101103 réponses à ce sujet

[ynh]

All they need to do is add a paragon and renegade interrupt while you are talking to God-VI. Shepard would then disprove God-VI's statements and convince him to call off the reaper attack. Perhaps God-VI would realize that his purpose had been fulfilled and that synthetic organic cooperation was possible without war and phase out.

Or they could cut out the God-VI part entirely and just let Shepard destroy the Reapers with the Crucible while Anderson watches in his final moments.

EDIT: I suggest option 1 because it is the most seamless retcon.

Modifié par ynh, 10 mars 2012 - 03:29 .

[GBGriffin]

B33ker wrote...

Ok I was just flipping channels on TV and came across a certain scene in a movie....

Does this sorta make sense?

While ranting to a friend of mine, he summed it up pretty well along those lines:

"If you loved Matrix Revolutions, chances are you'll love ME3."

Pretty much =/

[laughing sherpa girl]

B33ker wrote...

Ok I was just flipping channels on TV and came across a certain scene in a movie....

Does this sorta make sense?

Sorta?? Chuckles.. Thats what a great deal of this and the other mega thread are about.  Matrix/Deus Ex blended with Battlestar galactica and handed too us like it was fresh meat.. Its not even mass effect, and its not even original. Ergo, WTF??

[JPshieux]

CrimsonNephilim wrote...

mynameisdanza wrote...

Nyila wrote...

Levvi wrote...

Nyila wrote...

Schirach wrote...

slipliker wrote...

Btw, a little offtop here.
Is it just me or this kid appearing in the game multiple times is really annoying and makes you want to punch him in his face? o_o

I firmly believe Shepard felt guilty about not saving that child, and whatever manifested itself on the crucible used the image of what Shepard felt most guilt for to present itself.

I agree.

I would have preferred it if it manifested in the form of someone I actually knew that died, say Ashley, Mordin, Thane, or Legion. But maybe that's just me xD

Agreed.

I like the use of the child's image as the catalyst, though I was straining to recognize the other voices that were echoing along with the child's voice. I swear it sounded like Shep's voice, but I'd have to listen to it again.

Agreed.

I was trying to single out the echos in the catalyst's voice, and I swear they sound like male and female Shepard

Here is my other theory, the moment I heard about the Catalyst I said, "Shepard IS the catalyst."  Because a catalyst is what set events in motion no? and Shepard has been the moving source behind everything that happened.  Having the little boy show up in the form of what I believe was one of Shepard's regret is a little like a self manifestation of Shepard.. After all, Shepard is the one that makes the decision in the end. 

[Unender]

i would also pay for happy ending DLC, even though i'm okay with the delusion of headcannon, (in mine everything after harbingers beam hitting shepard was a dream, and anderson and my squad managed to use the crucible to deactivate the reapers. while doing so shepard died in his dream as well as in real life. which is why what we see is all we get since we're following shepards story. unless you did the destroy ending (( with high enough EMS)). in which case he survives while dreaming and wakes up to see the reapers defeated.)

[Kloborgg711]

ynh wrote...

All they need to do is add a paragon and renegade interrupt while you are talking to God-VI. Shepard would then disprove God-VI's statements and convince him to call off the reaper attack. Perhaps God-VI would realize that his purpose had been fulfilled and that synthetic organic cooperation was possible without war and phase out.

Or they could cut out the God-VI part entirely and just let Shepard destroy the Reapers with the Crucible while Anderson watches in his final moments.

EDIT: I suggest option 1 because it is the most seamless retcon.

I almost feel like they just didn't have time to add this, or they took it out at the last minute because it was too cluttered. Honestly, there have been times in ME before where I couldn't say exactly what I wanted to say, but never before did I feel so helpless. I was almost screaming at my monitor "WHAT ARE YOU DOING? ARGUE BACK! TELL HIM WHAT YOU TOLD SOVEREIGN!" But no. Shepard gives up. From a realistic point of view, I can't entirely blame him; he's on the verge of death, with this endless cycle on his shoulders, and he just has to pick a button. But this isn't about what an ordinary guy would probably do. This is about Shepard, the hero of the galaxy. I expected some more balls coming from him.

[Nyila]

Schirach wrote...

Here is my other theory, the moment I heard about the Catalyst I said, "Shepard IS the catalyst."  Because a catalyst is what set events in motion no? and Shepard has been the moving source behind everything that happened.  Having the little boy show up in the form of what I believe was one of Shepard's regret is a little like a self manifestation of Shepard.. After all, Shepard is the one that makes the decision in the end.

That was exactly my first thought too.

[Annaleah]

www.youtube.com/watch <- What the last five minutes of ME3 were like to me (Minus the humor)

Modifié par Annaleah, 10 mars 2012 - 03:34 .

[Alamandorious]

Just cancelled my Star Wars: The Old Republic subscription because of this debacle.

They will not get one more cent out of me.

[ynh]

Kloborgg711 wrote...

ynh wrote...

All they need to do is add a paragon and renegade interrupt while you are talking to God-VI. Shepard would then disprove God-VI's statements and convince him to call off the reaper attack. Perhaps God-VI would realize that his purpose had been fulfilled and that synthetic organic cooperation was possible without war and phase out.

Or they could cut out the God-VI part entirely and just let Shepard destroy the Reapers with the Crucible while Anderson watches in his final moments.

EDIT: I suggest option 1 because it is the most seamless retcon.

I almost feel like they just didn't have time to add this, or they took it out at the last minute because it was too cluttered. Honestly, there have been times in ME before where I couldn't say exactly what I wanted to say, but never before did I feel so helpless. I was almost screaming at my monitor "WHAT ARE YOU DOING? ARGUE BACK! TELL HIM WHAT YOU TOLD SOVEREIGN!" But no. Shepard gives up. From a realistic point of view, I can't entirely blame him; he's on the verge of death, with this endless cycle on his shoulders, and he just has to pick a button. But this isn't about what an ordinary guy would probably do. This is about Shepard, the hero of the galaxy. I expected some more balls coming from him.

They have the time now. I really hope they insert something like that in there, but I also hope that it isn't half-assed.

[Brandonhc]

Kloborgg711 wrote...

ynh wrote...

All they need to do is add a paragon and renegade interrupt while you are talking to God-VI. Shepard would then disprove God-VI's statements and convince him to call off the reaper attack. Perhaps God-VI would realize that his purpose had been fulfilled and that synthetic organic cooperation was possible without war and phase out.

Or they could cut out the God-VI part entirely and just let Shepard destroy the Reapers with the Crucible while Anderson watches in his final moments.

EDIT: I suggest option 1 because it is the most seamless retcon.

I almost feel like they just didn't have time to add this, or they took it out at the last minute because it was too cluttered. Honestly, there have been times in ME before where I couldn't say exactly what I wanted to say, but never before did I feel so helpless. I was almost screaming at my monitor "WHAT ARE YOU DOING? ARGUE BACK! TELL HIM WHAT YOU TOLD SOVEREIGN!" But no. Shepard gives up. From a realistic point of view, I can't entirely blame him; he's on the verge of death, with this endless cycle on his shoulders, and he just has to pick a button. But this isn't about what an ordinary guy would probably do. This is about Shepard, the hero of the galaxy. I expected some more balls coming from him.

Even near death Shepard would NEVER just accept the options laid out before him by some strange VI creature. Shepard did not lose his balls on the trip up.

Your not alone. I was yelling too "What are you doing! After all this! thats it!".
Then the feeling of complete emptyness and anger on how the story I grew to love.
Was spit out and then stomped on.

[thormir]

 still angry 24 hours later

[Beldamon]

Really, I think we know in our heart of hearts, we all know Bioware will not change their endings.

They wanted to generate a strong emotional reaction, and as that is what they got, they will consider the game they produced a success, no matter what the long term consequences may be.

I predict their reaction will be very much like their reaction to Dragon Age 2 -- mostly ignore it and soft-pedal their response with things like acknowledgement that maybe the journal wasn't perfect ( a common complaint) or the spacebar dong so many of things 'may' have been a mistake.

But all in all they stand to lose much face. The Devs took what they knew was a big risk, railroading us to the crappy endings they offered and the risk failed so badly it ruined what was otherwise a brilliant game and series.

Taking ownership of the real problem and fixing it would require them first to admit they made a serious mistake, thus make the failure real.

Besides they are metaphorical drug dealers who know however pissed off their clients may become, they have what we want. They know (or at least believe) we will keep crawling back for more regardless of how horribly they treat us.

[Zen_Mojo]

Brandonhc wrote...

Kloborgg711 wrote...

ynh wrote...

All they need to do is add a paragon and renegade interrupt while you are talking to God-VI. Shepard would then disprove God-VI's statements and convince him to call off the reaper attack. Perhaps God-VI would realize that his purpose had been fulfilled and that synthetic organic cooperation was possible without war and phase out.

Or they could cut out the God-VI part entirely and just let Shepard destroy the Reapers with the Crucible while Anderson watches in his final moments.

EDIT: I suggest option 1 because it is the most seamless retcon.

I almost feel like they just didn't have time to add this, or they took it out at the last minute because it was too cluttered. Honestly, there have been times in ME before where I couldn't say exactly what I wanted to say, but never before did I feel so helpless. I was almost screaming at my monitor "WHAT ARE YOU DOING? ARGUE BACK! TELL HIM WHAT YOU TOLD SOVEREIGN!" But no. Shepard gives up. From a realistic point of view, I can't entirely blame him; he's on the verge of death, with this endless cycle on his shoulders, and he just has to pick a button. But this isn't about what an ordinary guy would probably do. This is about Shepard, the hero of the galaxy. I expected some more balls coming from him.

Even near death Shepard would NEVER just accept the options laid out before him by some strange VI creature. Shepard did not lose his balls on the trip up.

Your not alone. I was yelling too "What are you doing! After all this! thats it!".
Then the feeling of complete emptyness and anger on how the story I grew to love.
Was spit out and then stomped on.

Let's face it.  Bioware pulled a Lost/Battlestar Galactica.  They gave you an amazing ride, completely forgot what the show was about, and decided to just throw out everything up until that point and pitch a message at you.

In Lost, they threw out all of the elaborate schemes, explanations, science fiction, time travle, and moral battles and gave you "Happy Supernatural Metaphysical Unitarian Funtime!"

In Battlestar Galactica, they threw out the human/AI conflict and gave you "Science is bad!  Time is circular!" crap that had nothing to do with the series.

In Mass Effect 3, they threw out peace, unity, diplomacy, perseverance against all odds, seeing the collective will for freedom and justice shared between species and races both organic and synthetic, and the family and friends you acquired in your travels and replaced it with, "Eldritch horror says organics and synthetics will never be able to cooperate no matter what!  Act accordingly!"

They led you down this winding path through the woods.  You learned, you grew, you were forced to think about things from a new perspective and exercise and test your philosophical underpinnings.  And then Bioware said, "Actually, none of that stuff that happened to you in the past matters anymore, the game is really about whether or not you want to kill all AIs in the universe!"

You can't help but feel that the ending was motivated more by Deus Ex than Fallout...or even the entire Mass Effect trilogy up until this point.  Deus Ex doesn't have many significant plot twists, and your choices don't drastically change the narrative.  However, in Fallout, this is exactly what happens to you.  Fallout (New Vegas in particular) designed an ending/DLC expansion system to recognize that you are shaping the land as you go along.

Mass Effect previously understood this, but then it treated the ending as if you just showed up.  It acted as if the only thing that was important was what you did AFTER you got to the end instead of all of the things you did in order to get to the end.

Modifié par Zen_Mojo, 10 mars 2012 - 03:52 .

[ynh]

Beldamon wrote...

Really, I think we know in our heart of hearts, we all know Bioware will not change their endings.

They wanted to generate a strong emotional reaction, and as that is what they got, they will consider the game they produced a success, no matter what the long term consequences may be.

I predict their reaction will be very much like their reaction to Dragon Age 2 -- mostly ignore it and soft-pedal their response with things like acknowledgement that maybe the journal wasn't perfect ( a common complaint) or the spacebar dong so many of things 'may' have been a mistake.

But all in all they stand to lose much face. The Devs took what they knew was a big risk, railroading us to the crappy endings they offered and the risk failed so badly it ruined what was otherwise a brilliant game and series.

Taking ownership of the real problem and fixing it would require them first to admit they made a serious mistake, thus make the failure real.

Besides they are metaphorical drug dealers who know however pissed off their clients may become, they have what we want. They know (or at least believe) we will keep crawling back for more regardless of how horribly they treat us.

The thing is, they don't need to remove content. They just need a simple paragon/renegade interrupt and add an additional ending. It's not asking for much honestly.

Modifié par ynh, 10 mars 2012 - 03:49 .

[Kloborgg711]

Beldamon wrote...

Really, I think we know in our heart of hearts, we all know Bioware will not change their endings.

I don't though. Maybe it's denial, or desparity, but I can't tell myself "That's it". I just can't. This series meant so much to me, and it was almost perfect. It's not fair that I paid $80, and not only did I feel disappointed with the ending of the game, but I was so distraught that I honestly don't see how I'll enjoy replaying ANY of the games. It sickens me to say it, but I felt better when I was still waiting for release. I can picture, unlikely though it may be, in a few years people discussing ME among the "best games ever" on some forum board, and someone in passing brings up this controversy that lasted a few weeks where everyone hated the ending and Bioware listened to their fanbase and saved the entire trilogy. Until they give some sort of official response, I still retain some hope for Bioware.

[Golferguy758]

Honestly, I think the opposite. The people who are finishing the game across the pond are having the same reactions as those people here. Boiware is concerned. EA is damn sure concerned because the loss of a huge portion of the fanbase is a serious thing.

if the opinions keep coming, if the emotions of the fans continue, and we are sane about our grievances I would say it's nearly a guarantee that DLC will come that relates directly to the ending in the form of additions as well as expounding on previous ones.

[Lexagg]

Beldamon wrote...

Really, I think we know in our heart of hearts, we all know Bioware will not change their endings.

They wanted to generate a strong emotional reaction, and as that is what they got, they will consider the game they produced a success, no matter what the long term consequences may be.

They generated a very strong emotional reaction in me with Baldur's Gate 2 that resulted in years of support and faith in the company. The emotional reaction they generated with ME3 leads to never doing business with them again. See, not every emotional reaction is good.

In fact, there is a very specific term on the internet for generating a negative emotional reaction. Wait for it...

Trolling.

[Landline]

Beldamon wrote...

I predict their reaction will be very much like their reaction to Dragon Age 2 -- mostly ignore it and soft-pedal their response with things like acknowledgement that maybe the journal wasn't perfect ( a common complaint) or the spacebar dong so many of things 'may' have been a mistake.

They do this and Bioware will be completely dead to me, I will never buy anything of theirs again.

[ynh]

Golferguy758 wrote...

Honestly, I think the opposite. The people who are finishing the game across the pond are having the same reactions as those people here. Boiware is concerned. EA is damn sure concerned because the loss of a huge portion of the fanbase is a serious thing.

if the opinions keep coming, if the emotions of the fans continue, and we are sane about our grievances I would say it's nearly a guarantee that DLC will come that relates directly to the ending in the form of additions as well as expounding on previous ones.

I agree with the second part of your statement (I can't speak for the reactions of EA or people across the pond). I sure hope that Bioware does see how much ME3 feels to people. I know I was completely bummed out by the endings and feel the same way that many others do (in terms of not being able to muster up the strength to play ME again).

[Neroteyen]

Beldamon wrote...

Really, I think we know in our heart of hearts, we all know Bioware will not change their endings.

They wanted to generate a strong emotional reaction, and as that is what they got, they will consider the game they produced a success, no matter what the long term consequences may be.

I predict their reaction will be very much like their reaction to Dragon Age 2 -- mostly ignore it and soft-pedal their response with things like acknowledgement that maybe the journal wasn't perfect ( a common complaint) or the spacebar dong so many of things 'may' have been a mistake.

But all in all they stand to lose much face. The Devs took what they knew was a big risk, railroading us to the crappy endings they offered and the risk failed so badly it ruined what was otherwise a brilliant game and series.

Taking ownership of the real problem and fixing it would require them first to admit they made a serious mistake, thus make the failure real.

Besides they are metaphorical drug dealers who know however pissed off their clients may become, they have what we want. They know (or at least believe) we will keep crawling back for more regardless of how horribly they treat us.

NOT
THIS
TIME
Im done with BW if this isn't fixed.
End of line

[DifferentD17]

You can have emotional reaction without making stuff up so it'll be an easier ending to make.

[Bachi1230]

thormir wrote...

 still angry 24 hours later

I'm having a mixture of anger/disappoint/confusion.

How did anyone think this was a good way to end the game?

[Eumerin]

Beldamon wrote...
They wanted to generate a strong emotional reaction, and as that is what they got, they will consider the game they produced a success, no matter what the long term consequences may be.

The problem is that the ending doesn't actually provide a strong emotional reaction.  Quite the opposite, in fact.  The ending itself produces very little in the way of an emotional reaction.

It's the realization that the ending produces so little emotion that is causing the anger on the part of the playerbase.  The distinction is a subtle one, but it's important.