2656 réponses à ce sujet

[Il Divo]

nitefyre410 wrote...

he is right Dark Souls is incrediable but be warned... that game is unforgivin...  you will die, you will die alot until  get the hang of the combat... which is ... Be prepared.

It's wrong, but it feels so right.

[Wulfram]

If we keep posting about other games without at least some connection to the issue, it'll give them the excuse to shut down this thread as off topic.

This is about masses of auto-dialogue taking away the ability to play our Shepard, not other games.

[N00blet666]

Wulfram wrote...

If we keep posting about other games without at least some connection to the issue, it'll give them the excuse to shut down this thread as off topic.

This is about masses of auto-dialogue taking away the ability to play our Shepard, not other games.

Indeed. Has anyone contacted any devs via twitter?

[phimseto]

phimseto wrote...

Revan312 wrote...

Goddy10 wrote...

If Kinect is responsible for the dumming down of the Dialogue in Mass Effect 3, I will be livid.

There's a few reasons ME3 is dumbed down..

EA
Time constraints (i.e. rushed)
EA
Wanting the "Call of Duty" crowd
EA
Multiplayer inclusion (don't care if it was a seperate team, the resources could have been used in SP)
aanndd.. EA

I was just watching a friend play ME1 last night, and after doing so, had to watch some of these early walkthrough videos. I reached the same conclusion as most of you: the amount of autodialogue in the third game is crushingly disappointing.

In many cases in the first two games, there were numbers of times dialogue stopped to prompt you for a response. It didn't matter that many of these responses did little more than flavor the conversation. They were your responses. The prompts were your chance to consider what you just heard, measure it against how you were playing the character, and respond accordingly. That is what made Mass Effect so special - Shepard's story was your story.

In ME3, Shepard's story is just his story. It really isn't yours anymore. Too little interaction, too much watching the story, too little playing it ...and by playing, I mean where it counts: in the roleplaying, not the barrage of action sequence after action sequence. Experiencing what I have of the game so far reminds me of how I felt watching the Star Wars special editions and prequels: that my investment to date has been deemed without value.

So much of the autodialogue has these "New crowd" pursuits written all over it. Dialogue depth removed to accomodate action mode, MP removing needed space to create workarounds or restore that depth. I played ME1 and ME2. So far, I am just experiencing ME3. How am I supposed to be emotionall
y engaged when my story is no longer mine and is instead dictated to me? What a catastrophic decision to make for the final part of the game - to blindly pursue a different crowd heedless of its effect on the gameplay that made people invest so much in it to begin with.

Skipping around to different parts of the playthrough, and am sad to report back that what we see in the early part of the game is what is there. Conversation prompts, investigate dialogue, and all the little touches that let you make the story your own are pretty much gone. What conversation prompts are there are so few and incidental as to be rendered useless, and interacting with characters feels superficial and uninformative. Instead of playing a conversation, you just sit there and watch it happen.

This reminds me of my response to Chris Priestly's suggestion to play ME3 non-import first. If BW thinks that is a viable option, that ME3 is a generically good game in its own right, then that means it has failed as the final part of the trilogy and failed to return the investment players of the first two games have made. From what I have seen, ME3 does this in the starkest, most dire way possible: by removing a player's connection and control from their Shepard.

Honestly, of all the concerns I had about this game, it never even entered my mind that they would do something like this.

Modifié par phimseto, 04 mars 2012 - 05:33 .

[bennyjammin79]

Wow, everybody here has played the game already?

Must be nice.

[Wulfram]

N00blet666 wrote...

Indeed. Has anyone contacted any devs via twitter?

I've been tweeting at them for ages now, initially after the demo was out. No response.

I'm giving up on it now.  They're clearly not willing to answer, and I'm struggling to stay polite.

edit: might try just one more with a link to this thread?

Modifié par Wulfram, 04 mars 2012 - 05:32 .

[nitefyre410]

Chrumpek wrote...

nitefyre410 wrote...

Il Divo wrote...

Chrumpek wrote...

Ok guys any ideas for a new IP to go-to now for RPG with a good gameplay?

I'll second the Bioshock Infinite nomination. The original had one of my favorite stories in gaming. Dark Souls is also pretty incredible if you're looking for a mix of Legend of Zelda, Shadows of the Colossus, Diablo, and God of War. In depth gameplay combined with an intricate narrative. It's tied for my favorite game , along with Portal 2.

 

he is right Dark Souls is incrediable but be warned... that game is unforgivin...  you will die, you will die alot until  get the hang of the combat... which is ... Be prepared.

I passed Demon Souls on new game++ so yea I know, didn't like the direction they went with dark souls but I'll have to give it a try, gameplay//story wise its brilliant but it's nowhere near good when it comes to character development and that's what I'm kinda looking for.

 

You did the new game ++ well then you're ready... I never got the chance to play Demon Souls  but I have to say Dark Souls is most challenging game I have played in years. 

It depends on  how far your willing to look around... I would recommend Catherine and I'm bit interested in how Max Payne 3 turns out.

[Il Divo]

Wulfram wrote...

N00blet666 wrote...

Indeed. Has anyone contacted any devs via twitter?

I've been tweeting at them for ages now, initially after the demo was out. No response.

I'm giving up on it now.  They're clearly not willing to answer, and I'm struggling to stay polite.

edit: might try just one more with a link to this thread?

Day and a half away until we find out for ourselves.

[Revan312]

phimseto wrote...

 Skipping around to different parts of the playthrough, and am sad to report back that what we see in the early part of the game is what is there. Conversation prompts, investigate dialogue, and all the little touches that let you make the story your own are pretty much gone. What conversation prompts are there are so few and incidental as to be rendered useless, and interacting with characters feels superficial and uninformative. Instead of playing a conversation, you just sit there and watch it happen.

This reminds me of my response to Chris Priestly's suggestion to play ME3 non-import first. If BW thinks that is a viable option, that ME3 is a generically good game in its own right, then that means it has failed as the final part of the trilogy and failed to return the investment players of the first two games have made. From what I have seen, ME3 does this in the starkest, most dire way possible: by removing a player's connection and control from their Shepard.

ME2 and then DA2 were pretty obvious warnings..

[DatIrishFella]

I really hope I don't regret buying the CE, that's alot of money. Judging by the demo and the way people are talking about the Palaven mission, the one thing I loved the most about the franchise had been taken out.

[FryPanNN]

Yes, I've sent a few tweets to the devs myself, but none of them answer. Of course they won't, what they'll say?

Some of us were very vocal on these forums when Lotsb came out, we were upset with all the auto dialogue there because we knew this was the direction the series was going.

Now, there it is, forced friendships all over it, not really "far reaching consequences", not "wild different conclusions", and most importantly, no dialogue options.

Modifié par FryPanNN, 04 mars 2012 - 05:36 .

[RSX Titan]

What a total disgrace.

[android654]

bennyjammin79 wrote...

Wow, everybody here has played the game already?

Must be nice.

We've seen hours, myself more than six. What more do you need to get an idea of what the game is like?

[DatIrishFella]

FryPanNN wrote...

Yes, I've sent a few tweets to the devs myself, but none of them answer. Of course they won't, what they'll say?

Some of us were very vocal on these forums when Lotsb came out, we were upset with all the auto dialogue there because we knew this was the direction the series was going.

Now, there it is, forced friendships all over it, not really "far reaching consequences", not "wild different conclusions", and most importantly, no dialogue options.

I never really believed that EA would try and dictate what BioWare should and should not put in their games, you would expect EA to have some level of trust in BW to make a great game, I mean, there is no way Casey, all of a sudden thought, "hey, lets remove the dialogue wheel and pre define Shep" =, this has EA written all over it. Maybe that's why Jesse Houston and couple of others left, they didn't like the direction EA was forcing BW. 

[KnifeForkAndSpoon]

DatIrishFella wrote...

I really hope I don't regret buying the CE, that's alot of money. Judging by the demo and the way people are talking about the Palaven mission, the one thing I loved the most about the franchise had been taken out.

If that's really how it is chalk it up as a learning experience and don't do it again

[Evelane]

who care if some dialogue are automatic, the important is to have the choice, when the decision really matter, i dont care if i cant answer by myself on a question like '' you look good sheppard bla bla bla....''

The game will be epic no matter what

[RSX Titan]

DatIrishFella wrote...

FryPanNN wrote...

Yes, I've sent a few tweets to the devs myself, but none of them answer. Of course they won't, what they'll say?

Some of us were very vocal on these forums when Lotsb came out, we were upset with all the auto dialogue there because we knew this was the direction the series was going.

Now, there it is, forced friendships all over it, not really "far reaching consequences", not "wild different conclusions", and most importantly, no dialogue options.

I never really believed that EA would try and dictate what BioWare should and should not put in their games, you would expect EA to have some level of trust in BW to make a great game, I mean, there is no way Casey, all of a sudden thought, "hey, lets remove the dialogue wheel and pre define Shep" =, this has EA written all over it. Maybe that's why Jesse Houston and couple of others left, they didn't like the direction EA was forcing BW. 

Blaming EA is a cop out in my opinion. BW has clearly changed and not for the better.

[MisterJB]

Evelane wrote...

who care if some dialogue are automatic, the important is to have the choice, when the decision really matter, i dont care if i cant answer by myself on a question like '' you look good sheppard bla bla bla....'' 

I do. It was the freedom to do that that placed ME and DA:O over games like Fallout or The Witcher.
If I can't do it anymore, I don't see the point playing another Bioware game. it certainly isn't because their stories about acient evils looking to destroy the world can't be found anywhere else.

[Revan312]

RSX Titan wrote...

Blaming EA is a cop out in my opinion. BW has clearly changed and not for the better.

Because EA now owns them. The EA CEO already stated they're planning on making DA a year to year churn fest like CoD..

EA can tell Bioware to do whatever they want them to. They are the parent company after all. EA has liquidated many companys they've bought - Westwood, Dice Canada, Bullfrog and many more. If and when Bioware becomes non-profitable, EA will do the same to them..

Modifié par Revan312, 04 mars 2012 - 05:55 .

[DatIrishFella]

KnifeForkAndSpoon wrote...

DatIrishFella wrote...

I really hope I don't regret buying the CE, that's alot of money. Judging by the demo and the way people are talking about the Palaven mission, the one thing I loved the most about the franchise had been taken out.

If that's really how it is chalk it up as a learning experience and don't do it again

Of course, it's just I have to finish the trilogy, I'm just disappointed that they have removed the dialogue wheel, well, streamlined it, it was my only concern about ME3 and it seems to have been realised. When I was playing the demo I just felt different, a good action game, yes, but not like Mass Effect. 

[Massefeckt]

DatIrishFella wrote...

FryPanNN wrote...

Yes, I've sent a few tweets to the devs myself, but none of them answer. Of course they won't, what they'll say?

Some of us were very vocal on these forums when Lotsb came out, we were upset with all the auto dialogue there because we knew this was the direction the series was going.

Now, there it is, forced friendships all over it, not really "far reaching consequences", not "wild different conclusions", and most importantly, no dialogue options.

I never really believed that EA would try and dictate what BioWare should and should not put in their games, you would expect EA to have some level of trust in BW to make a great game, I mean, there is no way Casey, all of a sudden thought, "hey, lets remove the dialogue wheel and pre define Shep" =, this has EA written all over it. Maybe that's why Jesse Houston and couple of others left, they didn't like the direction EA was forcing BW. 

People need to look up Westwood and how EA ran them into the ground, the similarities to the situation with Bioware are spooky.

Both popular companies with a very loyal fanbase.

Both had well known people leave after the take over "For new opportunities"

Both told by EA to make MMO's.

Both released rushed versions of popular games to a backlash from fans.

Both changed the direction and feel of games after the takeover.

Westwood was then strip mined and folded by EA. This is the worrying thing and why those that defend Bioware no matter what are actually hurting them rather than helping.

[Rickin10]

Is this how Star Wars fans felt when they saw the Phantom Menace?

[moneycashgeorge]

Yea this is very disappointing.

Don't you guys think that Mass Effect had so much potential? That it could have really been something revolutionary? I think if they wanted to they really could have gone amazing places with this series. I think that they squandered that.

I feel like Mac Walters let this happen. I don't think Drew K. would have gone this way.

Anyway, even if it's not what it could have been, or even what it should have been (or atleast what we were hoping for), I still think it will be a very good game. It's still got the characters and the story, and it looks like it has great production values. Still 6 classes to play as, and there's deeper progression and customization. Great graphics, great music. It will be a fun ride.

[phimseto]

MisterJB wrote...

Evelane wrote...

who care if some dialogue are automatic, the important is to have the choice, when the decision really matter, i dont care if i cant answer by myself on a question like '' you look good sheppard bla bla bla....'' 

I do. It was the freedom to do that that placed ME and DA:O over games like Fallout or The Witcher.
If I can't do it anymore, I don't see the point playing another Bioware game. it certainly isn't because their stories about acient evils looking to destroy the world can't be found anywhere else.

This. It was the high degree of control in conversations - to shape your character from point to point, be it big decisions or degrees of response in a dialogue that made the difference. Taking away that is both taking away what made the game unique and worthwhile, as well as slapping returning fans in the face because everything about ME3 seems to be driven by attracting a different crowd at the expense of the depth, immersion, and control that made the first two games matter to so many.

[phimseto]

Rickin10 wrote...

Is this how Star Wars fans felt when they saw the Phantom Menace?

Read my quote above.