101103 réponses à ce sujet

[mkohan7]

(wrap up)

[Astralify]

Ffelan wrote...

Speaking of emotional devastation, don't know if this was heard here yet. It's the cut dialogue between Shep and Anderson in their last scene together.

FemShep:
MaleShep:

Warming: might need a hanky on hand

Too bad this was cut. It's so much more powerful.

Why did they cut that??? No words...

[Dan Rosse]

Landline wrote...

How much longer until Bioware has to close this thread due to it getting too big and risking breaking the forums?

Are you actually hoping or fearing?

[Storm _]

How many hours until this thread hits 1000? Two maybe?

Keep up the good work everyone.

[B33ker]

WvStolzing wrote...

RebelByDesign wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Just so you know, Matriarch Aethyta is in ME1.

No she isn't?

Aethyta is the bartender in ME2; the relevant 'matriarch' in ME1 is probably the one whose scriptures we get to collect on various planets.

By the way, I didn't get the Aethyta bit in ME3 (although I did all that was necessary, according to the wiki page), but it looks like she is Liara's 'father' after all... Wow... masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Aethyta

Yup she is.  I convinced Liara to go talk to her too.

Later on when walking by Liara said something along the lines of "I have a half sister who's part Hanar?"

Was a good chuckle. 

[Nilofeliu]

Darth Suetam wrote...

                                                Storytelling,climax and anti-climax.

                Sure, anti-climax kicks in. But anti-climax should be a feeling of emptiness after you have experienced
a well deserved climax. A feeling that actually takes you back to relive the great emotions that once took you to that warm climatic emotions.

                Sadly, that is not the case in ME3. Anti-climax is the rule, and there were no candy and flowers before.  

                As a writer, I keep telling my friends that games are an art form that go between movies and books. They have the potential to be more complex than movies, and usually can’t be as dense as a book. Especially because you have to fill it up with action and you can’t let the imagination fill the gaps as you can do in books. So, RPG games, no matter what kind of RPGs, are based on the writing. And Bioware always excelled on this. Sadly, no one is immune to certain temptations.

                Let´s take a step back and discuss the origins of some of our writings and narrative styles. Not going to try to exam all of it, as it is impossible in mere lines. But let´s take a look at some of the culprits.

                Nietzsche and the merry band of nihilists. I’ll spare us of epistemological discussions, but Fred (our pall Friedrich Nietzsche) always said that the world returned us an inverse proportionally amount of results to the  amount we wanted. In other words, frustration with results is the law. Baudrillard pointed out in a very precise way that indifferentism is killing us. But that’s the tip of a big iceberg. The problem begins when our age embraces it as a viable option. We live in an age of nihilism. I think that that youth movement described as “emo” can be our representative today. Not that we didn’t have others before, but it appears to me that is their turn to represent the generation that likes to listen to depressive songs, wear black not as fashion or a “form of expression”, but as a form of quitting hope and embracing depression. 

                The point is: our writing got to a point where “happy ends are for the weak”, supposedly for the people “who can’t see that the world is bad, and supposed to quash our hopes”. People actually demand that stories go “darker”, and every “darker” story is praised automatically, as if “darker” automatically means good writing.

                Going back to ME3. What all this has to do with ME3? Well, to start, all the endings tell you something very grim: there is no hope! Not for total happiness. Neither beating entropy. And frankly, they all tell us that we  can’t, no matter how we try, to control our creations. The only way out is to accept a new way of life, devoid of technology and restrictive of thought. If not, inevitably we will face our doom. Well, as it is stated in the game, if we had not developed, the Reapers would not take interest in us, and we would survive. What we need is a gigantic
way of control, where we would constantly be challenged not to create or expand! Live knowing that whatever you do is just a way of accelerating your doom.

                Strangely enough, Commander Shepard was exactly the antagonist of that kind of thought. His mission was to fight for what the world kept telling him was impossible. Playing Commander Shepard meant playing against the odds. Playing to defy a written in stone story that said that there was no hope if we dared to evolve and to want more. It was about fighting for freedom of speech, for freedom from joining a pattern, for freedom in its pure state. 

                Being good or bad, what the end of the game tells you, no matter how you feel about it? That there is no hope, unless you join the ranks of the obedient, and supposedly live happily being subservient. And there´s no way around it. 

                You can say: but that is just one ending. You can control the Reapers or join with them. The point is there again. You either “control” again, or get to join the band. Individuality and freedom are not in those endings either. It´s control and control and control. It´s loosing yourself, giving away your freedom of thought, and not being able to do something about it. And that´s the thing is being commented. You just can´t do something about it. And  that´s nihilism for you.

                Again, the problem is that we played a character based on defying the odds (“never tell me the odds” by another space adventurer come to mind)! We were pushed to believe that this character could rally people, make accepting kettle-like people turn into freedom fighters, and find a way to free us. From others and from ourselves.  

                Alas, we can´t. Playing Shepard was just a way of delaying the inevitable. We never stood a chance.

                So I ask: what is the virtue of playing ME again? I´m not asking what is the fun in pointing and shooting,  or relieving emotions past. I´m asking what is the virtue of role-playing Shepard? You think that there is never  virtue when you play games (you would be wrong). You may think I just should shut up and play it anyway. Like a sheep, I should just pay, play, and never look for virtue? 

                But, wait! Isn’t it exactly the message of the game? Maybe there was something in it after all. Just play and don’t question it. Don´t look for virtue.

I saw the connection the moment I finished the game but was too depressed to even do anything about it. You have come with a clear and well reasoned explanation that not only makes perfect sense, but displays the reality as it is right now.

We do not search for virtue or values nowadays, we only follow the crowds. We do not seek a prize beyond the physical, we only want instant gratification with no deeper meaning. We act as we want our choices made for us, our freedom taken away from us. This is what people call "greatness" these days.

I call it emptyness. And by the feeling of so many of my comrades and fellow players, I see that many, if not most of you share this feeling with me. The closing statement of the above post holds a value higher than any shown in the game (or in many other places as a matter of fact). It shows us that the society wants sheep, people with no individuality and no self awareness that will just do as they are told. People that will not fight against the odds and against the wrongs society forces down on us. Isn't that the same we have been hearing from many articles? That we should just be happy to have the game and enjoy ourselves regardless of our own values and morals? That we are not supposed to voice our dissatisfaction?

I for once I will remain here speaking my mind and I will not be silenced...

[WarBaby2]

Astralify wrote...

Why did they cut that??? No words...

Because they needed to implement Kinect!

Sorry... still pretty upset about that...

[Eljacko558]

I saw this and thought of you guys :3

http://i.imgur.com/JbGcC.jpg

[ShaneP]

Eumerin wrote...
She's the bartender in ME2 and 3.

In ME2 she states that she suggested that the Asari ought to stop wasting their lives and do more important things such as attempt to unravel the secret of building more mass relays.  But she was a lone voice and was ignored.

There's no assignment tied to it.

Sorry, what I meant was that I missed her assignment in ME3.

Also, another couple of things confused me:

Conrad Verner and Illium were supposedly meant to be returning in ME3, and as far as I can tell neither made an appearance. What gives?

[DifferentD17]

Tazzmission wrote...

 proof endings were changed

---------------------------
After checking these boards, bioware forums, the twitters of various people involved with the game, audio file rips as well as some information I've gathered from other sources, I decided to talk with someone who used to run their own review website who still has ties to some people in the video game industry. That includes Bioware (they had sent him early review copies of the first ME). Anyway that's not what's important. The point is what I'm about to say you can take with a grain of salt if you want. I'm not here for attention or because I'm a fanboy of bioware. I'm simply here to help you all make sense of this situation. It will make a lot of sense and put the little things you've all found together. The reasoning for the ending change was they needed more time to implement it (this was supposed to be the reason for the delay) but Kinect implementation and the desire by some people (perhaps EA) to have an ending where things are left to interpretation messed with this. The ending was quickly altered which is why things don't "fit" and there are plot holes. Anyway, below is how things were supposed to happen.

The original ending was SUPPOSED to be extremely varied. Everything remained the same up until the part when Harbinger shoots at you and your team. This is when information that has appeared here already comes into play. There were going to be various outcomes determining how you reached the citadel and it was HOW you got there that determined what endings would be available to you. The following were the different scenarios from worst to best (based on EMS and war assets)

A: Your whole squad gets wiped out (the two crew members you took with you, Anderson). You struggle to make it to the citadel. Right as you're about to make it to the beam, Harbinger talks to you, saying you've been defeated and he kills you. Joker tries to swoop down to save you, but he also gets shot down.

B: Most of your squad gets wiped out. Still only you are able to make it to the citadel. Once up there, you must confront the illusive man alone. Because of this, unless you have high reputation and either talk him down or renegade interrupt and shoot him, he kills you and tries to control the reapers, but fails as he discovers he was indoctrinated. 

C: You and Anderson make it up to the citadel together and make your way to the control panel where you confront TIM. The same thing plays out where you can talk him down. With high enough reputation, you can "save" Anderson but its not necessary for you to make it to the next part. Anderson dies after TIM is shot or kills himself like in the ending we got.

D: You and Anderson make it up to the citadel together while you're two squad maters, who clearly survive, are holding off the reapers from following you to the citadel. Everything continues the same here as "C" until after TIM is shot and killed and the final conversation that Anderson and Shepard have (which is much longer than what we got). You get the shorter convo in C.

[The following you only see with outcome "C' and "D"] Shepard looks out at the war going on and activates the crucible. Hacketts says its not working. This is when Harbinger talks to Shepard through TIM as he lies on the ground. Harbinger tries to convince you that you've fail but you can argue with him. Harbinger says that he has your crew in his cross hairs. We see the Normandy arrive (the joker dialogue that was cut) and the rest of your friends help the two squad members you brought with you face off against Harbinger and his reaper minions.
---
Posted 3/13/2012 8:45:43 AM
message detailYou basically have a choice. You can submit to him and he claims he will spare your squad and earth until the next cycle because he is impressed that you were able to make it this far. This is when the motive of the reapers is more clearly established. Harbinger reveals that in the previous cycle, the prothean empire became too vast and they began to control all the other races, which would have prevented all of our races from developing. However, through more discussion, Shepard can uncover their true motives. They fear that they will be rivaled by something more powerful than they are (that this cycle will create AI that can topple the reapers). This implies they are merely fearful for their own survival and that is why they purge all life but they convince themselves they are protecting us.

Either way, you can submit to him and save your people or take your chances. Having 4000 EMS, not submitting to him you would lose everyone, but still eventually get to the three choices we actually got (more on this in a second). Having 5000+ and depending on how you resolved conflicts between characters and races, certain people will live or die. 

After rejecting him (whether you lose everyone or not), you end up in the area where vent boy was but hes not there. It's just you and "Harbinger". He explains that a new solution is needed. The solution he tries to convince you to take is merge (to perseve his kind). But if you have high enough reputation once again, you can open the control and destroy option. Harbinger tries to talk you out of it by discussing how your races are divided and mentioning the geth incident. You convince him otherwise, and it is at this point, the control option opens next where he admits that shepard may have a perspective he never considered. Harbinger tells Shepard that if he destroys them, the relays will be destroyed as will the geth (which is true. This is the only ending where the relays are destroyed).

Now for the four endings.

If you submit to him before the three main choices, the reapers leave earth but end up wiping out every other race who haven't proved themselves worthy. Shepard dies.

If you merge, the reapers leave and like the ending we got, we see all the characters we know with green eyes as a green light brightens the sky. Shepard dies for the same reasons in the ending we got.

The control option, the reapers leave. Everyone cautiously celebrates while joker and your LI look up to the sky and wonder what exactly happened. Life goes on but its hinted that the reaper threat may return. This ending ends on a cliffhanger.

The destroy ending does destroy the relays, but its implied that with all the races on earth, they, together, will restore what they lost and will attempt to work together. if shepard lives, your LI leading your squad, will be looking for you. You are beamed back down to earth (its assumed shepard was somehow blasted into the beam? this is the only questionable part). It ends with shepard's hand coming out of the rubble and breathing. Still a cliffhanger of sorts, but you can assume they will find him/her obviously.
---
http://www.gamefaqs....fect-3/62230265

They really at least need to make this the real ending, it would make alot of people feel better.

[christrek1982]

hello all

[ajunta_]

For years, Mass Effect was not only a game but my personal antidepressant. Going through a black stripe in my life with personal financial crisis and other unpleasant things piling on top of my head for the last few months, I thought playing ME3 and seeing a happy ending will give me a little more strength to overcome all this sh*t I'm fighting with.

Right now I'm feeling like this:
http://www.pbfcomics...s_Orphanage.gif 

And gods know, I could use the money I spent on ME3 right now.

P.S. With all that said, I'll gladly give 10 bucks away to see Shepard having a baby krogan with Garrus.

[DifferentD17]

christrek1982 wrote...

hello all

Hello, welcome to the resistance.

[Tracy-Shepard]

I feel betrayed... I want a new ending too...

[NPH11]

Anyone remember how big the ME: Deception thread was? I'd be interested to see how it grew compared to this thread.

[TSC_1]

Why is Bioware so tight-lipped? At this point, a "we're changing nothing, suck it up" would be better than continued silence. At least then I could move on.

[People4Peace]

ShaneP wrote...

Eumerin wrote...
She's the bartender in ME2 and 3.

In ME2 she states that she suggested that the Asari ought to stop wasting their lives and do more important things such as attempt to unravel the secret of building more mass relays.  But she was a lone voice and was ignored.

There's no assignment tied to it.

Sorry, what I meant was that I missed her assignment in ME3.

Also, another couple of things confused me:

Conrad Verner and Illium were supposedly meant to be returning in ME3, and as far as I can tell neither made an appearance. What gives?

Conrad returned in mine and it was epic. I always knew he didn't have a wife and the discussion about him having a shrine to Shep is hilarious and completely makes sense. Though I wonder if the same discussion happens with Sheploo

As for Illium, you can't go there.

Modifié par People4Peace, 13 mars 2012 - 07:53 .

[Hadscho]

ShaneP wrote...

Eumerin wrote...
She's the bartender in ME2 and 3.

In ME2 she states that she suggested that the Asari ought to stop wasting their lives and do more important things such as attempt to unravel the secret of building more mass relays.  But she was a lone voice and was ignored.

There's no assignment tied to it.

Sorry, what I meant was that I missed her assignment in ME3.

Also, another couple of things confused me:

Conrad Verner and Illium were supposedly meant to be returning in ME3, and as far as I can tell neither made an appearance. What gives?

Conrad Verner did return in ME3 and how he returned simply awesome :-) 

[Zhijn]

ShaneP wrote...

Eumerin wrote...
She's the bartender in ME2 and 3.

In ME2 she states that she suggested that the Asari ought to stop wasting their lives and do more important things such as attempt to unravel the secret of building more mass relays.  But she was a lone voice and was ignored.

There's no assignment tied to it.

Sorry, what I meant was that I missed her assignment in ME3.

Also, another couple of things confused me:

Conrad Verner and Illium were supposedly meant to be returning in ME3, and as far as I can tell neither made an appearance. What gives?

Conrad Verner is in ME3. I ran into him on the refugee docks on some random citadel mission. He as usually tried to be the hero only to look like total goofer. He did seem to find love tho. xD

[illutian]

I'm Commander Shepard, and I'm tired as ****.

Going to by room and listen to my music clock.

z_Z

[IndustrializedTaco]

What does Bioware do when this thread gets to 1000 pages? I mean after that you just can't assume it'll die down.

[TSC_1]

ajunta_ wrote...

For years, Mass Effect was not only a game but my personal antidepressant. Going through a black stripe in my life with personal financial crisis and other unpleasant things piling on top of my head for the last few months, I thought playing ME3 and seeing a happy ending will give me a little more strength to overcome all this sh*t I'm fighting with.

Me, too. For a while there, being able to escape into the Mass Effect universe was pretty much all that was keeping me going. My life sucks enough. Why do this to me?

[Hadscho]

beetlebailey123 wrote...

What does Bioware do when this thread gets to 1000 pages? I mean after that you just can't assume it'll die down.

Well i guess after they close it down we make a new one?

[DifferentD17]

Tracy-Shepard wrote...

I feel betrayed... I want a new ending too...

Most of us feel that way, I feel I can't trust Bioware anymore. They have completely succumb to the rEApers.