28 réponses à ce sujet

[ShadowAudsley]

From what I hear about the endings doesn't bother me. people saying not buying game I have been ripped off I have seen films and tv shows which were bad take stargate universe put crew in stasis the end. I love this series new trailer looks epic I can't wait .

[Hyrist]

Simple: People want control. And the endings are to similar without an epilougue that details the differences for them, so they feel as if they were denied control.

There is also the camp that wants to have an ending that leaves Shepard with his crew, regardless of the situation. I sympathize with this desire but I don't find it necessary to have a satisfying ending.

A ending wrap up overview like Dragon Age:Origins would be my biggest standing request. Doesn't matter to me that the relays are down, I still want a small idea how things wind up.

[ShadowAudsley]

If my Shepard and Normandy survive I will be happy. story could continue though dlc which I would be happy to buy its science fiction anything is possible.

[Jackal7713]

ShadowAudsley wrote...

From what I hear about the endings doesn't bother me. people saying not buying game I have been ripped off I have seen films and tv shows which were bad take stargate universe put crew in stasis the end. I love this series new trailer looks epic I can't wait .

I happy for you that you don't think the endings are that bad. However, since I played Deus Ex: HR , I noticed Bioware has really ripped off a lot from that games ending. The three chioces are almost a mirror of what Deus Ex did.

[KBomb]

You don't have to see it or understand it. If you're happy with it, the kudos to you. I would like more to choose from instead of “Bad, Really Bad and wtf?” It also doesn't seem like a definitive ending, as they promised. At least the crashed Normandy doesn't. The implications of the survived crew's life is dismal at best, horrific at worst. Also: space magic.

[ShadowAudsley]

Everything takes ideas from different media sources I have seen stargate episodes have similar story to star trek. Stargate universe took the visual ideas from battlestar galactica which you see from watching.

I with regards to the Normandy there is episodes of tv shows from star trek deep space nine, andromeda stargate universe where the same thing happens and the story seems to continue 

Modifié par ShadowAudsley, 03 mars 2012 - 07:38 .

[MythicLegands]

Because they're bad (and not in a good way).

[AkiKishi]

It's supposed to be a game with multiple endings not one ending with different themes.

[XX55XX]

There is zero closure, unlike DAO, with the final title cards.

[Siegdrifa]

"I can't see why people don't like the endings?"

Because they don't share your opinion, vision, interpretation, expectation ont this matter.

Modifié par Siegdrifa, 03 mars 2012 - 07:41 .

[AgitatedLemon]

Sparatus wrote...

Here are the problems with the endings.

*They all achieve the same thing. The relays are destroyed, galactic society crumbles, and the Normandy is stranded far, far away from everyone else.

*They do not provide any form of closure for any of the characters. Because they are either stranded on Earth, or planet Contrivance.

*They render our choices pointless. Why should I worry about the genophage backfiring and the krogan going on a rampage? Who gives a crap! They are trapped in their own system again!

This, in a nutshell.

[Jackal7713]

ShadowAudsley wrote...

Everything takes ideas from different media sources I have seen stargate episodes have similar story to star trek. Stargate universe took the visual ideas from battlestar galactica which you see from watching.

See that is the answer that promotes this kind of stuff. Oh other people do it, so it must be ok if I do it too. Its like being caught cheating on a college exam, just because you saw someone else doing it. Then saying to the Prof, "oh well, I thought it was cool, cause other people were doing it." Its total BS

Not to mention, Bioware premoted this game as " all your chioce over three games will matter."

Modifié par Jackal7713, 03 mars 2012 - 07:48 .

[KBomb]

ShadowAudsley wrote...

Everything takes ideas from different media sources I have seen stargate episodes have similar story to star trek. Stargate universe took the visual ideas from battlestar galactica which you see from watching.

I with regards to the Normandy there is episodes of tv shows from star trek deep space nine, andromeda stargate universe where the same thing happens and the story seems to continue 

 
Oh, I am sure the story will continue. If it does continue, they will either starve to death if there is no viable food source, or die out if they choose not to breed. Otherwise, they'll set up a Bedrock Utopia where they live like the Flintstones and breed copiously until the gene pool is filled with slobbering lunatics that look like Picasso paintings.

[Mr.House]

The endings blow.

[Canned Bullets]

Because every thing Shepard has worked for is pointless. Even if you're a full Paragon or a full Renegade it won't matter because the endings are the same and crap.

[Hyrist]

Sparatus wrote...

Here are the problems with the endings.

*They all achieve the same thing. The relays are destroyed, galactic society crumbles, and the Normandy is stranded far, far away from everyone else.

*They do not provide any form of closure for any of the characters. Because they are either stranded on Earth, or planet Contrivance.

*They render our choices pointless. Why should I worry about the genophage backfiring and the krogan going on a rampage? Who gives a crap! They are trapped in their own system again!

All of this could be addressed with an Epilogue though.

Relays being destroyed does not mean the end of civilization, though the reunification of the Galaxy would take quite a few years. Does not mean it collapses.

Characters being stranded to live out their lives on planet nowhere is closure, just not the closure you want. Their fates are pretty well decided at that point.

An an Epilogue would tell you, hey, did curing the Genophage cause the Krogan to develop a culture, or cause constant war with themselves? Did FAKING the Genophage cure cause the Krogan to die out on their planet once it was isolated?

Same issues with Rannoch, even more so cause if you sided with the Geth and then chose the destory ending, what happens to the remaining Quarians?


Then there is Sol system, and the fact that there was an aweful lot of aliens in the system when the Relays went boom. What was the political implications of your choice on earth? How did your decission and insterellar relations filter in when everyone winds up having to colinize one star system until a solution could be figured out?

There is plenty our choices could effect - but Bioware diddn't elaborate where they should have, IMO.

[upsettingshorts]

"They all achieve the same thing" and "They render our choices pointless" could be said of every BioWare game ever made, especially ones in universes they clearly plan on revisiting.  BioWare has always provided the illusion of choice and mostly uniform final consequence. 

You also seem to contradict "they don't provide any closure" by saying what happens to them.

It seems what they've done is a clear setup for the next installment in the Mass Effect universe taking place far in the future, which is fine by me, because it lets them tell stories that aren't overburdened by our choices to the extent that trying to reconcile everyones games becomes a complete disaster.

For an example of how trying to account for everyone's choices in future installments is a mess, see the I DEMAND OLD GOD BABY PROTAGONIST IN DRAGON AGE and BUT I DIDNT DO THE DARK RITUAL on the DA boards.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 03 mars 2012 - 07:52 .

[I_Jedi]

Hyrist wrote...

Sparatus wrote...

Here are the problems with the endings.

*They all achieve the same thing. The relays are destroyed, galactic society crumbles, and the Normandy is stranded far, far away from everyone else.

*They do not provide any form of closure for any of the characters. Because they are either stranded on Earth, or planet Contrivance.

*They render our choices pointless. Why should I worry about the genophage backfiring and the krogan going on a rampage? Who gives a crap! They are trapped in their own system again!

All of this could be addressed with an Epilogue though.

Relays being destroyed does not mean the end of civilization, though the reunification of the Galaxy would take quite a few years. Does not mean it collapses.

Characters being stranded to live out their lives on planet nowhere is closure, just not the closure you want. Their fates are pretty well decided at that point.

An an Epilogue would tell you, hey, did curing the Genophage cause the Krogan to develop a culture, or cause constant war with themselves? Did FAKING the Genophage cure cause the Krogan to die out on their planet once it was isolated?

Same issues with Rannoch, even more so cause if you sided with the Geth and then chose the destory ending, what happens to the remaining Quarians?


Then there is Sol system, and the fact that there was an aweful lot of aliens in the system when the Relays went boom. What was the political implications of your choice on earth? How did your decission and insterellar relations filter in when everyone winds up having to colinize one star system until a solution could be figured out?

There is plenty our choices could effect - but Bioware diddn't elaborate where they should have, IMO.

The Relays are not rebuilt due to severe technophobia.
Indeed.
They're doomed anyway.
Dead.
Nothing. Interstellar culture is totally destroyed.

[Hyrist]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

"They all achieve the same thing" and "They render our choices pointless" could be said of every BioWare game ever made, especially ones in universes they clearly plan on revisiting.

You also seem to contradict "they don't provide any closure" by saying what happens to them.

It seems what they've done is a clear setup for the next installment in the Mass Effect universe taking place far in the future, which is fine by me, because it lets them tell stories that aren't overburdened by our choices to the extent that trying to reconcile everyones games becomes a complete disaster.

The problem I see with the next game is that, even if it takes place in the far future, the choices made are still going ot have a huge impact, unless they force a canon choice (Like the Destory Ending) on the universe.

Merge ending, Geth/Quarian debate, Genophage, Rachni, etc all potentially have tremendous effect on the Galaxy in the long-long term.

I_Jedi wrote...

The Relays are not rebuilt due to severe technophobia.
Indeed.
They're doomed anyway.
Dead.
Nothing. Interstellar culture is totally destroyed.

Diddn't realize you wrote for Bioware - we can blame these endings on you then, right?

Modifié par Hyrist, 03 mars 2012 - 07:54 .

[upsettingshorts]

Unless handwavium, which becomes easier the more time they have to work with.

"How did the Geth disappear from the galaxy in 3 years" (if you sided with them and didn't pick Destroy)

versus

"How did the Geth disappear from the galaxy in a thousand years?"

Are totally different questions, the latter being much easier to answer.

[Hyrist]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Unless handwavium, which becomes easier the more time they have to work with.

"How did the Geth disappear from the galaxy in 3 years" (if you sided with them and didn't pick Destroy)

versus

"How did the Geth disappear from the galaxy in a thousand years?"

Are totally different questions, the latter being much easier to answer.

True, the Geth's ultimate goal was to merge into a Dyson's sphere, and the Krogan were already adapting beyond the Genophage before it was modified.

Good catch.

[upsettingshorts]

Sparatus wrote...

Even in Origins we learned what the hell our choices did to the world at large. Yeah, Gaider and the other writers are setting a canon path, but they still had the decency to allow us to see what our actions caused.

Archdemon still dead.  

Epilogue slides are apocryphal.  Word of God says so.

Sparatus wrote... 

Compared to Mass Effect 3's ending where we really don't know what happens to anyone other than "stranded" or the consequences of our actions because "no relays"

Maybe they want to leave that to future games/media?  

I really do not understand this obsessive desire for paragraph blurbs detailing how X led to Y.  I didn't miss them in Dragon Age 2, either.  

All the epilogue sliders did for me - taking Orzammar for example - was show me that if they ever do another game in Orzammar they won't be able to support both choices so it doesn't matter either.  I'd rather it be open so they can revisit it rather than lock themselves in to some canon in a paragraph.  We're never going to go back there and see Bhelan's Orzammar or Harrowmont's Orzammar, because both would have to be fully supported or people would be tearing their hair out.  At best we'll go back to find out the next king who is totally different from both of them will be there.

It seems tied in to this idea that players want to meticulously construct their idea of the perfect ending to their character setting up the perfect universe - confirmed to them via epilogues - they want to see through metagaming, and are angry when BioWare doesn't allow them to do this.  They never realize how totally unreasonable an expectation this is.

"Supporting choice" when it comes to end states has way more negative consequences for future installments than people ****ing about a lack of it like to realize or accept.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 03 mars 2012 - 08:05 .

[Hyrist]

 

"Supporting choice" when it comes to end states has way more negative consequences for future installments than people ****ing about a lack of it like to realize or accept.

I like this human...

However, as much as I understand your desire againt the slides due to writers eventually pinning themselves in a corner with ever branching paths - it's a nice dream, should games become a service, to be able to have a game that has a sort of continuity based enirely on your decissions.

We'd have to have a subscription based game to support something like that, though - and still your decissions would have to be muted a little in order to keep the work load on a sane level.

But as you said before, wavium can be utalized with a large enough time span. It would be great for us - at this stage of the IP, to receive a bit of extra closure, even if the branching paths are eventually merged again (like how Anderson quit his job as Councilor). Just to give THIS installment a better sense of closure.

Because the next one is likely going to be clean-slate anyways.