1317 réponses à ce sujet

[DraCZeQQ]

Heldenbrand wrote...

The theme of this series has never been about synthetic life versus organic life; that was contained solely within a subplot found between the Quarians and the Geth. In this capacity it was addressed beautifully providing the player the choice to make that determination to answer the question: do we have a soul?

The theme to Mass Effect, from the very start, has been that through unity and perseverance they can survive. The Paragon options generally bring this unity through diplomacy, whereas Renegade does it through force or deceit. If Shepard is our extension and avatar through humanity, then our other crew members represent the various Council races. Asari, Turian, Salarian, Krogan, and Quarian, even Geth; we care about their races because of these crew members and through them we witness their plights and struggles. Through our actions in the series we can doom not only the crew member, but often times their very civilizations.

In the ending all the choices we have made or effort we have put forth in the previous two games means absolutely nothing. As described by so many others here, the entirety of the series can be broken down into three choices; three choices that do not reflect the character I have created or how hard the races fought to survive. They worked as one not only to escape death, but to preserve their way of life. One way or another all that has been lost in those three choices presented to us.

Paragon or Renegade it doesn't matter, we're not upset at the Renegade ending or the Paragon ending; we're upset because we have neither. We do not see the consequences of the decisions we made in the game or in the prior, we only see the consequences of a single choice. It breaks down the very thing that made Mass Effect special to us; narrative choice and impact of our decisions. This horrific ending could haven been tolerated in Mass Effect 2, because we knew more was coming, but at the end of Shepard's story it is agonizing to us that we have wasted hundreds of hours and years playing and waiting.

THIS!!!

[comrade gando]

I had an N7 background I can't stand to look at anymore. I have an N7 hoody I won't wear anymore. This is unacceptable.

[Zeroscape]

Heldenbrand said it best in one post. Thank you.

[jackofalltrades456]

Since there are about 35 pages which I'm not going spend 2 hours reading through, I'm going to just post my thoughts on the ending.

It's not that the ending is poorly written; it was that it was too abrupt . I feel that the players wanted the ending to get spelled out to them rather than just speculate it.

First there's the choices your Shepard makes at the end of the game. The Paragon choice is sacrificing your Shepard and merging with the Reaper leader. This pacifies the Reapers, removes their role as the destroyers of galactic civilization and prevents Shepard from wiping out all the A.I races. Which brings me to the Renegade ending. This option is to just wipe out all synthetic races in the Galaxy. This means the Geth, Reapers, and EDI. Just think back to EDI & Legion for a moment. Legion wanted his race to evolve from a collection of programs to conscious beings. Then there's EDI. As the game progressed EDI became more interested in organic culture and seemed to become more "human" by the end of the game. By wiping out the synthetic races , your betraying their ideas and desires to become more like the organics and their attempt to bring peace between them.

The destruction of the Mass relays is suppose to represent the Galaxy's freedom from the Reapers. Remember back in the first game when Sovereign stated that the Reapers used the Mass Relays to progress the races at their own whim? The Reaper leader stated without the Reapers, the galactic races will become too powerful and may destroy themselves and doom the Galaxy in the future. That's why the Reapers spared the primitive races during their purges. They act as the balance for the Galaxy. Order to Chaos. With the relays destroyed, the civilizations will now be able to progress on their own rather than through the Reapers. Did you notice how at the end of the game that the child and old man were on a different planet? This means that the civilization did so and created their own future.

I feel that Shepard's companions crashing landing on the jungle planet was nothing more than just telling us that they survived the Reapers and could spread Shepard's legacy to the rest of the galaxy.

I hated how my Shepard died at the end of the game and could see why so many people were pissed off about it. I been playing my female Shepard since the first game and was depressed to see her die. I did wish that there was a better option to spare her and still get a happy ending, but I'm at least happy that she didn't die in vain.

I'm not surprised people are so pissed off about it and as I stated in a previous post that I wished for more closure and a better epilogue at the end, but I can't say that the ending was as terrible as people make it out to be.

Modifié par jackofalltrades456, 09 mars 2012 - 05:35 .

[Xellith]

I feel so dirty. I feel like ive been kicked to the curb. I want this fixed bioware. But part of me doesnt trust you to touch it for sake of making it worse somehow.

[Durdens Wrath]

The reason I found it bad is that nothing mattered. I can 100% the game, and I get the same ending some casual player gets. I got carebeared

[Niraven]

Wow. There isn't enough WTF in the world for those endings. I fully expected Shepard to sacrifice him/herself at the end (though I did hope for a longshot HEA where Kaidan and my FemShep had adorable dark haired superspectre lovebabies), but this? Color-coded endings?

The whole damn point of this story was that organics weren't going to resign themselves to some predetermined fate. Shepard told Saren, Sovereign, Harbinger, and The Illusive Man to go to hell, that they would determine their own fates. But then some Toddler God comes in and is like, "lol I own you" and she buys it without question? Why did they even need Sovereign to activate the Citadel if Toddler God was there? Not only did this new angle not make sense, it felt cheap.

And don't get me started on the whole, "Uh oh, Shepard's been gone for ten minutes, let's gather up the entire Normandy crew and peace out" bit at the end. Then they'll teleport to the relay before it implodes and crash land on the Lost island!

OH wait, Jack SHEPARD. Lost. I get it now! Bioware must have held a contest on one of the Lost fanfiction boards to write ME3's ending. After seeing those stupid leaves, I half expected to see a close-up of Shepard's eyeball. Very funny, Bioware!

Well, if there is an ending DLC that fixes this convoluted crap, I'll be one of the suckers who buys it. Well played, EA. Well played.

Modifié par Niraven, 09 mars 2012 - 05:38 .

[Glondor]

I've got a few problems with the ending. I'm sure they've been made before in this thread, but I want to add my feedback for the devs to read.

The whole Catalyst part didn't work for me. I couldn't accept its premise of inevitable annihilation of organics by synthetics and its methods seemed absurd. For the endings to be variations on a solution to what it perceives to be the main problem and not what I've perceived to be the main problem of ME ever since Virmire (the Reapers are destroying everyone) made the conclusion really unsatisfactory. Particularly the synthesis option, it seemed so vague and unnecessary; the Geth and the Quarians are already working together, even in the same suit. That's synthesis/symbiosis right there, without having to change who they were.

As for the mechanic,I don't like how the endings are more or less the same and determined by a single number and the end-game choice of ME2. I can appreciate that it's a lot of work to make endings that account for many decisions across 3 games. But the end game cutscenes and suggested resolutions are the same for my paragon and my renegade shepard, whether I released the cure or took the Salarian deal, etc. There's little incentive to take different options, because functionally they're all the same.

Finally and this is subjective, the endings didn't give me the resolution I personally was hoping for. I've grown attached to Shepard and the crew of the Normandy. I've seen them fight and struggle and overcome. My goal for ME3 was to see them get the rest I felt they deserved, the rest that the Reapers were denying them. Taking back Earth was just a means to get to that end, not the end itself. I loved the opening level with the small boy, because it personalised the loss. To me, Shepard wasn't upset about not being able to save Earth precisely, he was upset that he couldn't save that boy, that he couldn't save Thane, Mordin and so on. I can understand that there would be endings where Shepard died, some people want that and it's not an unlikely scenario. But to have no endings where Shepard can finally rest with the Normandy crew meant I didn't get the emotional payoff I'd been hoping for.

Modifié par Glondor, 09 mars 2012 - 05:42 .

[Durdens Wrath]

I hope one of the DLC involves your LI going to the shower, seeing Bobby Ewing, and realizing the epilogue was a dream.

[Vamphuntr]

I didn't mind that Shepard dies in the ending or that the mass relays are destroyed. What I did mind on the other hand was how there is no logical build up to what happens in the end and that there's no closure to anything.

The crucible was kinda a terrible deux ex machina. It gets even worse when the prothean VI mentions that apparently all races tried to built it but failed. All of the previous races added new parts and technology to it. It doesn't make much sense as they didn't even know what to do with it but yet they added parts to it?

Also didn't like how they throw at you some outrageous twists in the end. So there is an old advanced race that built reapers/synthetics to prevent organics from building synthetics that would ultimately kill/enslave them. You don't know who were these people, why they built reapers (outside of AIs are bad), how did they do it and how did they built the mass relays. The explanation that they are preserving organic legacy by harvesting them quite doesn't cut it as we learned nothing about how the reapers function. How does human DNA affect them? Why do they need it? Why do they look like monsters with tentacles.

You can't even talk with the catalyst in the end to learn more about him and the whole story. The worse thing is you don't even get a proper epilogue for each of the endings. It's basically more or less the same movie sequence. You don't get closure about how are people managing to live without mass relays and if FTL is still possible. What happened to the races that are stuck in the Sol System after the battle? You don't get closure about what happened to each homeworld either. Epilogue like DAO or Fallout are pretty much required if you want a good closure to a game with important decisions like this one.

There is no explanation at how the crucible can magically either control or destroy reapers or merge synthetic and organic life. It all seems shoved in there and you must accept it without further explanations and justifications.

In no way you can expect ME 1 and ME 2 to lead to this ending :/ There is no good hint at this. Both games instead show how reapers appear to be sentient evolved machines and in 3 it's revealed they are pretty much doing the bidding of their creators.

It's also weird that EDI and Kaidan were on the jungle planet in my ending. They should have died earlier as they were with me when the reaper used his beam on me.

The ending did sour me on the series as a whole. It's going to be hard replaying everything from ME 1 knowing how terrible the ending is.

No one else disappointed that there's no final boss?

[lookingglassmind]

The most important take-away message that BioWare needs to take from this thread:

Most of us, with the Shepard we have created, would DEFY the Guardian. We would, even if it meant our deaths, would have asked it to consider our struggles to unite differing perspectives and challenge preconceptions. We would cite our ability to unite the geth and the Quarians. We would resist the indoctrination the Guardian attempts to impose upon us.

We would defy.

I don't know about the writers, but that sends a literary chill down my spine. It's powerful.

[lastpatriot]

Perhaps we could make it a goal to break 50 pages by the end of today? With that much attention, do you all think it help motivate BioWare to quickly address the problem? I'm trying to have faith but my trust in them is almost gone now.

[comrade gando]

well I would count illusive man as a boss type character. maybe doesn't look like a boss from a gameplay perspective but it feels like it's more of a battle of wills in the form of dialogue. just me though.

[Valox Volofigor]

yeah not reading 34 pages of posts to see if my point is made.
Dear Bioware:

I want you to understand i know your the creators and you can do it how you want, but I have supported you since the begging, I've purchased Knights of the old republic, Jade Empire, Dragon age Origins and 2, your sonic game, Mass Effect,2and 3, all the dlc's released for said items and i have purchased these things without question or waiting for a review i have beaten most of these games a minimal of 7 times each. I have declared to anyone and everyone that your company is the best there is and to support it whenever you can, i even bought lithographs in my desire to support your company. I have even declared on multiple occasions that bioware is my god.

but these endings are a betrayal, I don't understand how the developers thought they were good ideas, in dragon age origins, the only reason it was alright (i didn't even like it then) was cause if you really wanted to you could throw someone else into the fire, so why couldn't you do that, instead of the illusive man shooting himself in the head , in the EXACT same way as Saren why not have him throw himself in the middle thing instead of sheapard, as a way for his retribution. when the kid says i'm controlling them why not have an option where sheapard tells the fleet to destroy the citadel since the kid is controlling them it would make sense that destorying it would if nothnig else weaken the reapers, My point being that yes i am that much of a pansy that i need an ending where everything works out, that my hard work and determination actually pays off not die,die, or kill an entire species that could've saved the quarians alot of time. and if it destroys all reapers and geth and can effect the machines inside you, why doesnt it affect all ships killing everyone. If you gave me the option to let you kick me in the balls, hit me in the head with a sledge hammer, or eat a bucket of nails, these aren't really options there only letting me know that you have some unusaul hatred for me. I have never posted before, even when dlc has come out and i paid ten dollars to do something completely useless like hop around rocks and get a tiny floating ball for my captains quaters, but i beat this game at 2 am and couldn't sleep until 6am because my mind was in turmoil of rage and disapointment this betrayal is so deep i;m not sure I want to support a company that seems to think that a person who plays a game for 200 hours (mass effect 1,2, and 3) want to see there beloved character die and not getting the happy ending they worked so hard to achiev.

[Ghost Rider LSOV]

I finally ended the game too.
Destroy, best outcome. And yeah, like others, while in ME1 and ME2, I had this great feeling and felt like a (virtual) hero, right now I feel... nothing.

I don't think about the colony and stuff, just what we see. The only thing I liked is that Shepard started firing almost like he'd fall down, but he strengthened his resolve and his aim, if one has to go like a hero, it must be Shepard. (and then he lives, what is he made of anyway? )

And in the end, Joker, Tali and... Javik? I expected to see Garrus.

Oh well, good thing I knew about the endings from some time ago, else the bad burning feeling in my stomach would have been greater.

Modifié par Ghost Rider LSOV, 09 mars 2012 - 05:45 .

[Valk72]

Glondor wrote...
 the Geth and the Quarians are already working together, even in the same suit. That's synthesis/symbiosis right there, without having to change who they were.

And we should have had the choice to point this to the Catalyst, proving that synthetic and organic can live together by citing the example of the geth and the quarian.

[Durdens Wrath]

lookingglassmind wrote...

The most important take-away message that BioWare needs to take from this thread:

Most of us, with the Shepard we have created, would DEFY the Guardian. We would, even if it meant our deaths, would have asked it to consider our struggles to unite differing perspectives and challenge preconceptions. We would cite our ability to unite the geth and the Quarians. We would resist the indoctrination the Guardian attempts to impose upon us.

We would defy.

I don't know about the writers, but that sends a literary chill down my spine. It's powerful.

The B5 ending, where he tells the god like beings to pack up and leave.

My Shepard would have found a way to use the Crucible to kill the god child.

[Xellith]

IF YOU THINK THE ENDING IS TERRIBLE THEN PLEASE MAKE YOUR VOICE HEARD.

PUT THIS POLL IN YOUR SIG

http://social.biowar...606/polls/28989

AND VOTE NOW!

caps lock got stuf rly gys >.>

[Sylvanfeather]

Props to Heldenbrand for explaining the issue so eloquently.

There was a moment, I thought the third option was available because of a high Paragon/Renegade rep and you'd be able to choose to not use the Crucible but instead simply shut down the Catalyst/Reapers.

As a result of your choices throughout the game, all the games, you became the catalyst that shepherded all the races to the crucible. The symbolism was so perfect. It just makes you wonder why they didn't drive the point home with the realization that the device wasn't needed because they'd already achieved it's purpose.

[lastpatriot]

Ghost Rider LSOV wrote...

Oh well, good thing I knew about the endings from some time ago, else the bad burning feeling in my stomach would have been greater.

I didn't really know much of anything as I avoided the spoilers as much as possible.  Now, I feel almost betrayed by the ending choices we got.

[Durdens Wrath]

Basically the plot of mass effect boils down to: we had to burn the village to save it.

FemaleMageFan wrote...

I love the endings! no sarcasm. The way it was presented was beautiful. Fitting ending for my shep.

Wait, you are OK with not a single choice mattering?  That even if you do everything right you get the same ending as if you'd screwed around?

Modifié par Durdens Wrath, 09 mars 2012 - 05:51 .

[Taleroth]

Xellith wrote...

IF YOU THINK THE ENDING IS TERRIBLE THEN PLEASE MAKE YOUR VOICE HEARD.

PUT THIS POLL IN YOUR SIG

http://social.biowar...606/polls/28989

AND VOTE NOW!

caps lock got stuf rly gys >.>

I refuse to vote in that poll until it gets decent options. I don't necessarilly want a brighter ending. I just want an ending that makes sense.

[XSarenXArteriusX]

Played Mass effect 1 for the first time years ago, ending i was in awe, thoroughly amazed, i floated on that for a few days, telling all my friends about how great it was, this was before ME2 was even announced.

Played Mass Effect 2 at release, purposefully disciplined myself not to read up on ANY stuff, about the game before release, just to keep that sense of ignorance so i could hopefully be amazed yet again, guess what, i was, floated on that ending for a few days too, again telling my friends its an awesome game with an awesome story

Mass Effect 3, loved the entire game, then i beat it, i felt kicked in the gut, hard, or like a significant other one would care so deeply about cheated on your and left you out of the blue saddened

[Parker Stephenson]

Im just curious as to what bioware was even thinking when making these endings?? Were they high or something when they created these? No one on earth would ever have liked these no matter your age... I just can't even believe they'd even drop an ending like this on such a phenomenal trilogy, they manages to say to everyone who loves all ME's "F*** You" and silently give us the middle finger. I'm really upset in both a sad and angry way because the Shepard you created was basically part of you, from looks down to the hero or ruthless choices. I won't let them take that from me, and especially to morph my choices into their own endings, I want my ending that my choices create not your 3 bleakly described choices by the catalyst who looks like a kid