101103 réponses à ce sujet

[ciaweth]

Prince_Valiant wrote...

XX55XX wrote...

The ending isn't bad, though. Yeah, not a lot of choice, but as in real life, you just can't save everyone. And ME3's ending is a reflection of that sentiment.

The ending isn't bad, it's a disaster. And again: This is a fictional game for entertainment, NOT real life. If I want real life, I shut down my computer and go out of my room. I'm not interested in reflections (for that I have far better options than a video game), but in escapism and entertainment. This end fits not the story, not to my personal walkthrough

Part of the reason these grimdark endings are engendering so much ire is that in the first two games, players could have a reasonably joyful ending.  That is the pattern that BioWare set for Mass Effect--in ME2 you could have your ending where everything sucked, or you could save everyone, or something in between. 

Now, in the Dragon Age series, you know you're going to get the emo stuff even if you try to avoid it.  It's there in all the PR and marketing and interviews.  Gaider loves himself the bittersweet, and he says that straight up.  Props for that honesty.  The fans know what they're getting into.

However, this wasn't the case in Mass Effect.  And now, suddenly, every possible ending is approximately the same level of painful, after all the "you get to choose," "it's about player choice," "this game has many different endings," "we want everyone to feel they have closure" PR stuff.  No one's asking for a ticker tape parade and for it to all have been a dream, but people have a right to be surprised and a bit butthurt when told "We're making it so that the characters we've gotten you all invested in are going to be screwed over no matter what you do." 

It's an expectation management thing.

[XX55XX]

The only thing keeping Origin from being spyware is a very thin technicallity. It still gets pushed as something else, while retaining the capacity to start datamining and reporting it home whenever EA feels like it.

What about Steam? I remember people complaining about the very same issues in 2004. Yet people put convenience over security any day. Now almost every game you buy retail requires activation via Steam. 

Do you use Gmail? Do you mind Google gleaning information from them to serve you ads?

It's just not Origin here. You might as well refrain from using the Internet altogether.

Modifié par XX55XX, 02 mars 2012 - 07:30 .

[Pr3ying M4nt15 360]

I still don't understand why the Synergy ending is the ultimate choice, hardest to achieve. Did Bioware think fans would want this all of a sudden?

[Nordicus]

Unit-Alpha wrote...
Haha, I always go with the Scoia'tael, I just love how the second act works if you pick them.

Bioware: "An entire act that feels different and possibly plays out differently because of players choices? What magic is this???"

[mulder1199]

panamakira wrote...

The crazy part is these interviews with the devs come out and say they can't wait for fans to play the game and that they'll love the ending because it will reflect their choices.

I mean, I'm not sure whether:

1) They're ignoring the fans that love the game since ME 1 or assume we're the minority? Idk maybe we are.
2) They really assumed WRONG and thought we would be OK with these endings
3) They just don't care and want to push their cannon story unto us (Fair deal, at the end of the day is THEIR story)
4) There's a possibility of another ending that nobody has seen but has been implemented in the final product
5) DAY 1 PATCH

I have to admit after a few days of feeling crappy about the endings I've come to accept them. It'll be a bitter end but it is what it is. There's nothing we can do about it and I'm sure lots of people will love it.

I will try to enjoy the game as much as I can, if not well then there's multiplayer which I find pretty addicting.....I guess as long as I stay away from SP. lol what a mess.

day 1 patch is 256 mb, which is big (some say) not enough to add play, but big enough to fix and add some cutscenes perhaps an end game....i'd like to think they are smart enough to know when they passed out copies early leaks were bound to happen and planned accordingly....

[Risselda]

Posted this a while back. Think it needs reposting since everyone is so glum and needs a good cheerin up!

I predict Bioware to show this on their main page on the release day.

[XX55XX]

ciaweth wrote...

Prince_Valiant wrote...

XX55XX wrote...

The ending isn't bad, though. Yeah, not a lot of choice, but as in real life, you just can't save everyone. And ME3's ending is a reflection of that sentiment.

The ending isn't bad, it's a disaster. And again: This is a fictional game for entertainment, NOT real life. If I want real life, I shut down my computer and go out of my room. I'm not interested in reflections (for that I have far better options than a video game), but in escapism and entertainment. This end fits not the story, not to my personal walkthrough

Part of the reason these grimdark endings are engendering so much ire is that in the first two games, players could have a reasonably joyful ending.  That is the pattern that BioWare set for Mass Effect--in ME2 you could have your ending where everything sucked, or you could save everyone, or something in between. 

Now, in the Dragon Age series, you know you're going to get the emo stuff even if you try to avoid it.  It's there in all the PR and marketing and interviews.  Gaider loves himself the bittersweet, and he says that straight up.  Props for that honesty.  The fans know what they're getting into.

However, this wasn't the case in Mass Effect.  And now, suddenly, every possible ending is approximately the same level of painful, after all the "you get to choose," "it's about player choice," "this game has many different endings," "we want everyone to feel they have closure" PR stuff.  No one's asking for a ticker tape parade and for it to all have been a dream, but people have a right to be surprised and a bit butthurt when told "We're making it so that the characters we've gotten you all invested in are going to be screwed over no matter what you do." 

It's an expectation management thing.

Hey guys, I've got an idea: Let's call the Federal Trade Commission and accuse EA of false advertising! We'll get noticed on Kotaku!

[panamakira]

mulder1199 wrote...

panamakira wrote...

The crazy part is these interviews with the devs come out and say they can't wait for fans to play the game and that they'll love the ending because it will reflect their choices.

I mean, I'm not sure whether:

1) They're ignoring the fans that love the game since ME 1 or assume we're the minority? Idk maybe we are.
2) They really assumed WRONG and thought we would be OK with these endings
3) They just don't care and want to push their cannon story unto us (Fair deal, at the end of the day is THEIR story)
4) There's a possibility of another ending that nobody has seen but has been implemented in the final product
5) DAY 1 PATCH

I have to admit after a few days of feeling crappy about the endings I've come to accept them. It'll be a bitter end but it is what it is. There's nothing we can do about it and I'm sure lots of people will love it.

I will try to enjoy the game as much as I can, if not well then there's multiplayer which I find pretty addicting.....I guess as long as I stay away from SP. lol what a mess.

day 1 patch is 256 mb, which is big (some say) not enough to add play, but big enough to fix and add some cutscenes perhaps an end game....i'd like to think they are smart enough to know when they passed out copies early leaks were bound to happen and planned accordingly....

Oh really? So there might be a patch? Maybe....just maybe BW learned from what happened with the leaks of DA2 and they'll fix that with a patch. That would be fantastic but I don't want to get my hopes up and then not get anything satisfactory lol...

[ciaweth]

Uh, I wasn't suggesting it was a crime. Just, as I said, an expectation management issue.

EDIT:  Also, getting noticed on Kotaku is not that great an achievement.

Modifié par ciaweth, 02 mars 2012 - 07:35 .

[Pr3ying M4nt15 360]

I find it ridicolous that you're fighting to keep these characters alive through Mass Effect 1 and 2. Not just squad mates, average people and you're doing all the sidequests.

But in the end, the people you saved get a fate worse than death. In the end it seems the people that rewarded the most were the people who rushed through the games and screwed everyone over, as they are less emotionally invested so the endings will be less of a big deal to them, they'll know to expect them

Think about colonies you saved in ME1 and ME2. Anyone not sitting on Earth or one of the homeworlds is probably good as dead.

The ending is basically: Haha jokes on you for wasting your time saving kittens. Should have screwed everyone because everyone was screwed anyway.

I mean example, you can make peace with the geth but the vast majority of players are just gonna pick destroy ending and kill them anyway hoping their Shepard will get to see his crew again, only to see the crew get marrooned anyway.

Modifié par Pr3ying M4nt15 360, 02 mars 2012 - 07:40 .

[XX55XX]

ciaweth wrote...

Uh, I wasn't suggesting it was a crime. Just, as I said, an expectation management issue.

I know. But I have no doubt that more invested fans might just do so. 

[XX55XX]

Prince_Valiant wrote...

XX55XX wrote...

Artist's license. Don't like it? Dump it, and buy someone else's work. 

The Witcher 2 is a pretty good alternative, by the way. 

Of course you're absolutely right, it IS artist's license. Bioware can do with their story what they want. But on the other hand, the artists broke clearly their promises (look at the quotation thread) and that's quite unfair in my eyes. As you suggest: If I can get no ending for the Mass Effect trilogy that is for me personally satisfying, I will never buy a game from Bioware again. My purse it's the only voice I have as a customer.

The Witcher 2 is a very good recommendation, but I've played it already a couple of times. (The ending of it is not really good, too.)

I see what you are saying. But who can call on BioWare to tell the truth anymore?

Calling the FTC's hotline might make some of you feel better. 

[blueruin]

dizzymonkey_bio wrote...

What we really need is a official response to this issue from Bioware on the spoiler forum. Either confirm the situation is as it appears or confirm there is some way to get a "good" ending. Either way, it'll shutdown the speculation.

lol no it wouldn't

[ciaweth]

XX55XX wrote...

ciaweth wrote...

Uh, I wasn't suggesting it was a crime. Just, as I said, an expectation management issue.

I know. But I have no doubt that more invested fans might just do so. 

LOL.  No one would even reply.  A twitter campaign of contacting the producers and marketers (not the devs or the writers--I mean the people who sit at a table and go, "Hmm, now, what do we think will make us the most money?"-- directly would be more fruitful.  (NOTE:  I mean a polite campaign.)

Modifié par ciaweth, 02 mars 2012 - 07:40 .

[albertalad]

haynoats wrote...

Bioware needs to be about their consumers. Without consumers, you have no games, no vision, no company.

Commitment. From Mass Effect to Mass Effect 3. Hours of game play, dollars of support for dlc. Choices carefully made in consideration of future possible consequence. Relationships chosen and either carefully maintained or forfeited for another. Effort. Devotion.

That is just a snapshot of what the faithful players of the series have put into this game. What is the result?

Choices that ultimately make no difference. Relationships that ultimately have no pay-off. An ending which is taken out of the players hands more or less to make sure there is no "Rocky" knockout finish possible for the player to choose. You know....like REAL rpg play.

If people had known a year ago what they know now, there would be no ME3. But you Bioware folks already knew that didn't you? So what did you do? You lied. "Yes choices matter." "Yes people will be pleased with the outcome of the romances." "We think people will be excited out how we chose to end Shepards' saga." "The faithful will be rewarded."

Rewarded my shiney hiney. I cannot fathom that you are that out of touch with your fanbase. Maybe you are. Maybe you are just plain ignorant. Maybe this is how you get your jollies. Maybe this is why Drew and others have fled the company. Maybe you have become just another EA drone company. In any case, I would not be surprised.

[Chrillze]

panamakira wrote...

The crazy part is these interviews with the devs come out and say they can't wait for fans to play the game and that they'll love the ending because it will reflect their choices.

I mean, I'm not sure whether:

1) They're ignoring the fans that love the game since ME 1 or assume we're the minority? Idk maybe we are.
2) They really assumed WRONG and thought we would be OK with these endings
3) They just don't care and want to push their cannon story unto us (Fair deal, at the end of the day is THEIR story)
4) There's a possibility of another ending that nobody has seen but has been implemented in the final product
5) DAY 1 PATCH

I have to admit after a few days of feeling crappy about the endings I've come to accept them. It'll be a bitter end but it is what it is. There's nothing we can do about it and I'm sure lots of people will love it.

I will try to enjoy the game as much as I can, if not well then there's multiplayer which I find pretty addicting.....I guess as long as I stay away from SP. lol what a mess.

But you can have a GREEN beam at the end! A GREEN BEAM!!!!!

[Risselda]

Drew Karpyshyn was truly a biotic god we miss him

[N172]

Rob_K1 wrote...

Also, quite a bit off-topic here, but the launch trailer has now been released. Damn, does it ever look great. Especially the space battles:

Official launch trailer

Another reason to hope that there is an ending where shepard wont get permanently seperated from the others.

[wrdnshprd]

for me, im just going to wait until i get the game to make a final judgement.. so far, from what ive seen, the story is going to be pretty epic. how will the ending be for me? well, until i see the full story, its kinda hard to make that call.

also, from the launch trailer, it looks as if we will at least have SOME time with our LI, which in the grand scheme of things is what's important.

if u look at other tv/movies like 24 or prison break, neither of those shows ever had a very happy ending, and i consider both to be some of the best TV of the last 20 years or so.

IMO, i think part of the point oof this series, and other tv/movies of this kind of premise is.. if you want to be military, CIA, or anything of the sort.. you have to be prepared to sacrifice everything. and sometimes that means sacrificing your time with your loved ones. IMO it wouldnt have credibility otherwise.

would it be nice to have the CHOICE of whether or not my LI is with me in the end, yes it would.

am i going to be upset if i dont get that choice? again, it depends on what happens in the overall story.. ill let you know when ive finished the game.

Modifié par wrdnshprd, 02 mars 2012 - 07:43 .

[Nerevar-as]

Prince_Valiant wrote...

XX55XX wrote...

Artist's license. Don't like it? Dump it, and buy someone else's work. 

The Witcher 2 is a pretty good alternative, by the way. 

Of course you're absolutely right, it IS artist's license. Bioware can do with their story what they want. But on the other hand, the artists broke clearly their promises (look at the quotation thread) and that's quite unfair in my eyes. As you suggest: If I can get no ending for the Mass Effect trilogy that is for me personally satisfying, I will never buy a game from Bioware again. My purse it's the only voice I have as a customer.

The Witcher 2 is a very good recommendation, but I've played it already a couple of times. (The ending of it is not really good, too.)

Speaking about the Witcher, the final book is how to do open endness, bittersweet and leave things to the reader´s imagination RIGHT.

That the game actually comes close to Sapkowski´s work is a great feat by CDP.

[BrookerT]

Modifié par BrookerT, 02 mars 2012 - 07:45 .

[ciaweth]

In an alternate reality, I wake up and find that the Day 1 Patch was actually BioWare's way of holding back the real endings to the game to prevent NDA breakers from leaking the plot payoff. Except it backfired and everyone got peeved because they really thought all the real endings were sad.

[Ghost Rider LSOV]

Nordicus wrote...

Unit-Alpha wrote...
Haha, I always go with the Scoia'tael, I just love how the second act works if you pick them.

Bioware: "An entire act that feels different and possibly plays out differently because of players choices? What magic is this???"

It's a whole different story part. Indeed the second acts of Witcher 2 were something you don't see too often I think.