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So we can't get the ending we want after all?


101103 réponses à ce sujet

#19601
TarielMaeda

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Faded-Myth wrote...

From the Mass Effect 2 facebook. I know they're not part of the dev team, but still...

"All of your feedback is very appreciated. We appreciate the time you all take to compose your responses, and we are taking an equal amount of time to read and consider each response. We hope that you are aware of that, and we would like you all to know that you are being heard :)."

Not much, but it's something.

What do you want to bet that's an automated response or something to just shut us up?
I've seen plenty of complaints with replys of "Thanks for your feedback :) "
Still, they know this will bite them in the ass SOMEHOW, right?

#19602
Computim

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Rulycar wrote...

I don't believe "Kobayashi Maru" was the way to end this title ...
... one way to end it, but NOT every way to end it.


Yeah.. at least have someone yelling "Perhaps today IS a good day to die.  Prepare for RAMMING SPEED!" and then ram the citadel into a reaper :P

#19603
infinitekilan

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TarielMaeda wrote...

Faded-Myth wrote...

From the Mass Effect 2 facebook. I know they're not part of the dev team, but still...

"All of your feedback is very appreciated. We appreciate the time you all take to compose your responses, and we are taking an equal amount of time to read and consider each response. We hope that you are aware of that, and we would like you all to know that you are being heard :)."

Not much, but it's something.

What do you want to bet that's an automated response or something to just shut us up?
I've seen plenty of complaints with replys of "Thanks for your feedback :) "
Still, they know this will bite them in the ass SOMEHOW, right?


Nah. Regardless of the current situation we are all facing, Bioware's long history of basically DEMANDING fan input speaks for itself. They are listening. How they respond to what we are saying is what will make or break their reputation as it pertains to caring about the fanbase.

#19604
DirtyBird627

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t_i_e_ wrote...

A lot of denial still going through the forums. Wonder when the acceptance will set in. More importantly how will players/fans move on from this? What will be the repercussions?


I think I've finally gotten past it, 4 days later. If this is what must be then I can live with it, but I'm done with Bioware, this is not how you finish a franchise. Someone should have taught Bioware not to burn their bridges.

#19605
christrek1982

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Rulycar wrote...

I don't believe "Kobayashi Maru" was the way to end this title ...
... one way to end it, but NOT every way to end it.


that was a grate ref mate all we need now is for Kirk to come and sort it lol

#19606
Guest_ShadowJ20_*

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RussianOrc wrote...

Just don't buy any ****ing dlc until they fix this crapy ending.


That's my game plan.  I also won't be buying anymore BW games.

#19607
cannedcream

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infinitekilan wrote...

TarielMaeda wrote...

Faded-Myth wrote...

From the Mass Effect 2 facebook. I know they're not part of the dev team, but still...

"All of your feedback is very appreciated. We appreciate the time you all take to compose your responses, and we are taking an equal amount of time to read and consider each response. We hope that you are aware of that, and we would like you all to know that you are being heard :)."

Not much, but it's something.

What do you want to bet that's an automated response or something to just shut us up?
I've seen plenty of complaints with replys of "Thanks for your feedback :) "
Still, they know this will bite them in the ass SOMEHOW, right?


Nah. Regardless of the current situation we are all facing, Bioware's long history of basically DEMANDING fan input speaks for itself. They are listening. How they respond to what we are saying is what will make or break their reputation as it pertains to caring about the fanbase.


I just want to hear an answer beyond some stock PR response.

#19608
DifferentD17

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www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004FYEZMQ/ref=cm_cr_rev_prod_title
www.metacritic.com/game/xbox-360/mass-effect-3

I'll just leave these here...

Modifié par DifferentD17, 12 mars 2012 - 03:57 .


#19609
Katosu

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infinitekilan wrote...

TarielMaeda wrote...

Faded-Myth wrote...

From the Mass Effect 2 facebook. I know they're not part of the dev team, but still...

"All of your feedback is very appreciated. We appreciate the time you all take to compose your responses, and we are taking an equal amount of time to read and consider each response. We hope that you are aware of that, and we would like you all to know that you are being heard :)."

Not much, but it's something.

What do you want to bet that's an automated response or something to just shut us up?
I've seen plenty of complaints with replys of "Thanks for your feedback :) "
Still, they know this will bite them in the ass SOMEHOW, right?


Nah. Regardless of the current situation we are all facing, Bioware's long history of basically DEMANDING fan input speaks for itself. They are listening. How they respond to what we are saying is what will make or break their reputation as it pertains to caring about the fanbase.


I dunno. I played SW:TOR with many others - many people oft times felt ignored. Now that's another undertaking and a massive one at that - so the lack of feedback there is maybe more understandable.

But this just seems par for the course after the feelings of neglect many people had over on that game. It seems ultimately perhaps Bioware's customer care skills just aren't really... as good as they could be? Perhaps 'Renegade' is what they would call it... :P

#19610
Soundsystem

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MrAtomica wrote...

- Anderson is suddenly aware of what the Collector Base looked like, despite never having seen the base, nor having any ability to have seen it (no one on Shepard's team takes photo or video of it). Again, the piles of bodies makes no sense in this regard, either.


My only nitpick here is that Anderson does say "It looks like your description of the Collector Base".

So I'm assuming some time in her 6 months on Earth Anderson and Shep sat down and she gave him a blow by blow of what her team had been up to.

#19611
PhoenixDove1

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revaew wrote...

Annaleah wrote...

Link
HA! Now he knows how we feel...


he almost described exactly how i have felt for the last 4 days


I almost feel bad for him.  Don't really know who he is.  Then I realize I don't know what he's talking about.  Is it because he truly feels our pain or because he is a go between for higher ups and will bet the bearer of bad news?  And speaking of which, how do we get to them?  I'm assuming the producers get the final say so ultimately the way the cutscenes are and the dialog used is on them.

This is the most I've posted on a sight about anything ever.  I feel a little crazy but I can't help it.

Modifié par PhoenixDove1, 12 mars 2012 - 03:59 .


#19612
ReapersSniper

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blackeyes677 wrote...

cannedcream wrote...

DifferentD17 wrote...

I'm glad the game has bad ratings on Metacritic and Amazon. User reviews of course, hopefully they will get the message.

5.0/10 on Metacritic www.metacritic.com/game/xbox-360/mass-effect-3
and
2.6/5 on Amazon www.amazon.com/Mass-Effect-3-Xbox-360/product-reviews/B004FYEZMQ/ref=cm_cr_dp_all_recent

I personally gave it a bad rating, because you can't promise so much and not deliver on it.


I have no idea how to rate ME3.

See, I LOVED the game, loved nearly all of it, just that ending ruins everything I thought I had done.

But... does this make the game bad? Well... no not really. It's still one of the best games I've ever played.... but the ending is one of the must insulting half-assed pieces of crap I've ever seen, too.... so I have no clue what to do.


Here is how I view it.  Give it a bad rating, say that the game was good until the ending.  If we get a new/fixed ending, go back and change your review to relfect that.



It got a 7/10 from me with no replay value, if they change fix the ending they'll get a 8.5 but until then its a 7

#19613
SkaldFish

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rianna wrote...

Yaldo wrote...

Feel I need to add my voice as well. I had prepared a few new sheps to start me3 with since losing most of my me1 playthroughs in a computer crash. And I was planning to start a whole lot more from the beginning of me1 after finishing me3, though you probably suspect how that panned out, not really feeling any motivation to play through it all again to end up with blue space-baby-jesus demanding I choose from 3 unacceptable options because of no reason what so ever.
Up until the end I was enjoying the game immensely, quite possibly the most enjoyably gaming experience I've had in a fair few years, continuing the emotional investment from the earlier games and adding to it, I was tearing up when Mordin sacrificed himself "Because someone else might get it wrong". I actually cared about Thane, who I found to be a bit bland and cliche in me2, Liara's timecapsule for future cycles had me sobbing. My up to that point pretty much pure paragon Fshep had to punch admiral Gerrel and throw him of my ship because I was that angry with him after returning from the geth dreadnought.
Being as we are what Terry Pratchett refers to as Pan narrans, the storytelling chimpanzee, we place a lot of weight on stories, even more so when we are as invested in them as you get after spending more than a hundred hours shaping the story with your own decisions. I suspect this is part of why it hurt so badly to have all those decisions stripped away and reduced to red/blue/green, oh and by the way the galaxy you fought to save is completely altered, and the people you care about are stranded somewhere for no apparent reason.
tl:dr like so many before me, loved the game up until the end, which soured the entire me experience.


Hello, fellow Pratchett fan! Now there's a man who knows how to write an ending! I agree that most of the anger toward the ending stems from how it simply does not mesh with the narrative we, as players, have been shaping for years. The story was changed on us and it isn't one we care to tell. That feeds into the feeling many of us have expressed that we don't want to play any part of the Mass Effect series again. The ending as it stands gives significance (or lack thereof, rather) to earlier actions in a way that subverts what we thought the story meant.

I swear, if I see one more snide comment about "entitled gamers trying to make artists change their ending" I'm going to throw my beer at the wall. My problems with this fallacious "infallible artistes have the right to make whatever they want without criticism" assumption aside, what's happening here is not standard gamer whining. Anybody who spends ten minutes actually reading this thread or the poll comments can see that. I realize it's an easy kneejerk reaction, especially for anybody who dared enjoy Dragon Age 2 and has spent a year having to hear about how supposedly terrible it is, but the differences between that fan reaction and this one are blatant.

I'm also irritated by such reverence for The Story, as if it's some kind of sacrilege to change an ending because it is so roundly despised. What century do you think this is? All art -- from writing to film to video games -- is rapidly becoming a direct collaboration of artist and audience. One of the great appeals of playing video games (at least those that value narrative as equal to or more important than shooting things) is to shape a story as it unfolds. It seems reasonable, then, that the audience has a greater stake than ever before in how a piece of art is presented. Does that mean every audience complaint is valid and must be accommodated? Of course not. But when the outcry is this loud and this focused and this anguished it should not be ignored. Artists today have the wonderful opportunity to take feedback and make changes to their work! Fighting that reality smacks of the stick-in-the-mud author insisting that only a typewriter can produce a good novel. This protest is NOT the equivalent of staging King Lear with no deaths at the end; it's the fans, as co-authors, objecting to an ending they find abhorrent. Our concerns are valid and I think Bioware should respond accordingly. Simple.

Someone remarked earlier here (or on one of the other "ending" threads - can't find it at the moment) something that bears repeating. To paraphrase:

A good author enters into an implicit contract with his/her readers. We all understand this contract at a subconscious level, because we sure know when it's been violated, but we rarely think about it on a conscious level. Similarly, because the ME trilogy is all about the story, BioWare (whether they like it or not) enters into an implicit contract with ME players.

The author (BioWare) understands that the reader is making an investment of money, time, intellect, and emotion in the story. In return, the reader trusts that the author (1) will adhere to the conventions of the genre; (2) will not change the rules in the middle of the story; (3) will provide an emotionally satisfying experience; (4) will not deceive the
reader; (5) will satisfy all expectations set earlier in the story, and (6) will provide a good (not necessarily happy, but appropriate, good quality) ending.

I think these elements of trust are even more important in an immersive, interactive product like a modern RPG, because the investment can be immense in scope and depth, and that requires a LOT of trust on the part of the gamer. Yet the attitude we see reflected by BioWare is that the story is what it is, is not subject to some democratic process, and we have no right to express concerns or criticism, even though, in the case of ME3, the writer/reader contract has been seriously violated.

I feel this can’t be reflective of BioWare’s internal corporate values, so I see it (in geeky programmer terms because that's what I am) as a failure to understand that its external user interfaces (BSN, user support, social media, etc) don’t reflect its internal values — something I’ve often seen happen to companies after acquisitions or rapid growth periods.

I remember a time when this wasn’t the case, and hope, if the right people get the message, that BioWare can regain the trust we want to give it. Because they can do amazing, brilliant work, and have demonstrated it time and time again.

Modifié par SkaldFish, 12 mars 2012 - 04:01 .


#19614
illutian

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Tunapiano wrote...

As you can see he states that their goal at this point is to polish the game and not add new content, so they really don't care what we want or say it seems, they are sticking to the 3 endings is what i get from reading the 2nd paragraph.

www.twitlonger.com/show/gcijat << Source


Fine by me.

Time to cancel my SWTOR and drop Bio(Crap) like all the other studios that told their fanbase to F-off.


EA, where great studios go to die.<_<

#19615
Faded-Myth

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I have no doubts Bioware aren't responding much until they're ready to address the issue. I still love ME3 immensely though and I still trust Bioware as a developer. I'll give them a chance to do something about this, and if I have to put up with auto-responses in the meantime.

#19616
Puppet_Guy

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PhoenixDove1 wrote...

revaew wrote...

Annaleah wrote...

Link
HA! Now he knows how we feel...


he almost described exactly how i have felt for the last 4 days


I almost feel bad for him.  Don't really know who he is, this is the most I've posted on a sight about anything ever.  When I feel bad for him I realize don't know what he's talking about.  Is it because he truly feels our pain or because he is a go between for higher ups?  And speaking of which, how do we get to them?  I'm assuming the producers get the final say so ultimately the way the cutscenes are and the dialog used is on them.


I feel rather bad for him...  THere's probably a fair number of staff on the Bioware team that put their friggan' souls into this...  To see this happening is probably one of the worst things that can happen to a game team.

That being said, at least it means they're watching...  I hope.

#19617
t_i_e_

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DirtyBird627 wrote...

t_i_e_ wrote...

A lot of denial still going through the forums. Wonder when the acceptance will set in. More importantly how will players/fans move on from this? What will be the repercussions?


I think I've finally gotten past it, 4 days later. If this is what must be then I can live with it, but I'm done with Bioware, this is not how you finish a franchise. Someone should have taught Bioware not to burn their bridges.


Brother you and me both. I'd buy you a drink if I could. But I wonder what the rest of the Bioware fan base will do.

#19618
DirtyBird627

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Ivon wrote...

Tunapiano wrote...

As you can see he states that their goal at this point is to polish the game and not add new content, so they really don't care what we want or say it seems, they are sticking to the 3 endings is what i get from reading the 2nd paragraph.

www.twitlonger.com/show/gcijat << Source


Fine by me.

Time to cancel my SWTOR and drop Bio(Crap) like all the other studios that told their fanbase to F-off.


EA, where great studios go to die.<_<


Agreed, it's too bad it has to be this way. I'm running out of game studios, might be time for a new hobby.

#19619
Auralius Carolus

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TarielMaeda wrote...

Still, they know this will bite them in the ass SOMEHOW, right?


Maybe. If the higher ups desire a satisfied consumer base, then yes. Unfortunately EA has developed something of a reputation as a slash-and-burn entertainment institution. If those in important design/corperate/shareholder positions do care, then it's a matter of breaching the bureaucracy shield and popular media deflection.

PR reps and moderators won't matter if certain project leads successfully downplay it in order to save face.

#19620
Lord Deshwitat

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Toby Shepard wrote...

Lord Deshwitat wrote...

The green is the way for me=). I only wish I could see how life became after my Shep saved everyone. I wanted more information about all races. That is the only thing lacking for me. 


With the Mass Relays gone the Krogan will die out. Their most respectable, most capable soldiers are stuck on earth / in the Sol system while their only hope, the female Krogan, sits on Tuchanka.

Quarians will never see the planet Shepard reconquered.

Asari have no possibilities cleaning up their homeplanet.

With the Mass Relays gone, no food imports for all the planets and systems that rely on it.

Humans are happy because they are the only ones sitting on their homeplanet.

The Normandy crew goes insane (same story as Jacob loyalty mission).

I'm sure I forgot a lot of other things but that is the rundown.


How do you know that? If you choose green ending you become half machine and if you have gotten alot of WA the earth is somewhat saved. With you new abilitys perhaps you can build new and better ships that can overcome what you just wrote. Even in the other endings that is possible. And normandys crew couild have repaired the ship and been able to fly to another planet with life on it.
If you now saying that the last scene with the old man and child say oterwise. How do you know that? Maybe it's only a grandfather and his grandson/daughter(?) talking about what the child want to do in the future. Maybe there already is possible to fly to the stars, but not for a young child.
Nevermind all... I liked it and that I will stand for. Just a more detailed epiloge would have been nice.

#19621
christrek1982

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Ivon wrote...

Tunapiano wrote...

As you can see he states that their goal at this point is to polish the game and not add new content, so they really don't care what we want or say it seems, they are sticking to the 3 endings is what i get from reading the 2nd paragraph.

www.twitlonger.com/show/gcijat << Source


Fine by me.

Time to cancel my SWTOR and drop Bio(Crap) like all the other studios that told their fanbase to F-off.


EA, where great studios go to die.<_<


well ending my sum on monday

#19622
KaiserinKai

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Sarz91 wrote...

Posted by Bulldog2012

"I saved the council.
I saved Wrex.
I completed the suicide mission with no one dying and destroyed the collector base.
I saved the Rachni
I cured the Genophage.
I stopped the Geth-Quarian war.

and all I got to do at the end was pick the color green."


Change "green" to "red", and that's what happened to me in a nutshell...

#19623
Katosu

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christrek1982 wrote...

Ivon wrote...

Tunapiano wrote...

As you can see he states that their goal at this point is to polish the game and not add new content, so they really don't care what we want or say it seems, they are sticking to the 3 endings is what i get from reading the 2nd paragraph.

www.twitlonger.com/show/gcijat << Source


Fine by me.

Time to cancel my SWTOR and drop Bio(Crap) like all the other studios that told their fanbase to F-off.


EA, where great studios go to die.<_<


well ending my sum on monday


I guess you have a point - stopping my SWTOR subS and placing the reason as "BioWare ****Ed up Mass Effect 3, want nothing more to do with them." is a strong way to send a message. Especially since as a PC gamer, I can't really go and sell my copy back to Gamestop.

At this point, I am heavily dissapointed. ): It even makes me regret having Origin's client, because now the MAss Effect 3 Digital Delux Edition picture is like a slap in the face.

#19624
MrPuschel

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Last +1 for today. Need a nap. I hope i have some weired **** dreams where cthullu, H.P. Lovecraft and Freddy Krueger givin a big party because it would STILL be better then ME3 Ending :3

#19625
infinitekilan

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I'm actually more inclined to blame EA rather than Bioware. EA only has one care in the world: money. Origin is a joke, their "customer service" is atrocious and insulting, and they don't care about their customers. If it weren't for the truckloads of money they receive from the sports games they release on a yearly basis with little more than updated rosters, they might actually be humble enough to care about the customer, the people who allow them to stay in business. Instead, crap like this happens while they sit there drooling with giant dollar signs in their eyes.