101103 réponses à ce sujet

[VivaLaWhatsername]

cheinara2 wrote...

Just found this three-part article on the endings, apologies if already posted:

http://www.gamearena...ead.php/5111120
http://www.gamearena...ead.php/5111121
http://www.gamearena...ead.php/5111122

I made them active links.

[TamiBx]

Darth Suetam wrote...

TamiBx wrote...

...I use ME wiki for that lol

When I'm playing, I don't like to stop to read codex. I need to stay active, talking to people...

Oh, no. I go very slowly. I read a lot of the codex while playing. Just when it goes too much into technobabble is that I sometimes close it.

I play very slowly, to tell you the truth. That's one other reason why I don't play MP. I like to talk to everyone, every time I go to the Normandy, go through every computer, choose every single thing again etc.

Oh, I do talk to everyone when I'm on the Normandy. I just can't use codex. No. I finished ME3 in 3 days because I refused to play the ending for a day lol 

[G Kevin]

Getting off for the night guys/gals.

Goodnight. Hold the line. Keelah Se'lai.

[morph4037]

DJBare wrote...

Watch those pyramid quotes, we'll have the Egyptians citing copywrite if you keep it up.

Haha! 

[PhoenixDove1]

TamiBx wrote...

*snip*

Oh, I do talk to everyone when I'm on the Normandy. I just can't use codex. No. I finished ME3 in 3 days because I refused to play the ending for a day lol 

I do the same thing first run through I just want to know what happens!  Then subsequent run throughs is when I start to read the codex.

[tfa1]

Dunno if this is the thread to post this, but I just wanted to say that, after finishing ME3 a week ago, and lurking on these forums since then, that I was thoroughly dissatisfied with the ending and support the movement to have it fixed. I would love to love Mass Effect and Bioware again, but for now... I just feel crushed. Thank you.

[Atraiyu Wrynn]

This notion that any of us owes any trust to Bioware is obsolete. We are at the point of needing to see real change, not a promise that the people who didn't see this disaster coming are now masters of interpreting what will fix it.

There's been a ton of talk about how they are factoring all constructive feedback, but the only indications we are getting is that the endings themselves won't be altered, just explained better.

There is nothing here that warrants trust. The company that made the greats such as KOTOR, Jade Empire, ME1 and DAO burned it's capital with it's last several games. It has to build new trust, not demand it in the present situation.

[Darth Garrus]

TamiBx wrote...

Oh, I do talk to everyone when I'm on the Normandy. I just can't use codex. No. I finished ME3 in 3 days because I refused to play the ending for a day lol 

Hahahahaha I can relate to that. I take long pauses during games. But actually I played ME3 fairly quickly for my standards. And I usually don't have that much free time. I remember that the first time I played ME2 it took me a long time. Some days I was just too tired to play. I had to avoid reading about it, since most fans had already played it.

[Computim]

tfa1 wrote...

Dunno if this is the thread to post this, but I just wanted to say that, after finishing ME3 a week ago, and lurking on these forums since then, that I was thoroughly dissatisfied with the ending and support the movement to have it fixed. I would love to love Mass Effect and Bioware again, but for now... I just feel crushed. Thank you.

We've all been there these past few weeks.  Disappointment turned to anger, turned to passion, turned to action, then we all found each other, and now we're talking it out til we get the new stuff Bioware's announced

[Debi-Tage]

tfa1 wrote...

Dunno if this is the thread to post this, but I just wanted to say that, after finishing ME3 a week ago, and lurking on these forums since then, that I was thoroughly dissatisfied with the ending and support the movement to have it fixed. I would love to love Mass Effect and Bioware again, but for now... I just feel crushed. Thank you.

Welcome! Grab a banner and stick around! This is a great place to stay sane and positive (most of the time)!

http://onima.org/ME3/index.php?zone=3

[Kyria Nyriese]

Darth Suetam wrote...

TamiBx wrote...

Oh, I do talk to everyone when I'm on the Normandy. I just can't use codex. No. I finished ME3 in 3 days because I refused to play the ending for a day lol 

Hahahahaha I can relate to that. I take long pauses during games. But actually I played ME3 fairly quickly for my standards. And I usually don't have that much free time. I remember that the first time I played ME2 it took me a long time. Some days I was just too tired to play. I had to avoid reading about it, since most fans had already played it.

I read the codex, talk to everyone I can talk to, stand around looking at stuff for hours on end.  Of course that last part was more because I didn't want to get to the ending /sigh

[Computim]

Atraiyu Wrynn wrote...

This notion that any of us owes any trust to Bioware is obsolete. We are at the point of needing to see real change, not a promise that the people who didn't see this disaster coming are now masters of interpreting what will fix it.

There's been a ton of talk about how they are factoring all constructive feedback, but the only indications we are getting is that the endings themselves won't be altered, just explained better.

There is nothing here that warrants trust. The company that made the greats such as KOTOR, Jade Empire, ME1 and DAO burned it's capital with it's last several games. It has to build new trust, not demand it in the present situation.

They don't demand anything of you.  However, for yourself, you may want to take a chance, I guarantee the rewards of trusting and having that trust reconciled will be far greater than not trusting and having them keep their word.

..and worst case you can light a torch, grab a pitch fork and yell at them if they break it

[PhoenixDove1]

Alright all, signing off for the night. Pleasure holding the line with you all. Back tomorrow. Keelah Se'lai

[cinderburster]

Doug M wrote...

So I was just thinking.

There have been a lot of important questions raised during the last couple of weeks about the relationship of game developers to game consumers, the artistic aspect of video games as art, how criticism should be presented, and whether or not the consumer should have an influence on the artist's work.

I'd like to make a couple of points:

Art is not necessarily whatever the artist wants it to be. Art that is inscrutable, oblique, or that otherwise requires additional significant explanation, is poor art. If the audience is, even after much consideration, left saying, "Huh? That doesn't make any sense." then the artist has failed. Good art is art whose meaning and symbolism is either readily apparent, or whose meaning and symbolism is apparent on the face and also deep enough to facilitate further introspection by the beholder. In the case of the Mass Effect trilogy, BioWare does a masterful job with their art: we get to explore deep and thought-provoking ideas bearing classic and modern cultural relevance - freedom, free will, what it means to be alive, whether a machine can have a soul, tolerance, unity, diversity, racism, sexuality, bigotry, and hope are all addressed in one way or another throughout the trilogy in brilliant ways.

Criticism of art also needs to be put a certain way. There are a lot of calls for constructive criticism, both by fans and by BioWare. Constructive criticism by its nature blunts the impact of the criticism by phrasing it in the least offensive way possible. The problem with constructive criticism is that sometimes there's no constructive way to say, "This part here was bad. The reasons are X, Y, and Z, and you need to do it over again." Granted, these days constructive criticism is synonymous with asking people not to spew obscenities while giving criticism, and considering how some gamers are, I agree with BioWare - give them "constructive" criticism.

Still, between you and me, BioWare, the ending was bad. Plot holes, confusion, philosophical themes discarded, and player decisions throughout the trilogy made no difference. You need to do it over again.

Note that I say this and still respect BioWare. I'm not talking down to them, and I'm not insulting them. I'm being straightforward with them, the way adults are.

And should the consumers have an influence over the artist's artistic integrity? Yes. If the art is being sold, it's a commodity. If the consumers don't like it, then the artist, if she wants to stay in business, needs to make some kind of change that the consumers do want.

I fully believe in the artistic ability of the entire development team. They're amazing. ME3's ending is an outlier, an oddity, a single mistake in what is otherwise a masterpiece. They can fix it, and I hope they do.

This is a fantastic post.  I'm not just quoting to say that, however.  I would like to add that when I took a creative writing class, the teacher gave us a great way to offer constructive criticism while being concise and to the point.

Tell them what you liked, too.  Don't just point out the bad things.  People need to know what they did right just as much as they need to know what they did wrong.  Focus on the good first; that will make them more receptive to your criticism.

I think that's what Dr. Muzyka meant by constructive criticism.  Destructive criticism focuses only on the bad and uses language that makes people want to shut down and not listen.

Most of us agree that there were things about the game we loved--we wouldn't be here if there wasn't.  Let some of that love show when you make your case.

Modifié par cinderburster, 23 mars 2012 - 03:40 .

[DJBare]

tfa1 wrote...

Dunno if this is the thread to post this, but I just wanted to say that, after finishing ME3 a week ago, and lurking on these forums since then, that I was thoroughly dissatisfied with the ending and support the movement to have it fixed. I would love to love Mass Effect and Bioware again, but for now... I just feel crushed. Thank you.

Welcome to the line tfa1, stow your gear and remember to keep your weapon lowered, enjoy the company, got a lot of great folk here that share your sentiment.

[DJBare]

Please do not embed or quote images, it might be seen as spam and then we run the risk of getting the thread closed
Please edit your quotes in order to reduce pyramids, this is very helpful to others reading.
Please do not bump the thread, it just takes a few minutes to think up meaningful content, the thread has a strong enough following to maintain it's presence on the forum.
Please do not use the term "troll" in any context, it is against forum rules to refer to anyone as a troll, if you are having problems with a member of these forums, use the report link or PM the moderators, but do it quietly, do not engange in arguments.
Above all, be respectful to each other.

Find below some important links you may want to follow.

Alternative forum(if required) courtesy of Cybermortis

Polls
Poll About Your reaction on Dr. Ray Muzyka's statement on 21st March 2012
Poll About The Ending
'Official' Poll For Mass Effect 3 Ending DLC
[POLL] What exactly would you change with the ending?

Provide Bioware with your feedback
Leave your feedback on Dr. Ray Muzyka's statement from 21st March 2012
Official ME3 Suggested Changes Feedback Thread

Bioware's Promises pre-game release and their PR response analysed
Mass Effect 3 debacle - Pre-release developer quotes
EA/Bioware in Full PR Damage Control Mode ***Regularly UPDATED***

Retake Mass Effect Movement Resources
Retake Mass Effect Banner Templates
Mission Statement Thread
Mass Effect 3 Resource Site with collection of statements and reports
Retake Mass Effect 3 Statistics

Retake Mass Effect Movement
Retake Mass Effect Group on BSN ***Please Join***
Retake Mass Effect on Facebook
Retake Mass Effect on Youtube

Retake Mass Effect on Twitter
@RetakeME3

Latest News
Dr. Ray Muzyka's statement on 21st March 2012
***Attention*** Mass Effect Survey Scam
Forbes, New Ending Setting Precedence?
GotGame, The customer is always right.
NY Daily News about Retake Mass Effect
The Telegraph in UK reporting about our movement
Forbes on indoctrination theory
Forbes reports on Dr. Ray Muzyka's statement
CVG, Mass Effect 3: 86% think BioWare blew the ending
BBC news technology section

[cApAc aMaRu]

I'm tired of all this. I haven't even played the game because they stole my face, and I have SOO much to look forward to if/when the patch comes out..

[TamiBx]

I lost this thread for a second...all the threads on this forum keep moving so fast!

[ld1449]

Back after several hours, any news

[Computim]

cinderburster wrote...

This is a fantastic post.  I'm not just quoting to say that, however.  I would like to add that when I took a creative writing class, the teacher gave us a great way to offer constructive criticism while being concise and to the point.

Tell them what you liked, too.  Don't just point out the bad things.  People need to know what they did right just as much as they need to know what they did wrong.  Focus on the good first; that will make them more receptive to your criticism.

I think that's what Dr. Muzyka meant by constructive criticism.  Destructive criticism focuses only on the bad and uses language that makes people want to shut down and not listen.

Most of us agree that there were things about the game we loved--we wouldn't be here if there wasn't.  Let some of that love show when you make your case.

I debated leaving in the original quote just because it IS such a good post and really almost required reading, but, it is quite long in total so I'm hoping this reply is close enough to yours that they can read it in yours.

I couldn't agree more.  I -loved- 95% of the game.. I felt like there was an epicness building.. I felt adrenaline, I felt a rousing call to arms.. I felt like I'd been kicked in the gut when Thessia fell (seriously.. if they had a renegade trigger there to blow some poor dude's head off I probably would have pulled it at that point despite being 100% paragon on that playthrough).

I really hope they flesh out the ending and add some content that makes it feel more appropriate for the series!

[ColloquialAnachron]

cinderburster wrote...


Most of us agree that there were things about the game we loved--we wouldn't be here if there wasn't.  Let some of that love show when you make your case.

   I really think (hope) that most of the people in the Retake movement are only a part of it because we love Mass Effect so much, and know how great a game and story Bioware IS capable of producing.  Maybe I'm wrong about this, but honestly, if this were any other developer, I'd write this off as a loss and move on.  Rockstar?  As far as I know they don't ask their fans for input, they just make the games they want and do a (in my opinion) good job making the worlds they want.  Bethesda?  Sorta did after Fallout 3, but they've always been more about opening up their worlds to their fans through modding and occaisonal expansion.  I could go on.  But really, I think a it shows how great the passion and respect for Bioware is among its fans that they'll come together like this and say, "You can do better, really.  We believe in you, fix this."  

  Just my thinkin' though.

Modifié par Harthouse, 23 mars 2012 - 03:47 .

[Neko Hibiki]

I'm not saying to give Bioware your money and trust them to do your best interests with it.. but I'm also saying that if you're going to spend the next months of your life sitting here secondguessing everything anyone says contrary to what you want to hear that you're going to be miserable...

I'm already miserable. I've got parasites in my legs now. They've blocked up the fluid channels, and my legs have swollen to huge size too.

[WvStolzing]

Shameless self-bump:

I actually did try getting an RMA from amazon, but couldn't; here's why:

To return, or not to return, that is the question:
Whether 'tis Nobler in the mind to suffer
The plotholes, and starchilds of outrageous endings,
Or to take Arms against a Sea of nonsense,
And by opposing, change it: to uninstall, to return
No more; and by returning, to say we end
The heart-ache, and the thousand forum posts
That the Eye is fettered to? 'Tis a consummation
Devoutly to be wished. To uninstall, to return,
To return, perchance to get a refund; Ay, there's the rub,
For in that resignation, what 'canon' may remain to us,
When we have given up this will to resist,
Must give us pause. There's the respect
That makes Calamity of so long a wait:
For who would bear the Whips and Scorns of reviews,
IGN's wrong, gamefaq's Contumely,
The pangs of despised fandom, the blog's delay,
The insolence of tweeters, and the Spurns
That patient merit of the unworthy takes,
When he himself might his Quietus make
With a bare RMA? Who would forums moderate,
To grunt and sweat under pyramid quotes,
But that the dread of what would remain of ME,
The mindless jungle planet, from whose bourn
No Traveller returns, Puzzles the will,
And makes us rather bear those ills we have,
Than fly to others that we know not of.
Thus Conscience does make Cowards of us all,
And thus the Native hue of Resolution
Is sicklied o'er, with the pale cast of Thought,
And the enterprise of authorizing a return,
With this regard its Current turns awry,
And loses the name of Action.

[Computim]

Neko Hibiki wrote...

I'm not saying to give Bioware your money and trust them to do your best interests with it.. but I'm also saying that if you're going to spend the next months of your life sitting here secondguessing everything anyone says contrary to what you want to hear that you're going to be miserable...

I'm already miserable. I've got parasites in my legs now. They've blocked up the fluid channels, and my legs have swollen to huge size too.

That sucks, seriously.  Can they do anything for it?

(FYI I honestly read that at first and thought you were being indoctrinated )

Modifié par Computim, 23 mars 2012 - 03:49 .

[RatedRRachel]

Harthouse wrote...

cinderburster wrote...


Most of us agree that there were things about the game we loved--we wouldn't be here if there wasn't.  Let some of that love show when you make your case.

   I really think (hope) that most of the people in the Retake movement are only a part of it because we love Mass Effect so much, and know how great a game and story Bioware IS capable of producing.  Maybe I'm wrong about this, but honestly, if this were any other developer, I'd write this off as a loss and move on.  Rockstar?  As far as I know they don't ask their fans for input, they just make the games they want and do a (in my opinion) good job making the worlds they want.  Bethesda?  Sorta did after Fallout 3, but they've always been more about opening up their worlds to their fans through modding and occaisonal expansion.  I could go on.  But really, I think a it shows how great the passion and respect for Bioware is among its fans that they'll come together like this and say, "You can do better, really.  We believe in you, fix this."  

  Just my thinkin' though.

^ Support this statement. Bioware has been my favorite game developer since Baldur's Gate. KOTOR really made me fall in love with their storytelling. And Mass Effect was my favorite series of all time... favorite series of any work of entertainment. And that is why the ending hurt so much.