2656 réponses à ce sujet

[MarauderESP]

Fireblader70 wrote...

If you can't beat them, join them. The game is gold, pre-orders are massive, impressions from most that have played it are good.

Since there is no way this particular game is going to get 'fixed', ever, I'm choosing to play it and enjoy it. If there's another Mass Effect game announced and it continues with the 'cliche action movie' approach, then an uproar might cause them to think, but... not now. Not unless sales drop sharply, but I doubt that will happen.

yup prettie much the same about da2 sales and..... oh wait..

[Naughty Bear]

We don't need dialogue, this is war remember?

Sorry for the old joke

Man i am gutted about the auto dialogue though.

[Fireblader70]

If you want to compare this game to Dragon Age 2, go ahead, but I honestly don't see it being such a disaster.

In fact, I just passed my driving test, so I'm leaving before any negative waves ruin my moment of euphoria... because, you know, I want to enjoy the game when it comes out

[Subject One]

Matt VT Schlo wrote...

The nerd rage was very intense when ME2 came out; way worse than at present. Way worse

Absolutely right. And as before, even the flaws are real (no ME1 face import) and the changes a bit worrying (more auto dialogue and not neutral options) so far all the impressions of people who has played the game are pretty positive. And most said that dialogue is now different (less 'filler' options, more cinematic approach, some different dialogues depending on your reputation and the remaining ME1/ ME2 survivors...) but not necessarily worse.

So as I've done before I will wait and see. All Bioware games seems to be backlashed here, but sometime I like them a lot (ME2) and sometimes not so much (DA2). So time will tell.

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

So it's like call of duty except sometimes you may choose something?

[MarauderESP]

Fireblader70 wrote...

If you want to compare this game to Dragon Age 2, go ahead, but I honestly don't see it being such a disaster.

In fact, I just passed my driving test, so I'm leaving before any negative waves ruin my moment of euphoria... because, you know, I want to enjoy the game when it comes out

congrats then for the test;)


that is what the da2 devs think at the time, but time will tell.....

have fun and remerber that the  old ladies or the ppl walking on the street dont give points......

[AkiKishi]

Fireblader70 wrote...

If you can't beat them, join them. The game is gold, pre-orders are massive, impressions from most that have played it are good.

Since there is no way this particular game is going to get 'fixed', ever, I'm choosing to play it and enjoy it. If there's another Mass Effect game announced and it continues with the 'cliche action movie' approach, then an uproar might cause them to think, but... not now. Not unless sales drop sharply, but I doubt that will happen.

DA2 had very good pre-orders. After which the game sank like a rock.

While I agree that ME3 is not as bad as DA2. It's been sold on being the sequel to ME2 and people will have certain expectations because of that.
If you get a lot of people selling copies of ME3 quickly then the knock on effect is more used sales and less units sold.

Also we get into the age old sold vs sold through.

[Alex_SM]

brunomalta wrote...

CHALET wrote...

brunomalta wrote...

android654 wrote...

The thing is there's a lot less decision making going on.

Ok...Bad Writing as "Starship Trooper" or "Dragon Age 2" ? lol

At least Starship Troopers wasn't trying to take itself seriously.

Well, the book was...

I assume you didn't read it. Starship Troopers is better written, more ambitious and more subtle, than any Bioware game to date.

Modifié par Alex_SM, 05 mars 2012 - 04:26 .

[Catsith]

Jedi Sentinel Arian wrote...

So it's like call of duty except sometimes you may choose something?

No.

[j78]

they gutted this franchise and turned it into a third person shooter with light rpg elements. Its so sad.

[Itkovian]

Subject One wrote...

Matt VT Schlo wrote...

The nerd rage was very intense when ME2 came out; way worse than at present. Way worse

Absolutely right. And as before, even the flaws are real (no ME1 face import) and the changes a bit worrying (more auto dialogue and not neutral options) so far all the impressions of people who has played the game are pretty positive. And most said that dialogue is now different (less 'filler' options, more cinematic approach, some different dialogues depending on your reputation and the remaining ME1/ ME2 survivors...) but not necessarily worse.

So as I've done before I will wait and see. All Bioware games seems to be backlashed here, but sometime I like them a lot (ME2) and sometimes not so much (DA2). So time will tell.

Well said. Thank you for casting a little bit of Reason in this ocean of hysteria.

Forums always go nuts before release (and for a while after). It's a simple result of a growing fanbase: the more players a game has, the more discontented posters will make thier voices heard on the forum. Since the forum itself does not "grow" with the number of fans, the more it becomes dominated with negative posts.

Fact of life on the internet: public forums have an inherent negative bias that grows with the "poster base".

Itkovian

[Subject One]

Jedi Sentinel Arian wrote...

So it's like call of duty except sometimes you may choose something?

No, I think that it will be more like an interactive adventure with critical choices and extra investigation dialogue options. Basically they have cut the filler options (the ones that doesnt change too much the output at ME1 and 2) and increaded the cinematic feel of the conversations.

Call Of Duty isn't even and adventure (really, someone follows the COD plot?). At least if you want spit your rage use Uncharted as example as others do

[brunomalta]

Alex_SM wrote...

brunomalta wrote...

CHALET wrote...

brunomalta wrote...

android654 wrote...

The thing is there's a lot less decision making going on.

Ok...Bad Writing as "Starship Trooper" or "Dragon Age 2" ? lol

At least Starship Troopers wasn't trying to take itself seriously.

Well, the book was...

I assume you didn't read it. Starship Troopers is better written, more ambitious and more subtle, than any Bioware game to date.

Actually i did and didnt liked it. Militaristic crap for me. But i respect the author and i agree that it is better than all the Bioware games put toguether. But in this case, i was only pointing out that the book is serious and the movie is not....

[KevShep]

Gibb_Shepard wrote...


No one complained about the lack of dialogue interactivity. ME2 actually added more of it.

I kind of took this aspect for granted. I never thought they'd remove it.

Iam the same way. It never occurred to me that they would remove the best thing about the series and its foundation.

[Itkovian]

BobSmith101 wrote...

Fireblader70 wrote...

If you can't beat them, join them. The game is gold, pre-orders are massive, impressions from most that have played it are good.

Since there is no way this particular game is going to get 'fixed', ever, I'm choosing to play it and enjoy it. If there's another Mass Effect game announced and it continues with the 'cliche action movie' approach, then an uproar might cause them to think, but... not now. Not unless sales drop sharply, but I doubt that will happen.

DA2 had very good pre-orders. After which the game sank like a rock.

While I agree that ME3 is not as bad as DA2. It's been sold on being the sequel to ME2 and people will have certain expectations because of that.
If you get a lot of people selling copies of ME3 quickly then the knock on effect is more used sales and less units sold.

Also we get into the age old sold vs sold through.

And ME3 is a lot closer to ME2 than ME2 was to ME1. Just look at the gameplay.

Just because there is more auto-dialogue does not mean it is necessarily worse.

The gameplay itself is clearly superior and includes many more RPG elements that were removed in ME2... and we sitll do not know the extent of auto-dialogue in ME3, nor do we know if it actually negatively impacts the storytelling.

Itkovian

Modifié par Itkovian, 05 mars 2012 - 04:38 .

[phimseto]

Subject One wrote...

Jedi Sentinel Arian wrote...

So it's like call of duty except sometimes you may choose something?

No, I think that it will be more like an interactive adventure with critical choices and extra investigation dialogue options. Basically they have cut the filler options (the ones that doesnt change too much the output at ME1 and 2) and increaded the cinematic feel of the conversations.

Call Of Duty isn't even and adventure (really, someone follows the COD plot?). At least if you want spit your rage use Uncharted as example as others do

What you call "filler" is what a lot of people (myself included) call the stuff that lets us define the story as our story - it's controlling the conversation on the little choices as well as the big decisions, and not being railroaded onto dialogue tracks like ME3 does in a lot of places.  Watching your character react in ways that a. you wouldn't want them to react and b. ways that you know you would have had a chance to define in ME1 and ME2 is a pretty big change and a very negative one.  

[Arkitekt]

Yeah, the Uncharted connection is more interesting.... but will never catch on because Uncharted isn't as hated as CoD.

[Subject One]

j78 wrote...

they gutted this franchise and turned it into a third person shooter with light rpg elements. Its so sad.

Hmmm... the same was said about ME2 for its poor leveling system/ skill trees. Something that is basically improved at ME3, by the way.

But if we have to discuss again what is and what is not RPG (Final Fantasy has not many dialogue options but is JRPG, and blah, blah, blah...) will be very boring.

Bioware changes a lot of things in each release. Sometimes it works and sometimes not. Dialogue is now different, but I won't know if they have dropped the ball until I play the game.

[Rickin10]

Itkovian wrote...

. and we sitll do not know the extent of auto-dialogue in ME3, nor do we know if it actually negatively impacts the storytelling.

Itkovian

People have watched hours of footage and there is substantial auto-dialogue.  Skim back a few pages.

[Eclipse merc]

Fireblader70 wrote...

If you want to compare this game to Dragon Age 2, go ahead, but I honestly don't see it being such a disaster.

In fact, I just passed my driving test, so I'm leaving before any negative waves ruin my moment of euphoria... because, you know, I want to enjoy the game when it comes out

Congrats on passing.

I'm still trying to stay positive even though i'm disappointed.

[phimseto]

Itkovian wrote...


And ME3 is a lot closer to ME2 than ME2 was to ME1. Just look at the gameplay.

Just because there is more auto-dialogue does not mean it is necessarily worse.

The gameplay itself is clearly superior and includes many more RPG elements that were removed in ME2... and we sitll do not know the extent of auto-dialogue in ME3, nor do we know if it actually negatively impacts the storytelling.

Itkovian

In the space of a few hours, I saw

1.  The ME1 Saren evidence/Spectre induction sequence with the Council.
2.  The talk with the Council in ME2.
3.  The initial talk with the Council in ME3 (and the sequences right after it).  

So I can tell you with 100% assurance that yes, autodialogue negatively impacts the storytelling.  Times in 1 and 2 when I could have defined my response were gone, and I found ME3 Shepard doing and saying things that my ME1 and ME2 iteration would not have.  The degree of interaction that gave the earlier games needed nuance are absent, and it shows.

Modifié par phimseto, 05 mars 2012 - 04:44 .

[Hunter of Legends]

android654 wrote...


It's not what I would call horrible, but this particular ending is like something we've seen in Vonnegut novels.

That's a bad thing?

Cat's Cradle and Catch 22 were awesome.

[Subject One]

phimseto wrote...

Subject One wrote...

Jedi Sentinel Arian wrote...

So it's like call of duty except sometimes you may choose something?

No, I think that it will be more like an interactive adventure with critical choices and extra investigation dialogue options. Basically they have cut the filler options (the ones that doesnt change too much the output at ME1 and 2) and increaded the cinematic feel of the conversations.

Call Of Duty isn't even and adventure (really, someone follows the COD plot?). At least if you want spit your rage use Uncharted as example as others do

What you call "filler" is what a lot of people (myself included) call the stuff that lets us define the story as our story - it's controlling the conversation on the little choices as well as the big decisions, and not being railroaded onto dialogue tracks like ME3 does in a lot of places.  Watching your character react in ways that a. you wouldn't want them to react and b. ways that you know you would have had a chance to define in ME1 and ME2 is a pretty big change and a very negative one.  

Maybe you're right. But also there are other changes that I have to experience myself. If the 'little' decissions are now automatic based on your paragon/ renegade reputation to give a more cinematic feel with less static dialogue maybe it won't be as bad. But I don't know If the autodialogue really changes much based on your previous good/ bad reputation or if the cinematic conversations are really a big improvement that balances the loss of options. As I said earlier I will wait and see.

[DatIrishFella]

phimseto wrote...

Itkovian wrote...


And ME3 is a lot closer to ME2 than ME2 was to ME1. Just look at the gameplay.

Just because there is more auto-dialogue does not mean it is necessarily worse.

The gameplay itself is clearly superior and includes many more RPG elements that were removed in ME2... and we sitll do not know the extent of auto-dialogue in ME3, nor do we know if it actually negatively impacts the storytelling.

Itkovian

In the space of a few hours, I saw

1.  The ME1 Saren evidence/Spectre induction sequence with the Council.
2.  The talk with the Council in ME2.
3.  The initial talk with the Council in ME3 (and the sequences right after it).  

So I can tell you with 100% assurance that yes, autodialogue negatively impacts the storytelling.  Times in 1 and 2 when I could have defined my response were gone, and I found ME3 Shepard doing and saying things that my ME1 and ME2 iteration would not have.  The degree of interaction that gave the earlier games needed nuance are absent, and it shows.

I think that's what people are forgetting. You essentially loose control of your Shep to the point were he/she is going to be identical to your other Sheps. 

[Alex_SM]

brunomalta wrote...

Alex_SM wrote...

brunomalta wrote...

CHALET wrote...

brunomalta wrote...

android654 wrote...

The thing is there's a lot less decision making going on.

Ok...Bad Writing as "Starship Trooper" or "Dragon Age 2" ? lol

At least Starship Troopers wasn't trying to take itself seriously.

Well, the book was...

I assume you didn't read it. Starship Troopers is better written, more ambitious and more subtle, than any Bioware game to date.

Actually i did and didnt liked it. Militaristic crap for me. But i respect the author and i agree that it is better than all the Bioware games put toguether. But in this case, i was only pointing out that the book is serious and the movie is not....

Well, in fact the book is the opposite of military crap. It may be the most misunderstood book ever. It's great at describing a terrible society from the eyes of a dumb drone. And was written in a time when Heinlein (who was nearly-anarchist) feared that the USA may  turn into totalitarism in its war against the URSS.