980 réponses à ce sujet

[HK-90210]

Capeo wrote...
Wait.  That's not what you said.  You said there are people who can't look that way and that's not true.  With effort anyone can do it.  And you're never going to see a fat runner, or a chubby cornerback, or a chubby gymnast, or any other sport that requires a mix of strength and heavy cardio.

"Can't" might have ben too strong a term. I meant 'can't' as in 'can't without endangering their health in the process'.

I, for one, will never looked 'ripped'. This is because I have a large amount of excess skin due to more than 200 lbs of weight loss. In three years since I reached my targeted weight, this skin has not gone away. Chances are, it never will unless I do one of two things: cosmetic surgery or starvation/crash dieting. Niether of those two options appeal to me when I am more than capable of running 5 miles a day meeting my monthly fitness goals.

My point was that what one looks like on the outside is not always indicative of their athletic ability. My 280+ lb Brother-in-law can outsprint me because his legs are longer and he's a natural sprinter, even though I'm more than 100 lbs lighter than him. nobdoy would guess this when we stand next to eachother. When people look at me, they see a guy who has some love handles, not the most in-shape person in the room. They don't see someone goes to the weightroom three times a week. What they see isn't what is there.

This is why I find the whole argument here ridiculous.

Modifié par CastonFolarus, 27 février 2012 - 08:58 .

[incinerator950]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

chengthao wrote...

ummmmm . . . yes, they do . . . i see it all the time . . . "dainty" sailors and soldiers carrying 90+ lbs of gear in 130 degree heat

i suggest you go down to your local recruiting office and enlist before arguing with ppl who are way, way, WAY more knowledgeable about the military than you are

You're missing the point, honey.

It's not that skinny or hot is bad.  The problem is that 99% of the women we see in videogames (and pretty much all entertainment) are skinny and hot, while the actual percentage of women who look like that is much, much lower.  Furthermore, the range of actual hotness is much broader, but we keep getting cookie cutter bodies.

I'd whine about BroShep, too, but at least he looks like he can punch a Yahg in the face and make it bleed.

It's amazing that people forget Shepard can be considered a Cyborg with all the implants Shepard got.  TIMs Turian Eye implants, several cardio muscular upgrades, a Skeletal fiber upgrade, muscle weaves. 

[chengthao]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

chengthao wrote...

ummmmm . . . yes, they do . . . i see it all the time . . . "dainty" sailors and soldiers carrying 90+ lbs of gear in 130 degree heat

i suggest you go down to your local recruiting office and enlist before arguing with ppl who are way, way, WAY more knowledgeable about the military than you are

You're missing the point, honey.

It's not that skinny or hot is bad.  The problem is that 99% of the women we see in videogames (and pretty much all entertainment) are skinny and hot, while the actual percentage of women who look like that is much, much lower.  Furthermore, the range of actual hotness is much broader, but we keep getting cookie cutter bodies.

I'd whine about BroShep, too, but at least he looks like he can punch a Yahg in the face and make it bleed.

i'm not missing the point . . . i'm pointing out ppl's "misconception" of military women . . . that somehow if your a female and serve in the military, you have to be some buffed-up butch

if Sheploo looked closer to the way i looked, i would have no complaints, there are skinny ppl who do serve in and alongside the infantry

[Carfax]

chengthao wrote...

ummmmm . . . yes, they do . . . i see it all the time . . . "dainty" sailors and soldiers carrying 90+ lbs of gear in 130 degree heat

i suggest you go down to your local recruiting office and enlist before arguing with ppl who are way, way, WAY more knowledgeable about the military than you are

I think you guys need to redefine what it means to be strong.  Carrying 90+ lbs of gear (or even 140lbs) doesn't mean you're strong, it means you're fit.

Being strong is when you can lift MORE than your body's weight.....much more. 

And you'll see that the strongest people, have a certain kind of build.  Their muscles are both large and dense, which comes from lifting heavy weight.

[the_one_54321]

AdmiralCheez wrote...
The problem is that 99% of the women we see in videogames (and pretty much all entertainment) are skinny and hot, while the actual percentage of women who look like that is much, much lower.

At this point my honest response to this complaint is "so what?" This is entertainment and sex/sexy is entertaining. I have no qualms with wanting fairness, but plain and simple I want the women in my games to be very attractive. If other folks want the men in games to be adequate sex objects as well, hell that's fine with me.

Modifié par the_one_54321, 27 février 2012 - 09:05 .

[Giant ambush beetle]

chengthao wrote...


ummmmm . . . yes, they do . . . i see it all the time . . . "dainty" sailors and soldiers carrying 90+ lbs of gear in 130 degree heat

i suggest you go down to your local recruiting office and enlist before arguing with ppl who are way, way, WAY more knowledgeable about the military than you are

They're rear echelon soldiers,they do not serve on front lines, they do not have to carry wounded comrades to safety, they don't have to haul 17lbs M249's + ammo around, they don't break down doors, they don't have to be physically strong enough to be able to beat male opponents in hand to hand combat.
Female soldiers that can do all of the above won't have the body of a ballet dancer, or a body that looks like FemSheps.
Simple physics, the stronger you are the bigger your muscles are, there is no magical super lean muscles, its pretty simple.

Modifié par The Woldan , 27 février 2012 - 09:02 .

[android654]

Capeo wrote...
They also didn't make Drake look like he bench 400lbs like BW did with Sheploo in this game.  If you're going that route with him they could have certainly given FemShep a more athletic build. 

I liked that they made and kept Drake looking like an average guy, since that is a big part of his charm. The thing with Jane is that she and John are the same person, simply male and female representations but the character is the same. If they were going to make Jane look like that, they should have kept the sedentary look he had in ME2.

Weltenschlange wrote...

android654 wrote...

[...]

Why make John look like Ryan Reynolds and Jane like Lara Flynn Boyle up top and Beyonce from the waist down?

I think that is the crucial question here.

I would really love to hear someone from the art department try and justify this.

[AlexXIV]

incinerator950 wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

chengthao wrote...

ummmmm . . . yes, they do . . . i see it all the time . . . "dainty" sailors and soldiers carrying 90+ lbs of gear in 130 degree heat

i suggest you go down to your local recruiting office and enlist before arguing with ppl who are way, way, WAY more knowledgeable about the military than you are

You're missing the point, honey.

It's not that skinny or hot is bad.  The problem is that 99% of the women we see in videogames (and pretty much all entertainment) are skinny and hot, while the actual percentage of women who look like that is much, much lower.  Furthermore, the range of actual hotness is much broader, but we keep getting cookie cutter bodies.

I'd whine about BroShep, too, but at least he looks like he can punch a Yahg in the face and make it bleed.

It's amazing that people forget Shepard can be considered a Cyborg with all the implants Shepard got.  TIMs Turian Eye implants, several cardio muscular upgrades, a Skeletal fiber upgrade, muscle weaves. 

Muscle is muscle. If artificial or synthetic. Unless he/she is a robot like the Terminater which only works like a machine and has muscles only for show. The thing is if you compare maleShep with femShep you see one athletic guy and one hot woman. And that's just something that shouldn't be. If you look at them both next to each other they both should look like they can actually kick ass and not just look good on a catwalk.

[incinerator950]

the_one_54321 wrote...

incinerator950 wrote...
The problem is that 99% of the women we see in videogames (and pretty much all entertainment) are skinny and hot, while the actual percentage of women who look like that is much, much lower.

At this point my honest response to this complaint is "so what?" This is entertainment and sex/sexy is entertaining. I have no qualms with wanting fairness, but plain and simple I want the women in my games to be very attractive. If other folks want the men in games to be adequate sex objects as well, hell that's fine with me.

I'm not responding with that, I was quoting Ms. Cheez.  

Please correct that.

[chengthao]

BrotherWarth wrote...

If you had read my earlier post you would have seen that I did serve. I was Air Force for 6 years and served on Army and Naval bases. I was in combat areas as well, so I've seen a wide array of servicemen and women. No petite, barely-muscled women were ever carrying full gear in the dense, humid heat of Iraq I can assure you.

well lets see . . . my gf is a 100 lbs and 5' 2" serving as a Navy Corpsman . . . oh and she's been out in the field and combat carrying 90+lbs of medical equipment . . . hmmm . . . let's see, i had a female shipmate who wieghed like 90 lbs carrying her own weight and went out into the field to medavac some wounded Marines

so i'm not sure where you serve but there are women all in the military who are very light/small and can still carry their own equipment

[the_one_54321]

The Woldan wrote...
Female soldiers that can do all of the above won't have the body of a ballet dancer, or a body that looks like FemSheps.
Simple physics, the stronger you are the bigger your muscles are, there is no magical super lean muscles, its pretty simple.

You're just flat out incorrect here. Those physical feats are about proper technique, not muscle mass. Small people can hit very "hard" if they know the right way to hit. Large muscles have only a small and very specific benefit in these kinds of activities.

[android654]

incinerator950 wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

chengthao wrote...

ummmmm . . . yes, they do . . . i see it all the time . . . "dainty" sailors and soldiers carrying 90+ lbs of gear in 130 degree heat

i suggest you go down to your local recruiting office and enlist before arguing with ppl who are way, way, WAY more knowledgeable about the military than you are

You're missing the point, honey.

It's not that skinny or hot is bad.  The problem is that 99% of the women we see in videogames (and pretty much all entertainment) are skinny and hot, while the actual percentage of women who look like that is much, much lower.  Furthermore, the range of actual hotness is much broader, but we keep getting cookie cutter bodies.

I'd whine about BroShep, too, but at least he looks like he can punch a Yahg in the face and make it bleed.

It's amazing that people forget Shepard can be considered a Cyborg with all the implants Shepard got.  TIMs Turian Eye implants, several cardio muscular upgrades, a Skeletal fiber upgrade, muscle weaves. 

Yet John looks like he's been working out and Jane looks like she needs an intervention.

[the_one_54321]

incinerator950 wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...

incinerator950 wrote...
The problem is that 99% of the women we see in videogames (and pretty much all entertainment) are skinny and hot, while the actual percentage of women who look like that is much, much lower.

At this point my honest response to this complaint is "so what?" This is entertainment and sex/sexy is entertaining. I have no qualms with wanting fairness, but plain and simple I want the women in my games to be very attractive. If other folks want the men in games to be adequate sex objects as well, hell that's fine with me.

I'm not responding with that, I was quoting Ms. Cheez.  

Please correct that.

My mistake. Will fix.

[zestyshade]

the_one_54321 wrote...

incinerator950 wrote...
The problem is that 99% of the women we see in videogames (and pretty much all entertainment) are skinny and hot, while the actual percentage of women who look like that is much, much lower.

At this point my honest response to this complaint is "so what?" This is entertainment and sex/sexy is entertaining. I have no qualms with wanting fairness, but plain and simple I want the women in my games to be very attractive. If other folks want the men in games to be adequate sex objects as well, hell that's fine with me.

What about neither being a sex object? Can we just focus on the story at hand? Why does something need to be sexualized? Is it necessary that you ultimately see your character as somebody to drool over?
Additionally, you will never see a situation where a man is sexualized and a woman is not, so the point of sexism stands.

[Randy1012]

Demonique wrote...

...I should go.

[idoless24]

android654 wrote...

incinerator950 wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

chengthao wrote...

ummmmm . . . yes, they do . . . i see it all the time . . . "dainty" sailors and soldiers carrying 90+ lbs of gear in 130 degree heat

i suggest you go down to your local recruiting office and enlist before arguing with ppl who are way, way, WAY more knowledgeable about the military than you are

You're missing the point, honey.

It's not that skinny or hot is bad.  The problem is that 99% of the women we see in videogames (and pretty much all entertainment) are skinny and hot, while the actual percentage of women who look like that is much, much lower.  Furthermore, the range of actual hotness is much broader, but we keep getting cookie cutter bodies.

I'd whine about BroShep, too, but at least he looks like he can punch a Yahg in the face and make it bleed.

It's amazing that people forget Shepard can be considered a Cyborg with all the implants Shepard got.  TIMs Turian Eye implants, several cardio muscular upgrades, a Skeletal fiber upgrade, muscle weaves. 

Yet John looks like he's been working out and Jane looks like she needs an intervention.

Yeah, when put side-by-side you can tell which representation was respected and which was flat out ignored in that area.

[the_one_54321]

zestyshade wrote...
What about neither being a sex object?

No thank you. I like sex and am not ashamed of it.

zestyshade wrote...
Additionally, you will never see a situation where a man is sexualized and a woman is not, so the point of sexism stands.

This is a much larger issue than just video games. My advice is to demand male sex objects. Or whatever your specific perference is therein.

Really, I am sorry that more developers are not paying more attention to equality. But I am not sorry that the things I enjoy are being included in games.

[chengthao]

the_one_54321 wrote...

The Woldan wrote...
Female soldiers that can do all of the above won't have the body of a ballet dancer, or a body that looks like FemSheps.
Simple physics, the stronger you are the bigger your muscles are, there is no magical super lean muscles, its pretty simple.

You're just flat out incorrect here. Those physical feats are about proper technique, not muscle mass. Small people can hit very "hard" if they know the right way to hit. Large muscles have only a small and very specific benefit in these kinds of activities.

exactly . . . i wiegh 140 lbs and can take down a 300 lbs Marine, i can easily drag a 300+ lbs Marine plus all his equipment

being strong doesn't mean you have to be buff . . . i'm cut but my muscles aren't enormous

[corporal doody]

the ONLY beef i have with femshep in her underoos....her thighs are pretty big...and they arent very defined. Figure she would have RIPPED hammies from all that running!!...

on second thought...im okay with them...it aint a beef...just either toned down alil or SHREDDED is what im thinking!

[KBomb]

Honestly, this place has the most confusing people(some, not all of course) I have ever seen when making arguments.

As I said earlier, when femshep punched the SB and some posters were arguing that it looked ridiculous and weird and no way a woman her size could fight with something that huge and win- posters then counter-argued that femShep was genetically and cybernetically enhanced and it made perfect sense!

Now she is a bit skinnier and everyone is saying how she couldn't carry <insert amount of weight< and could never hold her own and etc. etc. and etc. She's either a skinny woman who is modified to kick all kinds of ass, or she's going to have to look like the Hulk. I would rather believe she is genetically modified because I don't want to play a game where she has bulky muscles.

FTR: I don't find her undies offensive. I do find them hilarious.

[Carfax]

the_one_54321 wrote...

You're just flat out incorrect here. Those physical feats are about proper technique, not muscle mass. Small people can hit very "hard" if they know the right way to hit. Large muscles have only a small and very specific benefit in these kinds of activities.

You're the one thats incorrect actually, and Woldan is correct.  Larger muscles have more muscle fibers, therefore can exert more force.  The strongest people all have large, dense muscle mass..

There are some exceptions however, ie bodybuilders.  Bodybuilders use specific weight lifting techniques to increase their muscle size, but not necessarily their strength....ie lifting low to moderate weight for ridiculous amounts of reps.

If you want to be strong, lift heavy weight (heavier than yourself) and low reps with explosive technique..

[AlexXIV]

KBomb wrote...

Honestly, this place has the most confusing people(some, not all of course) I have ever seen when making arguments.

As I said earlier, when femshep punched the SB and some posters were arguing that it looked ridiculous and weird and no way a woman her size could fight with something that huge and win- posters then counter-argued that femShep was genetically and cybernetically enhanced and it made perfect sense!

Now she is a bit skinnier and everyone is saying how she couldn't carry <insert amount of weight< and could never hold her own and etc. etc. and etc. She's either a skinny woman who is modified to kick all kinds of ass, or she's going to have to look like the Hulk. I would rather believe she is genetically modified because I don't want to play a game where she has bulky muscles.

FTR: I don't find her undies offensive. I do find them hilarious.

She doesn't need to look like the Hulk. She-Hulk would do.

Also, what does 'she is genetically modified' mean. Does it say somewhere that she doesn't need to work out anymore? Far as I know she is just genetically optimized. Which means she is the best a human can be. Which is probably not much better than before. Because she was the best already before her resurrection.

[Carfax]

chengthao wrote...

exactly . . . i wiegh 140 lbs and can take down a 300 lbs Marine, i can easily drag a 300+ lbs Marine plus all his equipment

being strong doesn't mean you have to be buff . . . i'm cut but my muscles aren't enormous

Such B.S..