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So we can't get the ending we want after all?


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#29426
Lord Costantino

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Jorojr wrote...

lunamoondragon wrote...

Can't help but feel sad for Bioware, they've done a great job up until this ending. And even if they fix it, they've lost a lot as a result of this mistake. Mass Effect 3 was a beautiful game, ending aside. The whole series was wonderful...
I just hope that they can make it right again.


It's amazing how 10 minutes can do so much damage.  The ending of ME3 hurt the ME/Bioware brand.  Bioware's lack of response, insults, and vagues answers will destroy their fanbase.  


They have straight up damaged it. For instance people WILL be wary when Dragon Age 3 is launched. I bet you that a lot of people are not going to buy it till reviews of it come in from reliable sources. I for one will not buy it till that I see those reviews. They need to make this right and announce they will fix it with a few just endings depending on your choices.

#29427
Mr Chr15topher

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Mr Chr15topher wrote...

Tainan7509 wrote...

Lady_Aescwyn wrote...

Feraiin wrote...

Grunkera wrote...

Matt_gekko88 wrote...

German fleet is getting tired.


thats why we got comrades, to back us up when we need to rest, not beaming themselves out when it gets hard


The German rear-guard is still holding out, we're covering the rest of the fleet for as long as we can.

Rest if you need to and come back stronger in the morning. The American fleets are in full force and we've got your back. We will hold the line!

Don't worry Canadian Fleet is here!!;)

This is the SSV Dorset of the UK fleet. The troops are getting tired and need time to rest. Transfering command now. Keep holding the line for us.

Command transfered. I leave you with this:
You all know the mission and what is
at stake

I have come to trust each of you with
my life

But I have also heard murmurs of
discontent and I share your concerns

We were trained for great endings

We would be legends

But the records are sealed

Glory in battle is not our way

When Bioware gave us a terrible
ending, we held the line

When Gabe knocked us, we held the line

When big gaming sites called us
whiners, we held the line

Our influence will bring us great
endings!

In our stand today

WE WILL HOLD THE LINE!!!

#29428
TheFoxBlade

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So, are these 17 endings just the 3 normal ones, plus the secret one and then just 13 fail states?

#29429
jerobolod

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Menthro wrote...

So I just noticed something, even if we don't get the ending the series deserves one thing is true:

 

also, I have to say this video makes everything....okay for awhile. Still holding the line tho, cause it what shep would want.


Thank you for cheering me up. :D

#29430
KaiserinKai

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Seryndras wrote...

https://twitter.com/...067763778359297

I don't know if I should feel insulted, angry or sad. Or a combination of those.


This is totally 17 diferent endings! /sarcasm

#29431
talk_sick

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the number of replies to this is growing exponentially it seems - faster than the ****storm surrounding ACTA - that alone is an achievement. Also, the chaity donation has managed to get 40k already.

I daresay that is unprecedented.


Having a bit of spare time, I'd like to point out the issues with the ending of ME3:

first - ME3 does NOT have 16 endings. There is only ONE ending - space magic zaps everything - right after Shepard dies, and just before the relays blow up. The whole "your choices matter" thing is utter *****, and repeating that over and over doesn't make it any more true.

All the player's choices boil down to a single number - the EMS. And it doesn't matter.
Wether you have 7000 EMS, or just 1300 EMS, the game plays out the same.
The effect of your EMS is arbitrary, and only applied after the game ends.

And what a huge difference does it make:
An animation sequence shorter than a good ride.

Granted - the little differences are quite crucial for the fate of the galaxy - earth getting destroyed or not, reapers being killed or simply flying away etc.
But it still deserves more than Smokeless Wardance's average B.O.T. worth of animation at the end.

And to make matters worse, the whole EMS thing doesn't make any sense. If it's lower than X (1750 iirc), Earth gets destroyed. Ok, that makes sense (though a 4 second animation is not an adequate representation of such a dramatic fact). If it's lower than 2800, the space kid won't let you go green, and you're forced to choose between red magic and blue magic. Weird, but ok.

If it's higher than 4k and you manage to convince TIM to cap himself, or 5k if you don't, it is implied Shep lives (how is EMS in any way relevant to that). And if it's somewhere between 1700 and 2800, then Earth's fate hinges upon your initial choice to keep/destroy the collector base and final choice of blue/red magic beam. Wait, what?! What does EMS have to do with any of this? How does the decision to blow up/keep the base, that is on the other side of the galaxy (technically at the core, but the only way in is on the other side) affect the outcome of controlling/destroying the reapers?

Seriously - is that the best you can come up with? Like I said, a noob GM's mistake, one I'd expect from a first timer, not the developer of such epic series.


And on a slightly different note - where the hell is the option to toss admiral Gerrel out of the airlock? That's the first thing that came to my mind after it became clear that all he cares about is to bone the geth fleet with his huge lazor, putting in jeopardy the whole galactic war - that's an instant bullet to the head in my book.

As for BW's explanation ("it's an open ending and we'll leave you to fill in the gaps") - it's just a lame way of saying "we were too lazy to make a proper ending".

Don't get me wrong - I still think ME3 is a great game. In fact - I never regretted getting it on release day, and I like it so much that I just started a new game in ME2 (PS3 - go figure) just so I can bring my character over to ME3 and play it out properly.

However - telling people to "imagine the ending" is fundamentally wrong. By that logic, they could just as well imagine playing the game, and save themselves 65 bucks.


I'm not denying the developers' their right to end the story as they like, but...

As a Game Master with over 15 years of experience in pnp roleplaying games, I see the ending as a noob GM's mistake, not something to be proud of.
Again - this has nothing to do with happy/sad ending - it's purely the execution that bothers me.

Games like Halo, Assassin's Creed, Final Fantasy - the character you play is arbitrary. Their personality, morals, and therefore - choices, are all a result of how the storytellers (the game devs) want that character to develop.

But in a game, which aspires to be a RPG (and it is not - skill trees and moddable equipment does nor a rpg make) this goes against the most fundamental idea of the game - that the character you play is your character, and his choices are your choices.


Should there be a positive (ie happy) ending in the game. Of course - it doesn't have to be easy to get, nor 100% happy (more like bittersweet), but it should be there. Why? Because this is supposed to be a rpg, and the player should control his destiny. Making an arbitrary choice for the player is, like I said, a noob GM's mistake.


Sadly, I believe tha the tangled mess that is the ending is beyond redemption, unless BW is willing to rework the entire final assault to take accound of your EMS in a more complex way

#29432
RDSFirebane

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Matt_gekko88 wrote...

What happens to the line if we get our end? :3


It relocates to the happy side of things.

#29433
Yuoaman

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Matt_gekko88 wrote...

What happens to the line if we get our end? :3
Also: what happens to the holes when the cheese is gone?


The line will have held and we will have earned a rest.

#29434
FsDxRAGE_v2

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Matt_gekko88 wrote...

What happens to the line if we get our end? :3
Also: what happens to the holes when the cheese is gone?

Hopefully, the BSN will stay united and not become the ****storm it once was. :D

#29435
jerobolod

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Lord Jaric wrote...

Seryndras wrote...

https://twitter.com/...067763778359297

I don't know if I should feel insulted, angry or sad. Or a combination of those.


and just how are we supposed to get the other 16 endings


I thought there were ONLY "sixteen" different endings? Isn't that what everyone has been saying this whole time?

#29436
kongenial

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But there are sooooo many endings. 17 to be correct. :whistle: 

Edit: Damn to slow ^_^

Modifié par kongenial, 14 mars 2012 - 11:27 .


#29437
Lady_Aescwyn

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Adam-Sadface wrote...

Still holding the line, slumped over the bar in purgatory, spewing barely swallowed Serrice Ice Brandy over my Collector pants and crying to anyone in earshot how I'll never see Miranda again because of a 4 year old boy who's face I want to melt.

Blaaaaargh.

Right next to me, slamming down ryncols and blabbering incoherently about some dude named Kaidan and the end of the universe and how the krogans are gonna resort to eating everyone... all because of the Starchild. T__T

*cries on your shoulder*

#29438
Tainan7509

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Mr Chr15topher wrote...

Mr Chr15topher wrote...

Tainan7509 wrote...

Lady_Aescwyn wrote...

Feraiin wrote...

Grunkera wrote...

Matt_gekko88 wrote...

German fleet is getting tired.


thats why we got comrades, to back us up when we need to rest, not beaming themselves out when it gets hard


The German rear-guard is still holding out, we're covering the rest of the fleet for as long as we can.

Rest if you need to and come back stronger in the morning. The American fleets are in full force and we've got your back. We will hold the line!

Don't worry Canadian Fleet is here!!;)

This is the SSV Dorset of the UK fleet. The troops are getting tired and need time to rest. Transfering command now. Keep holding the line for us.

Command transfered. I leave you with this:
You all know the mission and what is
at stake

I have come to trust each of you with
my life

But I have also heard murmurs of
discontent and I share your concerns

We were trained for great endings

We would be legends

But the records are sealed

Glory in battle is not our way

When Bioware gave us a terrible
ending, we held the line

When Gabe knocked us, we held the line

When big gaming sites called us
whiners, we held the line

Our influence will bring us great
endings!

In our stand today

WE WILL HOLD THE LINE!!!

Got it. Now We will continue to hold the line!!

#29439
teenpanda

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What 17 endings? Are they referring to the normandy's crash landing and different squad mates walking out of the Normandy? That doesn't count.

#29440
XenoAlbedo

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Wrong link, sorry

Modifié par XenoAlbedo, 14 mars 2012 - 11:27 .


#29441
Jorojr

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kongenial wrote...

But there are sooooo many endings. 17 to be correct. :whistle: 


All three endings are presented by the three primary colors...combination?  

#29442
Richard STIHL

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Image IPB

#29443
Grunkera

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teenpanda wrote...

What 17 endings? Are they referring to the normandy's crash landing and different squad mates walking out of the Normandy? That doesn't count.


when different colours count then squadmates count just as much

#29444
Bionic Weapon

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CerberusMolecularNetwork wrote...

Listen to this guy! There is nothing else to say! He tells the TRUTH!





I love Jeremy! I also agree that a happy ending is plausible and needed for those who earned it. I know I would love to see that Shepard and Garrus beach scenario he mentioned or even TIM on trial, I'd destroy him so good.
:)

#29445
Guest_PDesign_*

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#29446
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A member of the Vancouver fleet needs to resupply.

Hold the line.

*for the little blue babies

#29447
ld1449

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Matt_gekko88 wrote...

What happens to the line if we get our end? :3
Also: what happens to the holes when the cheese is gone?


As far as I'm concerned the line doesn't go anywhere. We've already proven we can come together for something like this. And we can do it again if necesary. After we get our ending we tell Bioware and EA:

"This is our Line. Don't cross it."

#29448
Hydralysk

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Matt_gekko88 wrote...

What happens to the line if we get our end? :3
Also: what happens to the holes when the cheese is gone?


Well obviously if we get our end we'll reference it in our inspirational speeches for generations to come. "Our influence made Garrus a LI, but before that we HELD THE LINE. Our Influence stoppered the ending's plotholes, but before that we HELD THE LINE"

#29449
Richard STIHL

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#29450
Lord Costantino

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Astralify wrote...

FlyingCow371 wrote...

Hey, I remember some talk a while back, pre-release, about endings getting leaked...where did they go? Were they any better than what we ended up with here?



This is what ending were supposed to be:

Tazzmission wrote...

 proof endings were changed





After
checking these boards, bioware forums, the twitters of various people
involved with the game, audio file rips as well as some information I've
gathered from other sources, I decided to talk with someone who used to
run their own review website who still has ties to some people in the
video game industry. That includes Bioware (they had sent him early
review copies of the first ME). Anyway that's not what's important. The
point is what I'm about to say you can take with a grain of salt if you
want. I'm not here for attention or because I'm a fanboy of bioware. I'm
simply here to help you all make sense of this situation. It will make a
lot of sense and put the little things you've all found together. The
reasoning for the ending change was they needed more time to implement
it (this was supposed to be the reason for the delay) but Kinect
implementation and the desire by some people (perhaps EA) to have an
ending where things are left to interpretation messed with this. The
ending was quickly altered which is why things don't "fit" and there are
plot holes. Anyway, below is how things were supposed to happen.

The
original ending was SUPPOSED to be extremely varied. Everything
remained the same up until the part when Harbinger shoots at you and
your team. This is when information that has appeared here already comes
into play. There were going to be various outcomes determining how you
reached the citadel and it was HOW you got there that determined what
endings would be available to you. The following were the different
scenarios from worst to best (based on EMS and war assets)

A:
Your whole squad gets wiped out (the two crew members you took with you,
Anderson). You struggle to make it to the citadel. Right as you're
about to make it to the beam, Harbinger talks to you, saying you've been
defeated and he kills you. Joker tries to swoop down to save you, but
he also gets shot down.

B: Most of your squad gets wiped out.
Still only you are able to make it to the citadel. Once up there, you
must confront the illusive man alone. Because of this, unless you have
high reputation and either talk him down or renegade interrupt and shoot
him, he kills you and tries to control the reapers, but fails as he
discovers he was indoctrinated. 

C: You and Anderson make it up
to the citadel together and make your way to the control panel where you
confront TIM. The same thing plays out where you can talk him down.
With high enough reputation, you can "save" Anderson but its not
necessary for you to make it to the next part. Anderson dies after TIM
is shot or kills himself like in the ending we got.

D: You and
Anderson make it up to the citadel together while you're two squad
maters, who clearly survive, are holding off the reapers from following
you to the citadel. Everything continues the same here as "C" until
after TIM is shot and killed and the final conversation that Anderson
and Shepard have (which is much longer than what we got). You get the
shorter convo in C.

[The following you only see with outcome "C'
and "D"] Shepard looks out at the war going on and activates the
crucible. Hacketts says its not working. This is when Harbinger talks to
Shepard through TIM as he lies on the ground. Harbinger tries to
convince you that you've fail but you can argue with him. Harbinger says
that he has your crew in his cross hairs. We see the Normandy arrive
(the joker dialogue that was cut) and the rest of your friends help the
two squad members you brought with you face off against Harbinger and
his reaper minions.
---
http://i46.tinypic.com/n49ick.jpgXXX_Inferno_XXX
Posted 3/13/2012 8:45:43 AM
message detailYou
basically have a choice. You can submit to him and he claims he will
spare your squad and earth until the next cycle because he is impressed
that you were able to make it this far. This is when the motive of the
reapers is more clearly established. Harbinger reveals that in the
previous cycle, the prothean empire became too vast and they began to
control all the other races, which would have prevented all of our races
from developing. However, through more discussion, Shepard can uncover
their true motives. They fear that they will be rivaled by something
more powerful than they are (that this cycle will create AI that can
topple the reapers). This implies they are merely fearful for their own
survival and that is why they purge all life but they convince
themselves they are protecting us.

Either way, you can submit to
him and save your people or take your chances. Having 4000 EMS, not
submitting to him you would lose everyone, but still eventually get to
the three choices we actually got (more on this in a second). Having
5000+ and depending on how you resolved conflicts between characters and
races, certain people will live or die. 

After rejecting him
(whether you lose everyone or not), you end up in the area where vent
boy was but hes not there. It's just you and "Harbinger". He explains
that a new solution is needed. The solution he tries to convince you to
take is merge (to perseve his kind). But if you have high enough
reputation once again, you can open the control and destroy option.
Harbinger tries to talk you out of it by discussing how your races are
divided and mentioning the geth incident. You convince him otherwise,
and it is at this point, the control option opens next where he admits
that shepard may have a perspective he never considered. Harbinger tells
Shepard that if he destroys them, the relays will be destroyed as will
the geth (which is true. This is the only ending where the relays are
destroyed).

Now for the four endings.

If you submit to him
before the three main choices, the reapers leave earth but end up
wiping out every other race who haven't proved themselves worthy.
Shepard dies.

If you merge, the reapers leave and like the ending
we got, we see all the characters we know with green eyes as a green
light brightens the sky. Shepard dies for the same reasons in the ending
we got.

The control option, the reapers leave. Everyone
cautiously celebrates while joker and your LI look up to the sky and
wonder what exactly happened. Life goes on but its hinted that the
reaper threat may return. This ending ends on a cliffhanger.

The
destroy ending does destroy the relays, but its implied that with all
the races on earth, they, together, will restore what they lost and will
attempt to work together. if shepard lives, your LI leading your squad,
will be looking for you. You are beamed back down to earth (its assumed
shepard was somehow blasted into the beam? this is the only
questionable part). It ends with shepard's hand coming out of the rubble
and breathing. Still a cliffhanger of sorts, but you can assume they
will find him/her obviously.
---
http://i46.tinypic.com/n49ick.jpg







http://www.gamefaqs....fect-3/62230265


It was (slightly) better than what we've got.. :crying:


Those may be better but the Space God Child still bothers me

Modifié par Lord Costantino, 14 mars 2012 - 11:30 .