Aller au contenu

Photo

So we can't get the ending we want after all?


101103 réponses à ce sujet

#22751
Darkspazztic

Darkspazztic
  • Members
  • 254 messages

Jackal7713 wrote...

Darkspazztic wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

It just blows my mind how ten minutes can ruin 3 games. It would be like everyone in the fellowship getting powned at the end of return of the king.


Close.  It would be more akin to Frodo dying as he throws the ring in, then the rest of the Felloswhip getting stranded at the border of Mordor and not being able to return because Tolkien got Alzheimer's and forgot which part to put the YOU SHALL NOT PASS.

LMAO!!  Don't forget the you shall not pass has to be in three different colors! :o


Oh God I don't think we're supposed to be laughing at this, but I can't stop! :D

#22752
Jackal7713

Jackal7713
  • Members
  • 1 661 messages

DifferentD17 wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

It just blows my mind how ten minutes can ruin 3 games. It would be like everyone in the fellowship getting powned at the end of return of the king.



No the only way for Frodo to destroy the ring is for him to jump in the lava with it. Then Sam and Golem have magically teleported to the battle with Aragon, Gimli, Etc. They are all picked up by Gandalf and his eagles then the eagles out run the exploding eye and all our favorite characters are stranded on an island with a single palm tree since all the eagles some how died . So tropical I know.


Great Island Deliverance FTW! Although, I don't think Tolkien would resort to incest plot hole. :blink:

#22753
PhoenixDove1

PhoenixDove1
  • Members
  • 480 messages
I like all the comparisons to LOTR, Star Wars and all the other great epic movies like that, if BW *cough* takes a minute to think about how those movies ended without the main characters dying and we all still loved them, and how, even though they were longer than normal movies (LOTR I'm looking at you) we all felt closure at the end of them, making it all worth it.  I think that helps support that you can 'end' a trilogy (Shepard's story) in a highly satisfactory way.   What happened??

#22754
IndelibleJester

IndelibleJester
  • Members
  • 539 messages

MissNet wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

IndelibleJester wrote...

Personally, I don't understand how Bioware got ME3 out so fast after ME2 - I wish they'd taken more time, two more years say...

At ME 2 release it was in development.


And they didn't need to make it from a scratch. The enginie, textures and models were basically the same. Actually, they concentrated their work on history and multiplayer. I think...


I'm talking about actual content - what's there is there, but they upgraded textures, models, animations, plus writing, content, quests, areas... Two years just doesn't seem like enough - and with so much cut content, I wouldn't say I'm wrong, either...

#22755
ashley_actually

ashley_actually
  • Members
  • 163 messages

DifferentD17 wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

It just blows my mind how ten minutes can ruin 3 games. It would be like everyone in the fellowship getting powned at the end of return of the king.



No the only way for Frodo to destroy the ring is for him to jump in the lava with it. Then Sam and Golem have magically teleported to the battle with Aragon, Gimli, Etc. They are all picked up by Gandalf and his eagles then the eagles run away from the exploding eye and all our favorite characters are stranded on an island with a single palm tree since all the eagles some how died . So tropical I know.


Look on the God Child of the Ring works ye mighty and despair. 

#22756
Spartanak

Spartanak
  • Members
  • 26 messages

Jackal7713 wrote...

It just blows my mind how ten minutes can ruin 3 games. It would be like everyone in the fellowship getting powned at the end of return of the king.


exactly!!

#22757
illutian

illutian
  • Members
  • 136 messages
How do you keep reading this thread....play this link

http://www.repeatmyv...0&kmdom=youtube

It's the Mass Effect - Shepard Tribute on a site that will auto-loop it.

#22758
Jackal7713

Jackal7713
  • Members
  • 1 661 messages

Darkspazztic wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

Darkspazztic wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

It just blows my mind how ten minutes can ruin 3 games. It would be like everyone in the fellowship getting powned at the end of return of the king.


Close.  It would be more akin to Frodo dying as he throws the ring in, then the rest of the Felloswhip getting stranded at the border of Mordor and not being able to return because Tolkien got Alzheimer's and forgot which part to put the YOU SHALL NOT PASS.

LMAO!!  Don't forget the you shall not pass has to be in three different colors! :o


Oh God I don't think we're supposed to be laughing at this, but I can't stop! :D

Gollum "  the precious comes in colors" :P

Modifié par Jackal7713, 13 mars 2012 - 06:37 .


#22759
Darth Garrus

Darth Garrus
  • Members
  • 844 messages

MissNet wrote...

And they didn't need to make it from a scratch. The enginie, textures and models were basically the same. Actually, they concentrated their work on history and multiplayer. I think...


There´s a lot going on the preparation of a game like this. Let´s not go on this kind of speculation.

What I think is important is to emphasize that an ending defines a game. Or a book, a story, a movie, anything. You spend years in a game like this, and want the best possible endings. What is so bad is that companies think they can just give you amazing action or story, and ignore the endings.

I wanted to see a company that would be remembered by planning lots of different endings, all with their cutscenes, movies, dialogues etc. Instead of saying: "we recorded 40.000 lines of dialogue", they would say: "We recorded 40.000 lines of dialogue, and 1.000 just for the different endings". Have a team worried about the endings.

A bad ending defines your product. Ruins years of good work. A rushed or just bad ending keeps you from greatness. Respecting all the fans could think about a game they spent so many hours (and years) playing makes a company legendary.

Right now, BW lost an opportunity to go beyond all that.

#22760
Darkspazztic

Darkspazztic
  • Members
  • 254 messages

Jackal7713 wrote...

Darkspazztic wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

Darkspazztic wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

It just blows my mind how ten minutes can ruin 3 games. It would be like everyone in the fellowship getting powned at the end of return of the king.


Close.  It would be more akin to Frodo dying as he throws the ring in, then the rest of the Felloswhip getting stranded at the border of Mordor and not being able to return because Tolkien got Alzheimer's and forgot which part to put the YOU SHALL NOT PASS.

LMAO!!  Don't forget the you shall not pass has to be in three different colors! :o


Oh God I don't think we're supposed to be laughing at this, but I can't stop! :D

Gollum "  the precious comes in colors"


Nasty tricksy quarianses!

#22761
CatManDoo44

CatManDoo44
  • Members
  • 29 messages

IndelibleJester wrote...

MissNet wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

IndelibleJester wrote...

Personally, I don't understand how Bioware got ME3 out so fast after ME2 - I wish they'd taken more time, two more years say...

At ME 2 release it was in development.


And they didn't need to make it from a scratch. The enginie, textures and models were basically the same. Actually, they concentrated their work on history and multiplayer. I think...


I'm talking about actual content - what's there is there, but they upgraded textures, models, animations, plus writing, content, quests, areas... Two years just doesn't seem like enough - and with so much cut content, I wouldn't say I'm wrong, either...


It ended up being the same development timeline as between Mass Effect 1 and 2, with a lot less core work to be redone like gameplay and graphics.  It doesn't seem like an unreasonable development cycle.  Maybe it's just evidence of what happens when you replace Drew with Mac for the game's entire development.

#22762
Jackal7713

Jackal7713
  • Members
  • 1 661 messages

Darkspazztic wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

Darkspazztic wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

Darkspazztic wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

It just blows my mind how ten minutes can ruin 3 games. It would be like everyone in the fellowship getting powned at the end of return of the king.


Close.  It would be more akin to Frodo dying as he throws the ring in, then the rest of the Felloswhip getting stranded at the border of Mordor and not being able to return because Tolkien got Alzheimer's and forgot which part to put the YOU SHALL NOT PASS.

LMAO!!  Don't forget the you shall not pass has to be in three different colors! :o


Oh God I don't think we're supposed to be laughing at this, but I can't stop! :D

Gollum "  the precious comes in colors"


Nasty tricksy quarianses!

Smeagol doesn't like the incest innuendos

#22763
DifferentD17

DifferentD17
  • Members
  • 1 103 messages

Jackal7713 wrote...

DifferentD17 wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

It just blows my mind how ten minutes can ruin 3 games. It would be like everyone in the fellowship getting powned at the end of return of the king.



No the only way for Frodo to destroy the ring is for him to jump in the lava with it. Then Sam and Golem have magically teleported to the battle with Aragon, Gimli, Etc. They are all picked up by Gandalf and his eagles then the eagles out run the exploding eye and all our favorite characters are stranded on an island with a single palm tree since all the eagles some how died . So tropical I know.


Great Island Deliverance FTW! Although, I don't think Tolkien would resort to incest plot hole. :blink:


No they all wither and die, since they are all men.

#22764
Reaper of Reapers

Reaper of Reapers
  • Members
  • 60 messages

Darkspazztic wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

Darkspazztic wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

Darkspazztic wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

It just blows my mind how ten minutes can ruin 3 games. It would be like everyone in the fellowship getting powned at the end of return of the king.


Close.  It would be more akin to Frodo dying as he throws the ring in, then the rest of the Felloswhip getting stranded at the border of Mordor and not being able to return because Tolkien got Alzheimer's and forgot which part to put the YOU SHALL NOT PASS.

LMAO!!  Don't forget the you shall not pass has to be in three different colors! :o


Oh God I don't think we're supposed to be laughing at this, but I can't stop! :D

Gollum "  the precious comes in colors"


Nasty tricksy quarianses!


ROFLMAOOO! This is pure unobtainium right here.

#22765
SkaldFish

SkaldFish
  • Members
  • 768 messages
Regarding that magnum opus on IGN: Arrogance and condescension just drip from that video. Who has the entitlement issue here? I think it's the guy who feels ENTITLED to verbally abuse those with whom he disagrees.

It's one thing to engage in a real debate and quite another to set up a strawman, pretend it's the issue, and bludgeon it into the ground like Shepard head-stomping a husk. It's easy to be a bully when your targets stand silent behind a webcam lens, I suppose.

How many times do we have to say this? The real issue here is product quality, not user preference. ME 3's ending is of such poor quality that the contrast with the rest of the game is stark. From the perspectives of writing, gameplay consistency & mechanics, editing, plot development, conceptual coherence, characterization, user experience -- every important facet of game dynamics -- it misses the quality mark.

Moreover, this is NOT about an artist's right to freedom of expression or the idea that creativity is not a democratic process. (ALTHOUGH... is that really true? See the footnote*)

We are not saying to a novelist "we just don't like your novel -- rewrite it!"  We're saying "We paid you for a portrait, but you failed to capture the likeness. It needs to be reworked so that it looks like the subject."

Perhaps of equal importance is the simple fact that this is NOT a novel or a painting or a movie. It is an interactive RPG -- unfortunately one that, when interactive role playing is most critically important, completely ignores that role, dictates a completely generic set of outcomes and rushes to a completely incoherent conclusion. Can it really be true that no one at BioWare understands this?

There are objective standards that should have been met. They were not met. The product is defective. As consumers who have purchased the product, we are requesting that those defects be resolved. No amount of dismissive ridicule or name-calling invalidates the legitimacy of that position.

* Those who have so quickly invoked the notion that the public is wrong to evaluate or criticize or suggest (even demand) changes to a "creative work" like ME3 have clearly never been artists or writers. I have an undergraduate degree in art. From day one, it was hammered into us that criticism is the single most valuable gift an artist can receive. Once you've sat through a few hundred critique sessions during which your professors and peers excoriate your work, you begin to develop a thick skin -- and to understand that an artist who cannot graciously accept and respond to criticism -- no matter how harsh -- cannot grow or improve. Literary agents, editors, and publishers provide the same essential training to novelists. This prepares creators of art or literature for the final gauntlet -- the public. It would likely surprise those who feel the need to speak out on behalf of poor artists who are being "unfairly criticized" that Renaissance masters considered it to be not the right but the responsibility of the public -- in their case made up primarily of illiterate peasants -- to critically evaluate their work. How could they believe such a thing? Simple. They understood who their art was for.

Today, we more commonly hear retorts like "what gives you the right to criticize my work?" or "how dare you suggest that I change my personal creative expression!!" My, how things change...

Modifié par SkaldFish, 13 mars 2012 - 06:45 .


#22766
jtkirk2000

jtkirk2000
  • Members
  • 5 messages
I'm still chuckling over how messed up the ending is. I just want them to say that it is as intended, with no updates and that there will be no more DLC for the game released. The End.

With that they can talk about some other story in the ME universe that I may consider in the next decade.

#22767
allyon

allyon
  • Members
  • 46 messages
I'm off to bed. Have class and work.
Hold the line.

#22768
Jackal7713

Jackal7713
  • Members
  • 1 661 messages

SkaldFish wrote...

Regarding that magnum opus on IGN: Arrogance and condescension just drip from that video. Who has the entitlement issue here? I think it's the guy who feels ENTITLED to verbally abuse those with whom he disagrees.

It's one thing to engage in a real debate and quite another to set up a strawman, pretend it's the issue, and bludgeon it into the ground like Shepard head-stomping a husk. It's easy to be a bully when your targets stand silent behind a webcam lens, I suppose.

How many times do we have to say this? The real issue here is product quality, not user preference. ME 3's ending is of such poor quality that the contrast with the rest of the game is stark. From the perspectives of writing, gameplay consistency & mechanics, editing, plot development, conceptual coherence, characterization, user experience -- every important facet of game dynamics -- it misses the quality mark.

Moreover, this is NOT about an artist's right to freedom of expression or the idea that creativity is not a democratic process. (ALTHOUGH... is that really true? See the footnote*)

We are not saying to a novelist "we just don't like your novel -- rewrite it!"  We're saying "We paid you for a portrait, but you failed to capture the likeness. It needs to be reworked so that it looks like the subject."

Perhaps of equal importance is the simple fact that this is NOT a novel or a painting or a movie. It is an interactive RPG -- unfortunately one that, when interactive role playing is most critically important, completely ignores that role, dictates a completely generic set of outcomes and rushes to a completely incoherent conclusion. Can it really be true that no one at BioWare understands this?

There are objective standards that should have been met. They were not met. The product is defective. As consumers who have purchased the product, we are requesting that those defects be resolved. No amount of dismissive ridicule or name-calling invalidates the legitimacy of that position.

* Those who have so quickly invoked the notion that the public is wrong to evaluate or criticize or suggest (even demand) changes to a "creative work" like ME3 have clearly never been artists or writers. I have an undergraduate degree in art. From day one, it was hammered into us that criticism is the single most valuable gift an artist can receive. Once you've sat through a few hundred critique sessions during which your professors and peers excoriate your work, you begin to develop a thick skin -- and to understand that an artist who cannot graciously accept and respond to criticism -- no matter how harsh -- cannot grow or improve. Literary agents, editors, and publishers provide the same essential training to novelists. This prepares creators of art or literature for the final gauntlet -- the public. It would likely surprise those who feel the need to speak out on behalf of poor artists who are being "unfairly criticized" that Renaissance masters considered it to be not the right but the responsibility of the public -- in their case made up primarily of illiterate peasants -- to critically evaluate their work. How could they believe such a thing? Simple. They understood who their art was for.

Today, we more commonly hear retorts like "what gives you the right to criticize my work?" or "how dare you suggest that I change my personal creative expression!!" My, how things change...


We are not saying to a novelist "we just don't like your novel --
rewrite it!"  We're saying "We paid you for a portrait, but you failed
to capture the likeness. It needs to be reworked so that it looks like
the subject." 


Tell them brother!

#22769
TSC_1

TSC_1
  • Members
  • 568 messages
I may have missed someone posting this, so apologies if you've already seen it, but here is the latest from Kotaku.

#22770
Guest_Anthonx_*

Guest_Anthonx_*
  • Guests
Btw.. The Departed, great movie.
www.imdb.com/title/tt0407887/

#22771
The Big Palooka

The Big Palooka
  • Members
  • 175 messages
Well, I'm off for the night. Keep fighting the good fight - and Hold the Line.

Keelah Se'lai

#22772
CatManDoo44

CatManDoo44
  • Members
  • 29 messages
I saw that. It was posted earlier but it is good that you brought it up again. It's interesting how quickly they do an about face. The gameplay mechanic argument is great. However, I think the author is too dismissive of the plot hole issues as "creative" freedom.

#22773
Zulmoka531

Zulmoka531
  • Members
  • 824 messages
Found this on Kotaku. It made me lol a bit:
Image IPB

#22774
PhoenixDove1

PhoenixDove1
  • Members
  • 480 messages

SkaldFish wrote...

Regarding that magnum opus on IGN: Arrogance and condescension just drip from that video. Who has the entitlement issue here? I think it's the guy who feels ENTITLED to verbally abuse those with whom he disagrees.

It's one thing to engage in a real debate and quite another to set up a strawman, pretend it's the issue, and bludgeon it into the ground like Shepard head-stomping a husk. It's easy to be a bully when your targets stand silent behind a webcam lens, I suppose.

How many times do we have to say this? The real issue here is product quality, not user preference. ME 3's ending is of such poor quality that the contrast with the rest of the game is stark. From the perspectives of writing, gameplay consistency & mechanics, editing, plot development, conceptual coherence, characterization, user experience -- every important facet of game dynamics -- it misses the quality mark.

Moreover, this is NOT about an artist's right to freedom of expression or the idea that creativity is not a democratic process. (ALTHOUGH... is that really true? See the footnote*)

We are not saying to a novelist "we just don't like your novel -- rewrite it!"  We're saying "We paid you for a portrait, but you failed to capture the likeness. It needs to be reworked so that it looks like the subject."

Perhaps of equal importance is the simple fact that this is NOT a novel or a painting or a movie. It is an interactive RPG -- unfortunately one that, when interactive role playing is most critically important, completely ignores that role, dictates a completely generic set of outcomes and rushes to a completely incoherent conclusion. Can it really be true that no one at BioWare understands this?

There are objective standards that should have been met. They were not met. The product is defective. As consumers who have purchased the product, we are requesting that those defects be resolved. No amount of dismissive ridicule or name-calling invalidates the legitimacy of that position.

* Those who have so quickly invoked the notion that the public is wrong to evaluate or criticize or suggest (even demand) changes to a "creative work" like ME3 have clearly never been artists or writers. I have an undergraduate degree in art. From day one, it was hammered into us that criticism is the single most valuable gift an artist can receive. Once you've sat through a few hundred critique sessions during which your professors and peers excoriate your work, you begin to develop a thick skin -- and to understand that an artist who cannot graciously accept and respond to criticism -- no matter how harsh -- cannot grow or improve. Literary agents, editors, and publishers provide the same essential training to novelists. This prepares creators of art or literature for the final gauntlet -- the public. It would likely surprise those who feel the need to speak out on behalf of poor artists who are being "unfairly criticized" that Renaissance masters considered it to be not the right but the responsibility of the public -- in their case made up primarily of illiterate peasants -- to critically evaluate their work. How could they believe such a thing? Simple. They understood who their art was for.

Today, we more commonly hear retorts like "what gives you the right to criticize my work?" or "how dare you suggest that I change my personal creative expression!!" My, how things change...


I love your post!  You express it perfectly.  And on your (that) note this is my last post for the night.  Hold the line! Image IPB

#22775
ashley_actually

ashley_actually
  • Members
  • 163 messages
 Listening to the soundtrack again. It is just so damn good. 
www.youtube.com/playlist

Really the whole game was just so on point right up until the god child showed up.