70 réponses à ce sujet

[Monochrome Wench]

But ships already have FTL using the Ezo core. Don't need to relays to FTL, its just a much faster FTL

[Someone With Mass]

bwg888 wrote...

No, very true, it's a game and not real life. Light speed and Einstein and all that, it's impossible.......

OR SO WE THINK!!!!!!!11!1!!1

Einstein's theory that nothing can travel faster than the speed of light has already been disproved by today's technology.

Just saying.

[QuarkZ26]

Someone With Mass wrote...

bwg888 wrote...

No, very true, it's a game and not real life. Light speed and Einstein and all that, it's impossible.......

OR SO WE THINK!!!!!!!11!1!!1

Einstein's theory that nothing can travel faster than the speed of light has already been disproved by today's technology.

Just saying.

Yeah except that mashable.com/2012/02/23/faster-than-light-neutrinos-debunked/

Just saying.

[OdanUrr]

Someone With Mass wrote...

bwg888 wrote...

No, very true, it's a game and not real life. Light speed and Einstein and all that, it's impossible.......

OR SO WE THINK!!!!!!!11!1!!1

Einstein's theory that nothing can travel faster than the speed of light has already been disproved by today's technology.

Just saying.

Not quite.

[Falcon509]

Arkitekt wrote...

read the wiki.

Or the codex.

[OdanUrr]

Falcon509 wrote...

Arkitekt wrote...

read the wiki.

Or the codex.

As far as I can tell, the issues we've raised in this thread are not addressed by either source.

[QuarkZ26]

OdanUrr wrote...

As far as I can tell, the issues we've raised in this thread are not addressed by either source.

They pretty much disprove themselves actually. I think that unless you're a physics theorist, it'll be hard to give any kind of explaination other than space magic.

[OdanUrr]

QuarkZ26 wrote...

OdanUrr wrote...

As far as I can tell, the issues we've raised in this thread are not addressed by either source.

They pretty much disprove themselves actually. I think that unless you're a physics theorist, it'll be hard to give any kind of explaination other than space magic.

We could try to come up with one, at least, that is still bound by the laws of the Mass Effect universe.

[QuarkZ26]

OdanUrr wrote...

QuarkZ26 wrote...

OdanUrr wrote...

As far as I can tell, the issues we've raised in this thread are not addressed by either source.

They pretty much disprove themselves actually. I think that unless you're a physics theorist, it'll be hard to give any kind of explaination other than space magic.

We could try to come up with one, at least, that is still bound by the laws of the Mass Effect universe.

I guess if it was possible it would be known already . So unless you effectively disprove the theory of relativity, you just can't "come up with one" since the Mass Effect universe obeys our laws.

Wormholes are probably the best theory, since they permit to travel quickly without actually going faster than light, by "bending" spacetime. You, then, don't need to go faster because the distance between the two point is reduced. It's like folding a piece of paper and make the extremities touch.
But i think many people do not believe it's actually possible, for reasons that go far beyong my comprehension.

That's why it's called science-fiction, you need a bit of magic to make it work

Modifié par QuarkZ26, 05 mars 2012 - 03:43 .

[MostlyAutumn]

Once again, mass effect fields raise the speed of light within. ME version of FTL travel is FTL to an outside observer but the ship still travels much slower than the speed of light locally.

It's like you take the speed of light in Bose-Einstein condensate and say that you drive your car faster than light.

[Reapinger]

OdanUrr wrote...

QuarkZ26 wrote...

OdanUrr wrote...

As far as I can tell, the issues we've raised in this thread are not addressed by either source.

They pretty much disprove themselves actually. I think that unless you're a physics theorist, it'll be hard to give any kind of explaination other than space magic.

We could try to come up with one, at least, that is still bound by the laws of the Mass Effect universe.

As far as the corridor you keep speaking of goes... I would assume that since you are massless in FTL travel, the laws of physics no longer apply. If eneergy is mass times the speed of light squared, then since you are massless you have no energy. Therefore, the colission of two particles with no energy between them as postulated within the corridor is a non-issue. They have no energy to transfer in the sense that they are no longer bound by the laws of physics. I would guess in the corridor, you are the absence of anything since you are massless in a sense. You could not collide with an object in FTL travel if you tried. I hope that makes some kind of sense? Again, real physics I suppose don't apply. 

[Minaach]

ItsFreakinJesus wrote...

Slingshot.

Ah yes, "Slingshots". We have dismissed that claim

[QuarkZ26]

MostlyAutumn wrote...

Once again, mass effect fields raise the speed of light within. ME version of FTL travel is FTL to an outside observer but the ship still travels much slower than the speed of light locally.

It's like you take the speed of light in Bose-Einstein condensate and say that you drive your car faster than light.

And so how do you exactly "raise the speed of light"? You make it sound like it explains everything
 

[MostlyAutumn]

QuarkZ26 wrote...

And so how do you exactly "raise the speed of light"? You make it sound like it explains everything

And the answer for that is space magic Dark energy, hyperspace, any other cool sounding but poorely understood words.

AllianceNewsNetwork

Susskind Supercollider experiments on Calabi-Yau manifolds; results "promising," say physicists.

For example, these experiments are dealing with hyperspace and string theory.

Modifié par MostlyAutumn, 05 mars 2012 - 05:05 .

[78stonewobble]

Hmmm *ponders*

If mass relays makes light speed faster (and a ship travelling at light speed) in a corridor of sorts between mass relays then... hmmm *ponders*

Maybe they do warp space in some way between the relays?

Eg. the distance between relay A and relay B is 100 lightyears but along the corridor space itself is squeezed together to a shorter distance. Sun to earth like distance then it would only take 8 minutes to travel.



Yes space magic... Dark energy might not be energy at all but some intrinsic quality of the universe that we just doesn't understand yet.

EDIT: I did also like biowares idea that spacecombat was limited by heat build up in ships. It's actually a practical problem I really haven't seen mentioned in alot of other science fiction.

Modifié par 78stonewobble, 06 mars 2012 - 09:41 .

[OdanUrr]

So, we're agreed then that travel via a mass relay takes place in an alternate dimension? Because I'm still not too sure about that. Can't biotics create mass effect fields that interact with objects in our own space-time?

[illsteward]

 Hm.... Let's see...Element Zero can interact with particles bearing mass and make their impact neglible. FTL starship cores in ME universe work by applying electric current to Ella cores, reducing the mass of the ship. Then conventional drives are used to propel the now neglible-weight ship to high speeds according to a=F/m. This is easy - since to propel a ship, you have to apply F higher than it's own mass and whatever force is holding it now, you mostly have to overcome it's own weight. Ella makes this neglible. Still no FTL transport possible, as the mass if never zero and eventualy the acceleration will wear out (that is why ME2 exploration allows you to accelerate and decelerate, rather then go/stop).

As for Relays... Let's just not care about big relays and start with the Conduit. The Conduit is a point-to-point device, engineered by Protheans (reverse-engineered by them from Creators), based on the relays. So it is possible to build a device that allows FTL in Mass Effect universe. Also, the Conduit on Ilos isn't that big, it's just a few hundred metters AND is in the atmosphere. Thus, any "Relays work because no friciton" claims are wrong. It could be possible that the huge Ella cores in Relays allows the ship to make it's weight neglible and gain infinite acceleartion. This is supported by Codex mention of "light spectrum shift", that is supposed to happen to near-relativistic objects. The actual travel from relay to relay takes time, so it's not quantum travel. Is it FTL? Quote: With a mass effect drive, roughly a dozen light-years can be traversed in the course of a day's cruise. (wikia) So yes, this is FTL. This estimate also makes it so that the ship moves at 4380 times the speed of light. Counting in the space distortion probable for FTL travel, the "outer" speed of the ship would still be about 45c.

This estimate seems right for the Conduit, because it actually slows down time - there is no way Saren could get this far in five minutes YOU have between him and you using the conduit on Ilos. So the FTL travel in ME universe actually has impact on the Event Horizon, something we didn't hold possible in current physics. Ender's game series has worked on this aspect. Main character was 3000 years old to anyone who wasn't him, because he spend too much time traveling at FTL speeds. In Mass Effect, this isn't so apparent, because the distances traveled are so big that you simply can't make a jump where you will meet yourself (and the relays discharges after use, and I think this is for good reason - see Illos).

Also, the pilots have a word in final destination - they need to hold the "drift" of the ship within some range. This is possible range of the FTL corridor (warp-space for trekkies) established by the massive acceleration. I think that the Relay Effect is rather simple - by using massive amounts of Ella, it first makes weight of the ship INCREDIBLY LARGE and then reduces the weight of SURROUNDING MAGNETIC FIELD to subatomic level (remember that the ship is cloacked in magnetic field just before the launch). The observed effect is actually similar to very heavy cannonball being launched by static explosion - the acceleration is a bit larger then it would suposedly be and the cannoball accelerates even after being fired, whilst heavy cannonballs travel at higher speed (lead bullets, guys, that's why we have them). So the ship, whem fired from Mass Relay, doesn't weight nothing. On the contraty, it weights a lot and only internal emission sink (sinking free gravitons and ella) ensures that the crew won't be automatically threw on the ground.

Or, of course, I can be totally wrong, moronic and just speculating.  

[Kilshrek]

ItsFreakinJesus wrote...

Slingshot.

= wormholes, everyone knows that.

Mass relays are really just webway gates, many people don't know this.

[EpicHam]

swenson wrote...

On collisions, couldn't that be explained by the fact that nothing has mass when it's traveling through a relay? (or, rather, that it has negative mass) I'm much up on my physics, but what would happen if two things with negative mass collided? Would they simply pass through one another? If so, then there's no issue with collisions.

Alternately, let's say ships can't collide because relays are set up to only allow one through at once. Still not sure how they handle stars/debris, though.

that is not possible, the Normandy CANNOT be changed from matter , to negative mass .

[OdanUrr]

EpicHam wrote...

swenson wrote...

On collisions, couldn't that be explained by the fact that nothing has mass when it's traveling through a relay? (or, rather, that it has negative mass) I'm much up on my physics, but what would happen if two things with negative mass collided? Would they simply pass through one another? If so, then there's no issue with collisions.

Alternately, let's say ships can't collide because relays are set up to only allow one through at once. Still not sure how they handle stars/debris, though.

that is not possible, the Normandy CANNOT be changed from matter , to negative mass .

Well, we're working under the assumption that mass effect fields work. Otherwise what's the point?

[OdanUrr]

Bump so a dev can comment on this? Surely someone must've considered the issue? Anyone?