29 réponses à ce sujet

[--Deathstalker--]

The whole theme of the entire Mass Effect series in general has been creating an avatar for yourself, making choices on what abilities you have and so on. To change this type of theme in the multiplayer is baffling to me.

Why lock even basic skills we've had in other games to certain races/classes? Allow us to choose what skills we want like the other games! The current situation sucks because if you only like playing as a one particular race/class (such as Human/Adept) and there's a skill you really want to have (I'll use the Biotic power Throw as an example), the game essentially gives you the middle finger. In short, you're pretty much forced to choose the race/class which has the skill and forget playing as the Human/Adept.

Options are good. Forcing people to play a character they might not particularly enjoy is bad. Here's what I think should happen. Allow us to choose a character as we currently can, but let us customise most or all the abilties we want, then perhaps give us an extra slot since there are quite a few other abilities. Then this would all be like the other games in the series! Some extra icing on the cake would be to let us have more control over what our avatar looks like (such as changing helmets) and it'd be perfect I think.

Modifié par --Deathstalker--, 27 février 2012 - 06:12 .

[--Deathstalker--]

Agree? Disagree? Share your thoughts!

[Sabbatine]

--Deathstalker-- wrote...

Options are good. Forcing people to play a character they might not particularly enjoy is bad. Here's what I think should happen. Allow us to choose a character as we currently can, but let us customise most or all the abilties we want, then perhaps give us an extra slot since there are quite a few other abilities. Then this would all be like the other games in the series! Some extra icing on the cake would be to let us have more control over what our avatar looks like (such as changing helmets) and it'd be perfect I think.

Bioware doesn't force anyone to play characters they might not enjoy.  Multiplayer is completely optional and there is enough variety in choices for that nearly everyone can find something they like.

The whole point of multiplayer is to recruit people for the war.  Shepard is customizeable because he is supposed to represent the player's ideal avatar.  The people we play as in multiplayer on the other hand are basically support for Shepard.

[LadyAlekto]

What sabbatine said

Shepard is your avatar, she is the personification of yourself (there is no sheploo;))

The others are just random highly skilled individuals that have followed the rally cry (at least i can pretend its me under that helmet in my own dark twisted mind, beware of the aggresive ar infiltrator^^)

[Crimson Invictus]

Whatever balance there is would be a thing of the past. So, no, I can't really agree.

Customizing the aesthetic elements, however, if they wanted to do it I don't see an issue with it. I doubt they want to create thirty crest designs for krogan, though.

Modifié par Liana Nighthawk, 27 février 2012 - 06:53 .

[--Deathstalker--]

Sabbatine wrote...

Bioware doesn't force anyone to play characters they might not enjoy.

Yet, you gotta play characters you might not enjoy if you want to use (for example) a certain biotic power that an Adept can actually learn.

Sabbatine wrote...

Multiplayer is completely optional

So is singleplayer. So is the entire game.

Sabbatine wrote...

and there is enough variety in choices for that nearly everyone can find something they like.

Well, I don't deny that there is enjoyable elements. That isn't my issue.

Sabbatine wrote...

The whole point of multiplayer is to recruit people for the war.  Shepard is customizeable because he is supposed to represent the player's ideal avatar.  The people we play as in multiplayer on the other hand are basically support for Shepard.

Yet we can still customise them. They still represent another avatar of ours which transitions to an online world. Why not just go the whole way and let us customise the rest?

Modifié par --Deathstalker--, 27 février 2012 - 07:15 .

[Rizniik]

--Deathstalker-- wrote...
Yet we can still customise them. They still represent another avatar of ours which transitions to an online world. Why not just go the whole way and let us customise the rest?

Memory~ Memory~ Memory~  Space, even if the serie is about it, is limited.
Perhaps the PC audience could potentially customise and mod the various textures - however due to our consoles being ooold~  We have not got many options left if we want the game to look pretty and move at a comfortable pace~

But I agree with you ;   I'd love to get some more personalisation done on my characters.

[Kakaw]

Single player puts limitations through classes aswell. It isn't new. So multiplayer limits you a little more. The reason ofcourse being that it promotes teamplay. Multiplayer isnt singleplayer. in multiplayer we're all just "squad members". None of us are shepard in multiplayer.

And no, we cannot fully customize them. Humans don't even have faces, only helmets. Why should a generic alliance human adept be as powerful as shepard? Where's the magic in that. And why would you not want to promote teamplay?

Modifié par Kakaw, 27 février 2012 - 07:19 .

[--Deathstalker--]

Rizniik wrote...

Memory~ Memory~ Memory~  Space, even if the serie is about it, is limited.
Perhaps the PC audience could potentially customise and mod the various textures - however due to our consoles being ooold~  We have not got many options left if we want the game to look pretty and move at a comfortable pace~

But I agree with you ;   I'd love to get some more personalisation done on my characters.

I was actually meaning how we can customise our guns, the effects of the skills themselves and other stuff already. Anyway, that stuff you mention would be nice too!

Modifié par --Deathstalker--, 27 février 2012 - 07:17 .

[HolyAvenger]

No, it would ruin class balance and species would become cosmetic.

[--Deathstalker--]

Kakaw wrote...

Single player puts limitations through classes aswell. It isn't new. So multiplayer limits you a little more. The reason ofcourse being that it promotes teamplay. Multiplayer isnt singleplayer. in multiplayer we're all just "squad members". None of us are shepard in multiplayer.

Yeah, and we still have classes in multiplayer too. All that changed was we got limited further in the skills department. Even removing the limitation, we can still have the same teamplay, but just more options in what you want.

[adamashepard]

Kakaw wrote...

Single player puts limitations through classes aswell. It isn't new. So multiplayer limits you a little more. The reason ofcourse being that it promotes teamplay. Multiplayer isnt singleplayer. in multiplayer we're all just "squad members". None of us are shepard in multiplayer.

what Kawkaw said is pretty much true if you look at your mp char they have the equivelant of a squad members skill set.

[Kakaw]

--Deathstalker-- wrote...

Kakaw wrote...

Single player puts limitations through classes aswell. It isn't new. So multiplayer limits you a little more. The reason ofcourse being that it promotes teamplay. Multiplayer isnt singleplayer. in multiplayer we're all just "squad members". None of us are shepard in multiplayer.

Yeah, and we still have classes in multiplayer too. All that changed was we got limited further in the skills department. Even removing the limitation, we can still have the same teamplay, but just more options in what you want.

I disagree. I like the current diversity and limitations that force better teamplay. Less powerhouses that don't need any allies.

If I could bring Stasis+overload+throw, I would go around detonating and stripping everything without any worries. Or maybe I'd build myself 100% damage reduction and break the game.

Modifié par Kakaw, 27 février 2012 - 07:24 .

[--Deathstalker--]

HolyAvenger wrote...

No, it would ruin class balance and species would become cosmetic.

If the change ruins class balance, then you're essentially saying that singleplayer is broken which would be the fault of the design. Also, so what if species becomes cosmetic? It's personal choice for what character looks YOU want. Not everyone wants to play a butt ugly alien.

adamashepard wrote...

what Kawkaw said is pretty much true if you look at your mp char they have the equivelant of a squad members skill set.

So?

[Kakaw]

What I would like is some options regarding what armour to wear . Maybe in a patch some time. Just a few simple bonuses on different sets of armour.

[--Deathstalker--]

Kakaw wrote...

I disagree. I like the current diversity and limitations that force better teamplay. Less powerhouses that don't need any allies.

If I could bring Stasis+overload+throw, I would go around detonating and stripping everything without any worries. Or maybe I'd build myself 100% damage reduction and break the game.

How would there be no limitations? You could still make it so there are the same limits. All I'm saying is instead of an Adept getting Singularity, you could allow them the choice of changing it for something like Throw.

EDIT: Overload is a TECH power lol. You're not understanding what I'm saying. I'm not saying to cross over classes; only allowing full access to choose abilities related to their own class.

EDIT 2:

Kakaw wrote...

What I would like is some options regarding what armour to wear . Maybe in a patch some time. Just a few simple bonuses on different sets of armour.

Yes, that would be nice.

EDIT 3: Probably the only class I can think of that would have less choice in this regard is the Sentinel as they are a cross between two classes. Thus, they cannot fully specialise in something like Biotics as an Adept would.

Modifié par --Deathstalker--, 27 février 2012 - 07:46 .

[Kakaw]

ok, if I can have the potato launcher.

[--Deathstalker--]

Kakaw wrote...

ok, if I can have the potato launcher.

Sure, why not.

[WizenSlinky0]

No offense, but this is a really bad idea for a lot of reasons.

Balance-

By allowing players to select whichever abilities they want it makes it very easy to load up on the best abilities of the class and thereby make the co-op portion of the multiplayer absolutely irredeemable. Put singularity and stasis on a single adept? Yeah, consider the game broken.

The whole point of the limited skill part of multiplayer is to force players to think tactically not just about what their own character should have but how it compliments the team.

Lore-

Shepard is an anomoly. Not only is Shepard the players avatar but he/she is supposed to be one of the most skilled soldiers in the galaxy (hell just consider what you've accomplished with him over 2 games). However the multiplayer characters are more like "Generic Soldiers" taken to the next level (customization). They aren't "special" and therefore are limited to certain abilities that would be inherent to their culture, military, or race.

Gameplay-

The complexity of the multiplayer system is very much intentionally being limited in order to make it quick to pick uo. This is balanced somewhat by the random unlock system to offset the replayability lost by sliming the system to a quick and functional bare-bones system. I'd guess they were trying to avoid too many problems jumping right into the MP section by offering an overly complex multi-skill selection and heavy customization on-top of the race system.

[HolyAvenger]

--Deathstalker-- wrote...

HolyAvenger wrote...

No, it would ruin class balance and species would become cosmetic.

If the change ruins class balance, then you're essentially saying that singleplayer is broken which would be the fault of the design. Also, so what if species becomes cosmetic? It's personal choice for what character looks YOU want. Not everyone wants to play a butt ugly alien.

Nope MP and SP are balanced very differently. 

I don't want species choice ot be cosmetic. I want different characters/species to play very differently as compared to others of the same class.

[--Deathstalker--]

WizenSlinky0 wrote...

No offense, but this is a really bad idea for a lot of reasons.

Balance-

By allowing players to select whichever abilities they want it makes it very easy to load up on the best abilities of the class and thereby make the co-op portion of the multiplayer absolutely irredeemable. Put singularity and stasis on a single adept? Yeah, consider the game broken.

The whole point of the limited skill part of multiplayer is to force players to think tactically not just about what their own character should have but how it compliments the team.

1) The multiplayer is already broken and needs balancing in a lot of areas. Asari Adepts is one of the many things in the game that looks pretty overpowered from what I've seen.

2) Players having a little extra customisation still allows for teamplay. We can already customise a number of things, yet that doesn't remove teamplay.

WizenSlinky0 wrote...

Lore-

Shepard is an anomoly. Not only is Shepard the players avatar but he/she is supposed to be one of the most skilled soldiers in the galaxy (hell just consider what you've accomplished with him over 2 games). However the multiplayer characters are more like "Generic Soldiers" taken to the next level (customization). They aren't "special" and therefore are limited to certain abilities that would be inherent to their culture, military, or race.

 
Shepard is already allowed more skills than these characters, isn't he? That makes him 'special'. Plus, we can already customise these characters quite a bit, so why not just go one step further?

WizenSlinky0 wrote...

Gameplay-

The complexity of the multiplayer system is very much intentionally being limited in order to make it quick to pick uo. This is balanced somewhat by the random unlock system to offset the replayability lost by sliming the system to a quick and functional bare-bones system. I'd guess they were trying to avoid too many problems jumping right into the MP section by offering an overly complex multi-skill selection and heavy customization on-top of the race system.

Pure speculation.

Modifié par --Deathstalker--, 27 février 2012 - 08:18 .

[--Deathstalker--]

HolyAvenger wrote...

Nope MP and SP are balanced very differently.

I don't want species choice ot be cosmetic. I want different characters/species to play very differently as compared to others of the same class.

How do you know it's balanced differently? All I see is just stuff imported from the singleplayer. As for species choice....well, that's you. I don't like playing as wierd aliens just as I'm sure there are others who only prefer playing certain aliens (and so on).

Modifié par --Deathstalker--, 27 février 2012 - 08:11 .

[HolyAvenger]

--Deathstalker-- wrote...

HolyAvenger wrote...

Nope MP and SP are balanced very differently.

I don't want species choice ot be cosmetic. I want different characters/species to play very differently as compared to others of the same class.

How do you know it's balanced differently? All I see is just stuff imported from the singleplayer. As for species choice....well, that's you. I don't like playing as wierd aliens just as I'm sure there are others who only prefer playing certain aliens (and so on).

Because encounter design on each aspect of the game will have been different and the difficulty scaling will be different. Trust MP and SP will be balanced quite different.

As for the alien thing...ehh, so I guess I'm lucky the system is the way it is:D

[Hoki]

I don't know why people are using balance as an argument for anything. There is no balance. Some abilities are flat out better than others. Some abilities are amazingly situational, while others are highly practical all the time.

Asari Adept is a perfect example. They have no bad abilities.

[GroverA 125]

By having set abilities for races, it balances them.

Look at the asari, who have Stasis, to balance this, they cannot evade without losing their defences. Or look at the Krogan, they have better abilities, but are exposed in low cover and cannot evade at all.

If you grant all characters the ability to choose what abilities they can have, then it unbalances the game, as races all have different bonuses (and different shortfalls) which are only fairly placed when the skill loadouts are non-interchangable. Some classes, such as the asari, would be useless because you could get the main thing that equalizes them on a human, who doesn't have much, if any, negatives towards them.