would do. Though if you do it twice, without interference you gain 20% damage over the regular Nova.

You also permantly lose out on 40% force.


Right now there isn't a single adjustment that the OP has suggested that I have agreed with. And I honestly beleive that I won't ever, because I disagree with his flat reasonings. He's looking at this from a lore perspective not a gameplay one. And his suggestions would require an entire balance rework of all powers. No only is that unreaistic for a game gone gold, but rather disrespectful of the existing balance established, which we as players have yet to see the full picture of.

gunsagogo wrote...


true, but that normally only works with bronze. In silver and gold nearly all units have shields or barriers, and compared to stasis (which affects everything except atlas) its severely underpowered. completely agree with you on the nova

 

Gold, maybe, Silver no. And the problem is again, how people are using the ability.

Use singularity on a resistant target to stagger it and accompanying allies. Singularity MAINTAINS itself as you open fire on them, removing their resistance and causing them, on the next movement, to be swept into the existing singularity, which you can then detonate to damage surrounding enemies. Repeat this process for powerful crowd control and damage contirbution.

Is stasis faster? Only if you can kill the enemy with the explosion or if you don't break them out of Stasis with the damage you are dealing. Lift abilities have no damage threshold, singularity included.

Modifié par Hyrist, 24 février 2012 - 12:42 .

[Chriss0978]

Hyrist wrote...

Chriss0978 wrote...

Said 40% penalty can be negated if you spec Nova right as well. Then you could use just 1 Nova and keep half your shields for the same damage. Of course, it can be said that you lose the 40% bonus damage you could have, but then it would, just like the changes the OP wants, make Nova way too good.

I agree, Singularity is far from useless, and in the correct situations can do a lot more than Nova with no risks at all.

No, the calculation's dont work that way.

The deduction comes after bonuses.  So even if you boost everything, you still need to Nova twice for the full damage a single, non divided Nova would do. Though if you do it twice, without interference you gain 20% damage over the regular Nova.

You also permantly lose out on 40% force.


Right now there isn't a single adjustment that the OP has suggested that I have agreed with. And I honestly beleive that I won't ever, because I disagree with his flat reasonings. He's looking at this from a lore perspective not a gameplay one. And his suggestions would require an entire balance rework of all powers. No only is that unreaistic for a game gone gold, but rather disrespectful of the existing balance established, which we as players have yet to see the full picture of.

Ahhh, that's good to know. Thank you for the information.


I agree. Lore can be kept as long as it doesn't detract from gameplay, especially when it's MP we're talking about, where balance actually matters, even if it's Co-op. Besides, the lack of information regarding other enemies and if the powers changed from the demo to the full version makes it hard to discuss such things. I'm looking forward to when we can judge powers and weapons properly.

[The Spamming Troll]

D.Kain wrote...

Stasis is awesome indeed, other biotic powers should get a buff imo. 

1) Make enemies stop dodging biotics. That is completely lore braking. Dodging a biotic throw ( or any other biotic power for that matter, would be like dodgin rain or wind. The projectile is just braking the fourth wall so that we can aim with biotics better, it's not really there. Or just make biotics fast as bullets, which will make sure they are not dodged.

2) Biotic attacks should affect guardian with his shield. Carrying a shield doesn't protect one from shifting gravity, both the guardian and the shield can be thrown by powers like throw/shockwave, also if warp can affect a whole freaking atlas, I don't see why it can't warp a guardian with his shield. Singularity doesn't freaking hit the guardian, I don't get why they back away as if they gor a bullet, singularity should pull the shield off the guardian and make it float, like pull. Also area pull should lift both guardian and the shield at once. Charge should also send guardian to the ground with his shield, and nova should go right through it. 

3) Ideally I would make shielded targets be affected by all biotics as well, as stasis does, and just make every biotic power drain a portion of barrier, like nova does. And make a toggle for biotic barrier, so that enemies drain health without draining the barrier, when I need to use biotics under fire.

Thoughts? 

1. ME1 did it right with instacast abilities. they are direct and imediate impact abilities thast NEVER fail. ME2 features abilities that douche into walls and miss enemies. ive never understood the need for projectile abilities. it makes sense for throw and pull because those are somewhat based on angles and what not. but no other ability needs to rely on angles. ill admit it does look a little cooler throwing out biobubbles, but i much prefer stasis over any other biotic ability. solely becasue its instacast. i think singularity needs to be instacast for the adept, no doubt. everyone got a instacast ability, except adept.

2. totally agree. are sheilds made of magic? really, are they? its a little peice of metal, THAT BLOCKS SINGULARITY!!! hello bioware!!?!??? it makes zero sense!

3. good idea. biotic focus should have depleted your barrier, something like that. but hey, if bioware wasnt as aqesome as thinking up ideas, we wouldnt have abilities like "biotic grenade" right buddy?

[D.Kain]

LostRequiem wrote...

Is this topic a joke? Biotics are insanely superior to everyone else at the moment.

If Biotics get some kind of buff, please, buff everything else to an absolutely absurd degree.

Correction - Stasis is insanely superior to everyone else at the moment. 

All other biotics need a buff, because they are inferior to tech and combat skills.

[Tangster]

D.Kain wrote...

LostRequiem wrote...

Is this topic a joke? Biotics are insanely superior to everyone else at the moment.

If Biotics get some kind of buff, please, buff everything else to an absolutely absurd degree.

Correction - Stasis is insanely superior to everyone else at the moment. 

All other biotics need a buff, because they are inferior to tech and combat skills.

Or stasis needs a nerf.
Wait and see what it's like in the final game, maybe the reaper forces will be less affected by Stasis, etc.

[Barfwak]

Remember the Blood Pack in ME2? On insane basically every enemy had armor. I don't think stasis would help very much against an army like that. Cerberus tends to favor lots of grunts or enemies with shields instead of armor, and the enemies that are armored are mechanical enemies like the atlas and turret. Once we see enemies that are all armored (or, god forbid, entirely mechanical/armored) stasis is going to take a back seat to other builds and team compositions.

Which is really, really good, especially considering that we're going to have another alien race for every class as well as a respec option to change up our tactics or experiment with different ideas in retail. If we could get away with using nothing but asari adepts and vanguards the game would get stale in less than a week.

[D.Kain]

I know it is not the force, but it works a lot similar to it:



That's how I want to see biotic gameplay. That doesn't have to mean that player can't catch a bullet and go down in a sec.

[Wulfram]

Even if an enemy has as much armoured units as Cerberus has shielded units, Stasis will still be a bunch better than Singularity. Since it's undodgable.

And Warp/Throw bombs are pretty nifty, so I don't fear too much for Asari Adepts.

[D.Kain]

Tangster wrote...
Or stasis needs a nerf.
Wait and see what it's like in the final game, maybe the reaper forces will be less affected by Stasis, etc.

I wouldn't nurf cool skills, I would instead make everyone feel cool.

It is ok to kill most enemies with weapons if that is your primary focus. But when a biotic kills most enemies with weapons, something is wrong.

Modifié par D.Kain, 24 février 2012 - 01:40 .

[Tangster]

D.Kain wrote...

I know it is not the force, but it works a lot similar to it:



That's how I want to see biotic gameplay. That doesn't have to mean that player can't catch a bullet and go down in a sec.

That would make biotics too powerful. Way too powerful. Also Force Unleashed was awful.

[D.Kain]

Tangster wrote...

D.Kain wrote...

I know it is not the force, but it works a lot similar to it:



That's how I want to see biotic gameplay. That doesn't have to mean that player can't catch a bullet and go down in a sec.

That would make biotics too powerful. Way too powerful. Also Force Unleashed was awful.

Force unleashed wasn't like that video, I agree it wasn't very good. But you played force unleashed right? Now imagine that if you didn't dodge stormtrooper bullets, or wouldn't deflect them you would go down from 2 shots. Would that be very easy? 

[Tangster]

D.Kain wrote...

Tangster wrote...

D.Kain wrote...

I know it is not the force, but it works a lot similar to it:



That's how I want to see biotic gameplay. That doesn't have to mean that player can't catch a bullet and go down in a sec.

That would make biotics too powerful. Way too powerful. Also Force Unleashed was awful.

Force unleashed wasn't like that video, I agree it wasn't very good. But you played force unleashed right? Now imagine that if you didn't dodge stormtrooper bullets, or wouldn't deflect them you would go down from 2 shots. Would that be very easy? 

Force unleashed is giving me horrible nightmares, mostly related to a certain quicktime sequence...

If you're going to go with biotics like that, then the barrier mechanic would need changing, possibly based on the power of your biotic attack.
-Quick, weak biotic attack? Depletes a little of your barrier.
-Massive singularity or a powerful warp bomb? Takes all your barrier to summon up the biotic concentration to do it. 
Make it based on time, so the more powerful the attack, the longer you have to ready it.

[ZweiWing]

I've been having a lot of trouble with Throw's aiming mechanic. As in, it feels like it doesn't have one. I see it hit people and I watch nothing happen. Maybe I just don't understand what's going on with it. I hope it isn't like that in the single player. Throw has always been my trump card against hordes of Husks.

I also have issues with how Charge works. I don't like having to hold the button down for it because that takes my fingers off my movement keys and it takes a second for my hand to get back to where it needs to be without looking. It takes less time if I look down, but looking down takes my eyes off the screen and what time I save getting back to the controls I lose while getting my eyes readjusted to what's going on. In short, I just want Charge to be a quick tap, like every other power.

Modifié par ZweiWing, 24 février 2012 - 01:52 .

[D.Kain]

Tangster wrote...
If you're going to go with biotics like that, then the barrier mechanic would need changing, possibly based on the power of your biotic attack.
-Quick, weak biotic attack? Depletes a little of your barrier.
-Massive singularity or a powerful warp bomb? Takes all your barrier to summon up the biotic concentration to do it. 
Make it based on time, so the more powerful the attack, the longer you have to ready it.

Well sure, good idea. 

[D.Kain]

ZweiWing wrote...

I've been having a lot of trouble with Throw's aiming mechanic. As in, it feels like it doesn't have one. I see it hit people and I watch nothing happen. Maybe I just don't understand what's going on with it. I hope it isn't like that in the single player. Throw has always been my trump card against hordes of Husks.

Here's what's going on: 

A trooper has a trigger to sometimes evade the biotic attack. And even if the animation still hits the trooper, because he glitched and didn't directly evade the projectile, the program still says that he dodged it, so nothing happens. 

[Tangster]

D.Kain wrote...

ZweiWing wrote...

I've been having a lot of trouble with Throw's aiming mechanic. As in, it feels like it doesn't have one. I see it hit people and I watch nothing happen. Maybe I just don't understand what's going on with it. I hope it isn't like that in the single player. Throw has always been my trump card against hordes of Husks.

Here's what's going on: 

A trooper has a trigger to sometimes evade the biotic attack. And even if the animation still hits the trooper, because he glitched and didn't directly evade the projectile, the program still says that he dodged it, so nothing happens. 

Yeah, I was playing earlier and was looking for it, saw it this time. With warp it's even more stupid, the warp effect displays on the enemy, but you can't warp bomb them.

[tomcruisejr]

Like I said before, Biotics are actually pretty good.

The problem is specifically (for MP) Human Adept's "meh" power set and singularity's last evolution being bugged, which might lead people to believe they suck.

[D.Kain]

tomcruisejr wrote...

Like I said before, Biotics are actually pretty good.

The problem is specifically (for MP) Human Adept's "meh" power set and singularity's last evolution being bugged, which might lead people to believe they suck.

When a power set sucks there is something wrong. All powers should be valuable. 

[squee913]

Call me crazy, but isn't the only difference between and shield and a barrier that one was made by a mass effect core in the suit and the other was made from the biotic themselves? Unless I am mistaking, Kinetic barriers (shields) and biotic barriers are the exact same result from 2 different methods. they both use mass effect fields to repel things... so why should something that does is protected against by barrier not also be protected against by shields? And, in that light, if a biotic barrier can block biotics, shouldn't a shield as well?

To be fair, I may not be remembering my lore correctly and if so, please feel free to point me to where it proves me wrong

Modifié par squee913, 24 février 2012 - 03:05 .

[tomcruisejr]

D.Kain wrote...

tomcruisejr wrote...

Like I said before, Biotics are actually pretty good.

The problem is specifically (for MP) Human Adept's "meh" power set and singularity's last evolution being bugged, which might lead people to believe they suck.

When a power set sucks there is something wrong. All powers should be valuable. 

 But still, I can see them being more viable once the singularity mine thing works.  It can actually be usefull past bronze. 

Does it work for anyone ITT? Or just broken for me.

[The_mango55]

I just want the projectiles to move faster. They would FEEL more powerful if they moved faster, even if they didn't hit harder.

[D.Kain]

squee913 wrote...

Call me crazy, but isn't the only difference between and shield and a barrier that one was made by a mass effect core in the suit and the other was made from the biotic themselves? Unless I am mistaking, Kinetic barriers (shields) and biotic barriers are the exact same result from 2 different methods. they both use mass effect fields to repel things... so why should something that does is protected against by barrier not also be protected against by shields? And, in that light, if a biotic barrier can block biotics, shouldn't a shield as well?

To be fair, I may not be remembering my lore correctly and if so, please feel free to point me to where it proves me wrong

No shields and barrier are 2 different things. Shields are electronic, and  are configured to work with exact impact high velocity small objects, shields have little generators that activate and repulse those, they don't protect from heat, from slow moving obejcts or melee and from large objects. Barrier acts as a wall, it doesn't repulse, it just stops things, and protects from any of the above, and can change on biotics whim, but it exausts the user.