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[Capeo]

Sashimi_taco wrote...

Muzyka also shared his own experience with the game’s ending, saying that, “I just finished an end to end playthrough, for me the ending was the most satisfying of any game I’ve ever played… the decisions you make in this game are epic.”

YEAH. F***ING. RIGHT.

If the script is any indicator, and it seems to be with all these leaks, you do have to make some epic decisions that will potentionally kill a lot of main characters.  The problem is what they lead to.

[Sashimi_taco]

Vault N7 wrote...

Sashimi_taco wrote...

Muzyka also shared his own experience with the game’s ending, saying that, “I just finished an end to end playthrough, for me the ending was the most satisfying of any game I’ve ever played… the decisions you make in this game are epic.”

YEAH. F***ING. RIGHT.

I just dont get it, I keep seeing devs say that about the endings and stuff.

if all the endings that have been leaked are just it and are true, are we all just on another brainwave or something?

*brain explodes*

I don't get it either. There has to be something that we are missing here. Do they really think just killing shep or just having shep be dead but "maybe alive" is the way to say "there you go! end of story isn't that great? Now you have no questions about shep because she/he is dead! YAY SO SATISFYING! Also all the people you care about are screwed". 

[Ghost Rider LSOV]

Pr3ying M4nt15 360 wrote...

The fact we are having to speculate on how the Normandy crew survived...

And then comes the weird idea:

New multiplayer map,

"Normandy Crash Site"

Where we go save them.

Think they'd do something like that?

[KateKane]

Vault N7 wrote...

Sashimi_taco wrote...

Muzyka also shared his own experience with the game’s ending, saying that, “I just finished an end to end playthrough, for me the ending was the most satisfying of any game I’ve ever played… the decisions you make in this game are epic.”

YEAH. F***ING. RIGHT.

I just dont get it, I keep seeing devs say that about the endings and stuff.

if all the endings that have been leaked are just it and are true, are we all just on another brainwave or something?

*brain explodes*

Well...yes. There's is the marketing brainwave. You think they'd say anything other that "IT IS SO AWESOME" about thier own game?

That'd just be dumb.

[BrookerT]

Capeo wrote...

BrookerT wrote...


Ok, I found this on the superior pics forum, it basically explains how the endings are not as emo as everyone is making them out to be. Most of us haven't even seen them and those that have have not seen them in the context of the game, maybe we should all wait until we have played the game? anyway, here is the post

Spoilers Spoilers and more spoilers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


I have no idea, maybe they take their sweet sweet time. And about the epilogue: you're right, it's not specifically stated it's the same planet. That's just the assumption going around right now. He did say the Normandy planet looked like Jurassic Park while the epilogue video looks more like a Christmas card.

SAFG's answer: That's because - as far as I know - there's no confirmation that the planet the Normandy crashes on and the planet that Stargazer is on is one in the same. In fact, considering the epilogue scene fires regardless of the ending you get (even the one that implies the Normandy crew is dead), there's little proof that the Normandy crew is permanently stranded or that they form an incestuous colony.

Considering the overall tone of the ending, I'd say it's unlikely they are stranded or that the ending is supposed to be considered 'sad'. Everyone's smiling and poo poo and looking at the sunrise, not wailing helplessly because they believe they're trapped forever.

That's my two cents on the matter.

------------------

the "Grandpa & The Shepard" epilogue fires up even in case no one comes out of Normandy's hatch, then it mean the epilogue is NOT taking place on the same planet the Normandy crashed. If everyone died during crash, it means nobody produced synthetic/incestuous babies so Grandpa couldn't be born on this planet.

----------------

My Take: If Everyone is stranded how would anyone know "The Shepard" Story except those on Earth? The Ending takes place on a Colony World. Normandy Does get rescued by the Alliance, It seems the Relay just shot them near Arcturus station and not some backward unknown Planet.

Plus all the lore in ME tells us, Two relay must make a connection with one another for a ship to travel or attempt to travel through. Relay A(Which connects to Arcturus System) shoots the Normandy to Relay B (Inside the Arcturus System somewhere) near or by Arcturus Station. When they come out the Normandy has to outrun the exploding Relay which destroys the Normandy. Everyone at Arcturus saw it and sent help once their ships returned from Earth.

Remember FTL can still be used.

A couple issues with this.  Xio, who posted pics of the ending for us last night, got the impression that they were the same planet.  The planets/moons in the sky are the same and shots of Joker/EDI are even framed so you can't miss the similarity.  Also, obviously, if they are stranded their descendants would know about Shepard.  On top of that the epilogue dialog implies flight is impossible, at least for the people on the planet, as the kid asks when he'll be able to fly up to the stars and the old man replies 'Someday, sweet child.  Someday' or some such hokum.  

As for the epilogue firing no matter the ending, you're right, that's strange.  Thing is we already know there are flagging issues with the end.  The flashbacks only show Liara no matter your LI and flashbacks for both Ash and Kaiden are on the disc.  The epilogue firing even with the worst ending might not be intentional and the day 1 patch might resolve that.

All speculation of course.  Just pointing out that other people who've played the game certainly got a different impression.  It's also worth noting that if the SA guy your referring to is Tank he hasn't played the game in a quite a while at this point and is going on memory.

Yeah, it was just speculation, but there is one major problem with this whole thread, have any on us actually played the game? I mean, we have pictures yes, but without actually playing them it hard to belive anything until they go up on youtube. A incident happened with The Fight for the Love Forum weree they were shown "authentic" romance dialouge by a guy called Klace who turned out to be a troll, not suggesting Xio is a troll, but we should really wait.

[Capeo]

albertalad wrote...

BTW, someone explain to me what is a war asset? I understand having read Jack can be a war asset - how is this possible? Then who can become a war asset and how does one get them?

I don't have a full grasp of it.  I know certain characters can be war assets or you can recruit them to your party.  If you recruit them I don't believe they can be WAs.  WAs increase your overall readiness which, along with some other decisions, will define whate choices you get at the end.  I know with Jack, she's at Grissam (sp?) Academy, and you have to fend off a Cerebus attack to save her and biotic kids.  You can then get them to safety or something where they will live, or you can make them into a biotic brigade which becomes a WA but also means they can be killed in the Hammer attack.

Bear in mind, this is just my fuzzy recollections from the script.

[wright1978]

albertalad wrote...

BTW, someone explain to me what is a war asset? I understand having read Jack can be a war asset - how is this possible? Then who can become a war asset and how does one get them?

You gather them through the game based on your choices. People can be war assets, as can fleets of ships etc.

[Garrus30]

can anyone give me a link where Xio talks about him playing the game?

[Fault Girl]

KateKane wrote...

Vault N7 wrote...

Sashimi_taco wrote...

Muzyka also shared his own experience with the game’s ending, saying that, “I just finished an end to end playthrough, for me the ending was the most satisfying of any game I’ve ever played… the decisions you make in this game are epic.”

YEAH. F***ING. RIGHT.

I just dont get it, I keep seeing devs say that about the endings and stuff.

if all the endings that have been leaked are just it and are true, are we all just on another brainwave or something?

*brain explodes*

Well...yes. There's is the marketing brainwave. You think they'd say anything other that "IT IS SO AWESOME" about thier own game?

That'd just be dumb.

I'm not that naive 

To me it's just kinda of frustrating how they hype it up. In the long run if they are all the endings it is kinda silly. But oh well...

I may be totally wrong and I may react to the endings how they are but for now I'm just meh.

[RiouHotaru]

ciaweth wrote...

The ending isn't bad, it's a disaster. And again: This is a fictional game for entertainment, NOT real life. If I want real life, I shut down my computer and go out of my room. I'm not interested in reflections (for that I have far better options than a video game), but in escapism and entertainment. This end fits not the story, not to my personal walkthrough


Part of the reason these grimdark endings are engendering so much ire is that in the first two games, players could have a reasonably joyful ending.  That is the pattern that BioWare set for Mass Effect--in ME2 you could have your ending where everything sucked, or you could save everyone, or something in between. 

Now, in the Dragon Age series, you know you're going to get the emo stuff even if you try to avoid it.  It's there in all the PR and marketing and interviews.  Gaider loves himself the bittersweet, and he says that straight up.  Props for that honesty.  The fans know what they're getting into.

However, this wasn't the case in Mass Effect.  And now, suddenly, every possible ending is approximately the same level of painful, after all the "you get to choose," "it's about player choice," "this game has many different endings," "we want everyone to feel they have closure" PR stuff.  No one's asking for a ticker tape parade and for it to all have been a dream, but people have a right to be surprised and a bit butthurt when told "We're making it so that the characters we've gotten you all invested in are going to be screwed over no matter what you do." 

It's an expectation management thing.

This is why I still have a hard time believing there isn't at least one good ending.  Has Xio experimented with all ending choices with various level sof GAW and GR ratings?  What would be the point of making out the GAW/GR ratings if it only altered two variables, which only matter in ONE set of endings? (Destroy)  Also, the idea that Merge would be locked behind this mechanic makes even less sense.

Never before has ME locked out an ending through some bizarre mechanic, half of which is tied to MP.

Modifié par RiouHotaru, 02 mars 2012 - 08:24 .

[WizenSlinky0]

BrookerT wrote...

Yeah, it was just speculation, but there is one major problem with this whole thread, have any on us actually played the game? I mean, we have pictures yes, but without actually playing them it hard to belive anything until they go up on youtube. A incident happened with The Fight for the Love Forum weree they were shown "authentic" romance dialouge by a guy called Klace who turned out to be a troll, not suggesting Xio is a troll, but we should really wait.

My suggestion? Hold off judgement but go into the game prepared. That's all most of us are suggesting. I'll be the first one to sheepishly admit I've been trolled but I'd rather be pleasently surprised than go into this with blind excitement.

[Capeo]

BrookerT wrote...

Capeo wrote...

BrookerT wrote...


Ok, I found this on the superior pics forum, it basically explains how the endings are not as emo as everyone is making them out to be. Most of us haven't even seen them and those that have have not seen them in the context of the game, maybe we should all wait until we have played the game? anyway, here is the post

Spoilers Spoilers and more spoilers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


I have no idea, maybe they take their sweet sweet time. And about the epilogue: you're right, it's not specifically stated it's the same planet. That's just the assumption going around right now. He did say the Normandy planet looked like Jurassic Park while the epilogue video looks more like a Christmas card.

SAFG's answer: That's because - as far as I know - there's no confirmation that the planet the Normandy crashes on and the planet that Stargazer is on is one in the same. In fact, considering the epilogue scene fires regardless of the ending you get (even the one that implies the Normandy crew is dead), there's little proof that the Normandy crew is permanently stranded or that they form an incestuous colony.

Considering the overall tone of the ending, I'd say it's unlikely they are stranded or that the ending is supposed to be considered 'sad'. Everyone's smiling and poo poo and looking at the sunrise, not wailing helplessly because they believe they're trapped forever.

That's my two cents on the matter.

------------------

the "Grandpa & The Shepard" epilogue fires up even in case no one comes out of Normandy's hatch, then it mean the epilogue is NOT taking place on the same planet the Normandy crashed. If everyone died during crash, it means nobody produced synthetic/incestuous babies so Grandpa couldn't be born on this planet.

----------------

My Take: If Everyone is stranded how would anyone know "The Shepard" Story except those on Earth? The Ending takes place on a Colony World. Normandy Does get rescued by the Alliance, It seems the Relay just shot them near Arcturus station and not some backward unknown Planet.

Plus all the lore in ME tells us, Two relay must make a connection with one another for a ship to travel or attempt to travel through. Relay A(Which connects to Arcturus System) shoots the Normandy to Relay B (Inside the Arcturus System somewhere) near or by Arcturus Station. When they come out the Normandy has to outrun the exploding Relay which destroys the Normandy. Everyone at Arcturus saw it and sent help once their ships returned from Earth.

Remember FTL can still be used.

A couple issues with this.  Xio, who posted pics of the ending for us last night, got the impression that they were the same planet.  The planets/moons in the sky are the same and shots of Joker/EDI are even framed so you can't miss the similarity.  Also, obviously, if they are stranded their descendants would know about Shepard.  On top of that the epilogue dialog implies flight is impossible, at least for the people on the planet, as the kid asks when he'll be able to fly up to the stars and the old man replies 'Someday, sweet child.  Someday' or some such hokum.  

As for the epilogue firing no matter the ending, you're right, that's strange.  Thing is we already know there are flagging issues with the end.  The flashbacks only show Liara no matter your LI and flashbacks for both Ash and Kaiden are on the disc.  The epilogue firing even with the worst ending might not be intentional and the day 1 patch might resolve that.

All speculation of course.  Just pointing out that other people who've played the game certainly got a different impression.  It's also worth noting that if the SA guy your referring to is Tank he hasn't played the game in a quite a while at this point and is going on memory.

Yeah, it was just speculation, but there is one major problem with this whole thread, have any on us actually played the game? I mean, we have pictures yes, but without actually playing them it hard to belive anything until they go up on youtube. A incident happened with The Fight for the Love Forum weree they were shown "authentic" romance dialouge by a guy called Klace who turned out to be a troll, not suggesting Xio is a troll, but we should really wait.

Well, we can be sure Xio played the game.  Last night in the spoiler group he was asked to take pictures of the end.  He said give him an hour and he came back with the pics on his TV and they were all things in game, not the leaked vids.  If you haven't seen them you should check them out.

[cotheer]

Endings should never be fixed but rather be the result of players actions, and no, i'm not talking about the ones where only thing you can affect is the color (someone should make a meme).
If i want to save everyone, i should be able to, if i want everyone dead, i should be allowed to do that too. So making extremes possible AND everything in between should be possible if your slogan for the game is "choice". If it means dealing with xxxx variables to achieve the above, well tough break BW, it's your job so deal with it.

>_<

[Nerevar-as]

RiouHotaru wrote...

This is why I still have a hard time believing there isn't at least one good ending.  Has Xio experimented with all ending choices with various level sof GAW and GR ratings?  What would be the point of making out the GAW/GR ratings if it only altered two variables, which only matter in ONE set of endings? (Destroy)  Also, the idea that Merge would be locked behind this mechanic makes even less sense.

Never before has ME locked out an ending through some bizarre mechanic, half of which is tied to MP.

Maybe they think Merge is perfect. Even if cyberimplanting all life in galaxy could add who knows what problems and I don´t see how it would prevent Singularity. After all, any nre AI would likely be full synthetic, thus different, and hostile (according to the Guardian) to other forms of life, cyborg or not.

Of course, the Reapers and Guardian alrady follown Insane Troll Logic; to prevent AI Singularity genocide we do it ourselves first!  It´s like that gag where to prevent an unstoppable monster from destroying a city the heores destroy the city first.

[XX55XX]

Where are the pictures that Xio posted?

[Richard 060]

Things to think about:

- While it's true that the endings have galaxy-wide effects, considering that the Normandy crew are our 'ambassadors' for the ME universe (being representative of the various cultures and giving us a face and a personality, for us to invest in each group's fate), screwing them over with each ending surely detracts from the scope of the whole thing. Billions of faceless, anonymous beings will be saved or not (or something else entirely), and it'll be hard to appreciate the impact. But the people we DO know and care about will be shafted, which undermines any large-scale 'victory' if one exists, because our attention and priorities have been directed elsewhere (over the course of three games, no less).*

- Having the final twist being some kind of MacGuffin, where Shepard effectively has a choice of three 'magic buttons' to decide the fate of the universe, is a rather cheap, hollow plot device - and it's another thing that takes the 'oomph' out of the entire war effore, and why we should even care. Think about it - what's the point of the huge, galaxy-spanning conflict, when everything's ultimately decided by one man, in one specific moment, that has nothing to do with the actual 'war'? All those big space/ground battles, and the entire 'Galaxy at War' recruitment drive, whilst technically affecting the ending from a gameplay perspective ('readiness' being proportional to quality of ending), mean little from a story POV, because none of the battles will change the outcome. It's all down to Shepard's choice, so they're little more than a distraction to the Reapers, and eye-candy for cutscenes.**


*On this note, I'm reminded of the interview where Mac Walters cites the JJ Abrams 'Trek' movie as an influence on ME3, and it shows, since he makes the same mistake as that movie did. Spock's homeworld gets destroyed, which is a huge event, and would be a perfect tragedy to focus on (as well as a really clear sign that 'things are going to be different from the previous incarnation'), but instead, the writers chose to kill off Spock's mother as well, at the same instant, and focus on that. One or the other would have worked - as it was, by having two major tragedies and ignoring one for the sake of the more melodramatic option, a whole major plot element goes wasted.
Compare that to 'Star Wars', and the destruction of Alderaan - we don't even SEE the planet, but we care about Leia after only a handful of scenes with her, and so she becomes the representative for us. The destruction of the planet is made into a focal point, and we are made to feel and understand the impact, from both a logical and emotional standpoint. In short, don't take a colossal, literally 'earth-shattering' plot device, and throw it away because you've got the audience's attention directed elsewhere, either deliberately or accidentally.

** Another 'Star Wars' comparison, here - this time with 'Return of the Jedi'. The original trilogy is Luke's story in the same way that ME is Shepard's - he's the character with the destiny, who we follow throughout, and who ends up being pivotal in shaping the fate of the galaxy. But in the final showdown with the Emperor and Vader, the ground/space battle taking place simultaneously counts for something, too. How weak would the ending have been if, by killing the Emperor, the Empire is suddenly forced to give up? Instead, the ground troops have their job to do, regardless of Luke's own fight, as do the space forces, and it's all important to the war effort. Han takes out the shield generator and defeats the Empire's land army, Lando and co. take out the Death Star, and thus the Rebellion's own efforts win the war they fought for the three movies, not some momentary plot device beyond their control.
...case in point of this done badly? 'The Phantom Menace'. Anakin accidentally blows up one ship, and the entire fight is over - the armies of Naboo and the Gungans might not have bothered, other than to pad out the film. Indeed, the film suffers from my first criticism, too - there's a whole planetary conflict going on, and yet the most engaging, memorable segment is a largely unrelated fight between THREE PEOPLE. 'Qui-Gon's dead - and now so is Maul. Go Obi-Wan! ...oh, and the planet of Naboo is now liberated. I guess that's important as well...'


...wow. Didn't realise it when I started this thesis (!), but in hindsight, the same issues that apparently undermine ME3's endings (according to what I've seen, at least) are fundamentally the same as the Star Wars Prequels and the really poor storytelling therein. Same with the Abrams Trek movie (and I'm sure I could include some of the worse eps. of 'Enterprise' as being guilty of the same). That's never a good sign...  

Modifié par Richard 060, 02 mars 2012 - 08:35 .

[Capeo]

RiouHotaru wrote...
This is why I still have a hard time believing there isn't at least one good ending.  Has Xio experimented with all ending choices with various level sof GAW and GR ratings?  What would be the point of making out the GAW/GR ratings if it only altered two variables, which only matter in ONE set of endings? (Destroy)  Also, the idea that Merge would be locked behind this mechanic makes even less sense.

Never before has ME locked out an ending through some bizarre mechanic, half of which is tied to MP.

The Synergy ending, which Xio showed us last night is the "best" ending.  It's the hardest to get and Joker actually looks happy even though they crashed.  And there's more variables in play.  It also depends if you have the Human Reaper's heart or brain which is based on your Collector Base choice.  They each make some variations harder or easier.  Once you get over a certain readiness level though you can always get the Synergy end though it may be harder to attain.  Apparently most of the variation is more in the missions to collect War Assets as your decisions in this and prior games can effect what options you have there.

[Blargmaster]

Do you's know the consequences for destroying Maelon's work in Mass Effect 2?

[albertalad]

And what the hell are these point systems suddenly?

[Mr.House]

Capeo wrote...

RiouHotaru wrote...
This is why I still have a hard time believing there isn't at least one good ending.  Has Xio experimented with all ending choices with various level sof GAW and GR ratings?  What would be the point of making out the GAW/GR ratings if it only altered two variables, which only matter in ONE set of endings? (Destroy)  Also, the idea that Merge would be locked behind this mechanic makes even less sense.

Never before has ME locked out an ending through some bizarre mechanic, half of which is tied to MP.

The Synergy ending, which Xio showed us last night is the "best" ending.  It's the hardest to get and Joker actually looks happy even though they crashed.  And there's more variables in play.  It also depends if you have the Human Reaper's heart or brain which is based on your Collector Base choice.  They each make some variations harder or easier.  Once you get over a certain readiness level though you can always get the Synergy end though it may be harder to attain.  Apparently most of the variation is more in the missions to collect War Assets as your decisions in this and prior games can effect what options you have there.

Shepard survivng is in fact the hardest endign to get. You need 4000 ems.

[jellobell]

XX55XX wrote...

Where are the pictures that Xio posted?

The original links have expired but here are the relevant images.

[Mr.House]

So Joker get's to be with his li but not Shepard. What a kick in the quad Bioware.

[N7BLAZEOGLORE]

According to Mass Effect 3's producer, Mike Gamble, the ending is "not cut and dry".
Speaking to 360 Magazine, Gamble said, "There are many ways to end Shepard’s story, right? I wouldn’t necessarily say ending Shepard’s story means one thing or the other, like life or death or whatever. It comes to a conclusion and how you get to that conclusion."
"There a risks involved in how you get there or how you completely not get there," Gamble explained. "As in the previous games, you’ll make a decision and you’ll see the outcome and there are huge risks to all of those decisions. It’s not cut and dry."
"There are many different endings," he added. "We wouldn’t do it any other way. How could you go through all three campaigns playing as your Shepard and then be forced into a bespoke ending that everyone gets? But I can’t say any more than that…"
He won't need to. In just a few days Mass Effect 3 fans will see for themselves. The game is set to release March 6th.



SO RELAX EVERYONE PLEASE !!!!!!!!!!!!