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BIOWARE: We need an official bug thread / bug reporting system.


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#1
Mangonou

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Hey Bioware,

As a fellow professional in the video gaming industry, I have a suggestion which I hope you'll take to heart:

Let your players be testers.  Listen to the bugs that they find, and fix them if they're serious enough, or if the fixes are easy enough.

It is very likely that more man-hours of gameplay are done by your players in an hour than was done by your entire testing staff during the entirety of ME3's development.  This is a fact for pretty much any game.

Getting organized feedback from your players is the key to figuring out which issues are important enough to merit title updates, which ones are bad enough to require apologies to the community, and in some cases, which ones can just be ignored or fixed for future titles.

Of special note, the community understands that bringing MP to the ME franchise is tough.  You haven't had multiple games to refine your MP design, your matchmaking systems, etc.  There are some rough edges.  But by listening to the community, you can polish those edges until you've got something robust, fun, and without the frustration that comes with particularly nasty bugs or exploits.

That said, here's a list of bugs and other issues that I, personally, have experienced and verified first-hand.  I'm sure there are a lot more out there; searching back through the forums, I see a good number of bug threads.  I suggest that, if possible, you guys find a good way to organize user bug reports in some official capacity.

EDIT:
To give a good example of a system that would help, check out www.GetSatisfaction.com.  They sell a feedback system which includes voting on issues, moderation by staff, good exposure for official responses, integration with bug databases, etc.  Just check out the feedback system used on their own website.  Using that or something similar here would allow you to get much better / valuable bug reports from the community.

Common Issues:
  • Nemesis occasionally fire through walls/obstacles (you'll see a red bracket behind a wall, and then get shot by it).  This is worst in the cargo containers in the upper area of the level Firebase Ghost.
  • In the store, character cards are given for characters that already have max XP and have all customization options fully unlocked, when players still have other characters that do not have Max XP or all options unlocked. (EDIT: Demo-only bug, according to staff)
  • If host leaves and game dissolves instead of reforming, players lose all accumulated XP and credits for that mission.  Not fun when your hosting player craps out on wave 10 of Silver or Gold.  Especially not fun when you've used a ton of equipment and support items that you can't get back.  I would even go so far as to consider this a TCR failure due to loss of significant player data / gamestate.
  • Infiltrator cooldown for cloak is extremely inconsistent.  Allowing it to expire naturally or disabling it manually without firing a shot or using an ability appears to result in a noticeably slower recharge time.  My guess: the recharge timer when firing a shot is linked to when the shot is fired, even though the player doesn't come out of cloak for another half-second later; however, when letting cloak expire or ending it manually, the cooldown starts from that point without the benefit of the extra half-second or so.
  • The sound for hitting a Guardian's shield plays at full volume no matter the distance to the Guardian.  You will often hear other players fighting Guardians from across the level.
  • If player uses an Ops Survival Pack (the one that gives full shields and health) right before getting downed, they get downed anyways, AND the pack is still consumed.
  • Quarian Engineer's turret sounds persist after turret dies, until end of match.  This can cause the entire battleground to be filled with the sound of dozens of turrets over the course of play.
  • Atlas mechs walk over tall obstacles in ways that cause them to float multiple feet off the ground.
Rare, but happened at least twice:
  • For a while, with 2 Adepts in-game, effects for Warp and the Stasis bubble did not render at all.  Targets were still affected by the abilities, but the effects were not rendered.
  • With 2+ infiltrators in a game, my "you can use one ability and not come out of cloak" frequently broke.  There's was about a 50/50 chance of me coming out of cloak for using any ability.  Happened during at least 3+ games.
  • Vanguards sometimes get stuck on objects and do weird things.  I've had to quit out of games multiple times due to "jittering" all over the level, going through floors, being 100 feet up, etc.

Possible lag-related issues (latency and packet loss):

  • Can't climb ladders in laggy games.
  • Don't see enemies use jetpack animation in laggy games - they just pop in.
  • During a particularly laggy game, turret models did not dissapear after exploding until the wave changed.
  • Extraction vehicle hovers around extraction zone for the entirety of Wave 11 in laggy games, possibly longer (might have been there for more than just Wave 11, I only noticed it then).
One-offs:
  • Hard-lock when loading into a solo Bronze game with Krogan Soldier.
  • Hard-lock when biotic charging into an enemy with female human vanguard.
  • Player had "Revive" prompt while alive.  This persisted until end of mission.
  • Once ended up with my view diagonal for about 5 seconds as a vanguard after a biotic charge.
Annoyances (Probably not bugs)
  • Extraction - Partial extraction does not make sense.  It is rewarded if people are dead and all survivors are in the extraction zone, but not awarded if all players are alive and at least 1 person is in the extraction zone.  This means that it's better to have a dead teammate than one who hangs around just outside the extraction zone.  I have confirmed in multiple games that having 3 people in the extraction zone and 1 person NOT in the zone causes NO extraction points to be rewarded whatsoever.
  • Enemies hit by a stumbling attack multiple times in a row do not reset stumble each time; there is no way to stumble-lock an enemy unless you wait for it to finish its stumble animation and then hit it with another stumbling attack.  Makes sense for PVP, but maybe not PVE.
  • Turrets aren't affected by force / physics.  That thing has to weigh maybe 50 lbs, yet they're immovable.
  • Turrets are extremely deadly, and pretty tough, but are barely worth any points at all.
  • Players can be AFK an entire game, just sitting there and soaking up points and money while doing no work.  There needs to be some way of dealing with this, as players are being rewarded for hurting their teammates.
  • It's too easy to move around and break connection when interacting with objects.  You're already forced to hold down a button, why not just lock players so they can't move, or restrict their movement so they won't accidentally pop out?
  • It's too hard to interact with objects next to cover.  I often end up in cover instead of interacting with an object or picking up a downed teammate.
  • Phantoms often fail to orient vs. the player they're attacking.
  • Nemesis AI has poor melee-range behavior; just runs and hides, sometimes ignores player completely and allows them to walk right up to them.  Once you're within a certain distance to a Nemesis, it is no longer a threat (unless it pulls a BS point-blank quickscope).
  • Biotic Explosions - Credit for kills due to biotic explosions are generally granted to first person who hits a target with biotics, NOT the person who fires the second shot which actually detonates the explosion.
That all said, I've actually been enjoying the game so far!  Already a level 101 in the MP demo.  I think you chose a good way to do cooperative multiplayer, and I've already preordered the full version.  I just hope that you can convince EA to foot the bill to cover a couple TU's to patch the worst of the existing bugs. :)

Modifié par Mangonou, 03 mars 2012 - 12:05 .


#2
L4r90

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i might add a few bugs/annoyances i've encountered (all PC version)

- Every now and then i'm missing certain or all quickbutton options in a game, iE playing turian sentinel and recognizing that i dont have access to rockets, ops survial pack etc, thou i can access them through holding down shift. but also missing skills, which is a pain when it comes to gameplay.

- sometimes (rarely) a teammate or i, get stuck in the envirenment (usualy after using cover) which ends up in a bugged up movement for the rest of the game, hovering/shaking above the ground without beeing able to using cover. if however he/i try to use cover again we might end up hovering higher and higher, and ultimately beeing trapped in a endless falling animation... it's worse than having an afk teammate, to see a teammate hovering/falling endlessly without beeing able to do anything for the entire game.

- reloading a singlebolt/semiautomatic weapons (i can only vertify this for the pistols, mattlock, mantis and widow) stops when going into cover (might be plausible) and sometimes when moving backwards, right after starting the animation (this is not plausible at all) when i use a turian, krogan or quarian character (might be due to the lack of certain movement options... and here i thought that turians where so "flexible")

that's what i've encountered aside from the things already mentioned in the OP. and yeah, i totaly agree with the OP on the problem with leaving hosts, but also want to add that i't also lowers the overall score in the end, so i'd like to take this on by distibuting the lost score evenly to the remaing players. i've had a game where i for example bugged out in the 10th wave... i reconnected (friends game), but the score i've accumulated until then was lost -.- also i was leading by a longshot with over 100k, which was missing when it came to the final score/exp.

Modifié par L4r90, 01 mars 2012 - 01:35 .


#3
count_4

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The problem with a simple thread is that there is no way to tell how often a bug actually occurs and how players are perceiving it.
To get this information across, a community-based system would be best, where people can report bugs that are then voted up by all those that experience it as well + a kind of rating on how much it affects the player.

Actually I already thought about setting something like this up. Wouldn't be too hard. But then I remembered the BSN and how there's a metric f'ton of threads for every tiny problem- over and over again. Moderating such a bug report system would be insane as the system would require people to search for existing entries to work which is simply not going to happen.

#4
Fortack

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L4r90 wrote...

i might add a few bugs/annoyances i've encountered (all PC version)

- Every now and then i'm missing certain or all quickbutton options in a game, iE playing turian sentinel and recognizing that i dont have access to rockets, ops survial pack etc, thou i can access them through holding down shift. but also missing skills, which is a pain when it comes to gameplay.


This seems to happen when you change characters when you're already in the lobby. Exiting and changing character before you rejoin should fix the issue.

It's still a bad thing though, and hopefully gets fixed, but this might help to prevent it when you play the demo.

#5
L4r90

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ok... first i thought it was just because some of my characters where still leveling, but it's also annoying as hell right now that, when i open a pack for 20000 credits, all i get are some medigels, amps and another human vanguard. GIVEN THE FACT that i already got her up to lvl 20 and already unlocked all her appearance options (secondary color, lights etc.).
i hope bioware will fix this for the full release, since i opened up so many "doubles" already for classes where i already unlocked everything. would be nice if it where like a 5k pack thingy only since you can pretty much farm em in no time.
(what i'm getting at, is that once you got a certain common, for example; weapon to upgrade X, you stop opening it in the packs, hence you know that you'll get something new or upgrades for another item that is not at rank X already)


edit; not only the vanguard class but others as well... and here i hoped that i would finaly get a Claymore (still no luck) or upgrades for my carnifex, since all my weapons and mods are already at rank X/ or 5. also the only races i've unlocked so far are turian sentinel, quarian engineer, krogan soldier and drell vanguard... i'd like a new adept for a change, or any asari for that matter^^


edit #2; i started counting for human vanguards and just hit 20... is this a joke?

Modifié par L4r90, 02 mars 2012 - 12:59 .


#6
Mangonou

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Implementation is certainly an important part of getting this to work.

Some of the feedback tools I've seen for this kind of thing have literally everything you've called out here.  They force users to search for an issue before posting a new one, allow comments on issues, allowing voting on issues, allow moderators to close issues as fixed/duplicate/won't fix, etc.  Basically, a bug tracking system designed for large numbers of users who aren't professional testers.

Something like that would be amazing here, but failing that, even just a "bugs" subforum would be a step in the right direction.  Separating bugs out from discussion and opinions is one of the hardest parts of trying to get useful information out of forums like this.  They often tend to get lost under a sea of "OMG THIS class SUX!!!1", etc.

count_4 wrote...

The problem with a simple thread is that there is no way to tell how often a bug actually occurs and how players are perceiving it.
To get this information across, a community-based system would be best, where people can report bugs that are then voted up by all those that experience it as well + a kind of rating on how much it affects the player.

Actually I already thought about setting something like this up. Wouldn't be too hard. But then I remembered the BSN and how there's a metric f'ton of threads for every tiny problem- over and over again. Moderating such a bug report system would be insane as the system would require people to search for existing entries to work which is simply not going to happen.



#7
zoNiklv

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I approve, you can add my 50 cents:

http://social.biowar...index/9451336/1

#8
_symphony

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BioWare wouldn't use a public bug tracker because It will show bugs that they will never fix, like the bug with ME2's quickslots that is still present in ME3's demo.

#9
schecterplayer91

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I just had a match on Firebase Ghost (on the Xbox 360) where a team member deliberately glitched through the map and got sent back to the drop-off zone. After he did this, all of us had near-instantaneous shield regeneration for as long as he stayed alive. The only things that could really kill us were Atlas's or the Phantom's assassination move, everything else would just dent our shields for a split second before recharging.

I normally don't really care if people are exploiting game mechanics as long as what they are doing has no effect on anyone else (for example, people boosting in CoD to get a higher prestige). But if this kind of a glitch was used on a Gold mission, which the player had done already according to him, he's going to get a lot more money to use on unlocks, which gives him an unfair advantage. I seriously hope that stuff like this (and all the matchmaking/lobby stuff) gets patched before or soon after release.

#10
count_4

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Mangonou wrote...
Some of the feedback tools I've seen for this kind of thing have literally everything you've called out here. They force users to search for an issue before posting a new one, allow comments on issues, allowing voting on issues, allow moderators to close issues as fixed/duplicate/won't fix, etc.  Basically, a bug tracking system designed for large numbers of users who aren't professional testers.

Cool, wasn't aware of that as I'm only used to more traditional bug trackers. Can you recommend a particular one?
It might still be reasonable to set one up, transfer the bugs and point people to it to report new ones. Question is if BioWare would actually make use of it...

Mangonou wrote...
Something like that would be amazing here, but failing that, even just a "bugs" subforum would be a step in the right direction.  Separating bugs out from discussion and opinions is one of the hardest parts of trying to get useful information out of forums like this.  They often tend to get lost under a sea of "OMG THIS class SUX!!!1", etc.

Certainly. I once asked them via Twitter where I should report a bug I found. They pointed me to the main forums. Yeah, great idea there, Bioware...

#11
corporal doody

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bug....while doing a vanguard charge at a phantom...and you get hit in your charge...you get flown up!! 100% of the time (for me anyways). I can never get down. then as soon as the next wave pops...i wind up under the world and cant get out. i take large amounts of damage and get killed by messages...but never die. Only once did i float up to the top again...and thankfully died instantly cuz every mob on the map was in the same spot....ontop of me

#12
AcidThe Wraith

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Don't forget not being able to move at the beginning of the game unless you roll and then take cover.

Especially because some of the classes can't roll/dodge.

And what about the armor/ammo/weapon perks disappearing? I was saving those four pistol ones for when i use my Asari! >:l

#13
underdogg123

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Bug... Several times the enemies stop taking damage from any of my shots / biotics / tech but can still damage me - sometimes while this happens and almost all enemies do not see me or fire at me - I run out of ammo and can´t reload from the ammo cases - just stuck untill the game ends or quit and loose my points.

#14
Bryan Johnson

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Mangonou wrote...

<snip>

  • In the store, character cards are given for characters that already have max XP and have all customization options fully unlocked, when players still have other characters that do not have Max XP or all options unlocked.
  • If host leaves and game dissolves instead of reforming, players lose all accumulated XP and credits for that mission.  Not fun when your hosting player craps out on wave 10 of Silver or Gold.  Especially not fun when you've used a ton of equipment and support items that you can't get back.  I would even go so far as to consider this a TCR failure due to loss of significant player data / gamestate.
<snip>


First off, thank you very much for compiling such a list, it is very helpful to us. 

I would like to comment on this issue in particular. As I have stated in other threads the first is not a bug, there is a reason for that, which will be seen in the full game.

Thanks for this though :)

#15
Major Tao

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My sincere thanks to Mangonou for expressing his professional concerns and love of the game.

How about adding a bug report to the post game screen - so we can record a voice message on the spot to Bioware.

How's this for a Mass Effect Community Challenge....post You Tube videos of the continuing glitches and bugs you're encountering in Mass Effect Multi-Player !

Here's a link to a previous bug thread:   http://social.biowar...3/index/9276332


Latest Bugs

03-08-2012
Just played the weirdest Multi-player game ever !   I joined a Quick Match, and once in the game could NOT see my fellow players.  I could see the enemies and kill them, but not my team mates - they were invisible. 
The post game report claimed I'd played BY MYSELF !!!


I see that the muzzle flash of weapons fire continues to persist....even when the player is NOT firing.
As of 03-07-2012.

Characters are still spawning stuck in place at the start of the game. 
I experienced this yet again on a match at the Ghost base.  As of 3-3-2012.

Ongoing Concerns

When signing up for a Quick Match Round, instead of getting to preview my potential squad mates, I'm simply dropped into the middle of an ongoing round...either late on round 1, or as late as round 9 or 10 !  

This is no exaggeration, instead of seeing the team lobby - my character is simply whisked off to the battlefield !!!

This is cause for concern for several reasons.
1)  I'd really like the option to see who I'll be playing with first.  
Will I like the squad composition ?   If there are already two of one class, I may want to choose another class to round out the team. Is it all N7 level 1 players joining me for a Silver match ? 


2)  Is it fair to drop a player in at the end of a match to reap the benefits ?
Maybe that squad was abandoned by a player who quit ( for whatever reason )...and they would really appreciate someone joining to provide fire support.  STILL - I'D LIKE TO KNOW WHAT ROUND I'M JOINING !!!
If I"m going to be the emergency back-up....I'd like to know that too.  

Perhaps Bioware can make that additional choice available - with disclosures. 
JOIN SQUAD THAT NEEDS ADDITIONAL MEMBER ?   
Challenge: Silver :  Map Za'ha'dun :  Round 8

3)  Gears of War allows friends to join their friends who are short a player - once a round concludes. 
I have often joined such matches, and my friends have joined me in such matches.  This is welcomed by all as we want to have a full team as we strive for victory.   I encourage Bioware to consider such a model. 

Modifié par Major_Tao_Tau, 09 mars 2012 - 12:02 .


#16
Guest_Malcom el Zorro_*

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I have bought Veteran Packs, but after a 10-20 seconds wait I get a message that says my purchase couldn't be done and I lost credits. "Contact customer service".
And sometimes, due lag or reasons beyond my understanding, my powers don't work. Charge doesn't knockback and Warp/Throw/Pull hit about a meter away from the target.
EDIT: I know that it was posted, but I really hate when I get stuck in the environment around round 8-9 with my Vanguard. It happens when I get killed while charging.

Modifié par Malcom el Zorro, 02 mars 2012 - 05:04 .


#17
PD ORTA

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I've joined matches where I cannot see the enemies, but my teammates can. This happened to me mid-match for the first time. I'm being shot by an invisible enemy who's apparently standing right beside me, of course my teammates (who are all dead, are watching) and yelling at me as if i'm an idiot.

You actually forced me on to the mic, to defend myself. Shame on you Bioware.
I hope this doesn't happen in the full game.

#18
AreleX

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Major_Tao_Tau wrote...

I see that the muzzel flash of weapons fire continues to persist....even when the player is NOT firing.


i get this on 360 as well, except i've only seen it happen when people are using the Avenger

#19
Butthead11

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Everytime someone falls through the floor and gets that glitch i become invincible and my shields can never go down.

#20
randomfoo

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Bryan, in case you missed it, here was my lengthy list of bugs I left in the multiplayer feedback thread (organized by section): http://social.biowar...0725/64#9456354

I'd definitely use an external bug tracking tool, especially if it had a voting style scheme.

#21
Huttj509

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Props to Mangonou for a well stated organized coherent list. I figure any info we can give on exactly what happened (and what seemed to cause it) greatly increases chance of a solution. To often I see posts that effectly just say "fix the bugs!" without going into any detail.

Seems like charge + latency/lag causes a number of issues with stuff not synching up properly after the charge.

#22
jimmyw404

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I'm sure there will be a bug list thread on these forums filled with 100s of bugs that never get fixed.

The only recognition the thread will get is some random dev coming in and stating that one of the many line items is 'working as intended', as Mr. Johnson has demonstrated in this thread.

Modifié par jimmyw404, 02 mars 2012 - 05:30 .


#23
Heather Cline

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I have to disagree with the biotic explosion. If say a Asari Adept puts on the stasis/stasis bubble and someone else detonates it, the points should go to the person who put on the stasis bubble. It's not fair to credit the kill to someone who didn't put the stasis bubble on.

A bug I've come across is that If you've unlocked a Drell card for whatever class you have the possibility of unlocking said Drell Card again in the store which is stupid. The game should recognize that you already have that Drell Card and should give you something else.

Shields and armor of enemies don't get eaten away by bullets as fast as they should. For instance if you are using a SMG or a Assault Rifle those are meant to eat shields quickly but they don't. If you are using a pistol or a shotgun they should eat armor quickly but again they don't. This is extremely annoying when trying to take down an atlas or a enemy turret. This is why the weapons should be able to do what they do and then force you to switch or something if need be.

Powers don't always eat at shields or armor too properly. I've seen this happen a lot in the MP part of the game even on Bronze Level.

#24
TexasToast712

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Add the Turian bug where you have downwards recoil. Happens when you max his passive for stability and add a stabilizer to the weapon.

#25
K2daE

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"Extraction vehicle hovers around extraction zone for the entirety of Wave 11 in laggy games, possibly longer (might have been there for more than just Wave 11, I only noticed it then)."

I've seen this a few times. In fact, it never leaves from the begining of the match, at least in my experience.
Also one I think the devs said they were working on, where you cannot move at the start of the match and must roll or take cover to gain movement.