129 réponses à ce sujet

[Berkilak]

P38 ace wrote...

Like I said before I have not unlocked him/it, what ever you want to call the drell

And you my be talking elephant, strong relestless pounding
I want sarbertooth tiger: fast, quick, decisive using as little energy as possible,

I could do that in ME2.I can't in ME3

Just because you haven't unlocked it doesn't mean that you cannot. Do you read what you write? 

[Delta 57 Dash]

P38 ace wrote...

Like I said before I have not unlocked him/it, what ever you want to call the drell

And you my be talking elephant, strong relestless pounding
I want sarbertooth tiger: fast, quick, decisive using as little energy as possible,

I could do that in ME2.I can't in ME3

... using as little energy as possible... what?

If you want a quick, light class, Drell Vanguard is right up your alley.

But don't come in complaining that the Human vanguard, a high-risk, high-reward class, doesn't play the way you want it to.

And I don't know what you were doing in ME2, but playing Vanguard on Insanity in ME2 basically required you to charge as often as possible to keep your shields up.

[P38 ace]

Fine I will wait for drell, I still would like the old shockwave back, and I think most can agree with that

Modifié par P38 ace, 29 février 2012 - 12:54 .

[capn233]

Human Vanguard is quite powerful in this game. I don't know what exactly you are on about. Charge evolved to recharge 100% Barrier plus Nova evolved to "half blast"... Not to mention the Nova Animation Cancel Immunity 'sploit.

As far as Shockwave, yes it is different than in ME2. I find it about 2000 times more useful. It is your best power for Guardians. Hit them with Shockwave to stagger and shoot them in the head. It is that simple.

ME2 Shockwave was one of the worst powers in the game. If "most" want it back then I would question why we are even listening to the mob.

[P38 ace]

The ME2 shock wave was great for riping enamies out of cover with out having to get up close, I don't see how that is useless.
Being able to knock a half dozen enimeies flat on their back charging up and shottying them while they get up.
Shockwave was the only "long range" attack the vanguard had

[Esperys]

With both charge and nova causing stagger/knockback/anti-guardian support I've fuond zero use for modern day shockwave on a human vanguard. It's just a comparitively low damage knockback without immunity frames. No thanks.

[Tulio06]

I keep a simple formula as a HVanguard. To be honest, i think human vanguards are much better than their drell counterpart.

Charge-> Strong Melee -> Nova -> Charge

There, you will only die if you had the bad luck of charging on a group with an atlas, or many phantoms. You can play silver, dash in a group of centurions and engineers, and blast most of them. Just need to be carefull to where are you charging. Turrets, Atlas and 3+ Phantoms are the worst enemy of Vanguards. oh, and ALWAYS put a shotgun on your vanguard. Sometimes the combo will not kill the enemy(someone tha was on the side of your target, enemy with complete shield and barrier that you miss your melee) and the shotgun is the best option in these situations. 

This combo workout heavenly because with the add of the melee, just as you unleash your nova, charge is ready to use. With just Charge and Nova, the delay is a litle longer. 

And shockwave is great to kill guardians. Shokwave + SHotgun fire on their face

As skills allocations, i NEVER put nova half blast. Much more use to it with increased damage.

Modifié par Tulio06, 29 février 2012 - 01:45 .

[Shahadem]

ncknck wrote...

Nahhh, Asari Vanguard is more like a spider. Evil sexy spider. Preserves some targets for later in stasis, charges the rest.

Unfortunately it doesn't work that way.

Charge and Statis would share the same GCD unlike Nova which has no GCD.

The GCD was the worst concept Bioware introduced in ME 2.

Well that an thermal clips.

Modifié par Shahadem, 29 février 2012 - 01:43 .

[IlluminaZer0]

P38 ace wrote...
The ME2 shock wave was great for riping enamies out of cover with out having to get up close, I don't see how that is useless.
Being able to knock a half dozen enimeies flat on their back charging up and shottying them while they get up.
Shockwave was the only "long range" attack the vanguard had

The primary reason why Shockwave is considered weak in ME2 is due to it's (relative) uselessness on Insanity difficulty.  Character build was almost irrelevant on the normal difficulties.

Esperys wrote...
With both charge and nova causing
stagger/knockback/anti-guardian support I've fuond zero use for modern
day shockwave on a human vanguard. It's just a comparitively low damage
knockback without immunity frames. No thanks.

While I dislike shockwave overall, it can be good for defense and for safely killing Guardians. (Elaboration on defense: you can spam it through walls and block off entryways to certain areas.)

Anyone that tries to use shockwave for anything but a niche role (on Human Vanguard) is defininately making it harder for themselves.

Sadly it is even overshadowed by Nova in biotic explosions. lol

Modifié par IlluminaZer0, 29 février 2012 - 01:54 .

[CrazyCatDude]

capn233 wrote...

Human Vanguard is quite powerful in this game. I don't know what exactly you are on about. Charge evolved to recharge 100% Barrier plus Nova evolved to "half blast"... Not to mention the Nova Animation Cancel Immunity 'sploit.

As far as Shockwave, yes it is different than in ME2. I find it about 2000 times more useful. It is your best power for Guardians. Hit them with Shockwave to stagger and shoot them in the head. It is that simple.

ME2 Shockwave was one of the worst powers in the game. If "most" want it back then I would question why we are even listening to the mob.

Shockwave's usefulness in ME2 depended entirely on what difficulty you were playing on.  It was nigh useless on hardcore and insanity, but on lower difficulties, Shockwave was amazing for any mission involving husks.  I called it "husk bowling"

[P38 ace]

I aways ran Miri and Mordian/Thane depending on the map lay out.
Miri I took care of shields with overload
Double team on armor and barriers with duel warp w/ Thane
Or warp and incenerate on armor w/ mordian

First shock wave to knock the basics out of cover, kill them
Strip their defences of the others then knock them down with another shockwave, charge and wipe them out

[Omega-202]

P38 ace wrote...

The ME2 shock wave was great for riping enamies out of cover with out having to get up close, I don't see how that is useless.
Being able to knock a half dozen enimeies flat on their back charging up and shottying them while they get up.
Shockwave was the only "long range" attack the vanguard had

Then evolve it for range.  There's an evolution that REALLY extends its range by quite a lot so you can get it back to its old capacity.  

[bastardmofo]

GnusmasTHX wrote...

Shockwave is pretty bad.

Would rather have grenades.

I agree shockwave sucks

[P38 ace]

But it does not have the same spread as the old, you have a 1-1.5m wide area in a strait line
ME2 shockwave had a 10-15 m wide effect area.

If you are off by a few degrees from center it won't hit the person you are aiming at.
on the old verson you can aim in general direction and if you have enhanced shockwave, when it reachs the enamy it would pop two more waves on the left and right and hits any of his buddies near him.

so you have a "force piller" vs. a force tidel wave.

i like tidel wave.

Modifié par P38 ace, 29 février 2012 - 03:51 .

[TK EL_]

Esperys wrote...

With both charge and nova causing stagger/knockback/anti-guardian support I've fuond zero use for modern day shockwave on a human vanguard. It's just a comparitively low damage knockback without immunity frames. No thanks.

Truth. I'm likely not going to spec it for my MP vanguard when the game comes out. OP it just sounds like you don't know what you're doing. With half blast nova, you can use the first one to jump behind the guardian and the second one will affect him fully and cause him to drop his shield. This is the alternative to just simply charging the guardian and getting a headshot while he is staggered.

Baring the atlas one shot, and smoke grenades in some cases, the vanguard is invincible even against turrets thanks to the nova cancel. I never get one shoted by a phantom as a vanguard because it requires you to constantly move and turn making it hard for a phantom to blindside you from the back

Modifié par TK EL , 29 février 2012 - 04:05 .

[Omega-202]

P38 ace wrote...

But it does not have the same spread as the old, you have a 1-1.5m wide area in a strait line
ME2 shockwave had a 10-15 m wide effect area.

If you are off by a few degrees from center it won't hit the person you are aiming at.
on the old verson you can aim in general direction and if you have enhanced shockwave, when it reachs the enamy it would pop two more waves on the left and right and hits any of his buddies near him.

so you have a "force piller" vs. a force tidel wave.

i like tidel wave.

BULL $#!7

http://masseffect.wi.../wiki/Shockwave 

ME2 had a radius of 2.5 meters at rank 3 and 3.5 meters if you picked the wide evolution at rank 4.  You can get 2.6 meters in ME3 with the wide evolution which is a HELL of a lot easier to get to because you have a lot more points.  2.6 versus 3.5 at the maximum for each....

You NEVER had 10 -15 meters.  You're lying at this point or you're just deluding yourself.  

You lost 25% of your radius but in exchange you get biotic detonations, lifting shockwave and A LOT more damage and force.  

I'm sorry, but you're either a troll or just a really sad person.

[Arppis]

CrazyCatDude wrote...

capn233 wrote...

Human Vanguard is quite powerful in this game. I don't know what exactly you are on about. Charge evolved to recharge 100% Barrier plus Nova evolved to "half blast"... Not to mention the Nova Animation Cancel Immunity 'sploit.

As far as Shockwave, yes it is different than in ME2. I find it about 2000 times more useful. It is your best power for Guardians. Hit them with Shockwave to stagger and shoot them in the head. It is that simple.

ME2 Shockwave was one of the worst powers in the game. If "most" want it back then I would question why we are even listening to the mob.

Shockwave's usefulness in ME2 depended entirely on what difficulty you were playing on.  It was nigh useless on hardcore and insanity, but on lower difficulties, Shockwave was amazing for any mission involving husks.  I called it "husk bowling"

I agree, it was brilliant. Too bad it doesn't travel on ground anymore like it did in ME2. It feels really crappy in this game.

[Kakaw]

P38 ace wrote...

I just don't like the fact that the nova lease you so exposed after you use it, even with the half blast I still get downed half the time I use it, and other have said that shock wave is useless.

Replace it with pull, and you can do as I said above in quick order

Vanguards in ME2 were good at three things: crowd control, un-diging enamies in cover, and CQB
ME3 they lose the first two for a modest gain in the latter, that leaves you over exposed

Vanguard was my favorite class to run in ME2 now it just irks me.

So... you want all vanguards to have charge and pull and grenades? Hm. Same powers but different races. Great.

[Zhuinden]

capn233 wrote...
As far as Shockwave, yes it is different than in ME2. I find it about 2000 times more useful. It is your best power for Guardians. Hit them with Shockwave to stagger and shoot them in the head. It is that simple.

ME2 Shockwave was one of the worst powers in the game. If "most" want it back then I would question why we are even listening to the mob.

Area Shockwave in ME2 was more effective due to its higher radius and range.
ME3 Shockwave's range is ridiculous until you get the level 5 Reach upgrade, but even then, it's just not worth using in contrast to Charge and Nova.
Hell, I prefer charging a guardian to stagger it - because that at least recharges my shields.

[Kakaw]

I agree that shockwave should never be used. Charge = ~4 sec cooldown, then add shockwave for an extra 2-3 seconds .. A vanguard that can't charge for 7-8 seconds is usually dead.

But there's no denying that except for the range, shockwave is a much better tool in ME3 than in ME2

Modifié par Kakaw, 29 février 2012 - 06:06 .

[P38 ace]

Yes 3.5 for each blast but you have 3 in 1 it reaches an enamy

3.5+3.5+3.5=10.5 m total, and each are about 1 m between the center so the totel comes to 12.5m.
I know what I am f%#king talking about
Add a few power boosts from armor and other skills from you or a team, and it increases the power, that is all of stats not just the damage.

[Arppis]

Kakaw wrote...

I agree that shockwave should never be used. Charge = ~4 sec cooldown, then add shockwave for an extra 2-3 seconds .. A vanguard that can't charge for 7-8 seconds is usually dead.

But there's no denying that except for the range, shockwave is a much better tool in ME3 than in ME2

I don't think so, as enemies can just roll away OR IN IT and they are unaffected by the effect if they just do the roll. Which they do most of the time. It's pretty awful ability all and all.

[Mand0l1n]

To be fair most powers dont work when enemies do a roll so thats not unique to shockwave. I agree it's not worth spending points on for the mp vanguard but it's useful on the human adept who can use it to trigger detonations and provide some cc when trapped in a corner. I plan to make heavy use of it on my vanguard in sp who can spare the points to evolve it.

[Omega-202]

P38 ace wrote...

Yes 3.5 for each blast but you have 3 in 1 it reaches an enamy

3.5+3.5+3.5=10.5 m total, and each are about 1 m between the center so the totel comes to 12.5m.
I know what I am f%#king talking about
Add a few power boosts from armor and other skills from you or a team, and it increases the power, that is all of stats not just the damage.

No you really have no idea what you're talking about.  There's 6 pulses in an ME2 Shockwave, not 3.

Not to mention that total range is the same regardless of radius.  You don't get a longer range from a wider shockwave.

I'm done trying to correct someone who has no idea how the game actually works.  Its as if you've never actually played the game and you're talking like its a bunch of theorycrafting.  

[titoarc]

human vangard is god .