37 réponses à ce sujet

[Dovahzaan]

I was browsing the internet and saw this post :

"Is Shepard the worst mass murderer ever?
The Universe is 14 billlion years old. Let's say it needed like 4 billion years to breed life. 10 billion left.
Every cycle lasts 50 000 years.
10 000 000 000 : 50 000 = 200 000 cycles.
There are currently around 7 billion humans alive. Okay, let's pretent, that every cycle breeds 3 species (In Mass Effect 1,2 and 3 there are 7) with 7 billion members of every species.
200 000 cycles multiplied by 3 and 7 billion
200 000 x 3 x 7 000 000 000 = 4.2E15
If you choose to destroy the Reapers you kill 4.2E15 People for 7 species."

Your thoughts?

[Halo Quea]

If anything the endings have made Shepard's role in the universe TOO IMPORTANT. It's almost like he becomes the center of galaxy, the taker and/or giver of life. Nothing in the saga really foreshadowed him being THIS important. A key player? Yes, but not the man at the galaxy's end deciding EVERYONE ELSE'S fate.

Despite being resurrected, Shepard's not a particularly enlightened character. This is ironic given all of his involvements with galactic culture/politics, the protheon cipher, and his unexplored after-life experience. I'm not saying he's unintelligent, just that he doesn't quite cut it as the guy who should have access to the "awesome" magic button. lol

But there it is, Shepard is the one who gets to decide who lives, who dies and everything else in between. I personally think that these ending place this character way out of his element.

[Dovahzaan]

Halo Quea wrote...

It's almost like he becomes the center of galaxy, the taker and/or giver of life. 

BioWare gave Shepard the role of god. Nothing more, nothing less.
Hell, he even dies so the rest can live on. It's the classical Jesus story...just like LOST.

[f1ndmenow]

I could see Shepard being many things heroic or bad-ass, but a religious savior that everyone thinks can fix their problems? Well yah, but if so why the heck these end choices seem like the lady and the tiger. The story where a hero is place in a tough situation where he fallen in love with a princess. However the father says heck no and places him in a scenero where he chooses a door thats either a tiger going to eat him, or a woman he will force to marry. Thats basicly what is the mass effect endings, limited and forcful choice making.

Modifié par f1ndmenow, 03 mars 2012 - 06:30 .

[AkiKishi]

Yes if it was open choice it would have been better to leave clues like the Protheans did and let the Reapers do their thing.

[DarthLaxian]

well, who tells you, that someone who has been made into a reaper-part is even alive in a conventional sense?

i do not presume so - even more, if your own well being is in danger you are allowed to harm and even kill others IMHO, so:

get this reaper bastards!

greets LAX

[Halo Quea]

Dovahzaan wrote...

Halo Quea wrote...

It's almost like he becomes the center of galaxy, the taker and/or giver of life. 

BioWare gave Shepard the role of god. Nothing more, nothing less.
Hell, he even dies so the rest can live on. It's the classical Jesus story...just like LOST.

Oh no, not the Jesus references again.  <_<

Listen, can you honestly say that you see Shepard in the role of God of the Galaxy?

I mean you remember playing Mass Effect 1 don't you?   I remember the opening moments of that game and the first time I saw my Shepard's customized face when the Normandy made it's relay jump.  I'm sorry, but looking back on that game and Shepard's beginnings........................well I just didn't see him as a galactic god who would one day decide who lives and who dies in the entire galaxy.

Either I wasn't paying attention in ME1&2, or I just missed the dramatic evolution of Shepard's character that placed him in this godlike position.

[HoonDing]

[LilyasAvalon]

Is it murder when you go to war and kill your enemy?

An interesting note from Code Geass. On the street, they put you behind bars for killing a man. On the battlefield, they give you medals.

[Dovahzaan]

Halo Quea wrote...

Either I wasn't paying attention in ME1&2, or I just missed the dramatic evolution of Shepard's character that placed him in this godlike position.

I'm talking about the ending. If you have the power to coose who lives and who not, you're something like god. 
And it doesn't help, that Shepard raised from the dead. Like Jesus.

[AkiKishi]

Halo Quea wrote...

Dovahzaan wrote...

Halo Quea wrote...

It's almost like he becomes the center of galaxy, the taker and/or giver of life. 

BioWare gave Shepard the role of god. Nothing more, nothing less.
Hell, he even dies so the rest can live on. It's the classical Jesus story...just like LOST.

Oh no, not the Jesus references again.  <_<

Listen, can you honestly say that you see Shepard in the role of God of the Galaxy?

I mean you remember playing Mass Effect 1 don't you?   I remember the opening moments of that game and the first time I saw my Shepard's customized face when the Normandy made it's relay jump.  I'm sorry, but looking back on that game and Shepard's beginnings........................well I just didn't see him as a galactic god who would one day decide who lives and who dies in the entire galaxy.

Either I wasn't paying attention in ME1&2, or I just missed the dramatic evolution of Shepard's character that placed him in this godlike position.

In the prologue they call him "The Shepard".

Now whether they just pulled that out of thier butts at some point or whether they named him Shepard for a reason.

[seirhart]

Halo Quea wrote...

Dovahzaan wrote...

Halo Quea wrote...

It's almost like he becomes the center of galaxy, the taker and/or giver of life. 

BioWare gave Shepard the role of god. Nothing more, nothing less.
Hell, he even dies so the rest can live on. It's the classical Jesus story...just like LOST.

Oh no, not the Jesus references again.  <_<

Listen, can you honestly say that you see Shepard in the role of God of the Galaxy?

I mean you remember playing Mass Effect 1 don't you?   I remember the opening moments of that game and the first time I saw my Shepard's customized face when the Normandy made it's relay jump.  I'm sorry, but looking back on that game and Shepard's beginnings........................well I just didn't see him as a galactic god who would one day decide who lives and who dies in the entire galaxy.

Either I wasn't paying attention in ME1&2, or I just missed the dramatic evolution of Shepard's character that placed him in this godlike position.

But that is exactly what ea and bioware have done though, they have turned shepard into this god like being who everyone turns to whether they want to or not to save them and if it requires him killing a few thousand or more people to save the rest of the galaxy then so be. Because in the end  if shepard survives I'd bet 100 percent that they will absolutely do nothing to him, as a matter of fact I wouldn't be surprised if people started worshipping him, shoot even make a cult/religion after him.

@Dovhasan 

exactly it also doesn't help that he died and was brought back to save the galaxy again from the reapers. It aslo doesn't help that he is the end all be all of every civilazation that he decides who lives and who dies

Modifié par seirhart, 03 mars 2012 - 06:34 .

[Halo Quea]

Dovahzaan wrote...

Halo Quea wrote...

Either I wasn't paying attention in ME1&2, or I just missed the dramatic evolution of Shepard's character that placed him in this godlike position.

I'm talking about the ending. If you have the power to coose who lives and who not, you're something like god. 
And it doesn't help, that Shepard raised from the dead. Like Jesus.

The circumstances behind Shepard's first death was a ridiculous plot mechanism that was used to place him under the dubious auspicies of TIM, thus faciliting his time with Cerberus and the O4R mission.  An UN-NEEDED death I might add, TIM could have just as easily made his offer to a living Shepard who couldn't get help from the Council or the Alliance.   It was just cheap shock value, don't make more out of it than what it was.

Secondly, Shepard's resurrection remains a source of confusion for those of us who still wonder why his DOCTOR who spent two years re-building him suddenly wanted him dead.  Indeed the person who was responsible for his "rising from the dead" received a bullet to the brain from Miranda.  I'm not sure what spiritual analogy can be made out of that,  but it doesn't make sense to start reaching for "Jesus" in THIS scenario.

[Halo Quea]

seirhart wrote...

Halo Quea wrote...

Dovahzaan wrote...

Halo Quea wrote...

It's almost like he becomes the center of galaxy, the taker and/or giver of life. 

BioWare gave Shepard the role of god. Nothing more, nothing less.
Hell, he even dies so the rest can live on. It's the classical Jesus story...just like LOST.

Oh no, not the Jesus references again.  <_<

Listen, can you honestly say that you see Shepard in the role of God of the Galaxy?

I mean you remember playing Mass Effect 1 don't you?   I remember the opening moments of that game and the first time I saw my Shepard's customized face when the Normandy made it's relay jump.  I'm sorry, but looking back on that game and Shepard's beginnings........................well I just didn't see him as a galactic god who would one day decide who lives and who dies in the entire galaxy.

Either I wasn't paying attention in ME1&2, or I just missed the dramatic evolution of Shepard's character that placed him in this godlike position.

But that is exactly what ea and bioware have done though, they have turned shepard into this god like being who everyone turns to whether they want to or not to save them and if it requires him killing a few thousand or more people to save the rest of the galaxy then so be. Because in the end  if shepard survives I'd bet 100 percent that they will absolutely do nothing to him, as a matter of fact I wouldn't be surprised if people started worshipping him, shoot even make a cult/religion after him.

"Shepard...........hallowed be thy name"      It sounds even more ridiculous when you look at it that way.

[Pottumuusi]

Well of course Shepard is the center of everything and of course he should be.

If someone was more important than him then they should be the main character/player character.

[ManualReplica]

Adolf/Josef Shepard.

[Big I]

Shepard already has a bodycount in the hundreds of thousands not counting the Reapers.

304,000 people in the Bahak system.
However many krogan tankbred there were in Saren's breeding facility (at least hundreds, likely thousands).
A personal body count in the thousands (based on there being enemies in the hundreds in his missions).
However many Collectors there were on the Collector Base.

Furthermore Shepard can choose to take out a lot more. Notable instances include:
Letting the civilian part of the colony die in the N7: Javelin Missile mission (thousands)
Blowing up Heretic Station (2.4 million mobile platforms).
Not taking the Control ending and sacrificing the inhabitants of the Citadel (about 13.2 million)
Sacrificing the Migrant Fleet (17 million)
Sacrificing the geth (hard to say, but tens of millions of mobile platforms at least).

Bascially Shepard is the deadliest non-Reaper lifeform in the galaxy.

[100k]

Halo Quea wrote...

If anything the endings have made Shepard's role in the universe TOO IMPORTANT. It's almost like he becomes the center of galaxy, the taker and/or giver of life. Nothing in the saga really foreshadowed him being THIS important. A key player? Yes, but not the man at the galaxy's end deciding EVERYONE ELSE'S fate.

Agreed. One of the things I don't like about ME3 is that Shepard is (seemingly) acting as the sole diplomat, supersoldier, scientist, and explorer all in one. Hacketts tells Shep to build alliances... why the hell is that Shepard's responsibility? Why not an off-world Alliance commitee? Why would the salarians go to war with the krogan if Shepard doesn't intervene (especially when the reapers plan to wipe out all galatic life)? Why can't Shepard be on a secret mission involving smaller or more subtle methods of defeating the reapers, rather than being the main guy at ever major conflict the galaxy has to offer?

[Carnage752]

Shepard is nothing more than a catalyst to all this stuff. All he does is merely borrow other people's power or redirect it. Jesus (Allegedly) had his own power. Shepard simply puts other peoples power to better use.

[100k]

LookingGlass93 wrote...

Shepard already has a bodycount in the hundreds of thousands not counting the Reapers.

304,000 people in the Bahak system.
However many krogan tankbred there were in Saren's breeding facility (at least hundreds, likely thousands).
A personal body count in the thousands (based on there being enemies in the hundreds in his missions).
However many Collectors there were on the Collector Base.

Furthermore Shepard can choose to take out a lot more. Notable instances include:
Letting the civilian part of the colony die in the N7: Javelin Missile mission (thousands)
Blowing up Heretic Station (2.4 million mobile platforms).
Not taking the Control ending and sacrificing the inhabitants of the Citadel (about 13.2 million)
Sacrificing the Migrant Fleet (17 million)
Sacrificing the geth (hard to say, but tens of millions of mobile platforms at least).

Bascially Shepard is the deadliest non-Reaper lifeform in the galaxy.

Well, lets be reasonable for  a second:

The krogan killed on Virimire are under Kirahee's kill count, not Shepard's.

Heretic station should be split between Legion and Shepard.

But yeah. Shepard's pretty deadly. Still, TIM has a body count that's easily in the 400,000+ range. Saren's is probably somewhere around that number as well.  

[Halo Quea]

100k wrote...

Halo Quea wrote...

If anything the endings have made Shepard's role in the universe TOO IMPORTANT. It's almost like he becomes the center of galaxy, the taker and/or giver of life. Nothing in the saga really foreshadowed him being THIS important. A key player? Yes, but not the man at the galaxy's end deciding EVERYONE ELSE'S fate.

Agreed. One of the things I don't like about ME3 is that Shepard is (seemingly) acting as the sole diplomat, supersoldier, scientist, and explorer all in one. Hacketts tells Shep to build alliances... why the hell is that Shepard's responsibility? Why not an off-world Alliance commitee? Why would the salarians go to war with the krogan if Shepard doesn't intervene (especially when the reapers plan to wipe out all galatic life)? Why can't Shepard be on a secret mission involving smaller or more subtle methods of defeating the reapers, rather than being the main guy at ever major conflict the galaxy has to offer?

Wow, you're making way too much sense right now.    

But I agree, there's just too much going.   The only conflict that makes sense is the Geth and the Quarians.   Everyone else has been grumbling against each other but peacefully.  Until now.    The fact that these people need Shepard to come in and remind them of what's important (like Galactic Extermination)  is absolutely nutty.

Modifié par Halo Quea, 03 mars 2012 - 07:30 .

[VelvetStraitjacket]

I'd rather has a mass murderer than a dead Shep lol I'm just shallow and selfish like that.

[seirhart]

how is it nutty that shepard is the go to guy/girl on everything, the way I see it is that shepard is well known as a diplomat/bully and that they would much rather deal/negotiate with shepard than some diplomat. It makes perfect since for me, send the one guy/girl who is trying to unite the galaxy to go and settle the disputes that have been festering underneath the surface.