216 réponses à ce sujet

[the_one_54321]

Elite Midget wrote...
Just because you feel that a happy choice invalidates the sad choices doesn't maen there shouldn't be an option in a series about choices.

The implication is simply that if there are to be sad endings, then there cannot be an everyone-is-happy ending. Because the existence of such an ending robs the sad ending of all meaning. It's not a difficult concept to grasp.

Sometimes stories don't without some tears. Either way, it sure sounds to me like Shepard wins against the reapers.

[_Martyr_]

WeWant wrote...
Sad endings, when optional are useless because they lose their dramatic impact. People would just reload their game and try to get the "happy" ending instead.

If it was a "yes/no" decision that could point to a sad/happy ending i would agree with you. But that's not the case, lots of players built their story one piece after another, they deserve better.

A player plays videogames and stuff not to see that all their efforts are pointless, but rewarding.

These "Thereisnohope" endings just ruin all the hype and the atmosphere that WE players built during the first two games.

Modifié par _Martyr_, 02 mars 2012 - 06:39 .

[the_one_54321]

_Martyr_ wrote...
If it was a "yes/no" decision that could point to a sad/happy ending i would agree with you. But that's not the case, lots of players built their story one piece after another, they deserve better.

Better, you say? And what exactly is "better?" Some of the best story endings ever involve a hell of a lot of sadness. Many of them even involve the hero dying or losing everything close to him. I'm actually specificially reminded of Gladiator. That movie would have been cheapened by a happy-go-lucky ending.

[Siegdrifa]

WeWant wrote...

Elite Midget wrote...

Was it too much to add even one high note ending? Whould that have angered the grimdarkers and make them believe someone pissed in their cheeros? No, it wouldn't.

Yes. 
Sad endings, when optional are useless because they lose their dramatic impact. People would just reload their game and try to get the "happy" ending instead.
Were you emotionally affected when you saw your squadmated die in ME2? No because you knew that you can save everyone.
Virmire was much better done because no matter what you do, someone is gonna die. You just got to choose who it will be.
That's what I wanted for ME3. 
Cry me a river.

Irrevelant statement, if the emotionnal sad ending get more sens for you, you take it.
Because i think chocolate have better tast than vanilla doesn't mean i'll always choose choco over vanila if they are both available, this is the meaning of option.
Sometimes i want to eat vanilla and i won't care for the choco next to it.

Modifié par Siegdrifa, 02 mars 2012 - 06:42 .

[Elite Midget]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Elite Midget wrote...
Just because you feel that a happy choice invalidates the sad choices doesn't maen there shouldn't be an option in a series about choices.

The implication is simply that if there are to be sad endings, then there cannot be an everyone-is-happy ending. Because the existence of such an ending robs the sad ending of all meaning. It's not a difficult concept to grasp.

Sometimes stories don't without some tears. Either way, it sure sounds to me like Shepard wins against the reapers.

You have 6 sad endings. You're being offly selfish to deny many fans even 1 happy ending. And no, it doesn't rob the sad ones of all meaning. Some want their Sheperd to die a hero, others want to see Sheperd fail(Which isn't even a choice apparantly), and others just want Sheperd to save the Galaxy, at a huge cost, but still overcoming great challenges despite the odds.

Hell, ME2 was just about that. Everyone said it could only end in failure or sadness. Players had the option on failing, losing many, or working extra hard and doing the impossible. Which was something Sheperd was known for for 2 straight games. Than in ME3 there's no option to do the impossible or even fail?

Bioware must reevaluate themselves, they have drifted far from their roots and their reputation and sales are starting to reflect this.

[NeMounet]

Siegdrifa wrote...

It's very good for you if you like the ending (no sarcasme), it's always better to invest your money in something you will enjoy, and this is a totaly subjective matter.

NeMounet wrote...

1) The hero die in action, This is very good ending, because the ultimate heroic act is sacrifice.

That i strongly disagree because good ending isn't about a magicla formal that always works the same way.
The hero dieyng in a balze of glory to become a legend is in my opinion more due to an uncreatif and lazzy writting that can't find enough inspiration to make a "great ending".

It is like getting hungry and ordering a pizza... never fail ! god damn ****** cliché, BUT it do the job.
If you love pizza "woohoooo awsome idea !"
If you are tired of pizza or don't like it "... do you know that it's not the only ***** food that exist in the world damit !!!"

Agree with you on that, and maybe I haven't been clear enought (my bad).

Bioware adapt classic story in game, they create nothing new (on the story side). But they doing it so good. Putting together so many well know theme in a (mostly) coherent story is not so easy.

Indeed if you don't like this kind of story, that's alroght, there is no "way to think" and my post should be a bit misleading on this part.

To reuse your pizza stuff. My point is Bioware make great Pizza, if you like Pizza, that's good, if you don't like it, you can complain that they should do chinese food. But do not ask them to make a Nem with a pizza. it won't be a good Pizza, nor a good Nem.

But again, for me there is no surprise here, as since ME1 we know this will be a good damn Pizza

[the_one_54321]

Elite Midget wrote...
You have 6 sad endings. You're being offly selfish to deny many fans even 1 happy ending. And no, it doesn't rob the sad ones of all meaning.

Maybe you're not listening...

It robs the sad ones of all meaning.

Elite Midget wrote...
Bioware must reevaluate themselves, they have drifted far from their roots and their reputation and sales are starting to reflect this.

I can't say I disagree with you on this. But I don't think it has anything at all to do with ME ending sadly.

[LilyasAvalon]

WeWant wrote...


Yes.
Sad endings, when optional are useless because they lose their dramatic impact. People would just reload their game and try to get the "happy" ending instead.
Were you emotionally affected when you saw your squadmated die in ME2? No because you knew that you can save everyone.
Virmire was much better done because no matter what you do, someone is gonna die. You just got to choose who it will be.
That's what I wanted for ME3.
Cry me a river.

I completely disagree on the whole 'they lose their dramatic impact when optional'. ME2's bad endings are optional, and I ALWAYS tear up in the ending where Shepard ****s up on everything, with just Joker and EDI still alive. It is, in fact, one my favourite video game endings.

But I DO like the fact it's optional, that I CAN change that.

[Elite Midget]

The pizza thing is bad.

ME1 - Cheese Pizza
ME2 - Pepperoni Pizza
ME3 - A Coconut Pie.

At some point after Cheese and Pepperoni the maker, Bioware, decided that they don't think Pizza is the direction they want so they offer something completely different while removing all Pizza from their menues since the Pizzas don't effect the Pie.

Modifié par Elite Midget, 02 mars 2012 - 06:47 .

[xtorma]

2.1 Ending is not more important than walkthrough, it's just as important.

[the_one_54321]

LilyasAvalon wrote...
But I DO like the fact it's optional, that I CAN change that.

Are you going to do any runs of ME3 where everyone died in ME2? Be honest.

[Elite Midget]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Elite Midget wrote...
You have 6 sad endings. You're being offly selfish to deny many fans even 1 happy ending. And no, it doesn't rob the sad ones of all meaning.

Maybe you're not listening...

It robs the sad ones of all meaning.

Elite Midget wrote...
Bioware must reevaluate themselves, they have drifted far from their roots and their reputation and sales are starting to reflect this.

I can't say I disagree with you on this. But I don't think it has anything at all to do with ME ending sadly.

In your opinion it does that. Your opinion isn't fact, stop trying to make it as such.

I'm sure it does have something to do with it. The ending they envisioned for ME3 when ME1 is most likely vastly different than the one that they put out now.

[WeWant]

Elite Midget wrote...

WeWant wrote...

Elite Midget wrote...

Was it too much to add even one high note ending? Whould that have angered the grimdarkers and make them believe someone pissed in their cheeros? No, it wouldn't.

Yes. 
Sad endings, when optional are useless because they lose their dramatic impact. People would just reload their game and try to get the "happy" ending instead.
Were you emotionally affected when you saw your squadmated die in ME2? No because you knew that you can save everyone.
Virmire was much better done because no matter what you do, someone is gonna die. You just got to choose who it will be.
That's what I wanted for ME3. 
Cry me a river.

Maybe in your opinion. Not all want a happy ending and I know many that tried to make the perfect sad ending for ME2 that was importable. Just because you feel that a happy choice invalidates the sad choices doesn't maen there shouldn't be an option in a series about choices. Furthermore, if everyone wanted sunshines and rainbows we would have far less Renegades.

I feel cheated too, but not for the same reasons.  I'm incredibly disapointed that the major choices in the previous games don't matter at all. Thus, they should have put an fourth ending where the bad choices you made (Paragon AND Renegade) would result at failling to stop the Reapers, aka the darkest ending possible. This would make the actual endings look happy enough. 
And no, "Renegade" doesn't mean that you want the worst ending possible. People who let their companions die in ME2 did this in their second or third playthrough, let's be real. 

I find it incredibly childish that you complain just because the endings are not happy enough for you. I'm disapointed.

[AkiKishi]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Elite Midget wrote...
Just because you feel that a happy choice invalidates the sad choices doesn't maen there shouldn't be an option in a series about choices.

The implication is simply that if there are to be sad endings, then there cannot be an everyone-is-happy ending. Because the existence of such an ending robs the sad ending of all meaning. It's not a difficult concept to grasp.

Sometimes stories don't without some tears. Either way, it sure sounds to me like Shepard wins against the reapers.

I don't believe that is the case. In ME2 it was relatively easy to get a "perfect" but people still played around with who lived and who died in the SM to get a solution they liked.

[Halo Quea]

BobSmith101 wrote...

Halo Quea wrote...

Wow, this game is going to have NO replay value at all with these kinds of scenarios. I don't care how many Shepards you have to import, NO ONE is going to want to play these endings over and over again.

It's a bit of a slap in the face to the people who have been perfecting the perfect playthrough over ME/2.

Well the thing is we would have never been banking on the perfect playthrough, but Bioware kept INSISTING that our choices would shape the outcome.  Now that we know the truth,  it's exactly as you've put it.............a slap to the face.

THEY are the ones who created this belief in us that we would ultimately be responsible for how this all ends.   Any expectations that we had, Bioware fostered and nurtured over the two games. 

[_Martyr_]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Better, you say? And what exactly is "better?" Some of the best story endings ever involve a hell of a lot of sadness. Many of them even involve the hero dying or losing everything close to him. I'm actually specificially reminded of Gladiator. That movie would have been cheapened by a happy-go-lucky ending.

True that, but these endings are a lot like "The Mist". 

"**** no fuel, we're all gonna die, i've got 4 rounds left, i'll kill my son, two randoms and my loved one so that they won't have them"

*blam blam blam blam*

*crying* TAKE ME YOU BASTARDS, TAKE MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

*random trollmilitary approaches car*
"sir please, get back in your car, we're cleansing this area. It'll be over within an hour"

*end credits*


Despite its goodness, The Gladiator was a movie, we weren't fond to Maximus as we are now with our "sci-fi avatar"

[Elite Midget]

WeWant wrote...

Elite Midget wrote...

WeWant wrote...

Elite Midget wrote...

Was it too much to add even one high note ending? Whould that have angered the grimdarkers and make them believe someone pissed in their cheeros? No, it wouldn't.

Yes. 
Sad endings, when optional are useless because they lose their dramatic impact. People would just reload their game and try to get the "happy" ending instead.
Were you emotionally affected when you saw your squadmated die in ME2? No because you knew that you can save everyone.
Virmire was much better done because no matter what you do, someone is gonna die. You just got to choose who it will be.
That's what I wanted for ME3. 
Cry me a river.

Maybe in your opinion. Not all want a happy ending and I know many that tried to make the perfect sad ending for ME2 that was importable. Just because you feel that a happy choice invalidates the sad choices doesn't maen there shouldn't be an option in a series about choices. Furthermore, if everyone wanted sunshines and rainbows we would have far less Renegades.

I feel cheated too, but not for the same reasons.  I'm incredibly disapointed that the major choices in the previous games don't matter at all. Thus, they should have put an fourth ending where the bad choices you made (Paragon AND Renegade) would result at failling to stop the Reapers, aka the darkest ending possible. This would make the actual endings look happy enough. 
And no, "Renegade" doesn't mean that you want the worst ending possible. People who let their companions die in ME2 did this in their second or third playthrough, let's be real. 

I find it incredibly childish that you complain just because the endings are not happy enough for you. I'm disapointed.

Truth be told, I didn't know your Squaddies could die in my first ME2 playthrough and didn't know Wrex could die either in ME1. I just did all my side missions and stayed true Paragon. Though I did make a sad save with as many dead as I could because I wanted to see how vastly different they would be in ME3. Apparantly not so much.

Modifié par Elite Midget, 02 mars 2012 - 06:50 .

[LilyasAvalon]

@the_one_54321: I thought we couldn't import the save where it's just Joker and EDI left and Shepard falls to his death. ._. But I am doing saves where I lost my crew, where I lost over half my squad, etc. My favourite is going to be 'You Humans are all Racist' one. I'm looking forward to it. Or I was anyway.

[Jackal7713]

Elite Midget wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...

Elite Midget wrote...
Just because you feel that a happy choice invalidates the sad choices doesn't maen there shouldn't be an option in a series about choices.

The implication is simply that if there are to be sad endings, then there cannot be an everyone-is-happy ending. Because the existence of such an ending robs the sad ending of all meaning. It's not a difficult concept to grasp.

Sometimes stories don't without some tears. Either way, it sure sounds to me like Shepard wins against the reapers.

You have 6 sad endings. You're being offly selfish to deny many fans even 1 happy ending. And no, it doesn't rob the sad ones of all meaning. Some want their Sheperd to die a hero, others want to see Sheperd fail(Which isn't even a choice apparantly), and others just want Sheperd to save the Galaxy, at a huge cost, but still overcoming great challenges despite the odds.

Hell, ME2 was just about that. Everyone said it could only end in failure or sadness. Players had the option on failing, losing many, or working extra hard and doing the impossible. Which was something Sheperd was known for for 2 straight games. Than in ME3 there's no option to do the impossible or even fail?

Bioware must reevaluate themselves, they have drifted far from their roots and their reputation and sales are starting to reflect this.

agreed.  And all the people hating on us that wanted to have a choice, saying we are childish, take a good look in the mirror.

[the_one_54321]

Elite Midget wrote...
In your opinion it does that. Your opinion isn't fact, stop trying to make it as such.

Oh. Well, you know. Pot, kettle, and black and all that.

Btw, I speak for all the fans that have opinions similar to mine. So my posts are representative of them and I can generalize about what kind of reaction we're going to see, how this is or isn't fair to them. And thus legitimize my own opinion as it is implicitly backed a large number of the game's fans.

Seriously, take a step back. Stop posting for like an hour and having a snack or lunch or whatever. Watch some TV or something. Then come back and read through your last 20 or 30 posts and think about where you're going with this and what you're implying in your arguments.

I don't actually have any problem with people wanting a happy ending. I wouldn't have complained in the slightest if there was going to be a totally happy ending. But there is plenty of merrit to saying "we're going to end this series as a win for humanity, but with a heartwrenching personal loss for the main cast of characters. That'll be an incredibly emotional climax."

[the_one_54321]

_Martyr_ wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...
Better, you say? And what exactly is "better?" Some of the best story endings ever involve a hell of a lot of sadness. Many of them even involve the hero dying or losing everything close to him. I'm actually specificially reminded of Gladiator. That movie would have been cheapened by a happy-go-lucky ending.

True that, but these endings are a lot like "The Mist". 

"**** no fuel, we're all gonna die, i've got 4 rounds left, i'll kill my son, two randoms and my loved one so that they won't have them"

*blam blam blam blam*

*crying* TAKE ME YOU BASTARDS, TAKE MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

*random trollmilitary approaches car*
"sir please, get back in your car, we're cleansing this area. It'll be over within an hour"

*end credits*


Despite its goodness, The Gladiator was a movie, we weren't fond to Maximus as we are now with our "sci-fi avatar"

Whaaaaaaaaaat? I haven't heard anywhere that Shepard screws everyone over only find out that he didn't need to.

[Siegdrifa]

NeMounet wrote...

Siegdrifa wrote...

It's very good for you if you like the ending (no sarcasme), it's always better to invest your money in something you will enjoy, and this is a totaly subjective matter.

NeMounet wrote...

1) The hero die in action, This is very good ending, because the ultimate heroic act is sacrifice.

That i strongly disagree because good ending isn't about a magicla formal that always works the same way.
The hero dieyng in a balze of glory to become a legend is in my opinion more due to an uncreatif and lazzy writting that can't find enough inspiration to make a "great ending".

It is like getting hungry and ordering a pizza... never fail ! god damn ****** cliché, BUT it do the job.
If you love pizza "woohoooo awsome idea !"
If you are tired of pizza or don't like it "... do you know that it's not the only ***** food that exist in the world damit !!!"

Agree with you on that, and maybe I haven't been clear enought (my bad).

Bioware adapt classic story in game, they create nothing new (on the story side). But they doing it so good. Putting together so many well know theme in a (mostly) coherent story is not so easy.

Indeed if you don't like this kind of story, that's alroght, there is no "way to think" and my post should be a bit misleading on this part.

To reuse your pizza stuff. My point is Bioware make great Pizza, if you like Pizza, that's good, if you don't like it, you can complain that they should do chinese food. But do not ask them to make a Nem with a pizza. it won't be a good Pizza, nor a good Nem.

But again, for me there is no surprise here, as since ME1 we know this will be a good damn Pizza

Héhé, to stay with the pizza stuff i could argue that Bioware is used to include some few pizza on teir meny without ham or mushroom, and for ME3 you can't get any pizza without ham or mushroom, and as a pizza lover, it totaly ruine my need of pizza.  : ))
Now personnaly i'll wait to play the game and see the ending to forge my own opinion, may be some people are over reacting about the very bitter lightly sweet ending, i'll know for myself in few days.

[albertalad]

the_one_54321 wrote...

I FEEL SO STRONGLY ABOUT SUNSHINE-AND-RAINBOW ENDINGS THAT NO ONE COULD POSSIBLY DISAGREE WITH ME. MY EMOTIONAL ATTACHMENT AND MOTIVATION CLEARLY TRUMPS ANY NARRATIVE AND WRITING EXPERTISE OF THE STAFF OR THE OPINIONS OF ANY PLAYERS THAT DON'T FEEL EXACTLY THE SAME ABOUT SUNSHINE-AND-RAINBOW ENDINGS.

NOW LISTEN TO EVERYTHING I HAVE TO SAY.

/end sarcasm

Yeah, that really is what some of you sound like.

And YOU sound like a BW lap dog.

[WeWant]

Siegdrifa wrote...

WeWant wrote...

Elite Midget wrote...

Was it too much to add even one high note ending? Whould that have angered the grimdarkers and make them believe someone pissed in their cheeros? No, it wouldn't.

Yes. 
Sad endings, when optional are useless because they lose their dramatic impact. People would just reload their game and try to get the "happy" ending instead.
Were you emotionally affected when you saw your squadmated die in ME2? No because you knew that you can save everyone.
Virmire was much better done because no matter what you do, someone is gonna die. You just got to choose who it will be.
That's what I wanted for ME3. 
Cry me a river.

Irrevelant statement, if the emotionnal sad ending get more sens for you, you take it.
Because i think chocolate have better tast than vanilla doesn't mean i'll always choose choco over vanila if they are both available, this is the meaning of option.
Sometimes i want to eat vanilla and i won't care for the choco next to it.

You didn't understand me. I WANT the perfect ending, thus I would easily reload my game in order to get it. Just like every person in their "canon" playthrough. It's not that easy. 

[the_one_54321]

albertalad wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...
I FEEL SO STRONGLY ABOUT SUNSHINE-AND-RAINBOW ENDINGS THAT NO ONE COULD POSSIBLY DISAGREE WITH ME. MY EMOTIONAL ATTACHMENT AND MOTIVATION CLEARLY TRUMPS ANY NARRATIVE AND WRITING EXPERTISE OF THE STAFF OR THE OPINIONS OF ANY PLAYERS THAT DON'T FEEL EXACTLY THE SAME ABOUT SUNSHINE-AND-RAINBOW ENDINGS.

NOW LISTEN TO EVERYTHING I HAVE TO SAY.

/end sarcasm

Yeah, that really is what some of you sound like.

And YOU sound like a BW lap dog.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAH!!!!!

Man, I'm not even going to play the game. Not until EA ditches Origin.