43 réponses à ce sujet

[Grovermancer]

BlueEyes_Austin wrote...

Remember that a rogue archer can also enter stealth for a crit as well. So between Arrow of Slaying and 2 popsicles breaking you can take out three enemies in the first seconds of a fight. That's pretty darn worhtwhile.

Yeah, I often fired from Stealth when applicable.  Though rarely re-Stealthed in combat just to get that auto-critical; seemed too cheesy a tactic LOL!

ps.  I did enjoy setting traps and luring enemies into them -- though it really wasn't necessary it was fun

Haasth wrote...

Wait. So, you were an assassin / duelist?
Could you elaborate a bit on how you made those work so well with
archery, as they are clearly designed for melee combat. I'd love to use
them if possible.

No, could only use "Dueling," with "Keen Defense" passive.  And "Mark of Death" was better for allies than for myself.

Modifié par Grovermancer, 25 novembre 2009 - 05:22 .

[Arlock_Deathwind]

good rouge builds are good going with 22str 35dex 20will no magic and all the rest into cunning should come around to 40 or 50 if you get into the lvl 20's as for archers well they have good crits. but when you mobbed by 14 or so grenlocks.. crits count for crap.. dragons on the other hand.. well heh heh.. and yes lvl cap is 25 have to do pretty much everything in the game to get it though.. from disarming every trap to unlocking every chest and killing everything in the game.

[Haasth]

Grovermancer wrote...

BlueEyes_Austin wrote...

Remember that a rogue archer can also enter stealth for a crit as well. So between Arrow of Slaying and 2 popsicles breaking you can take out three enemies in the first seconds of a fight. That's pretty darn worhtwhile.

Yeah, I often fired from Stealth when applicable.  Though rarely re-Stealthed in combat just to get that auto-critical; seemed too cheesy a tactic LOL!

ps.  I did enjoy setting traps and luring enemies into them -- though it really wasn't necessary it was fun

Haasth wrote...

Wait. So, you were an assassin / duelist?
Could you elaborate a bit on how you made those work so well with
archery, as they are clearly designed for melee combat. I'd love to use
them if possible.

No, could only use "Dueling," with "Keen Defense" passive.  And "Mark of Death" was better for allies than for myself.

So you purely used them for the stat benefits, or? 

[T0rin3]

IMO, Bard is a great specialization for an archer. It gives you everything you want: attack, damage, critical chance.. and every good Rogue archery build is Cunning based, which Bard songs rely on.

[Grovermancer]

T0rin3 wrote...

What point?  That's we're not allowed to RP or else "suffer the consequences?"  They offer a powerful bow you can only get by being either "evil" or irresponsible or maybe just a forgetful or not thorough player.  If I gotta "be evil" and let an NPC commit suicide just to get an item that's geared towards any alignment, that's bullchite.  (because, you know, I couldn't otherwise get that bow from the back of the shop) ?????

You can choose to kill him out of pity, that's what I did.. not particularly evil, but if you're so concerned with itemization, I would think you would prioritize it above say, some artificial character and how he behaves in an artificial world. You either want to role play a very specific or you want the best items, it's your choice. Nobody to blame but yourself on that one.

The 'artificial' thing is having no other way to get that bow.  Just absurd.  Like you couldn't find it youself in the shop, or like that smith wouldn't offer it too you after the side-quest?  Ridiculous.  (and those sorts of things in this game pulls from the immersion of character and story and makes it feel contrived at those times)

Rapid Aim is a tier 1 talent, it is not supposed to be an end game "good" talent. Supressing Fire, a tier 3 talent is good against bigger, harder enemies. Aim is bad, except when combined with big attacks like Arrow of Slaying. There aren't many sustained bow talents that you can use all the time, most are situational, and personally I'm glad. With specializations there are quite enough sustained abilities to use, I barely have enough stamina to use 2 sustained talents and still be able to fire arrow of slaying.

Of my 3 other play-throughs (non-Archer), both "Shield Bash" and "Pommel Strike" were excellent tier 1 talents through the entire game, working on everything save the hugest bosses.

So there's no lore in DA or other fantasy of ranged weapons receiving runic powerups?

Not in any "traditional fantasy" game I've played in the last 15 years.

I rewatched the LOTR special DVD bonus stuff recently.  They talked about having special runic incantations inscribed on the elven bows, to give added power. 


The last fantasy-genre game I remember playing was Diablo II.  Yeah, it's been that long.  But their bows also accepted power-ups.

EDIT: Oh, and of course I played, NWN.  AA could enchant a fire arrow 3X per day, as well as get either elemental arrows, or a bow that added elemental damage.

Modifié par Grovermancer, 25 novembre 2009 - 05:37 .

[Grovermancer]

Haasth wrote...


So you purely used them for the stat benefits, or? 

Oh, yes, that too LOL!

IIR, both offered Dex bonuses, and the Bard/Ranger didn't interest me as much.  (have bad experiences from playing NWN as a Ranger, and vicariously played as a Bard via Leliana)

Also prefer Dex due to Defense bonus; the whole last 1/3, nothing could touch me except bosses, even then it was rare.  And "Dirty Fighting" or "Below the Belt" would allow for a quick getaway if needed.

Modifié par Grovermancer, 25 novembre 2009 - 05:40 .

[Siven80]

I usually go bard/Duelist . As an Archer your cunninf should be fairly high and the bards song of courage gives attack, dmage and crit chance based off cunning. It should be a nobrainer tbh. And Duelist just for the stat bonus and/or 1st sustained ability.



Rapid aim on a bow is a must so its possible to normal crit as you wont need rapid shot sustained on.



I too dont use the hotfix either. It was a quickfix thats not perfect and may very well be altered by the time the official patch comes out. along with a couple of issues people have found.

[Haasth]

Alright. In that case Bard / Duelist it is. I don't really like the theme behind a minstrel, but I can just pretend I only learned the spy skills. Ranger doesn't really suit for my Archer's idea.

[MerinTB]

Grovermancer wrote...

OH -- defusing TRAPS and UNLOCKING chest adds up to a LOT of XP too! 

(And there's a cheap belt you can buy that addes XP to discovering Codex entries, raising them from 50XP to 75XP.  I didn't bother with it either.)

There's those, and the little 1% from the Memory Band.

But, yes, chests and traps are XP treasure troves (heh) as I often found I got more XP for unlocking and disarming than from most the enemies I was slaying.

[Grovermancer]

edit/wrong post!

Modifié par Grovermancer, 26 novembre 2009 - 01:02 .

[raygunpk]

Why is it important to have high Cunning for archer? Shouldn't it be all Dex for damage?

Obviously you need Cunning for the skills and such, but talking purely damage wise.

[Grovermancer]

raygunpk wrote...

Why is it important to have high Cunning for archer? Shouldn't it be all Dex for damage?
Obviously you need Cunning for the skills and such, but talking purely damage wise.

I more or less agree.

Dex gives Damage AND Defense.

Cunning only adds to Damage, and then only if you have the Lethality talent.


Though Cunning can apparently help with pickpocket, lockpicking, and maybe traps?  (all of which can add up to a lot of money and XP).

[raygunpk]

What were your end game stats?

[Grovermancer]

raygunpk wrote...

What were your end game stats?

  Base  -- w/ Equip
Str:  22 -- 26
Dx: 78 -- 88
Wil:  20 -- 27
Mgc: 14 -- 16
Cng: 30 -- 32
Cnst: 12 -- 24

Armor: 18
Def: 133
Attack Rating: 112
Damage: 51.1

I also kept a high-Cunning ring (forget the name) in case there was a chest I couldn't open.  I was never able to Pickpocket the First Enchanter or Ziathrin, but stole from every other NPC I tried.  (not sure about Ignatius, come to think about it)

Modifié par Grovermancer, 26 novembre 2009 - 02:07 .

[Grovermancer]

T0rin3 wrote...

AFAIK, it is known that it messes up Shale, which I can accept. I've never heard of it ever affecting Alistaire or Sten.

Anyways, the only reason I use it, is because without it, Archery is overpowered. Using Longbows, you get 100% of your damage derived from strength, or as a Rogue with Lethality: cunning.

100% damage from cunning, the dump stat, well, that's just ridiculous.

Wait one second.  I just saw this.  ARE YOU KIDDING ME?

Isn't the Hotfix is supposed to make Archers STRONGER!?  But no, you use the Hotfix ...to intentionally make Archers WEAKER?   Puh-leeze!



Go back to the "overpowered" vanilla install I used here.

Go ahead and put everything into Cunning.

Let's see what kind of Armor you can wear, and let's see how high your Defense is.

Hell, if I used the Hotfix, ALL my damage would've been through the roof!

Modifié par Grovermancer, 26 novembre 2009 - 02:03 .

[Kaosgirl]

T0rin3 wrote...


You can choose to kill him out of pity, that's what I did.. not particularly evil, but if you're so concerned with itemization, I would think you would prioritize it above say, some artificial character and how he behaves in an artificial world. You either want to role play a very specific or you want the best items, it's your choice. Nobody to blame but yourself on that one.

i disagree. It is very much the  'fault' of the game-makers for providing very few options and tying them in to very specific paths.  What might be debatable is whether this is a 'feature' or a 'problem.'  

IMO, as long as the second-tier  items are still viable for taking you through the game, it's not a real problem. 

[Booisbackagain]

Grovermancer wrote...

raygunpk wrote...

What were your end game stats?

  Base  -- w/ Equip
Str:  22 -- 26
Dx: 78 -- 86
Wil:  20 -- 27
Mgc: 14 -- 16
Cng: 30 -- 32
Cnst: 12 -- 24


I also kept a high-Cunning ring (forget the name) in case there was a chest I couldn't open.  I was never able to Pickpocket the First Enchanter or Ziathrin, but stole from every other NPC I tried.  (not sure about Ignatius, come to think about it)

It is nice to see that I am on the right track with stats even in my first playthrough as a ranger. I will distribute those slightly differently however as I seem to need more Willpower to perform animal summonings.

The first 10 levels were quite hard though. Lots of aggro swapping, careful pulls and kiting bosses had to be performed. All this micromanagement was fun for me but I do not suggest it to everyone. It might get really irritating at times.

After level 10 things got a lot easier once  you get to take most of the archrer abilities. Right now at level 13 there is a victory pattern for every situation:

Bear blocks the way-->I have always activated Rapid shot and Suppressing fire-->Go stealth (just one point is enough)-->Pull enemy (instant critical)

If the bear stops him nothing else needs to be done but a right click.

If not, you can try Shattering shot to knock him down before he gets to you, or if he gets too close Dirty Fighting and running away from him till the bear finishes him.

I can not wait to take Arrow of Slaying at lvl 14 to test its damage. Thank you OP for posting this extreme numbers, I found them quite inspiring to be honest.

[Grovermancer]

Booisbackagain wrote...


I can not wait to take Arrow of Slaying at lvl 14 to test its damage. Thank you OP for posting this extreme numbers, I found them quite inspiring to be honest.

But remember -- part of the reason I made the post was to show the insanely high damage number was very circumstancial; it only hits that high on certain "throw away" units towards end-game.  Units that anyone from your party can kill in one hit.  Units that come in droves, but are mowed down, to give the feeling of being powerful and heroic.

On average, my Arrow of Slaying was hitting in the high 400's, usually around 470ish.
On tougher units, lower tier bosses, etc., it would hit around 170's to low 200's.

Very high, but also remember, Arrow of Slaying has such a long recharge time, you can really only use it once per encounter.

"Dirty Fighting" is a great equalizer and stunner against mele.  If I were to solo w/ my Archer build, I think I'd get to use 'Below the Belt' more as well.  But since I put so much into Dex, my Defense was fairly high, and I pretty much never got hit anyhow.  (I also had Evasion and Keen Defense passives IIR, on top of the Def numbers)

Towards the end-game, literally nothing could touch me.

[ClayMeow]

GoldenusG wrote...

Level 25 is the cap. Very few people reach it without exploiting a couple of xp traps. A fair few squeeze into level 24 though.

There is no cap, not sure where you read there is one.