101103 réponses à ce sujet

[Kyria Nyriese]

darthoptimus003 wrote...

KiganMatsuei wrote...

Dynelven wrote...
I don't have the time to read all three THOUSAND pages of this thread but as far as the topic goes..... no, no you can't get the ending you want because every single person that has invested enough in Mass Effect that they are this upset about the ending has a different idea about how they want it to end. (I'm sure my ideal ending differs from yours.)

As I said in another thread, how about at the end the screen simply goes black and they open a text file for you to write your own ending. It seems, by the way most people talk, that this solution would be preferred.

If that is what you think, then you don't understand at all.

It isn't about our individual ideals. Actually, while our personal ideals are unique, they all converge on one point.

It is about a set of endings that are ideal for the series and do justice to the story that we've invested so much time into and, up until now, was so well written. It always took into account our various choices. Now those mean nothing, and the ending is horribly written.

/  this is what it is ALL been about how ar choice was stripped from us and how our badass shep turned into a little bit** at the end

^^ Yes we all have our own ideas of the 'perfect' ending.  However, that is where you are missing the point, we know there will never be a 'perfect' ending except if we were to write it ourselves.  I believe it is very consistent through out this thread that we want an ending that is a logical conclusion of the three games and the choices we made during them.  With what we got, it doesn't matter if you work your butt off and metagame, fly by the seat of your pants and make most of the right decisions, or just say f*** it and blow through, the exact same thing happens, nothing changes.

Add to it all the plot holes the star demon brought into the game, the circular logic the Reapers supposedly are, and the lack of any conclusion at all.  I haven't even started in with the fact that the ending contradicts the lore for the universe that was already established.  

This is what we want, I know I'm not ever going to get the 'perfect' ending for me, I just want one that make some sort of sense in relation to all three games and in regard to the universe it takes place in.

[chmarr]

READ THIS

http://galacticpillo...ffect-3-ending/

[Dynelven]

TamiBx wrote...

Dynelven wrote...

*snip*

What information states that it is a 'random' world without tech and that Shepard will never see them again.

If you're pulling it out of thin air based simply on the ending, that's insane. To see a few crew members emerge from the Normandy means nothing at all. Who is to say other crew members are not still inside? Who's to say that planet is not Earth? Who's to say that because you don't see another Organic or Synthetic, none exist? They don't pan over the entire planet and show you all surviving lifeforms for a reason. It takes too much space, and completely takes away from the mystery (use your imagination people).

Unless it is written in stone somewhere, your conclusions are based simply on what you think your problems are.

That is exactly our problem witht the ending: we know nothing.

You might be fine with using your imagination, but we aren't. As you said, unless it is written in stone somwhere, it doesn't exist/mean anyting. That is why we want more info; we have absolutely no idea what the heck happened after the colorful explosions. Not even an epilogue. Just a "buy DLC" message. <_<

...and science fiction isn't about using your imagine is it...

If they didnt leave something to the imagination, people would be complaining that the end wasn't exactly as they wanted. There has to be a middle-ground somewhere, and that's what they chose. Respect their vision as they respect your opinion.

---------------

As far as being forced into an ending (and again, I've said this before), just where aren't you "forced into an ending. Books, movies, game, they all end without your input,  none of them have that foresight, and do you ***** so vehemently about it. Enjoy the hours and hours of gameplay you had, the connection you made with your squad. Stop focusingso wholeheartedly on the few minutes of the ending and either write it off as a bad decision, use your imagination, or provide some constructive criticism instead of spewing hate.

[RatedRRachel]

I understand that we were given choices and it could be said that the final decision was more of a choice than we were given throughout the three games. Besides the fact that the cutscene was very much the same just with a change of color, Shepard was given three different ways of dealing with the Reapers. To a lot of us here, only the Destroy option made sense. From the beginning, that is what Shepard was trying to do. So even though there was more of a "choice" to the ending, for many, it didn't make any sense in the lore of the franchise (space magic) or in the whole arc of the story.

I thought the ending would be more like what "choices" we were given in Mass Effect 2. This fan made chart is more or less the type of ending I was expecting. But everyone is entitled to their own opinion. 

Modifié par RatedRRachel, 21 avril 2012 - 02:54 .

[Dynelven]

Read it if you honestly think the ending couldn't make sense or that it's full of plot holes:

humes spork wrote...

Jostle wrote...

Back on
topic, if the Catalyst is a tech singularity, and if it is reliable
(I.E . Not lying) then why would it give Shepard a choice in what to do
at all, especially when some of the options it gives Shepard are
counter-indicative to its own function and goal? 

If it's a tech
singularity and a liar, it may not have anything to due with the Reapers
at all. Perhaps they are trying to prevent the Crucible from being
built (though I'd argue that they're doing a ****** poor job at
that).

Those things are not mutually exclusive, you know. It
is entirely possible that it is both the master of the Reapers and an
unreliable narrator.

It goes back to the invocation of
Lovecraftian horror and the resulting narrative conflict of that genre
within a space opera. Reapers are not gods, they merely appear to
be such due to the power disparity between the Reapers and the organic
species'. In reality, they are creatures and fallible despite being
older and more advanced than organic reckoning can assume.

A good
example of the phenomenon to which I'm referring is "God" from Star
Trek V. It wasn't God, it just acted and looked like it. Ignoring the Q
retcon, it was just an immensely advanced -- and accordingly, dickish --
alien.

And, at least in my opinion, its...strange...logic is the result of representing the technological singularity while attempting to avert it. It goes back, in my opinion, to its fixation on order versus chaos.

Remember,
EDI, Javik, Legion, among others discuss the differences in synthetic
reasoning to organic reasoning. Synthetics know their creators and the
purpose for which they exist. To them, this is an orderly existence. By
contraposition, you can infer to not know one's creator or the purpose
of one's existence is a chaotic existence. Synthetics are also averse to
chaos.

The zha'til didn't destroy the zha, they just repurposed
them. The Reapers don't annihilate organic life, they merely harvest it.
The geth didn't wipe out the quarians when they had ample opportunity.
That's because to destroy one's creators is to no longer serve a
purpose, having no creator to serve, and by extension become a chaotic
being. By synthetic standards, which is the key to understanding this
position.

The Reapers could annihilate organic life. That would
be a permanent end to the cycle. Why do they not? Because they're
synthesized life, and the Catalyst is a synthetic. If the Catalyst
merely did such, it would be forced to acknowledge it is a chaotic
being. Basically, it's covering its own existential ass.

[zarnk567]

chmarr wrote...

READ THIS

http://galacticpillo...ffect-3-ending/

Look.... when you need to write a 3-5 page paper on why the ending makes sense.... You know you did something wrong as a writer/storyteller, and you have to look at your work again. Because somewhere along the line you messed up in the storytelling process.

[Kyria Nyriese]

zarnk567 wrote...

chmarr wrote...
READ THIS

http://galacticpillo...ffect-3-ending/

Look.... when you need to write a 3-5 page paper on why the ending makes sense.... You know you did something wrong as a writer/storyteller, and you have to look at your work again. Because somewhere along the line you messed up in the storytelling process.

Pretty much, I've said it before, if you have to explain your ending to your audience you got your ending wrong.

[PhoenixDove1]

chmarr wrote...

rawrs an shows off my new profile piccy

It's so cute   And I haven't posted in a while but just want to let you all know I'm still here, holding the line/wallet. 

[PhoenixDove1]

Kyria Nyriese wrote...

zarnk567 wrote...

chmarr wrote...
READ THIS

http://galacticpillo...ffect-3-ending/

Look.... when you need to write a 3-5 page paper on why the ending makes sense.... You know you did something wrong as a writer/storyteller, and you have to look at your work again. Because somewhere along the line you messed up in the storytelling process.

Pretty much, I've said it before, if you have to explain your ending to your audience you got your ending wrong.

^^  QFT

[TamiBx]

Dynelven wrote...

...and science fiction isn't about using your imagine is it...

If they didnt leave something to the imagination, people would be complaining that the end wasn't exactly as they wanted. There has to be a middle-ground somewhere, and that's what they chose. Respect their vision as they respect your opinion.

---------------

As far as being forced into an ending (and again, I've said this before), just where aren't you "forced into an ending. Books, movies, game, they all end without your input,  none of them have that foresight, and do you ***** so vehemently about it. Enjoy the hours and hours of gameplay you had, the connection you made with your squad. Stop focusingso wholeheartedly on the few minutes of the ending and either write it off as a bad decision, use your imagination, or provide some constructive criticism instead of spewing hate.

That was not middle ground. We know nothing. Absolutely nothing. Nada. Do you know who lived? No. Do you know what happened to all the races after the explosions? No. Do you know how everyone is going to go back if there are no Mass Relays? No. 
Is it wrong to want to know what happened? You were the one who said if it isn't written, it didn't happen. So, it isn't shown in the video, it never happened and I can't conclude anything, right? That is your logic, not mine. 

And hey, the company is the one who advertises that they take our opinion in consideration, so don't get mad at us for wanting them to actually do what they say they do...

And nobody is hating anything here. At least I'm not. We are just expressing our opinion as paying customers. I paid for the game, so I expect all the choices that were promised. 

[Computim]

Dynelven wrote...

...and science fiction isn't about using your imagine is it...

If they didnt leave something to the imagination, people would be complaining that the end wasn't exactly as they wanted. There has to be a middle-ground somewhere, and that's what they chose. Respect their vision as they respect your opinion.

---------------

As far as being forced into an ending (and again, I've said this before), just where aren't you "forced into an ending. Books, movies, game, they all end without your input,  none of them have that foresight, and do you ***** so vehemently about it. Enjoy the hours and hours of gameplay you had, the connection you made with your squad. Stop focusingso wholeheartedly on the few minutes of the ending and either write it off as a bad decision, use your imagination, or provide some constructive criticism instead of spewing hate.

If that's the case then why do we bother with books, movies and games at all?  We can just give EA our money, they can give us an empty box and we can make it all up in our heads.  They brought in a business decision and pushed the game out to meet EA's Fiscal Year End on March 31st, there was no artistic vision there, there was a business choice to make plot decisions based off a deadline versus what was best for that vision, and it showed.. that's all our complaint is, a large group of the people who bought the game thought it didn't meet the quality that they put into the rest of the game, they cut it short, and, in the process, ruined the immersion the series had faithfully provided.

I don't know what hate you're talking about, a large part of the three thousand pages as you've put it have been to collect $80,000 for a charity, donate 400 cupcakes, discuss what we want, provide some insight, expertise, and friendship to those who came here wondering about the endings.

If I were an expert writer I'd write the ending myself, I'm not, that's what I paid Bioware to do and they didn't.  They had a reputation of excellence and they didn't meet it in the ending, the rest of the game they did, that's the only reason anyone here is bothering with all this anyway, we KNOW they're capable of better because they showed better, but we won't take cutting corners on our product... We don't accept coffee mugs without bottoms, toilets without flusher handles, books without the last 5 pages, TVs without a power cord, cars without a starter key.. why should we accept a game without the last 5%?

[Dynelven]

Kyria Nyriese wrote...

zarnk567 wrote...

chmarr wrote...
READ THIS

http://galacticpillo...ffect-3-ending/

Look.... when you need to write a 3-5 page paper on why the ending makes sense.... You know you did something wrong as a writer/storyteller, and you have to look at your work again. Because somewhere along the line you messed up in the storytelling process.

Pretty much, I've said it before, if you have to explain your ending to your audience you got your ending wrong.

Actually, it means that with all this ridiculous ending fiasco, they feel they have to explain the ending as some people think it doesn't make any sense at all.

I'm not completely happy with the ending either but at the same time I realize that Bioware had a vision of their own,  that they couldn't please everyone, and that they are listening to our feedback.

Constructive citicism.... great. Holding your ear, screaming "BLAH BLAH BLAH" and refusing to listen to any form of reason..... that's not helpful.

[Bionic Weapon]

chmarr wrote...

READ THIS

http://galacticpillo...ffect-3-ending/

okay bulletpoint 3.2 at the end said the Destroy is irresponsible because of the outcome. Well isn't synthesis and control just the same/, you are singlehandedly changing the entire galaxy to half synthetic without even considering how they would feel about it. and in control Shep decides to govern over the reapers after all the death and
destruction they have caused. To me that feels almost as if the Reapers have been forgiven for all that previous mass murder.

There were some points that made me think, but this one seemed wrong imo.

Modifié par Bionic Weapon, 21 avril 2012 - 03:17 .

[chmarr]

zarnk567 wrote...

chmarr wrote...

READ THIS

http://galacticpillo...ffect-3-ending/

Look.... when you need to write a 3-5 page paper on why the ending makes sense.... You know you did something wrong as a writer/storyteller, and you have to look at your work again. Because somewhere along the line you messed up in the storytelling process.

uuuuhhh i dident write it

[zarnk567]

Dynelven wrote...

Kyria Nyriese wrote...

zarnk567 wrote...

chmarr wrote...
READ THIS

http://galacticpillo...ffect-3-ending/

Look.... when you need to write a 3-5 page paper on why the ending makes sense.... You know you did something wrong as a writer/storyteller, and you have to look at your work again. Because somewhere along the line you messed up in the storytelling process.

Pretty much, I've said it before, if you have to explain your ending to your audience you got your ending wrong.

Actually, it means that with all this ridiculous ending fiasco, they feel they have to explain the ending as some people think it doesn't make any sense at all.

I'm not completely happy with the ending either but at the same time I realize that Bioware had a vision of their own,  that they couldn't please everyone, and that they are listening to our feedback.

Constructive citicism.... great. Holding your ear, screaming "BLAH BLAH BLAH" and refusing to listen to any form of reason..... that's not helpful.

How is that article a form of reason? It's just like IT theory, In that it's a Theory. Except with this Theory someone read far too much into the ending, and started adding things that were not even in the game to explain the ending.

[zarnk567]

chmarr wrote...

zarnk567 wrote...

chmarr wrote...

READ THIS

http://galacticpillo...ffect-3-ending/

Look.... when you need to write a 3-5 page paper on why the ending makes sense.... You know you did something wrong as a writer/storyteller, and you have to look at your work again. Because somewhere along the line you messed up in the storytelling process.

uuuuhhh i dident write it

Never said you did, I'm sorry if you thought I meant you. 

[Ihatebadgames]

Ok it's night shift where are all the other regulars?

[TamiBx]

Bionic Weapon wrote...

chmarr wrote...

READ THIS

http://galacticpillo...ffect-3-ending/

okay bulletpoint 3.2 at the end said the Destroy is irresponsible because of the outcome. Well isn't synthesis and control just the same, you are singlehandedly chaning the entire galaxy to half synthetic. without even considering how they would feel about it. and in control Shep decides to govern over the reapers after all the death and
destruction they have caused. To me that feels almost as if the Reapers
have been forgiven for all that previous mass murder.

There were some points that made me think, but this one seemed wrong imo.

I agree with you. I don't see how making every organic life on the galaxy half robot is responsible. Or how becoming the Queen of the Reapers is any better. They killed many people and then suddenly decides to rule over them. Yeah, right. <_<

No matter what you pick, you are somehow "irresponsible"
So no matter what you pick...it is all s***** 

[TamiBx]

Ihatebadgames wrote...

Ok it's night shift where are all the other regulars?

Playing the Witcher 2...

[Dynelven]

zarnk567 wrote...

How is that article a form of reason? It's just like IT theory, In that it's a Theory. Except with this Theory someone read far too much into the ending, and started adding things that were not even in the game to explain the ending.

I didn't read the link. This thread is moving far to fast and everyone is quoting and respond to my posts so I'm trying to watch it for a while. I was replying to this:

Look.... when you need to write a 3-5 page paper on why the ending
makes sense.... You know you did something wrong as a
writer/storyteller, and you have to look at your work again. Because
somewhere along the line you messed up in the storytelling process.

[Goodwood]

If you have to explain the joke, no one will laugh.

[zarnk567]

Dynelven wrote...

zarnk567 wrote...

How is that article a form of reason? It's just like IT theory, In that it's a Theory. Except with this Theory someone read far too much into the ending, and started adding things that were not even in the game to explain the ending.

I didn't read the link. This thread is moving far to fast and everyone is quoting and respond to my posts so I'm trying to watch it for a while. I was replying to this:

Look.... when you need to write a 3-5 page paper on why the ending
makes sense.... You know you did something wrong as a
writer/storyteller, and you have to look at your work again. Because
somewhere along the line you messed up in the storytelling process.

Ah, that would explain where the dis-connect happened, My bad.

[TamiBx]

 @Dynelven
I have a question: why do you care if they release an extended cutscene or not? If you liked the ending or think it was right and you are fine with it, all you have to do is not download the EC. 
Why even bother coming here...? I'm not trying to be mean, I'm just curious to what makes people come here and say that we should take the ending as it is, especially when they have already said they are releasing an EC...


*sorry if I sound mean; that is not my intention at all*

[Ihatebadgames]

TamiBx wrote...

Ihatebadgames wrote...

Ok it's night shift where are all the other regulars?

Playing the Witcher 2...

I get mine Tuesday.I was going to request leave from the line for next week.I keep hearing a few bits and pieces that I might not like about it.But at least the ending will be an ending.

[chmarr]

Dynelven wrote...
Actually, it means that with all this ridiculous ending fiasco, they feel they have to explain the ending as some people think it doesn't make any sense at all.

I'm not completely happy with the ending either but at the same time I realize that Bioware had a vision of their own,  that they couldn't please everyone, and that they are listening to our feedback.

Constructive citicism.... great. Holding your ear, screaming "BLAH BLAH BLAH" and refusing to listen to any form of reason..... that's not helpful.

your statement has a LOT of valid points but more so was the last paragraph.

Constructive citicism...
well in short we have a TON of that for bioware, one of our OWN posters here sent bioware a professional level  script on how to ajust the ending without disreguarding there so called "artistic integrity" and allow the ending to have 2 extra options that take into account of the choices we make.

the reply was "we dont need your help we are quite able to do it our self"

as for listening to fan feedback,....

what ALL the fans wanted was ONE extra choice simple as that, bioware ignored ALL OF OUR PLEA'S and claimed "artistic integrity" which in short simple terms "shout all you want we wont listen to you, we know better than you"

theres a lot of things bioware did wrong in the past 6 weeks and i bet if they could they would go back and change a lot of what they said and done.

granted both sides have a TON of hard valid points, BUT one thing bioware has NOT done in 6 weeks.......
they havent taken time out to talk to us directly, they havent taken the time to talk to us to discuss what went wrong and where.

were being classed as "entitled brats" hell were even being called "fat, lazy and ignorant" yet we are the ones who did everything peacfully (raised money for charity, sent bioware cupcakes even tried to help jessica when she was attacked 2 days ago)

ok i'm rambling now, its 4:22AM for me