101103 réponses à ce sujet

[Joyceee]

Thank you for the redirection to the poll on GameFAQs. Finally managed to place my vote. Cheers!

[ashley_actually]

xHezz90 wrote...

Koobarex wrote...

It's that time again.

Marauder Shields: Shepard's Last Foe
EPISODE 9: The Thin Blue Line
*snip*

Yay new M.Shields comic, I love you *cough* I mean these 

I'll say it. I love you Koobarex thank you for the satisfying entertainment. 

[DeathsAudit]

EmEr77 wrote...

I knew this was going to happen. Eventually the BioWare team was going to pull the "artistic integrity" card on us. Which is fine. I am both a writer, and an illustrator, and I enjoy having creative freedoms to produce what pleases me, and what makes my soul happy, regardless of what the people around me may think. To an extent, that's fine. But if I plan on producing my art for the masses, I better be prepared to gracefully accept the criticism that comes with it. That's just what happens when you take the gamble to be an artist in a public forum of any kind. Video games, movies, books, etc.

Case in point: I just went through a workshop for one of my stories. A workshop, is a forum of like-minded people, in this case, writers, who all read your story in advance and come and talk about it for a few hours. That's just a few hours. They give you their feedback, how they received it, what they appreciated or didn't appreciate about it, while I carefully take notes. Is it personal? Hell yes it's personal. This is my work, this is my brainchild. Is progress something that is achieved in a vacuum? No. It's not. For my own personal growth, it is imperative that I gain the necessary help from others to succeed. Not just anybody mind you, but people who share in my passions, and people who are actually willing to dedicate time to my work.

What is going on right now with the ending of this game is a workshop, on a much grander scale, with those who are "workshopping" the game being the players themselves. I'm not the only writer out there who sat back and looked at the ending of this game from a WRITERLY standpoint and said "there are massive plot holes, inconsistencies with character, and a surprising lack of continuity with this ending; completely unbecoming of the previous caliber of work we've come to expect of this company and its creative team."

Artistic integrity? Perhaps. However, I find it very difficult to believe much in the idea of "integrity" when it merely translates to stubbornness. Sure you have artistic greats like Picasso and Hemingway who were only recognized for their genius after their time, but is this moment truly anything like those men? I actually do not believe so. For the simple fact that the excellence of BioWare is something that has been recognized already, and because of this fact, they have a duty not only to their fans, but to themselves to continue to live up to the quality that THEY THEMSELVES have established. It's not our fault these people are nothing but constant displays of excellence and creative genius.

But no one is perfect, and it's important to remember that when someone falls short, there is more honor to be had in admitting fault, and accepting the help and positive constructive feedback of those who are actually giving such (which is a massive amount of the community, the numbers of flamers compared to the civil individuals is staggeringly different) because they care. What BioWare did was introduce an entirely new element to playing video games, one that was sort of tried in the past with other titles and other companies, but never fully realized... until BioWare.

I have nothing but the utmost respect for the BioWare team, and I'm not a fancy high-paid high-profile writer or illustrator, but I do know and value enough of my craft to count myself as someone able to give well thought out constructive criticism.

The ending of this game was beautiful, and absolutely intense. It is not something to be belittled--but it belonged to an entirely different story line, and an entirely different set of circumstances. Instead of an ending that displayed the culmination of work between both the development team and the gamers themselves, it seemed to cut out the gaming community entirely. Never mind what the critics say... critics can be bought. I look to the indie critics, the lesser-named publications, even the no-names--the ones who do this for the passion of it, and they are not happy. They are a reflection of the overall feeling of the community.

The real meaning of artistic integrity is being willing to admit both the wonders and flaws in your work, and accepting the opinion of those who you take the chance of showing it to. It is believing enough in yourself to know that no amount of money or notoriety means you are perfect--you are a being who is always growing and changing, and that if you ever hope to progress you cannot do so in a vacuum.

Well said! I share these sentiments as an amateur writer myself

Hold the Line!

[RussianOrc]

TamiBx wrote...

RussianOrc wrote...

Joyceee wrote...

RussianOrc wrote...

http://www.gamefaqs.....html?poll=4666
Good work the balance is changing very quickly.

Sorry, this is going to sound really stupid, but how do you vote on this poll? Do you have to make an account?

Unfortunately yes.

I don't think so. Just go to the main page (Home) and it's on your right side. 

Sorry i have an account, didn't knew.

[Xyalon]

RussianOrc wrote...

Joyceee wrote...

RussianOrc wrote...

http://www.gamefaqs.....html?poll=4666
Good work the balance is changing very quickly.

Sorry, this is going to sound really stupid, but how do you vote on this poll? Do you have to make an account?

Unfortunately yes.

I didn't.

I just picked an option and hit Vote.

[WvStolzing]

B33ker wrote...
I don't know, but even if you don't like his exact ideas, it's so obvious that he "gets it" better than even the people at EA/BW seem to.

Absolutely. Though the 2nd installment is somewhat unfocused.

Extremely imaginative take on Cerberus!

[TamiBx]

RussianOrc wrote...  

Sorry i have an account, didn't knew.

It's okay, everyone makes mistakes. 

If only Bioware would realize that too...

[DJBare]

Chronor wrote...

Don't do the poll. The question is skewed and makes us sound like deprived babies. Not really the impression we want to express is it?

People are going to vote anyway, it's passion that's driving them, besides with all the other votes going around, that one is small fish.

[AxisEvolve]

Is the poll over? I'm signed in and can't vote.

[-PG-Skyre]

If yas ever want to move off the BW forums at some stage, i ...think.... my old EVE Online corp forums are still running. Its empty, was cleaned out after the corp merged with an alliance.
Could use it after all this blows over for more Retake Movement actions *shrugs*

[WvStolzing]

DJBare wrote...
People are going to vote anyway, it's passion that's driving them, besides with all the other votes going around, that one is small fish.

Besides the opposition is really well organized this time.
I've never seen them gather 1600+ people before.

[EmEr77]

KLGChaos wrote...



Bravo, well said. My friend is also a writer and has been working toward publishing a book of his own. He's never played a Mass Effect (though the setting really does intrigue him... he especially likes the Krogan), but as I sat down with him and we discussed the ending, I started spelling out the reasons why people didn't like the ending. He agreed with me and said he wasn't sure he wanted to play the Mass Effect series now (I was going to let him borrow it).

As we talked, he pointed out things I had already seen-- the inconsistency of the character by Shep suddenly just accepting the choices he had when compared to my previous choices, the plot holes with teleporting characters, Joker abandoning everyone for unknown reasons, the really bad logic used by the Starchild, and of course, the fact that a game about choice suddenly removed those choices in the end. He just said "It sounds like bad writing. Even art can be bad." He seemed surprised that a game I had always raved about as the greatest series I had ever played had suddenly turned into this. He said it's not just about the journey or the ending to a story, but how they come together to form the whole and that they remain consistent during that transition.

Oh and that picture with the Mona Lisa and stick figure is brilliant. It's so true. Defending something as art means having to accept criticism. Any movie critic will tell you that.

Indeed. Your friend knows what's up--and it's a real testament when people who have not taken courses dedicated to understanding the theory of writing, or even workshopping stories are finding something seriously wrong with the ending. There is no getting away from this. Like I said, I, and even your friend, may not be paid massive amounts of money to be writing for high-profile projects, but we can still recognize issues just as the experts can--and even those without a trained eye are STILL catching these very same issues! 

[Calesca]

Good morning - or evening or whatever. *g*
Any news the last 8 hours?

[WvStolzing]

Calesca wrote...

Good morning - or evening or whatever. *g*
Any news the last 8 hours?

You may want to go in here and vote: http://www.gamefaqs.....html?poll=4666 

[ld1449]

Chronor wrote...

Don't do the poll. The question is skewed and makes us sound like deprived babies. Not really the impression we want to express is it?

The question might be skewed but the numbers arent. I'll say it before and I'll say it again like Hacket would have

"We need to meet them on every field they open"

Which means demonstrating flat out that we are not a vocal minority, that we are infact the vast majority of fans who are dissatisfied

[TamiBx]

WvStolzing wrote...

DJBare wrote...
People are going to vote anyway, it's passion that's driving them, besides with all the other votes going around, that one is small fish.

Besides the opposition is really well organized this time.
I've never seen them gather 1600+ people before.

*coughcough*employee*coughcough*

No, seriously. They will do anything to make sure we pass as minority, so they won't have to deal with us the way we want them to...or at least that's the impression I've been getting so far. 

[ashley_actually]

AxisEvolve wrote...

Is the poll over? I'm signed in and can't vote.

The gamefaq poll is at the top of the page on the right. If it's another poll you are asking about I have no idea. 
www.gamefaqs.com/

[DJBare]

I'm done, should have been in bed hours ago, hope nothing happens this time to stop me getting there, night folks, be civil and hold the line.

[RussianOrc]

DJBare wrote...

Chronor wrote...

Don't do the poll. The question is skewed and makes us sound like deprived babies. Not really the impression we want to express is it?

People are going to vote anyway, it's passion that's driving them, besides with all the other votes going around, that one is small fish.

I agree with you, but, i think we should take the chance to vote on as many  polls as possible, especially on the major game sites to make our point. 

Modifié par RussianOrc, 22 mars 2012 - 05:24 .

[TamiBx]

 "In The End" by Linkin Park just came on my iPod...this should've been on ME3 soundtrack, seriously. 

[AxisEvolve]

If you read between the lines in that poll:

42.1% are in favor of changing the endings.

17.37% are neutral.

40.54% are against the change.


And this is before the BSN steamrolls that thing. Still a majority.

[B33ker]

WvStolzing wrote...

B33ker wrote...
I don't know, but even if you don't like his exact ideas, it's so obvious that he "gets it" better than even the people at EA/BW seem to.

Absolutely. Though the 2nd installment is somewhat unfocused.

Extremely imaginative take on Cerberus!

Yup he rambles a little more in the second one, but I think thats in part due to the overwhelming response and him trying to cover a lot in such a short time.  He does far better than I'd do in the same situation thats for sure.  There are just so many things that could be talked about.

I like a lot of his ideas.  His idea in the first one of fighting Harbinger on foot would have been sooooo epic I've gone over it in my head dozens of times.

[NeverQuiteAwake]

I find it very strange that there are people trying very hard to oppose us. Why should it matter to them whether or not we get our alternate ending? If they want the ending the way it is, they are free to it.

[WvStolzing]

TamiBx wrote...

No, seriously. They will do anything to make sure we pass as minority, so they won't have to deal with us the way we want them to...or at least that's the impression I've been getting so far. 

Actually the votes in favor of change add up to 3325 vs. 2247 against.

But that's not what the length of those bars say.

[VivaLaWhatsername]

TamiBx wrote...

 "In The End" by Linkin Park just came on my iPod...this should've been on ME3 soundtrack, seriously. 

I agree "I tried so hard and got so far, but in the end it doesn't even matter"