221 réponses à ce sujet

[AcidThe Wraith]

Sr.Prize wrote...

Father Alvito wrote...

Sr.Prize wrote...

^^^ so the fact that these people tried to belittle me is irrelevant, right?

Yes.  Welcome to the Internets.  It goes with the territory.  If you say something stupid, many people will tell you that YOU are stupid.  And so forth.  Anonymity is the enemy of civility.

OT: Obviously something should be done if we agree that the game should not be dominated by one or two weapons.  But this thread is pointless because it's obvious that pistols are out of balance.  If you want to make a legitimate contribution, come up with some good ideas about what to do about the situation and start a thread.

Did you read any of my posts? I said either nerf the damage or increase the weight to reduce cooldown.

The Avenger AR has the same wieght as the pistol, doesn't it..? Not entirely sure. But again, the problem lies with the other guns being to weak, not the pistols being to strong. 

[Father Alvito]

Sr.Prize wrote...

Did you read any of my posts? I said either nerf the damage or increase the weight to reduce cooldown.

Neither of which is a new idea.  Reiterating things that already have been said countless times is not a contribution.

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

How is it obviously out of balance when several infiltrators, soldiers, vanguards etc top the charts with Shotguns, Ar's, snipers, and occassionaly pistol only.

The fact that some people are better at aiming than others does not invalidate the fact that you can do more damage faster with a Carnifex at all ranges than with just about anything else, and without cooldown reduction.  I love the gun, but it's pretty obviously out of balance.

If you want an opinion on how to fix things, I'll just say this: scopes for Pistols were a bad idea.  Making them much less effective at range would go a long way towards balancing the scales.

Modifié par Father Alvito, 28 février 2012 - 04:37 .

[Cloaking_Thane]

Have you ever been in a game with 4 carnifex users? On gold? it takes just as much if not more time to complete the mission.

Would that ever happen except with friends just to see anyway?

I've had great success on gold rocking the Hornet, came in second or first a few times....was I "doing it wrong"?

Modifié par Cloaking_Thane, 28 février 2012 - 04:39 .

[Cloaking_Thane]

Father Alvito wrote...

Sr.Prize wrote...

Did you read any of my posts? I said either nerf the damage or increase the weight to reduce cooldown.

Neither of which is a new idea.  Reiterating things that already have been said countless times is not a contribution.

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

How is it obviously out of balance when several infiltrators, soldiers, vanguards etc top the charts with Shotguns, Ar's, snipers, and occassionaly pistol only.

The fact that some people are better at aiming than others does not invalidate the fact that you can do more damage faster with a Carnifex at all ranges than with just about anything else, and without cooldown reduction.  I love the gun, but it's pretty obviously out of balance.

If you want an opinion on how to fix things, I'll just say this: scopes for Pistols were a bad idea. 

I've suggested this as a palatable compromise, but just becaue some people are better players does not make the Carnifex OP. Same principals apply my friend.

[Cosmo G. Spacely]

Nerf the Usas 12 with frag rounds and the akimbo shotguns...o wait...wrong game. Community seems alot alike though, honest mistake.

[Father Alvito]

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

Have you ever been in a game with 4 carnifex users? On gold? it takes just as much if not more time to complete the mission.

You shouldn't be running four classes that *should* be using the Carnifex on Gold.  A Salarian is more or less a necessity for objectives and Atlas slaying.  The one thing that the Carnifex really is poor at is putting down an Atlas, which is probably the time sink.

[leminzplz]

This might sound stupid, but what does nerf mean? does it mean something like, make them weaker?

[Cloaking_Thane]

Father Alvito wrote...

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

Have you ever been in a game with 4 carnifex users? On gold? it takes just as much if not more time to complete the mission.

You shouldn't be running four classes that *should* be using the Carnifex on Gold.  A Salarian is more or less a necessity for objectives and Atlas slaying.  The one thing that the Carnifex really is poor at is putting down an Atlas, which is probably the time sink.

Thank you for proving the exact point I was trying to make

[TexasToast712]

Father Alvito wrote...

If you want an opinion on how to fix things, I'll just say this: scopes for Pistols were a bad idea.  Making them much less effective at range would go a long way towards balancing the scales.

This. Much rather have laser sights. Pistols are just fine. Weight could be re-tweaked across the board but overall pistols and their performance are balanced. So please, people, stop whining about something that

1. Isn't going to change.
2. Isn't broken to begin with.

Pistols have always been strong in ME games and it isn't going to change anytime soon. Why can't this forum love pistols like the Bungie forums love the Halo CE pistol? Most people clearly enjoy hand cannon gameplay.

Modifié par TexasToast712, 28 février 2012 - 04:42 .

[Cloaking_Thane]

Mango370 wrote...

This might sound stupid, but what does nerf mean? does it mean something like, make them weaker?

Yes

[Cosmo G. Spacely]

Mango370 wrote...

This might sound stupid, but what does nerf mean? does it mean something like, make them weaker?

COD term that means we like to complain.

but seriously, you got it right,

nerf = make weaker

buff = strengthen

[Father Alvito]

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

Father Alvito wrote...

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

Have you ever been in a game with 4 carnifex users? On gold? it takes just as much if not more time to complete the mission.

You shouldn't be running four classes that *should* be using the Carnifex on Gold.  A Salarian is more or less a necessity for objectives and Atlas slaying.  The one thing that the Carnifex really is poor at is putting down an Atlas, which is probably the time sink.

Thank you for proving the exact point I was trying to make

Which leaves you with two optimal weapon combinations: Salarians should take a sniper rifle (currently the Mantis) and probably a Phalanx in case everyone else screws up, and anyone else should be toting a Carnifex.  I don't see how this is 'balanced' given that the Carnifex obsoletes so many other weapons right now.

I've had great success on gold rocking the Hornet, came in second or first a few times....was I "doing it wrong"?

I would totally take the Hornet on my Vanguard if it didn't screw with my cooldowns.  It would have a lot more potential as a niche weapon if its weight were competitive.  I like the gun at medium range from cover, and it's obviously a great short range problem solver. 

Modifié par Father Alvito, 28 février 2012 - 04:49 .

[Poison_Berrie]

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

How is it obviously out of balance when several infiltrators, soldiers, vanguards etc top the charts with Shotguns, Ar's, snipers, and occassionaly pistol only.
 
Asari Adept with SG is equally deadly as pistol, it's just people gravitate towards what they feel most comfortable with.

Because we aren't talking about player skill and preference and we never said the other guns were worthless.

Looking at the statistics and their ingame accuracy the Phalanx outpreforms the Mattock and the Carnifex is better at sniping than the Viper is. 

My suggestion would be no scope for pistols, reduce their range or their accuracy at long range and slightly more weight.

[Cloaking_Thane]

Father Alvito wrote...

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

Father Alvito wrote...

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

Have you ever been in a game with 4 carnifex users? On gold? it takes just as much if not more time to complete the mission.

You shouldn't be running four classes that *should* be using the Carnifex on Gold.  A Salarian is more or less a necessity for objectives and Atlas slaying.  The one thing that the Carnifex really is poor at is putting down an Atlas, which is probably the time sink.

Thank you for proving the exact point I was trying to make

Which leaves you with two optimal weapon combinations: Salarians should take a sniper rifle (currently the Mantis) and probably a Phalanx in case everyone else screws up, and anyone else should be toting a Carnifex.  I don't see how this is 'balanced' given that the Carnifex obsoletes so many other weapons right now.

Wrong that's just a narrow minded stance.

Most recent gold run.

Salarian Infi- Claymore

Salarian Infi- Widow

Krogan Soldier- Mattock

Turian Sentinal- Mantis X

Time completed 22ish...........

Modifié par Cloaking_Thane, 28 février 2012 - 04:49 .

[robarcool]

@OP. Just don't play with pistols if you don't want. Don't force other players to not play with the weapon they like by asking for a nerf. That is as silly as it gets.

[Sr.Prize]

Father Alvito wrote...

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

Have you ever been in a game with 4 carnifex users? On gold? it takes just as much if not more time to complete the mission.

You shouldn't be running four classes that *should* be using the Carnifex on Gold.  A Salarian is more or less a necessity for objectives and Atlas slaying.  The one thing that the Carnifex really is poor at is putting down an Atlas, which is probably the time sink.

The Carnifex isn't good for the Atlas shield because of it's slow firing rate. This is where the phalanx shines. Correct me if I'm wrong but I think the Phalanx's shield stripping abilities is up there with the ARs and SMGs. Plus, it works well on armor.

[TexasToast712]

Poison_Berrie wrote...

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

How is it obviously out of balance when several infiltrators, soldiers, vanguards etc top the charts with Shotguns, Ar's, snipers, and occassionaly pistol only.
 
Asari Adept with SG is equally deadly as pistol, it's just people gravitate towards what they feel most comfortable with.

Because we aren't talking about player skill and preference and we never said the other guns were worthless.

Looking at the statistics and their ingame accuracy the Phalanx outpreforms the Mattock and the Carnifex is better at sniping than the Viper is. 

My suggestion would be no scope for pistols, reduce their range or their accuracy at long range and slightly more weight.

We have yet to see the rest of the mods for the weapons. Heavy Barrels, penetration mods, lightweight materials mods will give other weapons advantages over pistols. Also, there are even stronger weapons in the full game. We can't sit here and justify a nerf for something without playing the full game. Especially when that something isn't broken in the first place.

[Dormin]

Considering we don't kill each other in this game, I can't see why anything would need to be nerfed.

[Cloaking_Thane]

Poison_Berrie wrote...

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

How is it obviously out of balance when several infiltrators, soldiers, vanguards etc top the charts with Shotguns, Ar's, snipers, and occassionaly pistol only.
 
Asari Adept with SG is equally deadly as pistol, it's just people gravitate towards what they feel most comfortable with.

Because we aren't talking about player skill and preference and we never said the other guns were worthless.

Looking at the statistics and their ingame accuracy the Phalanx outpreforms the Mattock and the Carnifex is better at sniping than the Viper is. 

My suggestion would be no scope for pistols, reduce their range or their accuracy at long range and slightly more weight.

So make the viper the ME2 viper again which I agree should be done.

And I'm sorry to day you cannot take player skill out of the equation. My friend is terrible with pistols but deadly with an AR or SG. It happens.

[Father Alvito]

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

Wrong that's just a narrow minded stance.

Most recent gold run.

Salarian Infi- Claymore

Salarian Infi- Widow

Krogan Soldier- Mattock

Turian Sentinal- Mantis X

Time completed 22ish...........

Taking the wrong guns and playing well doesn't make the wrong guns right.  I'll grant that the Claymore is a viable CQC choice on a Salarian.  But the Widow should be a Mantis X; that's been demonstrated so many times at this point that I won't reiterate the proof.   And the only reason the Krogan is playable in that setup is because you have three shield rips in the team.  Asari Adept is a better choice there.

[TexasToast712]

Dormin wrote...

Considering we don't kill each other in this game, I can't see why anything would need to be nerfed.

I like this Collector. He understands.

Modifié par TexasToast712, 28 février 2012 - 04:56 .

[Cloaking_Thane]

Father Alvito wrote...

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

Wrong that's just a narrow minded stance.

Most recent gold run.

Salarian Infi- Claymore

Salarian Infi- Widow

Krogan Soldier- Mattock

Turian Sentinal- Mantis X

Time completed 22ish...........

Taking the wrong guns and playing well doesn't make the wrong guns right.  I'll grant that the Claymore is a viable CQC choice on a Salarian.  But the Widow should be a Mantis X; that's been demonstrated so many times at this point that I won't reiterate the proof.   And the only reason the Krogan is playable in that setup is because you have three shield rips in the team.  Asari Adept is a better choice there.

efficiency, competency and skill with the weapon will always be greater than pure numbers. If you miss a shot there goes you dps stats. Stats in isolation of player skill mean nothing

There is absolutely no definitive proof Mantis X>Widow let alone Widow X. Asari adept not needed, never mind was it a "better choice".


So to reiterate every time you play gold you need 1 salarian Infi with a Mantis X and an Asari adept or you wont play. And 3 carnifex's?

This is optimal even though we cleared in 22-23 min?

[PnXMarcin1PL]

NO, DONT NERF THE PISTOLS ITS NOT PVP FFS

[Father Alvito]

Dormin wrote...

Considering we don't kill each other in this game, I can't see why anything would need to be nerfed.

Ideally, we want everything to be equally playable and situational.  In reality, that isn't going to happen.  As it stands, they're not doing a bad job with the classes.  Five of them are totally legitimate choices for Gold, with the Soldier being the only weak cousin that doesn't have a top shelf power in either flavor.  That's good balance work.

The weapon situation isn't so great right now because pistols are low weight and highly effective at all ranges.

[Jimbe2693]

Saying this as a pistol fan.

I don't think they should out perform larger weapons. Maybe just make them less accurate, better for close/medium range encounters. Long range should be up to AR's and SR's.