216 réponses à ce sujet

[Corvus Metus]

Elite Midget wrote...

Corvus Metus wrote...

You know what bothers me?

People who dislike the ending and call people who like it (or just don't care) "Biodrones". Personally, I never give two ****s about the ending. When I play a game, at least for me, it -is- about the journey and not the end.

Am I a Biodrone? Well, I hated the first NWN, have absolutely no intrest in Jade Empire,  and didn't care for Dragon Age: Origins since it was a modern game disguising its self as an "old-school" game.

Let's put it this way. Back in the PS2 era, there was a series called Xenosaga. Storyline-wise, the games intrigued me. The gameplay, however, was just awful. I forced myself through the first two but never bothered with the last because the games themselves were a torture to play.

Meanwhile, Baldur's Gate I? No ending. Replayed many times. Love it.

You should play Tactic Ogres, they even remade it. The game was that good. It's about many different choices that drasticly alter how each chapter ends up, who lives and dies, what side you end up, your allies and enemies, boss fights(one path even lets you recruit the bosses of the other paths) as well as what happens to everyone in the end as well as who was recruitable or not. Bioware should have taken a page from that game because it is perhaps one of the best games to handle choices that matter.

I wanted to get a PSP, just for the Tactics Orge and early Persona remakes - I'm waiting for the Vita in hopes the original will come down in price though. 

Of course, I never played ME for the choices, because I never really believed they would amount to anything.  Call me a cynic, but as far as that was concerned I was never really expecting much.  That being said, I play ME because I love a good space opera and the games have decent to good gameplay.  Maybe that's why I'm not bothered by the details I know about the ending - I'm not expecting anything but a fun game.

[dw99027]

the_one_54321 wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

WeWant wrote...
You didn't understand me. I WANT the perfect ending, thus I would easily reload my game in order to get it. Just like every person in their "canon" playthrough. It's not that easy.

So you want to be protected from wanting the perfect ending by there not being one?

Exactly! The sad ending doesn't mean anything if you can just avoid it.

Agreed. Allowing for a 'happy' ending would cause a huge reload wave. Reminds me of a certain 'mom' quest in DA2.

[Elite Midget]

Corvus Metus wrote...

Elite Midget wrote...

Corvus Metus wrote...

You know what bothers me?

People who dislike the ending and call people who like it (or just don't care) "Biodrones". Personally, I never give two ****s about the ending. When I play a game, at least for me, it -is- about the journey and not the end.

Am I a Biodrone? Well, I hated the first NWN, have absolutely no intrest in Jade Empire,  and didn't care for Dragon Age: Origins since it was a modern game disguising its self as an "old-school" game.

Let's put it this way. Back in the PS2 era, there was a series called Xenosaga. Storyline-wise, the games intrigued me. The gameplay, however, was just awful. I forced myself through the first two but never bothered with the last because the games themselves were a torture to play.

Meanwhile, Baldur's Gate I? No ending. Replayed many times. Love it.

You should play Tactic Ogres, they even remade it. The game was that good. It's about many different choices that drasticly alter how each chapter ends up, who lives and dies, what side you end up, your allies and enemies, boss fights(one path even lets you recruit the bosses of the other paths) as well as what happens to everyone in the end as well as who was recruitable or not. Bioware should have taken a page from that game because it is perhaps one of the best games to handle choices that matter.

I wanted to get a PSP, just for the Tactics Orge and early Persona remakes - I'm waiting for the Vita in hopes the original will come down in price though. 

Of course, I never played ME for the choices, because I never really believed they would amount to anything.  Call me a cynic, but as far as that was concerned I was never really expecting much.  That being said, I play ME because I love a good space opera and the games have decent to good gameplay.  Maybe that's why I'm not bothered by the details I know about the ending - I'm not expecting anything but a fun game.

I expected little after the Variables skyrocketed in ME2 and I knew Bioware just dug themselves a hole they can't get out of. Though I didn't expect them to offer something as small as... Whatever they wish to call this. Bioware has changed vastly since joining hands with EA.

[Ianamus]

the_one_54321 wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

WeWant wrote...
You didn't understand me. I WANT the perfect ending, thus I would easily reload my game in order to get it. Just like every person in their "canon" playthrough. It's not that easy.

So you want to be protected from wanting the perfect ending by there not being one?

Exactly! The sad ending doesn't mean anything if you can just avoid it.

I think quite the opposite: Not having a happy ending renders the sad ending and the entire galactic readiness system pointless. 

The whole point of the sad ending/good ending is to make players want to play multiplayer and the app games, and have a motivation for raising galactic readiness and make the right choices. 

If your Squad all died in ME2 even with all loyalty missions completed and upgrades purchased, would people bother mining or doing the side-quests? No, they are rendered pointless, and that is what has happened to the endings in Mass Effect 3. 

And not having a happy ending makes the sad ending seem like less of a loss, yeah Earth is destoryed and the Normandy crashes, but I don't really care becuase that happens in every ending. Not having a good ending actually reduces the impact of the bad endings, becuase theres no good to compare it against. Just like if all endings were good they wouldn't feel like as much of an acomplishment if there was no sad ending to compare it to. 

Modifié par EJ107, 02 mars 2012 - 07:53 .

[DarthSliver]

I decided i wont knock the ending until I see it for myself. Stuff i seen than hearing about the "3 endings" just dont add up to me. Also even if the Relays are destroyed its sorta been hinted at by Legion several times because the Geth choose to follow their own path and not the path the Reapers set forth for all species and what not. It makes you think there is a reason why the Geth havent traveled passed the Veil since gaining their freedom. But if the Relays are destroyed in the end of the game like the leaked says, I think its been hinted at by Legion in ME2 with how the True Geth work.

Modifié par DarthSliver, 02 mars 2012 - 07:47 .

[Whatever42]

dw99027 wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

WeWant wrote...
You didn't understand me. I WANT the perfect ending, thus I would easily reload my game in order to get it. Just like every person in their "canon" playthrough. It's not that easy.

So you want to be protected from wanting the perfect ending by there not being one?

Exactly! The sad ending doesn't mean anything if you can just avoid it.

Agreed. Allowing for a 'happy' ending would cause a huge reload wave. Reminds me of a certain 'mom' quest in DA2.

There really is no sad ending for Shepard, unless you fail to accumulate enough war assets, in which case you can't just reload but have to replay.

The fate of the crew could just as easily been more satisfying as unsatisfying, without having to reload.

Most people who wanted the grimdark endings wanted Shepard dead in all endings (as is all the rage in shooter games nowdays). No one really asked for Shepard to live but to blow the crew off into deep space. That's just aggravating.

[WeWant]

Elite Midget wrote...


I served in the armed forces, I'm more the willing to lay my life on the line to save my fellow man. It's a part of our training. However, I wont just throw my life away and will use it as best I can to save as many as I can. Maybe I'll die, maybe I wont. Whatever the case if I managed to save a life than I did my duty which I can be proud of.

Yes there was a happy one in NV. You can clean up the Republic, force the Brotherhood and the Republic to play nice, liberate the land of Ceaser's Legion, and ensure mny of the outer villages/towns/tribes are destroyed. This ending takes a lot more work than the other ones but it didn't invalidate any of them as fans made multiple characters and obtained many different endings.

Yes they do, Bioware told their fans that the choices from the previous games and in ME3 would effect the endings and those that did everything perfectly and put forth the effort would be rewarded. That isn't the case.

Then you should know better that you can't save everyone or you can die trying.
Heh, that was the ending I chose in NV. The Mojave becomes an anarchy and crime raises, so I doubt it's the happiest ending. Considering that the NCR would install more stability and security if you chose them. 

And again, based on your actions, Earth is either dostroyed or okay, so I wouldn't say it's nothing. But yes, I too expected more repercussions from the previous games and I feel cheated. But nothing to do with the endings themselves. FNV choices matter but the endings were still ambiguous.

Modifié par WeWant, 02 mars 2012 - 07:52 .

[Elite Midget]

EJ107 wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

WeWant wrote...
You didn't understand me. I WANT the perfect ending, thus I would easily reload my game in order to get it. Just like every person in their "canon" playthrough. It's not that easy.

So you want to be protected from wanting the perfect ending by there not being one?

Exactly! The sad ending doesn't mean anything if you can just avoid it.

I think quite the opposite: Not having a happy ending renders the sad ending and the entire galactic readiness system pointless. 

The whole point of the sad ending/good ending is to make players want to play multiplayer and the app games, and have a motivation for raising galactic readiness and make the right choices. 

If your Squad all died in ME2 even with all loyalty missions completed and upgrades purchased, would people bother mining or doing the side-quests? No, they are rendered pointless, and that is what has happened to the endings in Mass Effect 3. 

And not having a happy ending makes the sad ending seem like less of a loss, yeah Earth is destoryed and the Normandy crashes, but I don't really care becuase that happens in every ending. Not having a good ending actually reduces the impact of the bad endings, becuase theres no good to compare it against. Just like if all endings were good they would feel good if there was no sad ending to compare it to. 

As a wise man once said.

You cannot have Light without Darkness or Darkness without Light.

[Elite Midget]

WeWant wrote...

Elite Midget wrote...


I served in the armed forces, I'm more the willing to lay my life on the line to save my fellow man. It's a part of our training. However, I wont just throw my life away and will use it as best I can to save as many as I can. Maybe I'll die, maybe I wont. Whatever the case if I managed to save a life than I did my duty which I can be proud of.

Yes there was a happy one in NV. You can clean up the Republic, force the Brotherhood and the Republic to play nice, liberate the land of Ceaser's Legion, and ensure mny of the outer villages/towns/tribes are destroyed. This ending takes a lot more work than the other ones but it didn't invalidate any of them as fans made multiple characters and obtained many different endings.

Yes they do, Bioware told their fans that the choices from the previous games and in ME3 would effect the endings and those that did everything perfectly and put forth the effort would be rewarded. That isn't the case.

Then you should know better that you can't save everyone or you can die trying.
Heh, that was the ending I chose in NV. The Mojave becomes an anarchy and crime raises, so I doubt it's the happiest ending. Considering that the NCR would install more stability and security if you chose them. 

And again, based on your actions, Earth is either dostroyed or okay, so I wouldn't say it's nothing. But yes, I too expected more repercussions from the previous games and I feel cheated. But nothing to do with the endings themselves. FNV choices matter but the endings will still be ambiguous.

Yes I know that but this is a game that gives you many ways of greatly bolstering your forces and readiness. I ill tell you that if I had the ability to drop 50 more guys and a tank on a whim I wouldn't be worrying about death as much and will be expecting a much smaller casuality and death toll.

I ME3 that isn't the case, no matter what you do trillions are screwed by the ending and Sheperd and his crew always gets the short end of the stick. That goes against what Bioware said ME3 was going to be about and end.

[Ghost Rider LSOV]

WeWant wrote...

And again, based on your actions, Earth is either dostroyed or okay, so I wouldn't say it's nothing. But yes, I too expected more repercussions from the previous games and I feel cheated. But nothing to do with the endings themselves. FNV choices matter but the endings were still ambiguous.

In the grand scheme of things, losing Earth,Shepard, his crew, would still be ok if the galaxy is saved.

So, all endings are happy! (<- Future BioWare talk? )

[AkiKishi]

dw99027 wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

WeWant wrote...
You didn't understand me. I WANT the perfect ending, thus I would easily reload my game in order to get it. Just like every person in their "canon" playthrough. It's not that easy.

So you want to be protected from wanting the perfect ending by there not being one?

Exactly! The sad ending doesn't mean anything if you can just avoid it.

Agreed. Allowing for a 'happy' ending would cause a huge reload wave. Reminds me of a certain 'mom' quest in DA2.

Well I never cared much for mom so that was lost on me anyway.

But a huge reload wave ? So what ? 

[Jackal7713]

haynoats wrote...

Elite Midget wrote...

Yes they do, Bioware told their fans that the choices from the previous games and in ME3 would effect the endings and those that did everything perfectly and put forth the effort would be rewarded. That isn't the case.

These are the facts, and they are indisputable.

Agreed. Its not like it was one interview that they lied about somethings. This is months of lying over and over again about how chioces mattered and that extensive game play would be rewarded.

However, people are saying you shouldn't be upset because you got lied to. That makes no sense what so ever!

[AkiKishi]

DarthSliver wrote...

I decided i wont knock the ending until I see it for myself. Stuff i seen than hearing about the "3 endings" just dont add up to me. Also even if the Relays are destroyed its sorta been hinted at by Legion several times because the Geth choose to follow their own path and not the path the Reapers set forth for all species and what not. It makes you think there is a reason why the Geth havent traveled passed the Veil since gaining their freedom. But if the Relays are destroyed in the end of the game like the leaked says, I think its been hinted at by Legion in ME2 with how the True Geth work.

It's 3 endings with modifiers.

Destroy
Control
Merge

Earth is

A Screwed
B Slightly less screwed
C Not so screwed.

The mysterious 7th ending no idea what that is but it's NG+.

Although how that works in the time from invasion while you have been jetting around the galaxy is anyones guess.

[Ksandor]

BobSmith101 wrote...

The problem in the ending is not really in the tone. But rather you do pointless stuff for no reward. Thats just padding out a short game.

Imagine that in ME2 you did all that planet scanning and loyalty stuff but everyone still died. Kind of removes the point of doing it don't you think ?

Another thing, depending on who your LI is the ending is going to make more or less sense (much like DA2 made more sense as Templar than as a Mage).

The Reaper motivation is a little iffy too. I'd have prefered had they stuck with the dark energy theme.

Hear hear!

This month I heard a lot about the game theory, risk and reward system of video games and cutting corners for cost effectiveness from Bioware employees who post game theory article links on Twitter, praising the new Bioware game approach and telling us why famous old games are forgotten and why their developers went bankrupt, and how everything they (Bioware) do is gold. Make a search for Bioware's Twitter celebs and you will see who posted what.

The point is if the fundamentals of a video game is the risk and reward system then where is my reward, where is my happy ending? It seems we risk everything and we are screwed big time.

But wait... If the game makes profit who cares right? Their reward is killing enemies in a fancy bloody badassful melodramatic Hollywood fashion and have fun. So screw the ending. It is not fun anyway.

Sorry commander there is a big writing on the wall here "Games should be fun". But nobody sees it.

[Ghost Rider LSOV]

Jackal7713 wrote...

However, people are saying you shouldn't be upset because you got lied to. That makes no sense what so ever!

Nope. Getting lied to by devs today is not something to be upset about, you should even thank them.

Or "We never lied. You just didn't understand what we meant."

EDIT:

Ksandor wrote...

But wait... If the game makes profit who cares right? Their reward is killing enemies in a fancy bloody badassful melodramatic Hollywood fashion and have fun. So screw the ending. It is not fun anyway.

Sorry commander there is a big writing on the wall here "Games should be fun". But nobody sees it.

Success is sales, not morale.

Modifié par Ghost Rider LSOV, 02 mars 2012 - 08:04 .

[WeWant]

Ksandor wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

The problem in the ending is not really in the tone. But rather you do pointless stuff for no reward. Thats just padding out a short game.

Imagine that in ME2 you did all that planet scanning and loyalty stuff but everyone still died. Kind of removes the point of doing it don't you think ?

Another thing, depending on who your LI is the ending is going to make more or less sense (much like DA2 made more sense as Templar than as a Mage).

The Reaper motivation is a little iffy too. I'd have prefered had they stuck with the dark energy theme.

Hear hear!

This month I heard a lot about the game theory, risk and reward system of video games and cutting corners for cost effectiveness from Bioware employees who post game theory article links on Twitter, praising the new Bioware game approach and telling us why famous old games are forgotten and why their developers went bankrupt, and how everything they (Bioware) do is gold. Make a search for Bioware's Twitter celebs and you will see who posted what.

The point is if the fundamentals of a video game is the risk and reward system then where is my reward, where is my happy ending? It seems we risk everything and we are screwed big time.

But wait... If the game makes profit who cares right? Their reward is killing enemies in a fancy bloody badassful melodramatic Hollywood fashion and have fun. So screw the ending. It is not fun anyway.

Sorry commander there is a big writing on the wall here "Games should be fun". But nobody sees it.

Never play any GTAIV, RDR, Max Payne 2 or any Half Life if you play a game just to get a Disney ending. 

Seriously, what's wrong with this fanbase. Go play Nintendo games.

Modifié par WeWant, 02 mars 2012 - 08:09 .

[Ksandor]

Ghost Rider LSOV wrote...

Jackal7713 wrote...

However, people are saying you shouldn't be upset because you got lied to. That makes no sense what so ever!

Nope. Getting lied to by devs today is not something to be upset about, you should even thank them.

Or "We never lied. You just didn't understand what we meant."

EDIT:

Ksandor wrote...

But wait... If the game makes profit who cares right? Their reward is killing enemies in a fancy bloody badassful melodramatic Hollywood fashion and have fun. So screw the ending. It is not fun anyway.

Sorry commander there is a big writing on the wall here "Games should be fun". But nobody sees it.

Success is sales, not morale.

Actually I was being sarcastic.  Bioware cares about profit, not fans. The games I enjoy are the games which I can succeed if I do the right thing.

If some people like tragedy they get their endings. Veeerrry dramatic, veeerrry tragic endings, all 6-7 of them. But what about a single "humble" happy ending option? The O-P-T-I-O-N which was there at beta leak, yes?

[Ksandor]

WeWant wrote...

Ksandor wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

The problem in the ending is not really in the tone. But rather you do pointless stuff for no reward. Thats just padding out a short game.

Imagine that in ME2 you did all that planet scanning and loyalty stuff but everyone still died. Kind of removes the point of doing it don't you think ?

Another thing, depending on who your LI is the ending is going to make more or less sense (much like DA2 made more sense as Templar than as a Mage).

The Reaper motivation is a little iffy too. I'd have prefered had they stuck with the dark energy theme.

Hear hear!

This month I heard a lot about the game theory, risk and reward system of video games and cutting corners for cost effectiveness from Bioware employees who post game theory article links on Twitter, praising the new Bioware game approach and telling us why famous old games are forgotten and why their developers went bankrupt, and how everything they (Bioware) do is gold. Make a search for Bioware's Twitter celebs and you will see who posted what.

The point is if the fundamentals of a video game is the risk and reward system then where is my reward, where is my happy ending? It seems we risk everything and we are screwed big time.

But wait... If the game makes profit who cares right? Their reward is killing enemies in a fancy bloody badassful melodramatic Hollywood fashion and have fun. So screw the ending. It is not fun anyway.

Sorry commander there is a big writing on the wall here "Games should be fun". But nobody sees it.

Never play any GTAIV, RDR, Max Payne 2 or any Half Life if you play a game just to get a Disney ending. 

Seriously, what's wrong with this fanbase. Go play Nintendo games.

You are not to decide that nor to dictate me. I play any game I want, and complain about any game I want. Yo udon't know which games I played. Besides I don't say them to change the ending. I say make another option. This has nothing to do with Nintendo games nor is about Disney endings. Do you think that all happy endings are disney endings tough guy?

Modifié par Ksandor, 02 mars 2012 - 08:12 .

[dw99027]

But a huge reload wave ? So what ?

It would make Mass Effect 4 'Space Cowboys' difficult to sell to the general public as canon. The great space colony of 'New Alabama' requires the stranding of a less than optimal genetic pool on a planet with space cows.

[SilencedScream]

I don't want a "Disney ending" as everyone calls it.

I just want something well-written that reflects the countless hours I've already poured into two previous games. Not something where two decisions - 1.) how much I put into Galactic Readiness and 2.) Destroy, Merge, or Control - affect 10% of an otherwise unchangeable ending.

I don't mind loss. I don't mind making hard decisions. In fact, I loved having to decide on Virimire. That's fine - give me lots of decisions like that. Let me mold an ending that makes me feel like my time invested was well worth it.

Instead, I feel like I was handed a rushed ending that's meant to cover up the fact that they had no idea how to beat the reapers (seriously - I'd love to see the explanation for how every organic is made partially synthetic and vice-versa) and so they threw in a lot of unnecessary drama in order to hide that aspect.

[Ksandor]

dw99027 wrote...

But a huge reload wave ? So what ?

It would make Mass Effect 4 'Space Cowboys' difficult to sell to the general public as canon. The great space colony of 'New Alabama' requires the stranding of a less than optimal genetic pool on a planet with space cows.

This!

[Ksandor]

SilencedScream wrote...

I don't want a "Disney ending" as everyone calls it.

I just want something well-written that reflects the countless hours I've already poured into two previous games. Not something where two decisions - 1.) how much I put into Galactic Readiness and 2.) Destroy, Merge, or Control - affect 10% of an otherwise unchangeable ending.

I don't mind loss. I don't mind making hard decisions. In fact, I loved having to decide on Virimire. That's fine - give me lots of decisions like that. Let me mold an ending that makes me feel like my time invested was well worth it.

Instead, I feel like I was handed a rushed ending that's meant to cover up the fact that they had no idea how to beat the reapers (seriously - I'd love to see the explanation for how every organic is made partially synthetic and vice-versa) and so they threw in a lot of unnecessary drama in order to hide that aspect.

And this! Please no fast talking we KNOW what we are talking about.

[SilencedScream]

dw99027 wrote...

But a huge reload wave ? So what ?

It would make Mass Effect 4 'Space Cowboys' difficult to sell to the general public as canon. The great space colony of 'New Alabama' requires the stranding of a less than optimal genetic pool on a planet with space cows.

No, no, no.
Don't you dare let them use "canon" as an excuse. How many times have they stated that there is no "canon," that our choices are each our own canon? **** that.