101103 réponses à ce sujet

[HoldTheLine]

Hi my fellow night owls!! I just wanted to come by and post something that I wrote earlier on the Demand a Better Ending for Mass Effect 3 page.  Please...no flaming

Mass Effect 3 was the best game I ever played--I laughed, I cried, and in the end my Shepard died heroically to save the galaxy (even though that 'space magic' thing made no sense and of course there's the whole dark energy plot hole). But then, things went bad. I mean, stranding the crew on some random planet, destroying the relays, not knowing the fate of the galaxy Shepard gave her life for...sorry Bioware, but that's not right. I feel like I was given an incomplete game. All I want is some DLC in which I learn more about what happened after Shepard's demise. That's all I'm asking. Hell, at this point, I'd even pay for it--despite already buying the Collector's Edition and a guide riddled with inaccuracies (Grand total of over $100, so if it was free that'd be awesome). So please, Bioware, if you're listening, make this happen!!!

Modifié par HoldTheLine, 17 mars 2012 - 06:13 .

[People4Peace]

pikey1969 wrote...

baronkohinar wrote...

pikey1969 wrote...

Before I post, I personally thought the trilogy was wrapped up poorly and certainly flawed. Now...

The Re-Take campaign appears to be over. Sorry folks.

Something worth fighting for is worth more than a single week's perseverance. This is the time that will define us. If it wasn't a little hard (and face it, being nice to each other and sending letters/emails isn't particularly difficult in the grand scheme of things), everyone would do it. Don't be divided. Don't lose help. Hold the line.

Good on you, but really, you have even less hope than Shepard did against the crap ending.

Dude, you're giving up. Plain and simple.

To me and to many others it isn't over until they say "THERE WILL BE NO POST ENDING DLC!" And guess what? They have NOT done that yet. This isn't the time to freak out or give up.

It's time to unite and stick together. It's easy to get depressed about the whole situation but there is still hope and there is a lot of evidence to support this. If you want to give up, fine. BUT don't bring that attitude here. Because we're united, we're strong and WE WILL GET THROUGH THIS!

As for everyone else (including myself) we WILL be holding the line!!!

[pikey1969]

infinitekilan wrote...

pikey1969 wrote...

Reptilian Rob wrote...

pikey1969 wrote...
redacted. go tothis..

Quitter. 

Naw, never started. Don't get me wrong, you have no idea how much I also think the ending was crap.

But before this movement even got the heights it did, I kinda saw this coming.

It is what it is, the ending was crap and there's not much that can be done about it. The sooner you accept that, the sooner you can actually appreciate the 99 percent of the trilogy that was well-done and how significant it will be to RPGs in the future.

Like other great developers that have really risen in the past couple decades like Blizzard, Valve, Bungie, and etc, Bioware set a new space for itself in the gaming industry.

It's just too bad that one of their most defining works also has one of the sloppiest endings in the history of gaming.

You obviously don't understand the basics of consumerism, then. Bioware is viewing this from a purely financial standpoint; if we keep our movement going long enough, they will give us what we ask for in order to save their profits.

I understand it a decent amount actually.

From a purely financial point, they're gonna be fine. Whether it's actually true or not, Bioware has more or less successfully contained the outbreak to within BSN at this point. While Child's Play became a bit of an unexpected anamoly in that, Bioware more or less countered it with the unique characteristics of the gaming media outlets, they will stop at nothing to 'validate' the integrity of games and their profession (and exclusives/previews/leaks).

There has been a decent amount of coverage on ReTake Mass Effect, but in case you haven't noticed, most of the opinions on the movement are ones that ridicule the efforts. Guess what, these are the same guys that millions of gamers sheepishly follow for purchasing opinions and their 'gamer validations'.

Not to mention the BSN community which I gather has around 60-70k active in this issue, is already starting to falter on their 'strong feelings' over the game. Nevermind all the 'the ending wasn't that bad' or 'i liked the ending' threads that have been getting spammed out by the ending haters.

This isn't to mention, the game itself is fine, the only thing that sucks is the ending. For most that's gonna be acceptable, if not forgettable the next time they're looking at a Bioware game. That isn't to mention, the media with millions of followers will be supporting them as well. Bioware didn't make a ****ty game, they just made a great game with a terrrrible ending. There's a difference. Until they start making genuinely terrible games, they're not losing any customers.

Modifié par pikey1969, 17 mars 2012 - 06:14 .

[TheSteelArcher]

ld1449 wrote...

pikey1969 wrote...

baronkohinar wrote...

pikey1969 wrote...

Before I post, I personally thought the trilogy was wrapped up poorly and certainly flawed. Now...

The Re-Take campaign appears to be over. Sorry folks.

Something worth fighting for is worth more than a single week's perseverance. This is the time that will define us. If it wasn't a little hard (and face it, being nice to each other and sending letters/emails isn't particularly difficult in the grand scheme of things), everyone would do it. Don't be divided. Don't lose help. Hold the line.

Good on you, but really, you have even less hope than Shepard did against the crap ending.

Perhaps we do. Perhaps all of this was for nothing. But I can certainly say that I tried. Perhaps that means little to you. But when the day comes that we get the definitive answer.

We won

We lost

On that day I can still hold my head up and say that I at least tried something. Which is more than you can say. To naysay and say it was always hopeless is just the equivalent of rolling over and dying and give every other gaming company the green light to pull this kinda **** again. At least now they'll at least think twice before passing some piece of **** as an ending and call it art.

Maybe you're right, maybe we can't win this. But we'll fight regardless, no matter how insignifcant we might be. We will fight, we will sacrifice, and we will find a way.

In all seriousness, though, it's about making a statement, like he said. Maybe we won't succeed, but we will send a message that consumers aren't going to be stepped on.

[Emo Solus]

Been following on the sidelines trying to read all the pages and by the time I read one page there was one more page to read before I got to the last one lol. Now its 06:13 am o-O So yeah Sleep time.
Hold the Line! (If it helps, draw a line on some paper and hold it =3)
Keelah Se'lai!

[sumo390]

Wow, can't believe I missed what the Dragon Age Origins lead designer wrote earlier.
http://social.biowar...ndex/10087809/1

[Generic Name]

beetlebailey123 wrote...

I just read that PR thread it's very interesting, and kind of motivating. Here is the link people really should read it. http://social.biowar...dex/10084349/1. HOLD THE LINE! We are getting closer people!

That thread has been motivating. I'm slightly less depressed because of it.

[pikey1969]

People4Peace wrote...

pikey1969 wrote...

baronkohinar wrote...

pikey1969 wrote...

Before I post, I personally thought the trilogy was wrapped up poorly and certainly flawed. Now...

The Re-Take campaign appears to be over. Sorry folks.

Something worth fighting for is worth more than a single week's perseverance. This is the time that will define us. If it wasn't a little hard (and face it, being nice to each other and sending letters/emails isn't particularly difficult in the grand scheme of things), everyone would do it. Don't be divided. Don't lose help. Hold the line.

Good on you, but really, you have even less hope than Shepard did against the crap ending.

Dude, you're giving up. Plain and simple.

To me and to many others it isn't over until they say "THERE WILL BE NO POST ENDING DLC!" And guess what? They have NOT done that yet. This isn't the time to freak out or give up.

It's time to unite and stick together. It's easy to get depressed about the whole situation but there is still hope and there is a lot of evidence to support this. If you want to give up, fine. BUT don't bring that attitude here. Because we're united, we're strong and WE WILL GET THROUGH THIS!

As for everyone else (including myself) we WILL be holding the line!!!

That would be a stupid, stupid move for them. It'd be far better for Bioware to just ride this out then give it more fuel/vitriol.

[IndustrializedTaco]

Can someone please post the Bioware email. Also tell me when that is starting?

[ld1449]

infinitekilan wrote...

Some people are falling for the crap responses Bioware is throwing at us. "You haven't seen the last of Commander Shepard." Goodie? You're probably right. I KNOW I'll see pictures of him between now and some random time in the future. I know you're planning on releasing some form of SP DLC.

But your answer is not the answer to the question we are asking. We want a DEFINITIVE ANSWER. YES, we will get new endings, or NO, we will not. Until you give us a straightforward answer to our query, we will not back down.

And everyone falling for their damage control tactics, stop it. You're making the line weaker.

People need hope. Us all sitting here in gloom and doom won't ultimately help anyone.

I won't play the multiplayer, and that's the truth. What I will say is that the botom line does not change. If they refuse to change these endings, flat out say no. Or just ignore the problem, Games still have a long memory. And every time they pick up a game that says Bioware at the fron't they'll think back to this and put the thing down until the trilogy is complete and they know that things arent that bad.

Bioware may be able to recover from such hesitation in 10 plus years, but in the short term, they're gonna feel it and they're gonna feel it bad.

And as long as people make their presence still heard and still known every now and again The line is still strong. We're just at a temporary ceasefire as far as I can see

[Cro730]

beetlebailey123 wrote...

Can someone please post the Bioware email. Also tell me when that is starting?

contact@bioware.com
it starts March 17.

[zephyrus92]

Ok... Another repost for the letter campaign:
Send your letters (or emails) to BioWare on March 17th!

Mailing Address:
BioWare Edmonton
200-4445 Calgary Trail NW
Edmonton AB
Canada T6H 5R7

E-mail: contact@bioware.com

[pikey1969]

GiBBsBoT05 wrote...

pikey1969 wrote...

baronkohinar wrote...

pikey1969 wrote...

Before I post, I personally thought the trilogy was wrapped up poorly and certainly flawed. Now...

The Re-Take campaign appears to be over. Sorry folks.

Something worth fighting for is worth more than a single week's perseverance. This is the time that will define us. If it wasn't a little hard (and face it, being nice to each other and sending letters/emails isn't particularly difficult in the grand scheme of things), everyone would do it. Don't be divided. Don't lose help. Hold the line.

Good on you, but really, you have even less hope than Shepard did against the crap ending.

No way. It isn't dying down, it is growing! There are plenty of people who haven't beaten the game yet and don't know what all the fuss is. Heck, I just beat it two days ago and found out everyone was as upset about the ending as I was. I have three friends who are planning on beating it this weekend.

In other words - reinforcements are on their way. Just have to make it known. If any game developer would listen to it's fanbase, I'd bet on Bioware.

Will it really grow?

The media damage control is over, this movement has been firmly depicted as a movement of a disgruntled/entitled minority.

When their favorite gaming editors and outlets send out that message, people will follow. People are more impressionable/influenced than you think.

[IndustrializedTaco]

Cro730 wrote...

beetlebailey123 wrote...

Can someone please post the Bioware email. Also tell me when that is starting?

contact@bioware.com
it starts March 17.

Thanks.

[wicked_being]

New post in the PR thread (page 27). And please stop answering that nay-sayer troll.

atghunter wrote...

Greetings all,

I promise some
individual answers (working my way forward from page 18 atm) and my wife
thanks you all for letting me have dinner. But first, a take on the
latest Bioware maneuvers from a PR perspective.

First, I’ve
never met Ms. Merizan personally, but I’ve read some of her tweets and
find her to be an engaging and personable individual online. She is a PR
guys dream because I believe she genuinely has empathy for the players
and it shows.

That said, please remember that she (like everyone
else in this storm at Bioware is saying nothing more than they are
being told/authorized to say).

So on to the post. Of course,
we’ve covered the whole churning things out on Friday night to avoid the
news cycle under Mr. Hudson’s post. Standard Operating Procedure
there. However, the tenor of Ms. Merizan's post is much better
than what we’ve been seeing in the last 24 hours. Moreover, it is simply
less of a CYA publicity statement acknowledging a situation but
minimalizing the problem. Notice she drops the pretense of “most people
love this but a few people may disagree” and heads straight into a quasi
“throat exposure” by saying:

“In order for a collaboration
between the devs and the fans to work, I need you guys to CONTINUE being
constructive, and organizing your thoughts. I know where to look, but I
need you to help me by contributing to the dialogue.”

It
is a direct communication to the offended customers. No promise of
change to be sure, but probably the first genuine offer to discuss this
issue in terms of possible collaboration vs. discussion/explanation. It
won’t make the news b/c of Mr. Hudson’s statement issued shortly before
as a media "screen" (though honestly, this was probably the intended
message the PR guys want us to have all along).

As I mentioned
before, once you gain acknowledgement, you have taken the first step in a
PR campaign towards a compromise. Lots of road ahead, but to that end,
well done.

Also take that Ms. Merizan acknowledges the positive aspect
of the RetakeME3 movement. From a PR standpoint, it’s like
acknowledging the people you are presently struggling with actually have
virtue. You’re not saying they are right, but you aren’t simply
acknowledging their presence either. Mind you this can also be a gambit
to 1) deflect (as we’ve previously discussed) or 2) to enrage (i.e. hope
that the players will refuse to communicate and thus be seen as
unreasonable at this overture). Best PR counter response: strength,
civility, a touch of wariness and loads of conviction.

The only
troubling thing I can see is the collecting feedback data for “weeks”
comment when the game went into full release only about 12 days ago, but
I’m guessing that was possibly a PR guy’s oversight who assumed (based
on the historical curve of these kind of things) that this matter has
devolved in a much longer time that has actually elapsed. But it is
equally possible she has been keeping track as well. Still doesn’t
detract from the tone of the message.

Much less deflection, a
bit more acknowledgement. If it hasn’t become clear, these fights (and
make no mistake, they are fights be it abet civil ones) are of move and
counter-move.

Continue to make your voices heard. Give them the
concise arguments I’ve read on this forum a hundred times (regardless
of your side). This is a game of choices, and call me an old optimist,
but I have to believe there is enough room on my hard drive for some
endings for both the producers and we consumers. Continue to post
respectfully, but with the passion and conviction that inspires an old
gamer like me. If you do, and this ultimately turns out to be a
deflection, it is a dangerous one for EA/Bioware.

Here's
why. One of the greatest lessons of PR is don’t offer to negotiate,
unless you mean it. Doing so and ultimately being outed is called
“Brokering Solutions but Delivering Stonewalls”. Not to be melodramatic,
when I did this work, we called it something else…

Sudden Death

[ld1449]

Pikey. Why are you here? What exactly is your purpose besides just telling everyone that wants to see this through that we're all a bunch of idiots wasting our time? What exactly do you gain from this? Do you gain anything at all?

[JPR1964]

The message asking for more informations / details is nice, but it can be PR talk...

You know, canalizing all the angry players in one post, soon to be forgotten...

Personnaly, until I see really something coming out all this, I'm done with ME3 and all upcoming DLC... (I bought all ME1 et ME2 DLC)

And I'm done with preordering Bioware/EA game : I will now wait before buying anything else to them...

Hold the line!

JPR out!

[Bruinbear]

Hold the line brothers and sisters!

Ps Don't feed the trolls!

[Generic Name]

Stop feeding the trolls

Do not purchase DLC until there is an actual ending.

Do not stop holding the line!

[Tazzmission]

 The Final Hours of Mass Effect 3, Geoff Keighley's behind-the-scenes iOS app, has revealed some new details about the game's controversial ending that will likely give irate fans even more reason to be upset. Be warned: there are quite a few spoilers scattered throughout, so don't read on unless you've already completed the game.While former lead writer Drew Karphysyn had said that the broader strokes of the endingwere in place for years, it seems the specifics were hammered out remarkably late in the game's development cycle. The team actually delayed a recording session with Illusive Man voice actor Martin Sheen from August into November, so that the writers would have more time to finish off the dialogue for the ending.What's more, the ending was initially written to provide a much more robust explanation of the game's surprising — and to some, confusing — last-minute twist. According to writer Mac Walters:

"Originally, with the Catalyst, the Star Child at the end of the game, I had written that much more in the guise of a investigative style conversation, where there is something he tells you but then, you get to ask a bunch of questions and you get your questions answered. But then me and Casey talked and decided, let's keep the conversation high level, give you the details that you need to know, but don't get into the stuff that you don't need to know. Like 'How long have they been reaping?'. You don't need to know the answers to the Mass Effect universe, so we intentionally left those out."

In the end, Watlers decided to end the game in a way that would lead to, in his words, "lots of speculation for everyone."And as for complaints that the game's three endings don't provide enough variety? As late as November, the developers were considering at least one drastically different ending that was eventually scrapped. The sequence would have seen the player lose control of Commander Shepard, revealing that he or she had actually been indoctrinated by the Reapers. This ending was eventually cut for technical reasons, as the team was having a hard time making the gameplay mechanic work alongside dialogue choices.Another common complaint centers on the ending's lack of any real boss fight. The closest thing to it, the showdown with Kai Leng at Cerberus HQ, occurs more than an hour before the game finally wraps, leaving many fans upset that Mass Effect 3's gameplay ends on a somewhat anticlimactic note.Turns out, you were originally supposed to have a showdown with the Illusive Man just before the end of the game, but the team ultimately scrapped the idea because it felt too "video gamey" and predictable.To add insult to injury, the app apparently also reveals that the much contested day-one DLC pack, From Ashes, was, in fact, originally intended to be a part of the main game before time constraints caused the team to convert it to DLC instead.Frankly, none of these revelations bode particularly well for BioWare, as many of them only serve to confirm the suspicisions of the game's unruly fanbase. Given the nature of game development, it's wholly unfair to claim that BioWare ruined the ending by rushing it out the door at the last minute, but it certainly won't be easy to convince the detractors of that when these new details play so handily into their arguments.
http://www.gameranx....nding/:whistle:

[Ronnocloki]

While I appreciate Mr. Hudson taking the time to address us I will be abiding by my previous conviction. I will not be buying Mass Effect 3 dlc or any other Bioware games until such time as a dlc that alters the endings by: correcting the rampant plot holes, reflecting player choice, and staying true to the heroic character of Commander Shepard is released.

Hold the Line!

[pikey1969]

wicked_being wrote...

New post in the PR thread (page 27). And please stop answering that nay-sayer troll.

atghunter wrote...

Greetings all,

I promise some
individual answers (working my way forward from page 18 atm) and my wife
thanks you all for letting me have dinner. But first, a take on the
latest Bioware maneuvers from a PR perspective.

First, I’ve
never met Ms. Merizan personally, but I’ve read some of her tweets and
find her to be an engaging and personable individual online. She is a PR
guys dream because I believe she genuinely has empathy for the players
and it shows.

That said, please remember that she (like everyone
else in this storm at Bioware is saying nothing more than they are
being told/authorized to say).

So on to the post. Of course,
we’ve covered the whole churning things out on Friday night to avoid the
news cycle under Mr. Hudson’s post. Standard Operating Procedure
there. However, the tenor of Ms. Merizan's post is much better
than what we’ve been seeing in the last 24 hours. Moreover, it is simply
less of a CYA publicity statement acknowledging a situation but
minimalizing the problem. Notice she drops the pretense of “most people
love this but a few people may disagree” and heads straight into a quasi
“throat exposure” by saying:

“In order for a collaboration
between the devs and the fans to work, I need you guys to CONTINUE being
constructive, and organizing your thoughts. I know where to look, but I
need you to help me by contributing to the dialogue.”

It
is a direct communication to the offended customers. No promise of
change to be sure, but probably the first genuine offer to discuss this
issue in terms of possible collaboration vs. discussion/explanation. It
won’t make the news b/c of Mr. Hudson’s statement issued shortly before
as a media "screen" (though honestly, this was probably the intended
message the PR guys want us to have all along).

As I mentioned
before, once you gain acknowledgement, you have taken the first step in a
PR campaign towards a compromise. Lots of road ahead, but to that end,
well done.

Also take that Ms. Merizan acknowledges the positive aspect
of the RetakeME3 movement. From a PR standpoint, it’s like
acknowledging the people you are presently struggling with actually have
virtue. You’re not saying they are right, but you aren’t simply
acknowledging their presence either. Mind you this can also be a gambit
to 1) deflect (as we’ve previously discussed) or 2) to enrage (i.e. hope
that the players will refuse to communicate and thus be seen as
unreasonable at this overture). Best PR counter response: strength,
civility, a touch of wariness and loads of conviction.

The only
troubling thing I can see is the collecting feedback data for “weeks”
comment when the game went into full release only about 12 days ago, but
I’m guessing that was possibly a PR guy’s oversight who assumed (based
on the historical curve of these kind of things) that this matter has
devolved in a much longer time that has actually elapsed. But it is
equally possible she has been keeping track as well. Still doesn’t
detract from the tone of the message.

Much less deflection, a
bit more acknowledgement. If it hasn’t become clear, these fights (and
make no mistake, they are fights be it abet civil ones) are of move and
counter-move.

Continue to make your voices heard. Give them the
concise arguments I’ve read on this forum a hundred times (regardless
of your side). This is a game of choices, and call me an old optimist,
but I have to believe there is enough room on my hard drive for some
endings for both the producers and we consumers. Continue to post
respectfully, but with the passion and conviction that inspires an old
gamer like me. If you do, and this ultimately turns out to be a
deflection, it is a dangerous one for EA/Bioware.

Here's
why. One of the greatest lessons of PR is don’t offer to negotiate,
unless you mean it. Doing so and ultimately being outed is called
“Brokering Solutions but Delivering Stonewalls”. Not to be melodramatic,
when I did this work, we called it something else…

Sudden Death

Everything I read, only reinforces my point. You guys are in way over your heads if you think this is actually going to work.

[evisneffo]

Keep it civil! People are allowed to have dissenting opinions. That goes for both sides.

[People4Peace]

TROOPS:
Ignore the Debbie Downers (No offense to anyone with the name Debbie:P). They're only trying to bring us down to their level. Have pity on them for they have given up hope. We know better. We are making progress. I think that's obvious to us all. We (should) have more hope than we did a week ago.

But I have a feeling I don't need to lecture you all because you already know this!

HOLD the line!

[Edbi]

My longtime friend asked me to play with him during N7 challenge, if I refuse I won't be better then those ME3 endings.
I don't like endings and I hold and will hold the line.
But I am not with things like ending TOR subscription etc. It is childish.
And my friends are more to me then any game or company.
We all have our own ways how to support "change" - from signatures to donation.
Please don't be like starchild, let us choose our own path