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Scanning looks even WORSE in ME3 than in ME2


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#426
teh_619

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AlanC9 wrote...

teh_619 wrote...

Noone ever said anything bad about the very idea of landing on planets and exploring them.


Actually, some of us did say exactly that.

Not that space exploration is a bad idea for a game in the abstract, but that exploration doesn't have anything to do with the Mass Effect situation and storyline, and therefore it shouldn't have been shoehorned into the game.

Edit: just for clarity, ME2 and apparently ME3 do an OK job at the shoehorning. It actually makes sense to be scanning planets in ME2, whatever you think of the gamepay mechanics.


"but that exploration doesn't have anything to do with the Mass Effect situation and storyline"

You're in space. There's nothing else you need. When you're in space, you explore and/or you have fights in it DAMN IT

It's really like some of you loathe everything else about this series besides romances.

Modifié par teh_619, 26 février 2012 - 09:11 .


#427
Bekkael

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Terror_K wrote...

So... according to this video from IGN showing the galaxy map, not only do we have to still scan planets and not only do we still stupidly pilot the Normandy around like a little toy ship, but on top of that we now have to scan the areas between planets as well?! Seriously?

Gotta say... confidence that this final part will actually be good when you don't seem to have learned from what sucked about ME2 isn't high, BioWare.


I watched both of the IGN videos yesterday and liked them very much; especially the one that showed the new planet scanning and Reaper evasion. Sorry you didn't like it, but I really can't wait to try it out for myself. :kissing:

#428
AlphaJarmel

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adawg828 wrote...

Cancel your pre-order then I am sure somebody will love to have your copy of ME3. So much complaining and the game is not even out yet!


This is the most unimaginative and laziest response I've seen in any forum and people keep repeating it like it's clever.

#429
Wulfram

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Chris Priestly wrote...

Huh. I didn't dislike the ME2 scanning, but I do think the ME3 scanning is FAR better.

The planet scanning is now much faster (a common complaint of ME2 scanning was the repitition as you tried to find the richest veins of minerals). It has direct effect on galaxy at war assets and/or plots/stories on the Citadel. And the scanning between planets adds a large degree of danger due to Reaper attack.

Still, make up your mind because you haven't actually tried it yet. That's what the BSN is for, snap judgements based on incomplete detail. :innocent:


It's connected to plots?!  Why would you do that?  The only good thing about it in ME2 was that you could skip it.#

edit: The rule for all mini-games, no matter how good, is that you should be able to skip them without missing out on stuff.

Modifié par Wulfram, 26 février 2012 - 09:12 .


#430
teh_619

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Chris Priestly wrote...

Huh. I didn't dislike the ME2 scanning, but I do think the ME3 scanning is FAR better.

The planet scanning is now much faster (a common complaint of ME2 scanning was the repitition as you tried to find the richest veins of minerals). It has direct effect on galaxy at war assets and/or plots/stories on the Citadel. And the scanning between planets adds a large degree of danger due to Reaper attack.

Still, make up your mind because you haven't actually tried it yet. That's what the BSN is for, snap judgements based on incomplete detail. :innocent:




:devil:


You're willingly ignoring the fact that Bioware just removed planet exploration and didn't even try to improve on it.
Just that is a reason to criticize.

#431
AlanC9

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Arppis wrote...

I just think that Scanning could have rewarded players a bit better. Like finding some money-caches here and there maybe? Or upgrades... something more than minerals and missions.

Talking about ME2 scanning OFCOURSE.


But we did get upgrades and credits from ME2 scanning. Scanning's the only way to get the N7 missions, which produce cash and several upgrades.

#432
hawat333

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I like it better from the looks of it.
It actually spares me the four hours of scanning (two after being patched) to grind a useable amount of resources, and it also seems we don't have to pilot that model ship to every planet (yeah, I still don't get why that flying around part was neccessary, but I can live with it) if we are only going after anomalies.

#433
RoboticWater

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teh_619 wrote...
You're willingly ignoring the fact that Bioware just removed planet exploration and didn't even try to improve on it.
Just that is a reason to criticize.

If you read the title, it clearly says "Scanning" not exploration. The only reason exploration is technically not off topic is because ME2's missions were found by scanning

#434
Tazzmission

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believe it or not i like the new look of the scanning and i hated it in me2.

#435
AlanC9

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teh_619 wrote...
You're in space. There's nothing else you need. When you're in space, you explore and/or you have fights in it DAMN IT


An actual argument would be nice here. All you've been saying is ITS SPACE DAMMIT SPACE AND IF ITS A SPACE GAME ITS SUPPOSED TO HAVE SPACE EXPLORATION WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME!!!!

#436
Justicar

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Ghost Rider LSOV wrote...

Justicar wrote...

Any video showing what happens if the Reapers catch you?

OM NOM NOM? [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/grin.png[/smilie]


Makes sense :wizard:

Modifié par Justicar, 26 février 2012 - 09:21 .


#437
AlanC9

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teh_619 wrote...


You're willingly ignoring the fact that Bioware just removed planet exploration and didn't even try to improve on it.
Just that is a reason to criticize.


So we've got space exploration, but not planet exploration, right?

#438
teh_619

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AlanC9 wrote...

teh_619 wrote...
You're in space. There's nothing else you need. When you're in space, you explore and/or you have fights in it DAMN IT


An actual argument would be nice here. All you've been saying is ITS SPACE DAMMIT SPACE AND IF ITS A SPACE GAME ITS SUPPOSED TO HAVE SPACE EXPLORATION WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME!!!!




Welcome to the series.
May I inform you that we had space exploration on ME1.
Alright bye.

#439
teh_619

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AlanC9 wrote...

teh_619 wrote...


You're willingly ignoring the fact that Bioware just removed planet exploration and didn't even try to improve on it.
Just that is a reason to criticize.


So we've got space exploration, but not planet exploration, right?


How is that exploring? That's pac man with a space backround and in 3D.

#440
RoboticWater

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teh_619 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

teh_619 wrote...
You're in space. There's nothing else you need. When you're in space, you explore and/or you have fights in it DAMN IT


An actual argument would be nice here. All you've been saying is ITS SPACE DAMMIT SPACE AND IF ITS A SPACE GAME ITS SUPPOSED TO HAVE SPACE EXPLORATION WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME!!!!




Welcome to the series.
May I inform you that we had space exploration on ME1.
Alright bye.

And we didn't in ME2 becasue ME1's exploration wasn't very good.

#441
teh_619

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BlahDog wrote...

teh_619 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

teh_619 wrote...
You're in space. There's nothing else you need. When you're in space, you explore and/or you have fights in it DAMN IT


An actual argument would be nice here. All you've been saying is ITS SPACE DAMMIT SPACE AND IF ITS A SPACE GAME ITS SUPPOSED TO HAVE SPACE EXPLORATION WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME!!!!




Welcome to the series.
May I inform you that we had space exploration on ME1.
Alright bye.

And we didn't in ME2 becasue ME1's exploration wasn't very good.


That isn't an excuse and I've been saying it's all Bioware's fault for not trying to improve on it and just removing it completely.


It's just a quick and lazy solution out of it.

#442
DarthSliver

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Chris Priestly wrote...

Huh. I didn't dislike the ME2 scanning, but I do think the ME3 scanning is FAR better.

The planet scanning is now much faster (a common complaint of ME2 scanning was the repitition as you tried to find the richest veins of minerals). It has direct effect on galaxy at war assets and/or plots/stories on the Citadel. And the scanning between planets adds a large degree of danger due to Reaper attack.

Still, make up your mind because you haven't actually tried it yet. That's what the BSN is for, snap judgements based on incomplete detail. :innocent:




:devil:


The scanning in ME3 looks alot better but still simple, I suppose it can be quite fun if your in the nebula and in system that doesnt have the Mass Relay. But it seems quite easy if you have the Mass Relay in the same system your scanning. 

#443
Tazzmission

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AlanC9 wrote...

teh_619 wrote...


You're willingly ignoring the fact that Bioware just removed planet exploration and didn't even try to improve on it.
Just that is a reason to criticize.


So we've got space exploration, but not planet exploration, right?



um did you even listen to what the guy at ign says. he said you can still land by scanning

#444
AlanC9

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teh_619 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

teh_619 wrote...
You're in space. There's nothing else you need. When you're in space, you explore and/or you have fights in it DAMN IT


An actual argument would be nice here. All you've been saying is ITS SPACE DAMMIT SPACE AND IF ITS A SPACE GAME ITS SUPPOSED TO HAVE SPACE EXPLORATION WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME!!!!


Welcome to the series.
May I inform you that we had space exploration on ME1.
Alright bye.


Yep. We did. I thought it was a bad idea in ME1, and said so at the time. ME2 and ME3 are doing better by at least trying to give RP reasons to do the exploration.

Still looking for that argument.

#445
hawat333

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BlahDog wrote...

And we didn't in ME2 becasue ME1's exploration wasn't very good.

Most of the complaints were about the Mako to be honest. And the Mako wasn't even bad. The terrain (apart from a few example) was rough... although you could always find a path. Some of the players didn't even try, and there they came complaining: "the Mako suxccssksk!!!114441". Well, the terrain or the design could be better, or a bit more obvious about the intended track (no arrows like in Overlord though, that's just being dull), and I think there wouldn't be that many negative comments about exploration.
And a bit clumsy exploration is still better than no exploration, at least in my books.

#446
jasonirma

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BlahDog wrote...

Jjacobclark wrote...

can i still probe uranus?

You have to be quick though. Once the reapers take earth, you'll only have seconds to probe uranus.


OMG--So I'm at work eating lunch and just spewed Pepsi out of my nose...that was the single best response I've read on this whole 14-page chain.  Jacob wins the internet--absolutely hysterical :).  But now my sinuses hurt.  And no one will sit near me.  Still worth it...

Posting on-topic is hard after that, but I'll try..

Sometimes I think games try to create content just to make the content feel "bigger".  In many ways, the Mako, Hammerhead, mineral mining, and scanning portions of both ME1 & ME2 felt that way to me.  Somewhere buried in the hours of time spent in this minigame, there was genuine content.  I personally loved the N7 missions in ME2 (especially the teetering ship on one lush world).  But the process of getting to the content felt precisely like the attempt was at a "longer, bigger game," rather than somehow making it a deeper, more meaningful one.  I will acknowledge that at least in ME2 there was some terrific backstory on a fair number of the planets that made exploration fun for those of us who appreciate the fiction of an RPG.

So how could BW have attempted to make exploration both worthwhile and simultaneously optional?

  • Given the extent of backstory on many of the planets in the systems to which you can travel, it would be great to consider minigames that involved RTS-style overlays.  For example, a Turian settlement needs air assistance to eradicate an unexpected fauna invasion.  The Normandy could serve both as an air-to-ground targeting system along with issuing battle orders for ground units.  This would serve both to allow exploration of the fiction surrounding the ME universe, an opportunity to coordinate/have purpose for being at a certain planet, and offer a gamestyle change from RPG to RTS.
  • Space flight with option for atmospheric flight (that would be a game-heavy mechanic, more of a game of its own, but would be cool for space combat).  Star Wars Galaxies' space game was incredible and part of the game unto itself.  Would make the Normandy less of a placeholder and more of an actual spaceship, though.  Nothing on rails, please--SWTOR space combat is not my thing.  But think of navigating ringed planets, planets with picket defenses (trying to sneak between pickets and avoiding both air-to-air and ground-to-air and space-to-air combat.
  • It would be cool to have a more "open world" feel to the space exploration: Skyrim's wide open map is a pleasure to explore.  I can fast travel to places I've been to (or take a "cab") or I can wander.  The wandering takes time, but there's almost always something I bump into by pure accident (other than just the flora and fauna) that makes it feel like a real & lived in place.  Admittedly, space is mostly just...space...dizzyingly empty.  But  you can envision some way to make this "compressed somehow" (think about how rapidly the Normandy jaunted between planets in the opening of ME1).  But make it more "3d" (allow exploration within the plane of a solar system, say), and let people truly stumble over things or scan for them by a ship-level view (not this toy thing that represents a ship).
  • The backstory on planets was awesome, but mattered little ultimately on what you found in ME2.  Weave the backstory into gameplay.  Consider a diplomatic mechanic: one that offers up interaction via comm with the planets' governments.  This would work more in the ME 1&2 settings of being a spectre than it would in the context of ME3, but somehow espionage, back-handed deals, contacts with information brokers, etc--these would be great in engaging the planetary stories.  I'm not necessarily talking about a mechanic that would be somehow tied to space "movement" (in fact, all of this could theoretically be accomplished via the galaxy map), but get it tied into the wonderful writing that exists for the planets.
  • Have exploration impact outcomes in the game.  Right now, most of the exploration served 2 functions: in ME1 they were for side quests or cash, in ME2 they were for upgrades.  Exploration had no impact on paragon/renegade status and had no impact on later story arcs later in the game.  Take a cue from Witcher2 where many minor choices have large impacts later in the story, often unexpectedly.  Exploration then embraces the game rather than just to make it "bigger and longer".
My $0.02.

#447
RoboticWater

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teh_619 wrote...
That isn't an excuse and I've been saying it's all Bioware's fault for not trying to improve on it and just removing it completely.


It's just a quick and lazy solution out of it.

I for one, prefer ME2's missions that were asthetically diverse. Sure, Bioware could have found a way to make a whole area to explore around these levels but that would just mean more time to develop nice looking environments for the soul purpose of just looking nice. Not to mention Bioware would have to remake the Mako entirely which they eventually did with the hammerhead (but see how that was received).

#448
Worried Mitch

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One of my greatest disappointments in the series is the fact that the planets look so ugly now. What happened to the beautiful planets in mass effect one; where you felt like you really were orbiting over it, looking out the window.

#449
teh_619

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AlanC9 wrote...

teh_619 wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

teh_619 wrote...
You're in space. There's nothing else you need. When you're in space, you explore and/or you have fights in it DAMN IT


An actual argument would be nice here. All you've been saying is ITS SPACE DAMMIT SPACE AND IF ITS A SPACE GAME ITS SUPPOSED TO HAVE SPACE EXPLORATION WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME!!!!


Welcome to the series.
May I inform you that we had space exploration on ME1.
Alright bye.


Yep. We did. I thought it was a bad idea in ME1, and said so at the time. ME2 and ME3 are doing better by at least trying to give RP reasons to do the exploration.

Still looking for that argument.

Argument for what?
The "argument" YOU make is that they removed it because it was implemented poorly.

I'm saying I want it back and improved.

Modifié par teh_619, 26 février 2012 - 09:32 .


#450
Tazzmission

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hawat333 wrote...

BlahDog wrote...

And we didn't in ME2 becasue ME1's exploration wasn't very good.

Most of the complaints were about the Mako to be honest. And the Mako wasn't even bad. The terrain (apart from a few example) was rough... although you could always find a path. Some of the players didn't even try, and there they came complaining: "the Mako suxccssksk!!!114441". Well, the terrain or the design could be better, or a bit more obvious about the intended track (no arrows like in Overlord though, that's just being dull), and I think there wouldn't be that many negative comments about exploration.
And a bit clumsy exploration is still better than no exploration, at least in my books.


the mako was fine ( for me at least) imo and just mine alone is that the exploration in me1 couldve been alot better when it comes to the planets.

its still fun dont get me wrong but they couldve done some little puzzle games with certain things

Modifié par Tazzmission, 26 février 2012 - 09:32 .