106 réponses à ce sujet

[RunCDFirst]

MassEffect762 wrote...

She says the child will represent  freedom for an old god, a second chance. Something along those lines.

Yeah... that's not very detailed.

[MassEffect762]

RunCDFirst wrote...

MassEffect762 wrote...

She says the child will represent  freedom for an old god, a second chance. Something along those lines.

Yeah... that's not very detailed.

Sorry for the lack of a better quote, not that it would help much anyhow hence the speculation.

[RunCDFirst]

MassEffect762 wrote...

RunCDFirst wrote...

MassEffect762 wrote...

She says the child will represent  freedom for an old god, a second chance. Something along those lines.

Yeah... that's not very detailed.

Sorry for the lack of a better quote, not that it would help much anyhow hence the speculation.

It's alright . I vaguely remember the conversation. It was her vagueness that did the deal in for me since I couldn't think of any good reasons not to tell the truth unless it wasn't going to be something I'd approve.

[marshalleck]

RunCDFirst wrote...

MassEffect762 wrote...

RunCDFirst wrote...

MassEffect762 wrote...

She says the child will represent  freedom for an old god, a second chance. Something along those lines.

Yeah... that's not very detailed.

Sorry for the lack of a better quote, not that it would help much anyhow hence the speculation.

It's alright . I vaguely remember the conversation. It was her vagueness that did the deal in for me since I couldn't think of any good reasons not to tell the truth unless it wasn't going to be something I'd approve.

You're overlooking the obvious reason--it would blow the plot of the sequel. It was poorly handled. I can't see any reason why Morrigan wouldn't at least go into a little more detail than "it will be good, ya rly" especially since if you romance her it's clear your relationship has deeply affected her. This is why I am willing to metagame it a little bit and have some of my characters put their faith in her.

Modifié par marshalleck, 04 décembre 2009 - 03:05 .

[Statulos]

I like your idea of Morrigan just completely confused. In fact, the conversations you can get when she tries to convince you for the ritual and, especially the ones after that (if you thank her during the siege of Denerim, she just wishes she had been other in a different time to better compensate you) show that she does not feel too well about it. More exactly, if you have romanced her (I don´t know if not) she states that she cannot "let her feelings take her appart from her duty".

classic love? Sure not! I mean, the lover/friend she has made is basicaly her best guarantee of survival. In fact, after the "romantic scene" she clearly states that she enjoyed it and being selfish, he probably regrets loosing the best sexual partner of her life.



But as going away, my guess is simple: the pc is a warden and that means that he´s slowly turning into a darkspawn (that´s why they start feelling the call and dye in the Deep Roads, so they do not become a darkspawn). That means that as much as the wardens feel darkspawn´s presence, they also feel warden´s one and that means attracting them to the baby and well, getting another archdemon and consequently, another Blight is not exactly what Morrigan seeks.

[Kabraxal]

That is what I have leaned at as well. The whole taint having a specific time-line and respectfully giving nightmares to indicate a horrible death seems to coincidental. It seems to much like it is the Warden losing his humanity, not his life.



So, if that is true, then of course Morrigan would not only want to take the child away, but would have to keep the old god from becoming an arch-demon again. This also means that Duncan is likely to rear his face in DLC or sequels since we never actually saw him die.

[Kilyhan]

A lot of folks reference Morrigans child and the next edition of DA.  The thing is you can clearly tell her no - so for players doing that option - her child could not be their sequel..  So it is hard to read much of what is to come into any choices we made and a next game as we had many options and different outcomes.. Otherwise how can they tie it all together with you being dead or alive, purge the mage tower or save it, kill the Dalish or help them... A lot of things would have to factor in one way or another is all..

[marshalleck]

Kilyhan wrote...

A lot of folks reference Morrigans child and the next edition of DA.  The thing is you can clearly tell her no - so for players doing that option - her child could not be their sequel..  So it is hard to read much of what is to come into any choices we made and a next game as we had many options and different outcomes.. Otherwise how can they tie it all together with you being dead or alive, purge the mage tower or save it, kill the Dalish or help them... A lot of things would have to factor in one way or another is all..

Well Mr. Gaider has said Morrigan's story isn't over, so that's about as official as it's going to get that she'll be back, or at least elements of her plot thread...this isn't just the wishful thinking of Morrigan fans.

[Lotion Soronarr]

It takes 20-30 years for them to even start hearing the call.





That saide, I simply cannot trust Morrigan. I tried exploring as many conversation options with her and Flemeth and she jsut doesn't strike me somone you cna trust. Even if htat was teh case, her bahavior at the end is utterly supicious.

She's so evasive and vauge and it's MY FRIGGIN CHILD. And if anyone of you has kids, that should raise a LOT of red flags.





"Hai mysterious witch. You want to travel with me? K? Waht? You hate kidz? Sorry, wasn't listening, busy lookign at your clevage. You like my dog? Yes, he's manipulative..you are too? Kewl. Survival of hte fittest, emotions are for fools..interesting..aha.. Man allways willing belive a pretty gir falls for them..yeah, I can see that. No, I'm not looking at your clevage again. Soo..you hate the Cirlce? Kill all the mages? Teh kids too? Well, I dunno...Le'ts go to Redcliffe.possesed kid. Kill it too? Leave everyone to die? But we might need the Earl. LEt's jsut go somewhere else.

What? Kill your mother for you? Why? She wants to kill you? No proof huh? Well, K, as long as I get some nookie..... Hai again, your mothers dead. Yes I know I'm your big hero.

Say what? Dark ritual? Possesion? Taint? Old gods soul? My child? Care to elaborate? No? Why should I go along with it? NOOKIE!!! Hell yeah.

Hey wait. Where is she? And where's my kid? Hmm..Is it my kid anymore at all or jsut an empty shell? MEh..who cares. I shall find her again, cause she is clearly crazy about me and is a great mother...she's jsut playing hard to get! ONWARD!

[Kilyhan]

marshalleck wrote...

Kilyhan wrote...

A lot of folks reference Morrigans child and the next edition of DA.  The thing is you can clearly tell her no - so for players doing that option - her child could not be their sequel..  So it is hard to read much of what is to come into any choices we made and a next game as we had many options and different outcomes.. Otherwise how can they tie it all together with you being dead or alive, purge the mage tower or save it, kill the Dalish or help them... A lot of things would have to factor in one way or another is all..

Well Mr. Gaider has said Morrigan's story isn't over, so that's about as official as it's going to get that she'll be back, or at least elements of her plot thread...this isn't just the wishful thinking of Morrigan fans.

Yeah I am just wondering how they plan to tie in the love child if not everyone took that route - wouldn't it kind of discount the efforts of those who made the sacrifice at the end and died if in the next game suddenly opps she had the child regardless... Just wondering.  Now I know if you romanced her but turned down the ritiual it still says she is with child - just that it isn't the god child... So I guess we all get to wait and see.

[Alex Savchovsky]

MassEffect762 wrote...

Alocormin wrote...

I believe everything Morrigan says about her intentions and what the child would be. There's no reason not to, she's pretty straightforward about it. The question is, what else it could be for, in addition to the reasons she offers? I think she earnestly wants to preserve something she considers valuable.

That's the problem, more valuable than you the PC(If romanced/love). Normal folk wouldn't think that why. I dunno maybe, JUST MAYBE she's trying to protect you from something by leaving you.(nah)

Why would she leave you?

Just as an example - because you're a Grey Warden. And Grey Wardens are known to bear the darkspawn taint. The one that corrupts the Old Gods into Archdemons. And since the child carries the soul of an Old God... maybe it's not very wise to hang around. 

Kilyhan wrote...

A lot of folks reference Morrigans child and the next edition of DA.  The thing is you can clearly tell her no - so for players doing that option - her child could not be their sequel..  So it is hard to read much of what is to come into any choices we made and a next game as we had many options and different outcomes.. Otherwise how can they tie it all together with you being dead or alive, purge the mage tower or save it, kill the Dalish or help them... A lot of things would have to factor in one way or another is all..

For one, there is Riordan hanging around, so if you decline, Morrigan can still try to seduce him and get the child anyways.
On the other hand, as I stated before - you can also clearly tell her "yes" and survive despite killing the Archdemon yourself. So it would feel just as awkward if you did and the child is never mentioned in the expansion/sequel. There are some serious issues about that story line (like, continue it decently without making another Baldur's Gate), but there is just too much potential in this line to just drop it.

[Statulos]

My guess is as simple as Morrigand did not lied to us but otherwise she did not told the whole truth because... Flemeth has lied to us all!

I mean, when you get to fight her, she directly tells you a kind "kill the crone? Oh boy; been there, done that, you know". Flemeth is several centuries (at least!) old and probably this has happened to her before. But maybe this time is different because maybe Morrigan is different to all her "sisters".

A possibly cool side quest? Well, who is (or was) Morrigan´s father?


And as a matter of sequels; I can tell you that I basicaly loved every companion (Wynne a bit less, but the grandma thing has a point still); something that did not happened in any BG games since I basicaly found characters as Brawen, Kagain, or Garric as absolutely insipid.

Modifié par Statulos, 04 décembre 2009 - 09:22 .

[Alex Savchovsky]

Statulos wrote...

A possibly cool side quest? Well, who is (or was) Morrigan´s father?   

There were a theory around which had Maric as her father.

[Walina]

BigKevSexyMan wrote...

Why does everyone seem to think that Morrigan only wants that god-child so that she can possess it?

It just doesn't seem like something morrigan would really do.  Morrigan is a person where the ends justify the means, but she isn't downright evil enough to do something to someone else that she would not want happening to her.

When at the anvil, if you have a high enough coercion skill, Morrigan will suggest we keep the anvil, but if you threaten to put her in there, then she backs down and, I think, sees your point.

The question I have is, what else would an uncorrupted old god be used for?  Also, what exactly was the corrupting factor for the old gods?  Revenge?  Vanity? Something else? 
In the dialogue in redcliffe about the god-child, she says that she wants to see the old god restored to what it was.

I really think there is more than just a power play going on here, although I wouldn't dismiss it entirely.  The problem is that I just can't quite put my finger on it.

Do you really had to make a new thread while there already one (Dark ritual) ?
Whatever you say, only Bioware know what she will do with the baby so it's pointless to try to defend her since any options are possible.

[Malsumis]

Feraele wrote...
Would she do what Flemeth was going to do to her....educate Morrigan..get Morrigan powerful then take over her body? 

Could be..........

Not likely, since Morrigan is not a unique abomination.

[Lotion Soronarr]

The question is - is the abomination that makes the possesion possible for Flemeth, or is it just some old, forgotten magics.

[phordicus]

the god's tainted soul is purified by the transfer from archdemon to embryo. morrigan very obviously is a big believer in self-determination. i think it's as simple as her wanting to give birth to the god of beauty. it pleases her ego, is a show of tremendous power, and slaps the chantry in the face. throw in a good roll in the hay with the Hero of Ferelden and her legacy is complete.

... i don't think flemeth has anything to do with morrigan's intentions.  morrigan herself said (paraphrasing) that flemeth is mortal and dies to a sword as any other creature would.

Modifié par phordicus, 04 décembre 2009 - 11:31 .

[Allattar1]

Is Flemeth an abomination? or is Flemeth possessed as it where by a similar spirit to Wynne?

There are more than just the spirits of Hate, Desire etc...

[Lotion Soronarr]

phordicus wrote...

the god's tainted soul is purified by the transfer from archdemon to embryo. morrigan very obviously is a big believer in self-determination.

Yeah, because she respects others peoples decision ...NOT. "Wynne CHOOSE to support the Chantry? Kill the mages. All of them are cattle!"

Let's fact it - Morrigan isn't the devil incarnate (maybe..she's very good at acting and manipulation), but she is definately NOT a nice/good person.
You may have something on birthing a god stroking her ego, but I just dont' see her waste so much time and energy purely for that. She's a survivor, belives in the rule of hte strong and despises authority. She's also a pragmatist (unless it conflict with the prior things). There's got to be more to it.

[car07ms]

Well if you decided to go down the path of you/alistair not sleeping with her, you'll notice that there's more to her than what you know. She glares you with evil eyes and says something along the line of one way or the other i'll find a way or something, meaning one way or the other she WILL have a child regardless wether if its a god-child or not.

Which raises the question, so is she Flemeth afterall? To me it seems that she's desperate to get a child, preferably a god-child. Which is why she suddenly departs your group after she realises her plan isn't working. Well that's just my thought.

Modifié par car07ms, 04 décembre 2009 - 12:02 .

[Statulos]

Possession during game can be a posibility. If you listen to Morringan´s voice she sounds quite different in several ocasion. I mean, when you´re romancing her and she does not want to have sex with you (by 90% approval), she sounds confused and scared if you ask her why even to the point of saying that you´ll regret not breaking with her and she will also regret it. It is cleary Claudia Black´s voice but sometimes she sounds like a different person. If this is the case, she did a great job with the voice.

[slackbheep]

Yeah I have to admit that upon reexamining the game Morrigan does appear to change later on. I'm not sure if that was due to my previous character having gotten her higher romance conversation options only late in the game however, So this time around I'll be keeping her at friendly and watching for odd behavior after the main areas.

Edit: I'm still not sure if that implies she's been possessed by Flemeth, I tend to believe that she's been hiding something important all along.

Modifié par slackbheep, 04 décembre 2009 - 07:20 .

[Alex Savchovsky]

Statulos wrote...

Possession during game can be a posibility. If you listen to Morringan´s voice she sounds quite different in several ocasion. I mean, when you´re romancing her and she does not want to have sex with you (by 90% approval), she sounds confused and scared if you ask her why even to the point of saying that you´ll regret not breaking with her and she will also regret it. It is cleary Claudia Black´s voice but sometimes she sounds like a different person. If this is the case, she did a great job with the voice.

Or there can be another reason behind this - she feels very confused about your relationship. She believes that love is a weakness and it harms both her and you - yet she cannot overcome it. Basically what she wants to talk about with you when you get her on +100 (Adore).
I think that Flemeth will appear again, but she will not possess Morrigan.