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So we can't get the ending we want after all?


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#73326
Aedera

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To Jessica M., the Retakers and anyone else reading (heaven help you if you do…this gets wordy) –


First I want to say it has been a real pleasure seeing how the ReTakers handled this situation. For the most part, we were concise with our requests and kept it civil and we did get a response from Bioware which is something of note. While, I, and many other don’t believe it is the response we actually wanted, it is something.


To Jessica. We traded a few tweets back and forth and I think I came across as…well…a jerk. It is hard to communicate effectively in 140 characters at a time. I can tell you were short with me and I understand as you were just off a cross country flight and have had a long couple of days so I deserved it. But I also wanted to make a public apology because after some thought and re-reading some tweets, I was jerkish so I am sorry.


Now, to the point. In one of the tweets to Jessica, she mentioned that this decision (the extended cut) was made directly because of fan feedback. I 100% agree. No major corporation is going to do something for nothing. The consumer complained and the company responded. My argument was that sure Bbioware did something but they didn’t actually listen to what we were saying. The buzz words that I keep hearing were “closure” , “clarity”, & “better understanding.” Ummm…that is not at all what we actually wanted.


We want star child and space magic gone. It was a completely new concept introduced at the end of an epic trilogy. The ENTIRE series was about fighting the reapers. MY Shepard didn’t want any of three choices that were presented and it is faulty storytelling to spending 98% of a series to all of a sudden present a new premise during the last 2%.


Not to give Lucas any ideas but it would have been like if all of a sudden an Ewok (or Star Child forbid, Jar Jar) showed up on the Death Star and told Luke “Ok you have three choice. A) Destroy all Force users including all your friends and family B) Sacrifice yourself to the force to control all the force users (Because Luke wanted that?) or C) Combine all light and dark force users into one giant shade of meh. Doesn’t make sense and neither did star child’s choices for our story and our Shepards.


MY Shepard would not have chosen the Renegade option because he would not kill the geth and EDI after making sure the Geth and Quarian can get along. He would have argued this point with Star Child. He would not rewrite EVERY SINGLE THING’S DNA because a major point in the game was about diversity and forcing the different races to get along. And there is no way he would control all the Reapers since he was fighting TIM the entire game about doing just that. Honestly, my Shepard would have told Star Child to go to hell and then queue Arkis’s alternate ending.


But he was never given that option. If you, Bioware, want to argue that you don’t always get what you want, that is fine. But it is not in character for Shepard to roll over and take whatever Star Child is offering. He (or she) fights to the end.
I won’t go into all the plot holes and other issues with the ending. Other people have said it better and I don’t want this opus to go any farther then it needs too.


Bioware is treating us like we are ignorant and don’t understand what they were trying to convey so it is our fault so they are going to pat on us on the head and say “Here you go you little country bumpkin. Let the adults talk in small words and really slow (like an Elcore) and maybe you will understand this time.”


Bioware – you kept repeating the mantra “we are listening” but I would argue you just heard what you wanted to hear and didn’t actually listen to a word we were saying. I mean, if just “clarifying” space magic and star child was going to be the end result, you could have released the blog post from yesterday a month ago and wouldn’t have had to bother with new DLC since that was pretty much checkmate.


I am sure many people are going to keep “holding the line” and more power to them. I don’t think there is a line to be held anymore. You made you intentions clear. The endings are staying as they are and we are only going to add more information so you can understand them. I am going to go out on a limb and say the majority that we are getting is material that previously cut from the ending with minimal “new” material created.


All this being said, I hope that I am wrong. I loved the Mass Effect Universe. It was a sci-fi universe that was for adults not like Star Wars (*glares at Jar Jar*). It forced me to deal with issues like racism, corruption, homosexuality, death & love. I loved losing myself in the story and replaying ME 1 & 2 over and over. Hell, after Thane’s sacrifice, I wanted to play ME2 again just because I never really used him as a character so I wanted to build that relationship so when I say “that was for Thane you son of a ****” I can REALLY mean it. But after that ending…Not only do I not want to play ME 1, 2 or 3, I don’t want to play video games in general. You killed my hobby. I think you under estimated just how much your game meant to people. You took all hope away. If Shepard can’t save the universe, no one can.


I hope the indoctrination theory is true though after all that has been said, I really doubt it. Maybe you keep saying we are not changing the endings because the real endings haven’t actually happened yet. But again, I really doubt it. Not after what has been publically said. I really hope that the extended cut fixes the issues with the ending but again, I doubt it. You guys, for better or worse, are sticking to your guns with star child and space magic.


I, along with many others, think this is a mistake. You already have our money so there is not much we can do now. But, I know I won’t be buying any DLC. I know I won’t be pre-ordering any more games. I made that mistake with DA2 and didn’t think you could somehow ruin Mass Effect 3. I might buy them used after a few weeks to make sure that you “didn’t pull a Mass Effect 3” or even worse “all the caves and buildings are the same like DA2.” Either way, my undying loyalty toward you company is gone.


Bleh…after all this… I still don’t feel better. All because of some pixels and polygons. Anyway, if you need me or my shepard, we will be hanging out with Miranda is some sketchy apartment watching the universe burn. That Shep got a spoiler alert so he knows it all ends the same. He was lucky. I was not.

Modifié par Aedera, 06 avril 2012 - 01:28 .


#73327
Alamandorious

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Was wondering if there's going to be a PAX livestream.

I'd like to see what Bioware has to say, quite honestly, to the inevitable questions that will come up.

#73328
VivaLaWhatsername

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chmarr wrote...

how do we set a poll up lol


Top of the page - Click Polls - Then Create New Poll

#73329
Feraiin

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ARCTIC EAGLE wrote...

in the Q/A for the extended cut they flat out said they won't add more ending(s) doesn't that pretty much kill any hope for a fix? Also is BW doing a Pax talk about ME3? if so when is it and will it be live streamed?


No and no.

They will not add new endings, but expand the current ones. How, we don't know. They say it's cinematics and epilogue. Cinematics is straightforward enough, but epilogue sounds intriguing. Maybe some final interaction with the squad? I don't know, but nothing rules out an interactive segment. Especially not with a planned summer-release.

They will talk about ME3, but the announcement and Jessica Merizan said they would not touch the topic of the ending at PAX. Now, that is pretty naive, I think. I wonder how the plan to ignore the freaking giant blue-red-green elephant sitting at the panel.

#73330
chmarr

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VonVerrikan wrote...

Oh Bioware, you really let down Mass Effect. It deserved better than you.



some how i am not blaming bioware 100% but i blame EA for most of it, bioware should have stayed as an indipendant compay and not allowed it to be taken over by EA.

so the blame is shared between bioware and EA (mostly EA for restricting deadlines)

#73331
badmojo88

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and this is where even more people start cancelling their swtor accounts

#73332
g_bassi13

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Mr Chr15topher wrote...

g_bassi13 wrote...

g_bassi13 wrote...

VyseN1 wrote...

2.) Since it is just an extension of the current terrible endings, then yes. My guess is that the cinematics are going to open up a lot more plot holes.


I don't think it will open more plot holes, but I also believe that the plot holes they have now only exist because they never thought about the implications of what they were doing in the first place. They'll delve into some fan explanations desperately trying to make sense of the actions in the endings and "borrow" them.

I highly doubt they had these explanations ready.


I'm quoting myself here, but I also wanted to mention that to explain away these things, the game is going to have to break the rules of its own lore.


I think that explanation was what dug them into this hole in the first place. They tried too hard to explain the Reaper's motivations and it just didn't work. The Reapers were supposed to be unknowable. They came bacck every 50,000 years to cleanse the galaxy.

We didn't need to know why. They were ancient machines, their motives should have been left secret. Just let us kill them and have our choices impact the battle (e.g saved the rachni= rachni ships helping to blow up the Reapers). We didn't need any of this starchild explanation to finish the game with everything tied up.


I totally agree with that. That's what made Reapers so eerie in the first game. It was the unkown. If their motivation was self serving, for their races own reproduction and  such, that would've been perfect.

The second game deviated a bit from that though. It tried to set up a purpose for them. And the third game just dropped it altogether and did it's own thing, to the extreme detriment of the series. It was just absurd, and simply contradicted itself.

If went with what Drew Karpyshyn was planning, it would've been better than what we got... But I still prefer the unknowable god-like villains over anything.

#73333
chmarr

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what gets me is that when bioware announced the extended cut EA's stock jumped UP 1.68% for the first time since the fluster cuck they started

#73334
Aedera

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chmarr wrote...

VonVerrikan wrote...

Oh Bioware, you really let down Mass Effect. It deserved better than you.



some how i am not blaming bioware 100% but i blame EA for most of it, bioware should have stayed as an indipendant compay and not allowed it to be taken over by EA.

so the blame is shared between bioware and EA (mostly EA for restricting deadlines)


Bioware could not make Mass Effect 2 or 3 without EA and their money.  I do alot of this was caused by a a FYE of March 31 for EA since some of it seems rushed (hello getty image tali).

#73335
chmarr

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Feraiin wrote...

ARCTIC EAGLE wrote...

in the Q/A for the extended cut they flat out said they won't add more ending(s) doesn't that pretty much kill any hope for a fix? Also is BW doing a Pax talk about ME3? if so when is it and will it be live streamed?


No and no.

They will not add new endings, but expand the current ones. How, we don't know. They say it's cinematics and epilogue. Cinematics is straightforward enough, but epilogue sounds intriguing. Maybe some final interaction with the squad? I don't know, but nothing rules out an interactive segment. Especially not with a planned summer-release.

They will talk about ME3, but the announcement and Jessica Merizan said they would not touch the topic of the ending at PAX. Now, that is pretty naive, I think. I wonder how the plan to ignore the freaking giant blue-red-green elephant sitting at the panel.



its better to add more endings than expand the current ones, as the current ones are an insult to our artistic integrity

#73336
MayWitcher

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Mr Chr15topher wrote...

I think that explanation was what dug them into this hole in the first place. They tried too hard to explain the Reaper's motivations and it just didn't work. The Reapers were supposed to be unknowable. They came bacck every 50,000 years to cleanse the galaxy.

We didn't need to know why. They were ancient machines, their motives should have been left secret. Just let us kill them and have our choices impact the battle (e.g saved the rachni= rachni ships helping to blow up the Reapers). We didn't need any of this starchild explanation to finish the game with everything tied up.


Hear, hear. This is what I was ranting about last night to my hubby - been doing that for the past month, though. The mystery surrounding the Reapers was the entire point, after all. And I do love when things are not explained in their entirety. A bit of myth never hurt anyone. We really didn't need to know the ultimate reason.

Thinking about this is mentally exhausting. Still I find myself lurking about the forums for some PAX rumours to cling to. Hopefully something will come out that'll take my mind off the negativity surrounding the ME franchise atm.

#73337
kewnsty

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twitch tv just sent nme a link in my email for pax east . its for y2k . but it goes to show you how.. yes it can be done easily dwspite what other companys tell you. lol

#73338
D.Shepard

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chmarr wrote...

what gets me is that when bioware announced the extended cut EA's stock jumped UP 1.68% for the first time since the fluster cuck they started


Can someone please tell me what we know about the so called Extended cut?
I saw many posts talked about it but I missed the "announcement" since yesterday I was unable to visit BSN.

Thanks.

#73339
Kales Neochild

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Anyone at PAX right now???

#73340
-PG-Skyre

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chmarr wrote...

what gets me is that when bioware announced the extended cut EA's stock jumped UP 1.68% for the first time since the fluster cuck they started


Its marketing. They are banking on people thinking this annoucement means the game is fixed, and then start buying it. I know a lot of people who didn't want to buy it till the announcement, then I had to explain to them that nothing has changed. BioWare is still ****g up and just making things worse.

People clinging to hope, thats all it is. Wells, sorry to tell people who hope, but BioWare is dead. Its been EAed.

#73341
Militarized

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Kales Neochild wrote...

Anyone at PAX right now???


Don't think Bioware is on till round 330 or 430 my time(Eastern). 

#73342
chmarr

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D.Shepard wrote...

chmarr wrote...

what gets me is that when bioware announced the extended cut EA's stock jumped UP 1.68% for the first time since the fluster cuck they started


Can someone please tell me what we know about the so called Extended cut?
I saw many posts talked about it but I missed the "announcement" since yesterday I was unable to visit BSN.

Thanks.

http://blog.bioware....3-extended-cut/

#73343
VivaLaWhatsername

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D.Shepard wrote...

chmarr wrote...

what gets me is that when bioware announced the extended cut EA's stock jumped UP 1.68% for the first time since the fluster cuck they started


Can someone please tell me what we know about the so called Extended cut?
I saw many posts talked about it but I missed the "announcement" since yesterday I was unable to visit BSN.

Thanks.


http://blog.bioware....3-extended-cut/ 

#73344
chmarr

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Kales Neochild wrote...

Anyone at PAX right now???



PAX - bioware is at 4:30pm - 5:30pm EST (9:30pm - 10:30pm uk time)

#73345
-PG-Skyre

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Jess stated that BioWare will NOT be answering questions about the ending, or ending related DLC.

In other words, spam them with ending questions till they admit they are bull****ting and trying to rip people off.

#73346
MayWitcher

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Militarized wrote...

Kales Neochild wrote...

Anyone at PAX right now???


Don't think Bioware is on till round 330 or 430 my time(Eastern). 


This will be a long day. Quite fitting, actually, given that today's Good Friday. In Finnish it happens to be "Pitkäperjantai" which literally translates as "Long Friday".

Not a religious person myself, but today I certainly feel we're walking on Via Dolorosa of sorts...

#73347
badmojo88

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well blizzard, ncsoft, and gpotato's will be excited about all this, as will a great number of other companies. They each have been getting an inrush of players since the start of this ugly mess.

#73348
Mr Chr15topher

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Who will actually be on the PAX panel? They have said that the Bioware team will be there but as far as I know, not who specifically.

#73349
chmarr

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-PG-Skyre wrote...

Jess stated that BioWare will NOT be answering questions about the ending, or ending related DLC.

In other words, spam them with ending questions till they admit they are bull****ting and trying to rip people off.



i wish people would spam them with questions about the endings untill they tell us to ****** off and storm off the stage blurting out crap about how were entitled brats  lol

#73350
GroverA125

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D.Shepard wrote...

chmarr wrote...

what gets me is that when bioware announced the extended cut EA's stock jumped UP 1.68% for the first time since the fluster cuck they started


Can someone please tell me what we know about the so called Extended cut?
I saw many posts talked about it but I missed the "announcement" since yesterday I was unable to visit BSN.

Thanks.


Not a whole lot, in fact absolutely nothing other than we won't get new endings and there'll be a cinematic or two extra.

and chmarr, yes, it's gone up a bit, but once everyone sees that the actual extended cut hasn't really done much, and the fight starts all over again, it'll drop again. They've delayed a major slump in stock by baiting. Once the bait is gone, they've got to deal with this all over again, albeit they will have a month or two to prepare for it. Still won't save Bioware though, they're purpose has been served, and I'd put money on it (obviously not money to them, they can go f**k themselves) EAs bosses are thinking of wonderous ways to blow apart the company in the most money-making way possible.