326 réponses à ce sujet

[slimgrin]

MissOuJ wrote...

Waage25 wrote...

What's wrong with the sex in the Witcher series. It is fitting because of the book and the very mature themes that series has it is not afraid to show skin .

To show female skin, you mean.

The Witcher series has always been about pandering for the male audience: the sex card minigame in Witcher 1, and the incredibly creepy and problematic peep show in the Witcher 2 ("Oh, looks like we're trapped. Well, nevermind, let's have sex! Lemme magic all my clothes away and show off my magnificent boobs!"). Only female characters are objectified and shown naked/scantly clad - notice how pretty much everyhting else is fair game except Geralt's junk? Would you feel comfortable seeing that? I don't think so.

Plus, what's so horrible or "immature" about (optional!) cuddling? Especially when you think what kind of things both Shepard and his/her LI have been through?

https://encrypted-tb..._X7lWMBGOsgD_SA

[NPH11]

I'm fine either way. Doesn't make that much of a difference.

If I'm that desperate to see more skin out of the Mass Effect series, well... the internet.

[Cosmar]

In ME1, the sex scene was a lot more revealing...bare bottoms and side boobs. But if you all remember, Bioware got a lot of flack from the non-gaming media and other people for including that in the game. So I think in ME2 and ME3 they purposefully toned it down to scantily clad cuddling to avoid another media ****storm.

[BatmanPWNS]

Does the game even need sex scenes? I sure wouldn't care if they got rid of them.

[someguy1231]

Bioware's "sex scenes" are about as "sexy" as taking two blow-up love dolls and having them awkwardly grope each other. It baffles me and always will baffle me that some ME fans care so much about a few cheesy flirtatious dialogue options and a laughably bad cutscene of dry-humping with a fictional character. If you want porn, just use the internet. That's what it's for, after all.

Oh, and you should've posted this in the romance section. Keep the topics for pathetic lonely nerds who think [ME character here] is their waifu/husbando where they belong.

Modifié par someguy1231, 03 mars 2012 - 07:36 .

[fropas]

BatmanPWNS wrote...

Does the game even need sex scenes? I sure wouldn't care if they got rid of them.

I'm sorry many people seem to be confused. This thread is not about the NEED for sex-scenes in games. They exist, and they are in the game.

This thread was made to ask the question if these scenes needed more sexual "realism."

Many people have said "no we like our romance tasteful." Many say "yes we like our pixelated boobs in the buff."

But saying "you don't need them" seems like a "cop-out" answer to me. but that's just me, because you know they ARE in the game. 

[knightnblu]

MissOuJ wrote...

Waage25 wrote...

What's wrong with the sex in the Witcher series. It is fitting because of the book and the very mature themes that series has it is not afraid to show skin .

To show female skin, you mean.

The Witcher series has always been about pandering for the male audience: the sex card minigame in Witcher 1, and the incredibly creepy and problematic peep show in the Witcher 2 ("Oh, looks like we're trapped. Well, nevermind, let's have sex! Lemme magic all my clothes away and show off my magnificent boobs!"). Only female characters are objectified and shown naked/scantly clad - notice how pretty much everyhting else is fair game except Geralt's junk? Would you feel comfortable seeing that? I don't think so.

Plus, what's so horrible or "immature" about (optional!) cuddling? Especially when you think what kind of things both Shepard and his/her LI have been through?

Also, I'm Scandinavian as well, but I'm also a woman, and really bored of gaming's portrayal of female characters as objects of male titillation. Seriously, breasts aren't that great - I can tell you, I actually have a pair.

You can climb down off of your high horse because women objectify men as well. This isn't a male thing or a female thing. It is a human thing.

[slimgrin]

someguy1231 wrote...


 Keep the topics for pathetic lonely nerds who think [ME character here] is their waifu/husbando where they belong.

Gee that was original. On a gaming site no less.

Modifié par slimgrin, 03 mars 2012 - 07:40 .

[someguy1231]

MissOuJ wrote...
To show female skin, you mean.

The Witcher series has always been about pandering for the male audience: the sex card minigame in Witcher 1, and the incredibly creepy and problematic peep show in the Witcher 2 ("Oh, looks like we're trapped. Well, nevermind, let's have sex! Lemme magic all my clothes away and show off my magnificent boobs!"). Only female characters are objectified and shown naked/scantly clad - notice how pretty much everyhting else is fair game except Geralt's junk? Would you feel comfortable seeing that? I don't think so.

Plus, what's so horrible or "immature" about (optional!) cuddling? Especially when you think what kind of things both Shepard and his/her LI have been through?

What's the air like up there on your high horse?

Oh, and Witcher does in-game romance/sexual encounters far better than anything Bioware has ever done. And given my well-known distaste for dating-sims, that's really saying something.

Modifié par someguy1231, 03 mars 2012 - 07:44 .

[fropas]

someguy1231 wrote...

Oh, and you should've posted this in the romance section. Keep the topics for pathetic lonely nerds who think [ME character here] is their waifu/husbando where they belong.

Sry I wasn't even aware there was a "romance" discussion forum. But then again I'm not some lonely pathetic nerd who spends his time trolling discussion threads .

[OdanUrr]

Ah, yes, the evolution...

[SpectreSaren]

They're rated E for everybody.

The sex scenes are about as racy as two Krogans giving head bumps to each other.

[MissOuJ]

knightnblu wrote...

MissOuJ wrote...

To show female skin, you mean.

The Witcher series has always been about pandering for the male audience: the sex card minigame in Witcher 1, and the incredibly creepy and problematic peep show in the Witcher 2 ("Oh, looks like we're trapped. Well, nevermind, let's have sex! Lemme magic all my clothes away and show off my magnificent boobs!"). Only female characters are objectified and shown naked/scantly clad - notice how pretty much everyhting else is fair game except Geralt's junk? Would you feel comfortable seeing that? I don't think so.

You can climb down off of your high horse because women objectify men as well. This isn't a male thing or a female thing. It is a human thing.

Male sexual objectification isn't institutionalised, or indeed have such a wide representation in the media - games or otherwise.

Name one game where any of the male characters has been anywhere near as sexually objectified as Triss is IN W2. Or any game where there's quite as much detail is put to camera angles to showcase the characters physique as there is in ME2 with Miranda.

Institutionalised female sexual objectification is a fact, and it's represented in all forms of media. Male sexual objectification - not so much. Seriously, if you want male sexual objectification, check Tom of Finland.

[slimgrin]

MissOuJ, you shouldn't talk of The Witcher as you are clearly unfamiliar with it, and it's not worth my time to correct you. Maybe it could be that there are different definitions of what is sexy or appropriate? And yours just happens to be WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY conservative.

Modifié par slimgrin, 03 mars 2012 - 08:01 .

[fropas]

Alright, thread moved:

http://social.biowar...5/index/9603424

continue discussion or don't.

I'm ready for LOCKDOWN mods.

Edit: OdanUrr that's a very amusing picture, I'm glad to see others noticed the "transition" in ME sex scenes as well.

Modifié par fropas, 03 mars 2012 - 08:00 .

[MissOuJ]

someguy1231 wrote...

MissOuJ wrote...
To show female skin, you mean.

The Witcher series has always been about pandering for the male audience: the sex card minigame in Witcher 1, and the incredibly creepy and problematic peep show in the Witcher 2 ("Oh, looks like we're trapped. Well, nevermind, let's have sex! Lemme magic all my clothes away and show off my magnificent boobs!"). Only female characters are objectified and shown naked/scantly clad - notice how pretty much everyhting else is fair game except Geralt's junk? Would you feel comfortable seeing that? I don't think so.

Plus, what's so horrible or "immature" about (optional!) cuddling? Especially when you think what kind of things both Shepard and his/her LI have been through?

What's the air like up there on your high horse?

Oh, and Witcher does in-game romance/sexual encounters far better than anything Bioware has ever done. And given my well-known distaste for dating-sims, that's really saying something.

I love how people accuse me of having a hauty attitude when I point out the way sexual representation in games treats female and male characters unequally. But hey, it's not like we need to change our attitude about sexism or gender politics in gaming or anyting! <_<

And no, it does not. The only thing I can think of (as in, representing romance well) is how his romance with Triss might affect Geralt's choice later in the game, but that's the old "choose between your loved one or the 'greater good'" which, as relationship tropes go, is older than dirt and only serves to victimise female characters, so I wouldn't call it better, by any definition of the term.

But, you know, **** girls opinnion on gaming's representation of sexuality and female characters! Boys club and all...

[bennyjammin79]

There was supposed to be a full penetration mini-game available as DLC on day one but it got scrapped since everybody handled "From Ashes" so intelligently.

[Impulse and Compulse]

It's tough.

On one hand, it feels like kind of a letdown to have built up such a relationship with a character only to have the most graphic scenes involve a 5-second clip of someone take their shirt off. (which doesn't even happen in about 2/3 of them)

On the other, I think Bioware doesn't want to make it too graphic, especially with the whole fiasco started over ME1. And of course, artistic choice and all the stuff.

I'd still hope to have at least somewhere around ME1-levels, but longer than 5 seconds.

[MrnDvlDg161]

Funny thing is, you know these media outlets who railed and whined, most of the TV show line ups on their very channels show far worse and get away with far worse ... just interesting hypocrisy at best.

Though I understand the balance between PR issues and game media because there is still a strong stigma that when people hear " Video Game" it automatically involves children or kid oriented and so the red flags and such go up.

...but like someone else also mentioned... ok... so your going to gripe and spew about shadowy love scenes and quick flashes of skin but its ok for your 10 year old to mindlessly play Modern Warfare online in which he's learning the different methods to kill someone else using modern weapons ---- so no, he's not getting the side boob, but he can at least identify that at SCAR rifle can have a Red Dot or ACOG scope attachment and that placing claymore mines in strategic areas will greatly increase the amount of death it can achieve from an invading squad.

Yeah. Right.

[fropas]

MissOuJ wrote...

someguy1231 wrote...

MissOuJ wrote...
To show female skin, you mean.

The Witcher series has always been about pandering for the male audience: the sex card minigame in Witcher 1, and the incredibly creepy and problematic peep show in the Witcher 2 ("Oh, looks like we're trapped. Well, nevermind, let's have sex! Lemme magic all my clothes away and show off my magnificent boobs!"). Only female characters are objectified and shown naked/scantly clad - notice how pretty much everyhting else is fair game except Geralt's junk? Would you feel comfortable seeing that? I don't think so.

Plus, what's so horrible or "immature" about (optional!) cuddling? Especially when you think what kind of things both Shepard and his/her LI have been through?

What's the air like up there on your high horse?

Oh, and Witcher does in-game romance/sexual encounters far better than anything Bioware has ever done. And given my well-known distaste for dating-sims, that's really saying something.

I love how people accuse me of having a hauty attitude when I point out the way sexual representation in games treats female and male characters unequally. But hey, it's not like we need to change our attitude about sexism or gender politics in gaming or anyting! <_<

And no, it does not. The only thing I can think of (as in, representing romance well) is how his romance with Triss might affect Geralt's choice later in the game, but that's the old "choose between your loved one or the 'greater good'" which, as relationship tropes go, is older than dirt and only serves to victimise female characters, so I wouldn't call it better, by any definition of the term.

But, you know, **** girls opinnion on gaming's representation of sexuality and female characters! Boys club and all...

Not everyone thinks that way, but if girls like you never speak up, I don't know how things are ever going to change in this industry.

Female objectification is so ingrained in my masculine synapses that I never even noticed how right you are about the CLICHES present in the Witcher 2's approach to casual sex. 

Elven hooker you save from the fire: "Oh Geralt you saved me. There must be some way I can reward you."

Ves: "You showed me what a BIG STRONG MAN you are by not taking it easy on me. Let's have sex!"

Succubus: "please don't turn me into the fantasy-police. I'll make it worth your while."

Thanks Missouj. I'll try to keep in mind that women don't actually act, like this, WILLINGLY. 
And I'll try to notice these objectifying cliches (which "someguy" and "slimgrin" have no problem with) in other games  

Modifié par fropas, 03 mars 2012 - 08:20 .

[ZLurps]

I for one liked the way ME1 did the "romance" scenes. I never had any other LI other than Liara in ME2 so I don't know how exactly they went, but I have seen some screen caps and I don't feel trying romances in ME2 anymore.

Fade to black and cuddling sounds good though.

I think reason why sex was presented using in game engine in ME2 was because there were so many characters PC could have sexual relationship. Perhaps not enough time or budget to pre-render them, perhaps not enough space on disc. Anyway, I think they did it the way they did because they had to.

What comes to Witcher, I have played first one through, I have not finished Witcher 2 but IMO they are male fantasy and female characters are portrayed from that perspective.

That's not to say they are "wrong" and I'm not one to judge romance novels female audience reads either. It's just that there aren't many choices for women gamers as there are for males.

EDIT:

I meant that as male, I might find it difficult to immerse myself in ME if about every male in Normandy would dress like they were from Tom of Finland. That doesn't mean I have anything against homosexuals.

Modifié par ZLurps, 03 mars 2012 - 08:20 .

[MissOuJ]

fropas wrote...

MissOuJ wrote...

But, you know, **** girls opinnion on gaming's representation of sexuality and female characters! Boys club and all...

Not everyone thinks that way, but if girls like you never speak up, I don't know how things are ever going to change in this industry.

Female objectification is so ingrained in my masculine synapses that I never even noticed how right you are about the CLICHES present in the Witcher 2's approach to casual sex. 

Elven hooker you save from the fire: "Oh Geralt you saved me. There must be some way I can reward you."

Ves: "You showed me what a BIG STRONG MAN you are by not taking it easy on me. Let's have sex!"

Succubus: "please don't turn me into the fantasy-police. I'll make it worth your while."

Thanks Missouj. I'll try to keep in mind that women don't actually act, like this, WILLINGLY. 
And I'll try to notice these objectifying cliches (which "someguy" and "slimgrin" have no problem with) in other games  

Thank you so much for this comment. It is nice to see people listen and take me seriously as a female gamer, and not just be told to "get over it" or that I "don't understand" games/gaming/sexuality/my own gender!

Thank you!



Edit

@ ZLurps I completely agree with you. Yes, there are deffinetly problems with both female and male presentation in romance literature aimed at women (there's a mountain of wrong in the Twilight series alone), and it shouldn't go unchallenged. My point is, we should portray both relationships and sex in a tasteful manner, and when it fails to do so, inspect what went wrong.

Modifié par MissOuJ, 03 mars 2012 - 08:45 .

[fropas]

np Missouj. A mature opinion is much appreciated when the subject of sex is being discussed. I'm surprised how classy BSN has been in this thread--six pages and only a handful of masturbation jokes.

Stay classy BSN.

[Mendelevosa]

So I see you get turned on by naked animated characters....

[mi55ion]

as a female playing femShep all the way, and having only one LI throughout all the playthoughs, Liara, I can honestly say that the ME1 scenes were tasteful and well presented (well the one i had + others I saw on vids) just enough of flashes and skin to trigger the 'dirty mind' subset, with just enough time to actually believe the Shepard character is a real being with feelings and all) then equally quickly wiped clean with a rifle in the hand ready to kick some geth circuitry to oblivion.

As stated previously, my femShep still had the thing for Liara and would not even consider anyone else (thus I never got either of the achievements - but was glad to see Liara was 'spoken for' in the DLC) but the vids pretty much showed the decline from tasteful to just plain 'filler'. This makes me think that ME3 scenes should go back to the way they made ME1 scenes, even the scene with the Consort was very masterfully made sexy without showing anything but a palm and a glimpse of a naked wrist implying the nudity and not of the "let me keep half my clothes on". Thus in retrospect, better to have a scene like that where it's up to the viewer to decide whether they are naked or not, whether they are naked baking cookies or having sex then to make the dry humping and clothed scenes without imagination and dull to say the least.