101103 réponses à ce sujet

[Efesell]

Canned Bullets wrote...

This just isn't what the fans want and so far only the minority like it.

I don't think that is something that can be judged at this time.

[Reorte]

AdhamS wrote...

Bioware EA= Money money money! Lets give them what they want man! IF they want $$$ fine take it !! TAKE IT GODDAMIT BUT GIVE ME A GOOD ENDING!!

Imagine ur family was kidnapped and  the kidnappers asked for $$$$$ and its either that or BOOM!

Cmon Bioware! GIMME THE DLC! TAKE THE DOUGH AND WE ARE ALL HAPPY....sort of..........

And don't expect me to ever spend another penny with you again.

[blooregard]

Kyria Nyriese wrote...

blooregard wrote...

Canned Bullets wrote...

blooregard wrote...

halo 3: halo array destroyed MC on a ship and is deemed MIA

ME3: mass relay network destroyed shep MIA/KIA normandy deemed MIA

both of the ships are frigates

coincidence? I think not!

At least with Halo the Galaxy wasn't thrown into a Dark Age. The Halo ending would have been better than the leaked ME3 ending if they didn't throw in that stupid "Master Chief lands on an unknown planet" as an excuse to make Halo 4.

Now see theres another issue. Where does it say ME was thrown into a dark age? Grant it they're pretty boned by the looks of it but look at the galaxy as a whole this way


destroy: reapers destroyed a bunch of reaper tech laying around as well as synthetics rebuilding possible

merge: robots and meatbags are now as one reapers are peacful and with their infinite wisdom/tech can rebuild the relay network

control: you are reapers assist galaxy in rebuilding relay network


look at WWII end of war everything sucked 50 years later 75% of the suck is gone (obviously it would take longer to rebuild a galaxy spanning civilization then a few blown to smitheroons cities but the point still stands)

In all endings as of what we know right now, the Relay network is destroyed, that is why people are saying the galaxy is thrown back into the dark ages.

I personally wouldn't go that far with it, but I do say it puts Galactic Civilization back hundreds if not thousands of years.

As for the Reapers.  They are the physical manifestation of a Technological Singularity, which exist to prevent a Technological Singularity by wiping out Organics who may or may not be on the cusp of a Technological Singularity 'ascending' them to become a Reaper which is the physical manifestaiton of a Technological Singularity.  It's called Cicurlar Logic and it goes no where.

I have no argument that it sets galactic civilization back quite a bit but they still have alot of resources reapers, relay remnents, most of the tech they have now its not the total end for civilization just a set back.
As for the normandy getting stranded just remember what happened to the prothean scientists when they reprogrammed the keepers their sacrafice was the only reason we could get this far in the first place. Its only reasonable that the normandy and crew who have been at the heart of it from eden prime have to make an equal sacrafice in order to stop the reapers once and for all.

happy endings aren't always sunshine and kittens but the knowledge that your choices and sacrafices are the only thing that allow future generations to live without fear



EDIT: from what I gathered the reapers only want to preserve the galaxy as a whole not stop tech singularities. Unless I misunderstood the catalyst but what I gathered is by harvesting the advanced races (prothean, turian ect) they're helping the unadvanced species making sure that the advanced ones don't make something that ends up destroying the galaxy. Their "trap" is just a buffer zone to make sure the advanced species don't advance down a path that would put the galaxy as a whole in danger.

Modifié par blooregard, 04 mars 2012 - 09:57 .

[AkiKishi]

It's just shockingly bad and forced. This sort of thing is shocking I sat there for 5 minuters afterwards just staring at the screen



And nothing has come close to Isara in Valkyria Chronicles for just empty loss

[AdhamS]

Lana Del Rey wrote...

AdhamS wrote...

glenboy24 wrote...

AdhamS wrote...

This is the link for the Petition....guys spread it ON EVERY DAMN FORUM/ WEBSITE AND TO YOUR FRIENDS!

Yes Bioware won this round-they (hopefully) would release a DLC with the continuation of the storyline after the ending (hopefully for free but who am I kidding?!)

NEXT ROUND WE WIN! That DLC will be the last product we ever buy from Bioware! Atleast we got a satisfying end for our Shepard and his crew via the DLC!

Edit required. No Link. 

Here it is
http://www.gopetitio...-dlc-patch.html

Signed. Number 145. You need to find some better way to spread this.

We have to help each other! HELP ME SPREAD IT!!! AND TELL OTHERS TO SPREAD IT!! I ALREADY WARNED BIOWARE ON FACEBOOK!
GO to 4chan! GO TO EVERYWHERE FORUM OR AND LI FORUM AND SPREAD IT!!!! AND TELL THEM TO SPREAD IT!!

I CANT DO IT ALONE!! CMON PEOPLE!! FOR A BETTER ENDING!!!! HELP A COMRADE OVER HERE!!

[Reorte]

AllThatJazz wrote...

See, for me that wouldn't be bittersweet in a war situation at all. That would pretty much count as the sunshine and rainbows ending if the people I loved were definitely all alive and I could be with them. Not having stuff, being homeless or hungry for a bit or whatever really wouldn't affect that. For me, a bittersweet ending is one where I'm alive (but my family don't know that), and my family are alive (but I don't know it) or something along those lines.

Eh, maybe that's partly why Bio couldn't come up with a 'bittersweet' ending that appealed to all people - definitions of the term are subjective I guess ...

But in your example there's still the hope of getting back together. The impression I'm getting is that that hope is not there. We're being offered "You've won but there's nothing left for you."

[rtv053]

Ghost Rider LSOV wrote...

rtv053 wrote...
Because, ultimately, if Shepard were able to survive and become reunited with his crew, then truly they would have made no sacrifice at all.

Shepard can and does lose quite a few friends in the game, so I don't think this counts as "no sacrifice".

But their deaths aren't Shepard's sacrifice - they are the personal sacrifice of the people who gave up their lives for him, for their friends, for the war effort, for their own species and most importantly (from a paragon perspective) for the galactic community. Shepard's sacrifice needs to be something else.

People also seem to forget that, however heartbreaking it might be that Shepard may never see his old friends again, if he survives, he has the chance to go on and rebuild, to make new friends, to have a new life and find new loves. And hopefully, never have to pull a trigger ever again.

[Nerevar-as]

rtv053 wrote...

I've been eagerly following the conversations on this board ever since I heard about the leaks. I understand people's frustrations, but at the same time, I can't agree with them. I hope that I'll be able to expand upon the following in more exacting detail in some kind of essay post eventually, but here's my two pence.

1) One issue that people seem to have is that the ME universe is fundamentally altered by the destruction of the mass relays, and the subsequent fracturing of the galactic community. But this is what great sci-fi does; it shows change, often on a galactic or universal scale.

And in many ways, this was the only logical endpoint of the series. Manuel at the dig site in ME1 prophesised the end of humanity/the coming of a dark age, and in all the endings, that is more or less what we get. The Reapers created the mass relays to control the way species evolve - so we had to destroy them and find our own path. Legion says pretty much the same thing about the Geth, wanting to find their own way outside of the destiny that might be intended by whoever came before, be it the Quarians or the Reapers.

2) People seem most aggravated by the fact that it is not possible to rescue the Normandy crew from their fate, and furthermore, that if Shepard lives, he is forever seperated from those that he has come to care about most. But why is this wrong?

What is this sense of entitlement that we fans have? Why do we feel that Shepard should be the ONLY person in the entire galaxy who does not lose something in this war? Because, ultimately, if Shepard were able to survive and become reunited with his crew, then truly they would have made no sacrifice at all. With the destruction of the mass relays, so many people all across the galaxy have been, for the foreseeable future, irrevocably seperated in space and time from loved ones, friends, family, homes, jobs, home worlds... if Shepard and the crew of the Normandy did not share in this sacrifice, then all their efforts would be cheapened.

Why is it expected that Shepard should be perfectly happy? What is truly important is that, however battered and broken it may be, the galactic community, and humanity in particular, have survived, and have the opportunity to prosper.

I'll continue to reserve my judgment until I've played and finished the game, but from all I've read, this sounds like a near-perfect ending to a near-perfect gaming series, and one that - however divisive it may eventually become - has touched all of our lives.

You would have a point if ME saga had felt as BSG. As it felt more like SW, expecting an actual happyending for the main character was reasonable. If you didn´t wanted the play like the guy in the stream and be happy with the outcome.

All endings being this bleak makes about as much sense as if ASoF&I had a happy ending.

[Lana Del Rey]

rtv053 wrote...

I've been eagerly following the conversations on this board ever since I heard about the leaks. I understand people's frustrations, but at the same time, I can't agree with them. I hope that I'll be able to expand upon the following in more exacting detail in some kind of essay post eventually, but here's my two pence.

1) One issue that people seem to have is that the ME universe is fundamentally altered by the destruction of the mass relays, and the subsequent fracturing of the galactic community. But this is what great sci-fi does; it shows change, often on a galactic or universal scale.

And in many ways, this was the only logical endpoint of the series. Manuel at the dig site in ME1 prophesised the end of humanity/the coming of a dark age, and in all the endings, that is more or less what we get. The Reapers created the mass relays to control the way species evolve - so we had to destroy them and find our own path. Legion says pretty much the same thing about the Geth, wanting to find their own way outside of the destiny that might be intended by whoever came before, be it the Quarians or the Reapers.

2) People seem most aggravated by the fact that it is not possible to rescue the Normandy crew from their fate, and furthermore, that if Shepard lives, he is forever seperated from those that he has come to care about most. But why is this wrong?

What is this sense of entitlement that we fans have? Why do we feel that Shepard should be the ONLY person in the entire galaxy who does not lose something in this war? Because, ultimately, if Shepard were able to survive and become reunited with his crew, then truly they would have made no sacrifice at all. With the destruction of the mass relays, so many people all across the galaxy have been, for the foreseeable future, irrevocably seperated in space and time from loved ones, friends, family, homes, jobs, home worlds... if Shepard and the crew of the Normandy did not share in this sacrifice, then all their efforts would be cheapened.

Why is it expected that Shepard should be perfectly happy? What is truly important is that, however battered and broken it may be, the galactic community, and humanity in particular, have survived, and have the opportunity to prosper.

I'll continue to reserve my judgment until I've played and finished the game, but from all I've read, this sounds like a near-perfect ending to a near-perfect gaming series, and one that - however divisive it may eventually become - has touched all of our lives.

Well, can't say I don't agree with you.

[KateKane]

Canned Bullets wrote...

This just isn't what the fans want and so far only the minority like it.

The game wasn't made for the fans.

[mozgalo]

only thing important is that u make end with Shepard and crew alive... with that cliffhanger i imagine that we could expect possible MMO coming.... after all franchise like ME is not gonna simply shut down just like that

[The Bridgeburner]

rtv053 wrote...

I've been eagerly following the conversations on this board ever since I heard about the leaks. I understand people's frustrations, but at the same time, I can't agree with them. I hope that I'll be able to expand upon the following in more exacting detail in some kind of essay post eventually, but here's my two pence.

1) One issue that people seem to have is that the ME universe is fundamentally altered by the destruction of the mass relays, and the subsequent fracturing of the galactic community. But this is what great sci-fi does; it shows change, often on a galactic or universal scale.

And in many ways, this was the only logical endpoint of the series. Manuel at the dig site in ME1 prophesised the end of humanity/the coming of a dark age, and in all the endings, that is more or less what we get. The Reapers created the mass relays to control the way species evolve - so we had to destroy them and find our own path. Legion says pretty much the same thing about the Geth, wanting to find their own way outside of the destiny that might be intended by whoever came before, be it the Quarians or the Reapers.

2) People seem most aggravated by the fact that it is not possible to rescue the Normandy crew from their fate, and furthermore, that if Shepard lives, he is forever seperated from those that he has come to care about most. But why is this wrong?

What is this sense of entitlement that we fans have? Why do we feel that Shepard should be the ONLY person in the entire galaxy who does not lose something in this war? Because, ultimately, if Shepard were able to survive and become reunited with his crew, then truly they would have made no sacrifice at all. With the destruction of the mass relays, so many people all across the galaxy have been, for the foreseeable future, irrevocably seperated in space and time from loved ones, friends, family, homes, jobs, home worlds... if Shepard and the crew of the Normandy did not share in this sacrifice, then all their efforts would be cheapened.

Why is it expected that Shepard should be perfectly happy? What is truly important is that, however battered and broken it may be, the galactic community, and humanity in particular, have survived, and have the opportunity to prosper.

I'll continue to reserve my judgment until I've played and finished the game, but from all I've read, this sounds like a near-perfect ending to a near-perfect gaming series, and one that - however divisive it may eventually become - has touched all of our lives.

I get what you're saying, but where my frustration lies is with the MacGuffin and that the choices are ripping off of a much loved/vaunted sf rpg in its own right, Deus Ex. That doesn't sit well with me. At least rip off something less close to home. Not too mention the implausibility of the Merge/Synthesis ending... that's more my issue, less that Shepard is apart from the crew (although I feel for those who wish for the re-united option).

[Brahlis]

blooregard wrote...

Kyria Nyriese wrote...

blooregard wrote...

Canned Bullets wrote...

blooregard wrote...

halo 3: halo array destroyed MC on a ship and is deemed MIA

ME3: mass relay network destroyed shep MIA/KIA normandy deemed MIA

both of the ships are frigates

coincidence? I think not!

At least with Halo the Galaxy wasn't thrown into a Dark Age. The Halo ending would have been better than the leaked ME3 ending if they didn't throw in that stupid "Master Chief lands on an unknown planet" as an excuse to make Halo 4.

Now see theres another issue. Where does it say ME was thrown into a dark age? Grant it they're pretty boned by the looks of it but look at the galaxy as a whole this way


destroy: reapers destroyed a bunch of reaper tech laying around as well as synthetics rebuilding possible

merge: robots and meatbags are now as one reapers are peacful and with their infinite wisdom/tech can rebuild the relay network

control: you are reapers assist galaxy in rebuilding relay network


look at WWII end of war everything sucked 50 years later 75% of the suck is gone (obviously it would take longer to rebuild a galaxy spanning civilization then a few blown to smitheroons cities but the point still stands)

In all endings as of what we know right now, the Relay network is destroyed, that is why people are saying the galaxy is thrown back into the dark ages.

I personally wouldn't go that far with it, but I do say it puts Galactic Civilization back hundreds if not thousands of years.

As for the Reapers.  They are the physical manifestation of a Technological Singularity, which exist to prevent a Technological Singularity by wiping out Organics who may or may not be on the cusp of a Technological Singularity 'ascending' them to become a Reaper which is the physical manifestaiton of a Technological Singularity.  It's called Cicurlar Logic and it goes no where.

I have no argument that it sets galactic civilization back quite a bit but they still have alot of resources reapers, relay remnents, most of the tech they have now its not the total end for civilization just a set back.
As for the normandy getting stranded just remember what happened to the prothean scientists when they reprogrammed the keepers their sacrafice was the only reason we could get this far in the first place. Its only reasonable that the normandy and crew who have been at the heart of it from eden prime have to make an equal sacrafice in order to stop the reapers once and for all.

happy endings aren't always sunshine and kittens but the knowledge that your choices and sacrafices are the only thing that allow future generations to live without fear

Nobody is asking for sunshine and kittens, and quite frankly it's ridiculous to keep reading this crap being spewed from people's mouths.

People, including myself, are pissed at the choices being ripped from our hands. By your all's logic, why was there any way to save 'everyone' from the Collector Base assault? After all, sacrifice is required to do anything good, even in a video game, correct? But no, the option was there to have a good ening (for the player) and save all the characters they've grown attatched to.

Nobody is asking for a similar ending for ME3 to be the "canon" ending. People just want the option. As it stands all the endings (when it comes to your crew) are essentially ALL the same. What kind of decision making is that for the player? For a lot of people, the crew is the best part about the games. The interaction with your squad and the dialogue between them and Shepard and the friendship and bonds that develop in the game.

When you're forced to have  a singular downer ending with that aspect of the game, it's going to ****** people off and no amount of rationalization from people like you can change their mind, mine included. If this many people are pissed, SOMETHING IS WRONG.

The option should have been there to get a more feel good ending, plain and simple.

[rtv053]

Canned Bullets wrote...

This just isn't what the fans want and so far only the minority like it.

Good writers don't give people what they want. They give people what they need. In a totally different genre, I just finished reading The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo. I didn't want Mikael to hurt Lisbeth, but the story was all the better for it.

[Nerevar-as]

rtv053 wrote...

Ghost Rider LSOV wrote...

rtv053 wrote...
Because, ultimately, if Shepard were able to survive and become reunited with his crew, then truly they would have made no sacrifice at all.

Shepard can and does lose quite a few friends in the game, so I don't think this counts as "no sacrifice".

But their deaths aren't Shepard's sacrifice - they are the personal sacrifice of the people who gave up their lives for him, for their friends, for the war effort, for their own species and most importantly (from a paragon perspective) for the galactic community. Shepard's sacrifice needs to be something else.

People also seem to forget that, however heartbreaking it might be that Shepard may never see his old friends again, if he survives, he has the chance to go on and rebuild, to make new friends, to have a new life and find new loves. And hopefully, never have to pull a trigger ever again.

Why? Why has the definition of a hero changed so much that not only have the challenges be great, but that if his/her life doesn´t suck at the end of the fight people think their acomplishments are worth less than if the hero actually gets something out of it? Victory tasting like defeat doesn´t make a better story, especially not when it is this contrived.

[Hexxys]

KateKane wrote...

Canned Bullets wrote...

This just isn't what the fans want and so far only the minority like it.

The game wasn't made for the fans.

Correct, but there's only so far you can go to antagonize your customers before sales drop off.  Money, my friend, is what this game is made for.  And fans are money.

[Sargerus]

Canned Bullets wrote...

This just isn't what the fans want and so far only the minority like it.

Provide some reliable data to back up your statement then.

Modifié par Sargerus, 04 mars 2012 - 09:59 .

[Brahlis]

rtv053 wrote...

Canned Bullets wrote...

This just isn't what the fans want and so far only the minority like it.

Good writers don't give people what they want. They give people what they need. In a totally different genre, I just finished reading The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo. I didn't want Mikael to hurt Lisbeth, but the story was all the better for it.

A book is totally different from an 'epic' game that's touted as giving the player a heavy hand in influencing the story. There's zero rationalization for having all the endings be so downer with Shep and the crew.

[Hexxys]

Sargerus wrote...

Canned Bullets wrote...

This just isn't what the fans want and so far only the minority like it.

Provide some reliable data for your statement then.

What's your definition of reliable?  The ratings and responses on youtube have been overwhelmingly negative on videos showing the ending events.  There isn't an official poll though, if that's what you're asking.

rtv053 wrote...

Canned Bullets wrote...

This just isn't what the fans want and so far only the minority like it.

Good writers don't give people what they want. They give people what they need. In a totally different genre, I just finished reading The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo. I didn't want Mikael to hurt Lisbeth, but the story was all the better for it.

True.  But that doesn't mean that NOT giving people what they want is good writing.

Modifié par Hexxys, 04 mars 2012 - 10:04 .

[Reorte]

rtv053 wrote...

What is this sense of entitlement that we fans have? Why do we feel that Shepard should be the ONLY person in the entire galaxy who does not lose something in this war?

Because Shepard is the character we're playing. He still loses a lot but the endings mean he loses everything. It's not a case of "You'll lose people but who is down to your choices", like Kaidan or Ashley or depending on how you played ME2.

[fresh101]

I am not attackinig anybody here, nut I will pu some of the stuff, of what have been promised to be delivered, and what we have get:

1) we have been promised multiple DIFERENT endings, where our choices MATTERED and we got this:


2) we have been promised that ROLE-PLAYING MODE, would be just that, and we get, enormous amount of auto dialog in that mode, where Shepard just would not shut up,and here is an example, just watch careffuly:

p.s. also in this video is shown the lack of conversation options, there were mostly 3 options without investigate, and neutral option

3) we were promised better graphic and cinematic, or at least should expect in 2012 we wouldn't have to watch  minecraft people in AAA title:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xverS30ipL0

4 ) we have been promised a triling conclusion of trilogy, and we get Deus Ex PUSH THE BUTTON THAT DOES EVERYTHING ENDING with little differations, because in all endings mass relays get destroyed and your crew strangels in LOST series

5) and finally one of the things that wasn't promised, but we as a fans have expected  it:
a plot of this final story to be at least as good as in MASS EFFECT, and we get a plot that doesn't make sense, and is not even worthy of mentioning, it's just plane simple bad writing and lack of anykind of an idea


So conclusion:

They ruin the SAGA:o

I have never belive this game was meant to be a trilogy, no matter how many times they said it did, to support this claim, just look the lack of imagination in writing, and holes in lore of this narrative;

Also it's clear now that BioWare pushing this to be "GREAT START TO JUMP IN MASS EFFECT SERIES" has cost, and strip this game of hers core, insted of deepening the story they have dumb it down so that n00bs could play this, and finally:

I undestand that they can't, and will not comment this game until it is officially relised, but after 6-th march, Bioware should make an official apology to the fans and communty, and somehow punished those who are responsible for this disaster

It's at least what they can do:mellow:

[KateKane]

Hexxys wrote...

KateKane wrote...

Canned Bullets wrote...

This just isn't what the fans want and so far only the minority like it.

The game wasn't made for the fans.

Correct, but there's only so far you can go to antagonize your customers before sales drop off.  Money, my friend, is what this game is made for.  And fans are money.

But it's mostly being marketed towards a completely new audience.

They have the built-in fanbase and the new crowd they've catering to. It's actually very clever, but the game appears to have suffered for it.

That and the obvious cut corners, of course.

[Sargerus]

Hexxys wrote...

Sargerus wrote...

Canned Bullets wrote...

This just isn't what the fans want and so far only the minority like it.

Provide some reliable data for your statement then.

What's your definition of reliable?  The ratings and responses on youtube have been overwhelmingly negative on videos showing the ending events.  There isn't an official poll though, if that's what you're asking.

Ah, the world where youtube dislikes actually mean something. 

Modifié par Sargerus, 04 mars 2012 - 10:03 .

[rtv053]

The Bridgeburner wrote...

I get what you're saying, but where my frustration lies is with the MacGuffin and that the choices are ripping off of a much loved/vaunted sf rpg in its own right, Deus Ex. That doesn't sit well with me. At least rip off something less close to home. Not too mention the implausibility of the Merge/Synthesis ending... that's more my issue, less that Shepard is apart from the crew (although I feel for those who wish for the re-united option).

I don't like this term 'ripping off'. There are very few original ideas these days, least of all in science fiction. There are shapes, structures, tropes, memes, that keep reappearing over and over again in all of SF-dom. What makes each universe/IP unique is how those shapes, structures etc. are embellished and defined with details. Its not what you paint - its how you paint it. And ME is one of the most fascinating universes I can think of.

As for Deus Ex (and I mean the series), it 'ripped off' its ideas for the ending from dozens of other works. It was still a fascinating narrative though.

[Efesell]

Demanding apologies is nonsense, and I hate when developers actually do cave to that.

Fortunately it doesn't seem common.