2656 réponses à ce sujet

[Chozo_Hybrid]

I don't know what side of the debate this puts me on, but I'm going to be playing this to see the end as well as the consequences of my previous games actions. Rachni, collector base etc. As long as I get to make the key choices in this game (I would love it to be as good as the previous game, hope it is) it will be roughly what I thought it was going to be.

We have built up to this point, apart from the odd finishing touch, the building was completed as we start this. I imagined it would be more about the fight and getting your allies together than anything else.

In the end, If it disapoints, and I hope it does not, that sucks and I am sorry to hear that.

PoliteAssasin wrote...

Hmm. Maybe by playing it I will
have a different perspective of it. We'll see tomorrow. At least I'll
enjoy the multiplayer though if not the single player. I was a fan of
gears 3 horde mode, but not a fan of the clunky feel of their combat.
The ME skim just makes it better, plus the customization.

-Polite

I hope playing it makes it better for you, and everyone else going by that. If not, that is a shame.

Modifié par Chozo_Hybrid, 06 mars 2012 - 08:55 .

[Crashloop_No]

Bawseee wrote...

This is NOT that bad. Sure, it has less than ME and ME2, but this is a different game. There are still enough dialogue choices available. Overall i'm satisfied with what i've played so far.

This is NOT a different game, it is the third game in a series and people expect that game to be similar with previous games. The dialogue in the game is not very good, my playing yesterday made me feel more like I was being told a story where I could choose it's direction then I actually control Shepard and develop my character. So far ME3 seems far from being close to an RPG game, more of a story based action gamed with rpg elements. A rpg game should not make me feel like I'm watching a interactive movie, it should involve me it should suck me in and allow me to develope and control my character as I see fit. And so far in ME3 it's not doing this, I can choose dialogue's but for all I care it could be random. It feels like an interactive movie, and I'll treat the game like a story based Action game rather then an RPG until it makes me see it in any other way.

In some ways ME3 is what DA2 was for Dragon age series. It removed most of the rpg elements that was there and focused on fast paced action and story.To see them removing even more of the freedom now makes me think that Bioware has totally lost it's grip and understanding of what a RPG is. I'll play ME3 to the end to see how it turns out, it could be that the beginning of the gameis like this and everything opens up and turns out nice. But the beginning is NOT a good sign for the future of RPG's from Bioware. DA2 wasn't a bad action game, but it failed badly as a RPG. I just hope ME3 surprises me. So far tho I'm not convinced...

Modifié par Crashloop_No, 06 mars 2012 - 09:18 .

[slimgrin]

I'm finding most dialog choices to be thoroughly inconsequential so far. Worst part of the game imo. Literally just got renegade points for calling the Reapers bastards. Oooo boy that's really badass Shepard.

[Gruzmog]

It was presented as a trilogy and as such it should not be a totally different game you can do that in a normal series even though people won't like you for it. that said with some 5 hours playtime in now,

I don't mind thte autodialogue as such, that stuff is well written its when I do actually have a choise I am often forced to be a dick or all caring, I really miss the neutral option sometimes here. My char cares about some characters enough to really care, on others I wan't to be able to keep more distance without being a dick :S

[Aesandil]

DaJe wrote...

PoliteAssasin wrote...

Actually the auto dialogue does change based on paragon and renegade scores. For example in the demo, if you're paragon you tell the krogan female that you'd like to get to know her. If your renegade you tell her earths survival depends on the alliance between the krogans through her. So it changes based on alignment. Something at least.

-Polite

So my Shepard, who is not "humans first" and actually quite diplomatic with alien races but has a bigger renegade score than paragon would act out of character?


That is exactly the problem.
A two sides system can never portray personality. Roleplaying rated PG-5.

I agree that something of this type would actually be an issue. Many of us roleplayed Shepards that were much less "streamlined" than your typical Paragon/Renegade archetype (all those Paragades or Renegons, for one), and having your character railroaded into saying something that you wouldn't necessarily have them say is bound to cause more than just a few winces here and there. 

[BentOrgy]

I'm just going to leave my review here; considering much of it deals with this thread:

After playing Mass Effect 3 for about four hours, and taking in a fair amount of its content, I can say this; Its very pretty, decently directed, and has a few interesting subplots that might be engaging later on. However; while its VERY obvious that Bioware had tried to recapture the visual aesthetic of ME1, they fell staggeringly short in recapturing one of the series' core values: Player Choice.

Auto-Dialogue is omnipresent, and when selectable dialogue is present, its relegated to merely two options, both offering little in different outcomes, and those that offer more, offer three, with the third being little more than two extra lines to basically reiterate what was already said.

There have been several scenes where my hand was on my mouse, because I believed (Because of where and how the conversation was going.) that a dialogue option was going to arrive, but it never did. Numerous times Shepard just talked over whatever I was thinking, and many times said things that I didn't really agree with.

Basically, many scenes in ME3 would have had at least two to three dialogue options in ME1 or even ME2, but in ME3 have nothing at all. Specific scenes in particular are the majority of the ones involving Liara, and the reunion scenes with the Council and Udina; nearly every word out of Shepard's mouth was automated, and the ones that weren't were redirected into speeches that I didn't mean or wouldn't have chosen.

In the End, I kept thinking; "Why the **** can I make choices at all? There's no benefit or even a sense of 'Yeah, that was me,' in anything I've said."

I'll keep playing, because its still early, but these are pivotal scenes that I'm referring to, like the intro (I call it this because its the beginning of the game, not because it actually felt like one.) and character introductions/reunions, and the Citadel scenes I've mentioned above. But I have been severely disappointed;

Many people shouted that the demo wasn't an accurate portrayal of the full game; that many elements had been restricted, and that it was too short to give a real impression. In my opinion now, they're wrong. Mass Effect 3's demo was a very clear look into what all of us ME veterans can expect in the full title, and I for one am not eager to see more; because I feel that it will be only more of the same.

Thank you Bioware, but for the memories you've created, not for the ones you're making now.

[Rockworm503]

slimgrin wrote...

I'm finding most dialog choices to be thoroughly inconsequential so far. Worst part of the game imo. Literally just got renegade points for calling the Reapers bastards. Oooo boy that's really badass Shepard.

Paragon's don't use such language even when talking about a race of robotic cthulu monsters that are trying to wipe out all life in the galaxy.

[Wulfram]

PoliteAssasin wrote...

Actually the auto dialogue does change based on paragon and renegade scores. For example in the demo, if you're paragon you tell the krogan female that you'd like to get to know her. If your renegade you tell her earths survival depends on the alliance between the krogans through her. So it changes based on alignment. Something at least.

Don't think the Krogan female dialogue is based on Paragon/Renegade in the Demo, I think it's based on how much damage she's taken.

[AkiKishi]

BentOrgy wrote...
Many people shouted that the demo wasn't an accurate portrayal of the full game; that many elements had been restricted, and that it was too short to give a real impression. In my opinion now, they're wrong. Mass Effect 3's demo was a very clear look into what all of us ME veterans can expect in the full title, and I for one am not eager to see more; because I feel that it will be only more of the same.

Thank you Bioware, but for the memories you've created, not for the ones you're making now.

People always say that, they said the same about DA2. I think that's why I've become more positive, not because my position has changed but because I saw everything I needed in the demo where as people who were expecting the full game to be somehow different are expressing disapointment now they have found out they were delluding themselves.

[Rockworm503]

Well I'm never saying that again.
Every time I say "its a demo its not a 100% indicator of what the game is" I end up regretting it.
This time I could've sworn someone involved in the development said it so I was convinced.

[Zamyslianskyj]

 Personally, I was a bit disappointed with the fact that auto-dialogue has an increased role in ME3, despite it being classed as an RPG (and, admittedly, an Action game). However, the more reviews I read about it, the more insignificant the dialogue issue becomes; as long as I can "romance" my various crew-members manually and can initiate dramatic speeches on the Citadel (or something), I don't care. I feel that it is going to a great game, despite the increased focus on action, and the fact that the Citadel has been enlarged (my favourite place, btw) makes it even better.

By March 9th, I'll be excited, I'm sure. But for now, I'll reserve my judgement until I've played the first two hours or so. I suggest anyone else who cares about not spoiling their game does the same.

[Eterna]

So people are mad because they can't investigate the background of some random dude who got caught in some heavy crossfire for 10 minutes while the world blows up around them?

[bboynexus]

Reserve judgement for two hours?

Yeah, sure, that's indicative of a 40+ hour product...

[Chozo_Hybrid]

bboynexus wrote...

Reserve judgement for two hours?

Yeah, sure, that's indicative of a 40+ hour product...

I don't think that person meant literally 2 hours somehow.

[KainrycKarr]

 It's garbage. I'm playing it right now, and there is a DRASTIC reduction in dialogue wheels from the previous games. I hate to say, but PoliteAssassin called this one a while ago. 

These aren't our Shepard's anymore....

[KainrycKarr]

bboynexus wrote...

Reserve judgement for two hours?

Yeah, sure, that's indicative of a 40+ hour product...

Once you're past the intro missions, yes, it is.

So far, I've been to Earth, the Citadel, and two other planets and frankly, the amount of auto-dialogue doesn't appear to be getting any better.

[Icinix]

So far - as much as it sucks having the choice taken away from you - it makes the choices based on what I would probably would have chosen anyway.

I don't like it, but I can live with it.

[phimseto]

phimseto wrote...

As my last post of the night, allow me to use the Emily Wong Twitter episode as an example of where ME3 goes terribly wrong.

In prior games, if you heard the news of her death, you would be prompted with three, maybe five, options. Let's stick with three for now.

Perhaps you choose paragon to express your sadness at her loss or admiration for her defiant bravery.

Perhaps you choose neutral, using the opportunity to reaffirm to those around you why we fight and why they need to stay focused on the task ahead.

Perhaps you choose renegade to brush her off as just another death or more likely to swear bloody vengeance against the Reapers.

A quiet moment with no real consequence, but powerful because you sift through your emotions and make an important decision about how you feel and then a critical distinction about how to express it. In ME1 and ME2, you would have that moment.

In ME3, more likely than not, you will not even have a choice. You will just watch your Shepard react along some predetermined line. It doesn't matter whether or not the reaction matches your own. What matters is that you are no longer engaged in that moment - you do not have to make a choice when push comes to shove about how you feel and how to say it. That is a tragic and undeniable loss for ME players.k

Today's Twitter ARG was brilliant. ME3 dialogues...not so much. Good-night, all.

To quote myself, the above is why even what the so-called "illusion of choice" matters. Saving the council or rachni or blowing up the collector base are all big choices that affect the game, but the many small asides within conversations are how we define our character and our role in the overall story. They are chances for us to really consider how we feel and how we want to express that - not just once in a dialogue, but from point to point where the situation or our opinions might warrant.

And that has, in the final game, been fundamentally taken from us. That is an awful, immersion-breaking thing, and a slap in the face to returning players because it is a result of the lazy streamlining done to accommodate the coveted "New player" who apparently focus groups say hide under the bed and wet themselves at the sight of a dialogue wheel.

I should be living this story, but with each conversation where I get thoughtlessly and incorrectly carried along, it is ruining the experience for me. I play ME for my story, not some generically considered interpretation of it.

[bboynexus]

Except you're talking about a story that has a great deal of authorial control. 'Your' story is merely one of numerous paths the writers themselves have coined.

Quit taking ownership of these things, BSN.

[phimseto]

KainrycKarr wrote...

 It's garbage. I'm playing it right now, and there is a DRASTIC reduction in dialogue wheels from the previous games. I hate to say, but PoliteAssassin called this one a while ago. 

These aren't our Shepard's anymore....

Yep, this is the bitter truth.

[bboynexus]

They've never been 'your' Shepard's. Not really. You've all only ever controlled a Shepard whose aactions you direct. He has, for the most, always been a pre-defined character with his own motives.

[BentOrgy]

bboynexus wrote...

They've never been 'your' Shepard's. Not really. You've all only ever controlled a Shepard whose aactions you direct. He has, for the most, always been a pre-defined character with his own motives.

His/Her motives are what we say they are though; Shepard can be either a Human elitist and a backstabbing bastard, or he/she can be a smooth-talking, Alien loving do-gooder that always sacrifices his/her comfort for others.

The things we did might have been controlled, but how and why we did them weren't. I think that's what we mean by Shepard being "Us." My Shepard in ME1 and ME2 was certainly me, because he did and said what I would have said and done.

In ME3, he no longer feels like "Me."

[bboynexus]

Would you really have 'done and said' what he has if you yourself were in his situations where you weren't confined to the options BioWare rigidly set for you?

I doubt it.

[Gibb_Shepard]

bboynexus wrote...

They've never been 'your' Shepard's. Not really. You've all only ever controlled a Shepard whose aactions you direct. He has, for the most, always been a pre-defined character with his own motives.

No. Just no. That is the biggest pile of crap i've ever heard. Each of my Shepard have different motives, and act different based on these motives.

Without the very basic customization of your character, being motivation, the game CANNOT be called an RPG, for there is no roleplaying. The Witcher 2 has a protagonist that was predefined in a book series, but i have been able to customise his motives, ideals and thought processes. The game has allowed me to do this extremely well.

I'll just reiterate here that you're wrong.

[bboynexus]

Gibb, please, why don't you liberate yourself from boundaries of definition of genre?