8899 réponses à ce sujet

[Noelemahc]

You know what the sad part is? Dead Space 2 had unofficial official patches before it had official official patches, disseminated via the game's forums by the devs (granted, they only fixed the PC version missing out on DLC, but still).
I mean, a hotfix is a hotfix, it doesn't bear much certification time if they would release a quickie patch to fix ONLY the face import, it being the most pressing issue.

P.S. We still get to LOL at BioWare for letting through such an easily noticeable bug into release, right? Right?

Modifié par Noelemahc, 29 mars 2012 - 01:36 .

[chainsawgutsfuck]

rapchill wrote...

chainsawguts**** wrote...

...Hopefully people learn from this and stop throwing their money around...

Everyone here - apart from maybe the more informed of us - bought the game on the pretense that it was a working product. To suggest people are "[...] throwing their money around" for buying this game is ignorant, and degrading.

I wasn't being ignorant or degrading towards anyone - if you're personally insulted that's not my problem. If I was a betting man i'd probably wager most of the whiners would still fork out cash for DLC, that's what I was getting at with the "throwing money around", and that's all EA seems to care about. Deny all you want but where there's naivety, there's profit.

Most of the arguments seem to be confusing "working product" with "a product that doesn't match my expectations / specifications". Mass Effect 3 does work. For some people it's not compatible with faces from the previous games, which is of course absolutely retarded; but it will still import your character assuming you don't mind creating a new face from scratch that won't look the same, butthurt tears or not.

[rapchill]

chainsawguts**** wrote...

rapchill wrote...

chainsawguts**** wrote...

...Hopefully people learn from this and stop throwing their money around...

Everyone here - apart from maybe the more informed of us - bought the game on the pretense that it was a working product. To suggest people are "[...] throwing their money around" for buying this game is ignorant, and degrading.

I wasn't being ignorant or degrading towards anyone - if you're personally insulted that's not my problem. If I was a betting man i'd probably wager most of the whiners would still fork out cash for DLC, that's what I was getting at with the "throwing money around", and that's all EA seems to care about. Deny all you want but where there's naivety, there's profit.

It sounded pointed towards situations currently, not future inevitability. I agree with you that people are likely to buy the DLC, but you can look at it thusly: people will buy it because they hope that in funding a "favoured" dev, they will guarentee future "quality" products (which is all too abundantly clear that it's going the other way); on the flip, you have the people that don't really care about the "selling factor" of the game (i.e. the face import) and will mindlessly drendge through a couple more hours worth of mindless...whatever...regardless of the build and story quality.

And no, I didn't take it personally, I was just seeing it from an objective position. Until you cleared it up, it looked like you were generalising people into the "You Bought it, deal with it" box.

Most of the arguments seem to be confusing "working product" with "a product that doesn't match my expectations / specifications". Mass Effect 3 does work. For some people it's not compatible with faces from the previous games, which is of course absolutely retarded; but it will still import your character assuming you don't mind creating a new face from scratch that won't look the same, butthurt tears or not.

I kind've see what you're getting at, but with Mass Effect, the aim of the game was importing your character. If you're selling point is not implimented properly, your product is not fit-for-purpose.

It may not be a "game-breaker" for new or previous game players who were lucky with their facial feature choices, but for those who've been with the series since ME1 and who've been able to go through the series so far with a personal touch to their games, it's almost a personal insult to the loyalists that it hasn't been reported on more in the press (over the Ending debacle - I think that's one of the most infuriating things in this whole issue. We've sat here patiently waiting for acknowledgement, then evidence that the issue is being fixed, only to be faced with BioWare and EA only publically acknowledging peoples disappointment with the ending, which those of us who won't play the game without our Shepards' can't experience...and then Casey Hudson annouced that he was going to publically talk about the ending...which we can't experience.) /ETA hasn't been given/lack of customer support...

It's more than a case of us not wanting to play the game because of our invested time in a particularly appearance. It's that that invested time has apparently been hindered, and then effectively ignored until AFTER the ending has been annouced and discussed. So a lot of us with little or no ability to "help ourselves" have had the ending spoiled - I've managed to stay away from spoiler sources this long, and I hope to until this issue has been fixed in whatever capacity.

[m0gwa1]

I feel like we still aren't getting through to Bioware/EA. So Chris/Lion, if you see this, I'll try to explain again.

You guys made a mistake. Not an innocent mistake, but a dilberate one. You released a game with a known bug. An explanation would be nice, but its not necessary. What we really need, is an apology, a genuine one. How do you make a "genuine" apology you ask? This is how.

You start with apologizing. Admitting the mistake and taking full responsibility. In this case, when you say "I'm sorry it didn't work for you", that is not an apology. That's like saying "I'm sorry you feel bad". That admits no wrong doing and actually puts the blame on the person that was wronged and not the person who made the mistake.

Finally, you make it up to them. You do something, promise it won't happen again, treat them extra nice, whatever. Basically, you go out of your way to let the person wronged know that they are valued in some way. What you've done so far, hasn't helped. The patch explanation? It sounds like a bad excuse, a justification for the delay. Never a good thing to include in an apology. What you made clear, is that you aren't willing to do anything extra for us.

No, I'm not saying we need free stuff. But something like releasing this fix on its own, as a separate patch, would be a big step in the right direction. It would say "We know we messed up, and even though this is going to cost us some money, we are going to release this is an extra patch, instead of lumping it with all the other fixes and delaying it.".

I realize its probably too late for that at this point. But honestly, we aren't even on that step. We're still waiting for an apology, a real one.

[chainsawgutsfuck]

We're on the same team here I can just come across rather... "incendiary" at times. You have to be when you're surrounded by pesky children! Internet should be a privilege, not a default! Back in my day we had to wait for .jpg's to load /rant

My female Shepard was absolutely, unequivocally butchered when I imported her. I actually laughed for a few seconds before realising that was actually the import I was getting and not just a default Shepard face...

I was fortunate that my male Shepard not only imported relatively well but I could actually make him look better in ME3 than he did in ME2, so i've done a complete Paragon run so far - not sure if i'll bother doing much else unless DLC is free; being able to solo silver Cerberus runs on multiplayer as a Salarian Infiltrator repeatedly (Utter, utter domination) means there's no real point teaming up with complete strangers I have no way to communicate with, and to be honest I have other things to soak up my free time that are probably more enjoyable.

What was meant to be the epic finale to a trilogy that started with pure excellence turned out being a Michael Bay-esque filler for Guild Wars 2. The odd amazing, cliché moment wasn't enough to ignore the sense of disappointment.

Modifié par chainsawgutsfuck, 29 mars 2012 - 02:55 .

[Walker White]

What gets me about this bug is how easy it should have been to catch it. This is a data serialization issue. This is the number one thing that you can catch with automated testing. Automatically generate a representative set of faces from ME1, automatically translate to ME2 format, and import. No human testers should have been involved in tested something like this at all. This has absolutely nothing to do with real-time player input.

And if a AAA studio like BioWare does not have automated regression testing for exactly this type of thing, they need to hire some software engineers with experience in doing this.

Modifié par Walker White, 29 mars 2012 - 03:08 .

[timbobway]

Mr .Priestly, it is now Thursday, a week since your last update. I understand you are in Edmonton, making you 2 hours behind the east coast, so I'll give you some leeway in the matter. However, please for our sake and yours' give an update on the patches release date and certification progress. You are the boss so use your power. Also, please no company line quotes or what not, just give facts and help alleviate our concerns. Loyal paying customers deserve that much, because Bioware seems to be losing them after 255+ pages of complaints.

[DoctorEss]

chainsawguts**** wrote...

rapchill wrote...

chainsawguts**** wrote...

...Hopefully people learn from this and stop throwing their money around...

Everyone here - apart from maybe the more informed of us - bought the game on the pretense that it was a working product. To suggest people are "[...] throwing their money around" for buying this game is ignorant, and degrading.

I wasn't being ignorant or degrading towards anyone - if you're personally insulted that's not my problem. If I was a betting man i'd probably wager most of the whiners would still fork out cash for DLC, that's what I was getting at with the "throwing money around", and that's all EA seems to care about. Deny all you want but where there's naivety, there's profit.

Most of the arguments seem to be confusing "working product" with "a product that doesn't match my expectations / specifications". Mass Effect 3 does work. For some people it's not compatible with faces from the previous games, which is of course absolutely retarded; but it will still import your character assuming you don't mind creating a new face from scratch that won't look the same, butthurt tears or not.

I wouldn't consider a legitimate complaint about a promised feature being broken as "whining".  Complaining about the weapon holstering is whining.  Complaining about the face import is legitimate.

Has nothing to do with "butthurt tears".  Good job being an ass, though.  That's a sure way to win friends and influence people.

And for the record, no, I would not buy any DLC for this.  I'm not in the habit of rewarding failure.  If I can not touch the game since the day it launched, do you honestly think I'd be so weak-willed as to buy DLC for a game that *I am not even playing*?

Modifié par DoctorEss, 29 mars 2012 - 03:10 .

[your-friendly-noggin]

Walker White wrote...

What gets me about this bug is how easy it should have been to catch it. This is a data serialization issue. This is the number one thing that you can catch with automated testing. Automatically generate a representative set of faces from ME1, automatically translate to ME2 format, and import. No human testers should have been involved in tested something like this at all. This has absolutely nothing to do with real-time player input.

And if a AAA studio like BioWare does not have automated regression testing for exactly this type of thing, they need to hire some software engineers with experience in doing this.

There is no doubt that they caught this bug, they even had an error message all built in for this issue, what should really get you and is something i want to know is why they ever thought that people would be ok with it?!

[Corma]

your-friendly-noggin wrote...

Walker White wrote...

What gets me about this bug is how easy it should have been to catch it. This is a data serialization issue. This is the number one thing that you can catch with automated testing. Automatically generate a representative set of faces from ME1, automatically translate to ME2 format, and import. No human testers should have been involved in tested something like this at all. This has absolutely nothing to do with real-time player input.

And if a AAA studio like BioWare does not have automated regression testing for exactly this type of thing, they need to hire some software engineers with experience in doing this.

There is no doubt that they caught this bug, they even had an error message all built in for this issue, what should really get you and is something i want to know is why they ever thought that people would be ok with it?!

THIS, 

that error message is the evidence that they already know about this freaking issue

[Dimensio]

Corma wrote...

your-friendly-noggin wrote...

Walker White wrote...

What gets me about this bug is how easy it should have been to catch it. This is a data serialization issue. This is the number one thing that you can catch with automated testing. Automatically generate a representative set of faces from ME1, automatically translate to ME2 format, and import. No human testers should have been involved in tested something like this at all. This has absolutely nothing to do with real-time player input.

And if a AAA studio like BioWare does not have automated regression testing for exactly this type of thing, they need to hire some software engineers with experience in doing this.

There is no doubt that they caught this bug, they even had an error message all built in for this issue, what should really get you and is something i want to know is why they ever thought that people would be ok with it?!

THIS, 

that error message is the evidence that they already know about this freaking issue

The error message implies that the character import feature explicitly relies upon the face code, rather than upon the stored vector data, to rebuild the face.  When considering that Mass Effect 2 relied upon stored vector data to reliably recreate Mass Effect 1 faces, I am unable to comprehend such a design choice.

[Shotgun Diplomacy]

I don't expect an ETA, but you guys can at least let us now on how far the testing/certification/techinal bull**** talk/etc. is...

[BBK4114]

No face import, gimped SP; meanwhile over in the MP forum their getting big promos & freebies.

Truly I'm just about done with them.

[chainsawgutsfuck]

DoctorEss wrote...

I wouldn't consider a legitimate complaint about a promised feature being broken as "whining".  Complaining about the weapon holstering is whining.  Complaining about the face import is legitimate.

Has nothing to do with "butthurt tears".  Good job being an ass, though.  That's a sure way to win friends and influence people.

And for the record, no, I would not buy any DLC for this.  I'm not in the habit of rewarding failure.  If I can not touch the game since the day it launched, do you honestly think I'd be so weak-willed as to buy DLC for a game that *I am not even playing*?

If they fixed the issue, yes I do think you'd have a higher chance of shelling out for DLC. If someone came out and apologised over the mess alongside a delicious bug-fixing patch and character import / creator update i'd probably be more interested in DLC they bring out too, lots of people would. As for "rewarding failure", a lot of people seemed to do just that by pre-ordering Mass Effect 3 after the debacle that was Dragon Age 2, one of the most heinous butchers of a stellar game series i've ever witnessed... ME2 should of been a warning.

Trust me, the last place I go to make friends is BioWare forums... as for influencing people, you probably picked up on "butthurt" immediately, even dedicated an entire sentence to it so I guess it did it's job. Read it's context and you'll realise i'm not calling anyone butthurt!

[Sinnerous]

This really sucks. It's been weeks and no fix. I don't remember any other game developers taking this long for a patch. Multiple ones at that. I hope this patch isn't only for this issue but a bunch of them.

[Corma]

Marco Tulio Cortés ‏
@XboxSupport when the mass effect 3 patch will arrive xbox ?

Xbox Support
@korutsuru We don't have any information on that ^CB

@XboxSupport A lot of people is concerned about this and BIOWARE says it depend on xbox, is there a way you scalate this question?

@korutsuru I would if i could, however, i simply don't have any information to provide at this time ^CB

[Jtm79]

DocDoomII wrote...

Benny8484 wrote...

DocDoomII wrote...

I don't know if anyone played a bit with the character creator, but personally I discovered that my femShep wasn't imported just because her eye color was not directly available in ME2.
As I see it, when you import a face from ME1, ME2 keeps all of its features even if they are not directly available in the character creator.
This however leads to the bug where the game cannot create a facecode because such features do not have their alphanumeric value (which simply is the position of the slides in the character creator).

It is very well possible that these features are still present in ME3, but the game cannot extrapolate them because ME2 couldn't generate a facecode with their alphanumeric value.

I'm extremely curious on how they will be able to fix this without patching ME2 or using an external program that will simply read the face from our ME1 save and produce a ME3 facecode to paste in the character creator.

Excellent find.  This is exactly what I have been getting at.  I spent HOURS & HOURS trying to make my character look like my ME1 & ME2 character & its simply not possible with the current character creator in ME3.  To those who replied "The graphics are better so of course she will look different", no just no.  My character should not look WORSE in a AAA title that was released years after its previous title.

about the face looking worse. to me it just seem that some facial features had their geometry changed: if i import my actual face for example, the chin and jaw will result extremely 'pointy', but as you can see in my avatar (it is a bit small, i know) i pretty much have a face very close to ME1 standard face abd that is not pointy at all.

May i ask how did you do it can could you post larger picture where i can see your me1-2 and me3 versions?


Anyone succesfully made me3 shep look like that? Thats pretty much how my femshep looks and i want that same look on me3.

i973.photobucket.com/albums/ae219/scampermax/Mass%20Effect%20Stuff/Andromeda%20Shepard/Andromeda_Collage_02.jpg

[DoctorEss]

chainsawguts wrote...

DoctorEss wrote...

I wouldn't consider a legitimate complaint about a promised feature being broken as "whining".  Complaining about the weapon holstering is whining.  Complaining about the face import is legitimate.

Has nothing to do with "butthurt tears".  Good job being an ass, though.  That's a sure way to win friends and influence people.

And for the record, no, I would not buy any DLC for this.  I'm not in the habit of rewarding failure.  If I can not touch the game since the day it launched, do you honestly think I'd be so weak-willed as to buy DLC for a game that *I am not even playing*?

If they fixed the issue, yes I do think you'd have a higher chance of shelling out for DLC. If someone came out and apologised over the mess alongside a delicious bug-fixing patch and character import / creator update i'd probably be more interested in DLC they bring out too, lots of people would. As for "rewarding failure", a lot of people seemed to do just that by pre-ordering Mass Effect 3 after the debacle that was Dragon Age 2, one of the most heinous butchers of a stellar game series i've ever witnessed... ME2 should of been a warning.

Trust me, the last place I go to make friends is BioWare forums... as for influencing people, you probably picked up on "butthurt" immediately, even dedicated an entire sentence to it so I guess it did it's job. Read it's context and you'll realise i'm not calling anyone butthurt!

See, that's where you're wrong.  Again, I don't reward failure.  Giving them more money just lets them know that they can screw up this badly, and still get people to give them money anyway.  So, no.  It wouldn't give me a "higher chance" of buying DLC.  I'm fairly certain I know my own purchasing habits more than you.  

Regardless of apology or anything else, there's a thing called "too little, too late".  Bioware is, right now, in the land of too little, too late.

The "debacle" of DA2?  Ohhh, that explains a lot.  You're one of *those*.  DA:O is not Baldur's Gate 3.  That's most people's first problem.  DA2 is not, and was never meant to be DA:O2.  Too many people assumed DA was going to be another ME styled series, where you carry your character on.  Bioware never SAID that it was, but people just assumed, and got disappointed over their assumption being wrong, and began to convince themselves that they were promised something that was never even said.

DA was meant to be a collection of stories of Ferelden (and such).  Different characters, different places, different protagonist.  Just taking place in the same world.  DA2 is a perfectly acceptable game, it takes place in the same world, and fixes a lot of the horrid flaws of DA:O that it's fanboys seem to refuse to acknowledge.  Horrible animations, for one, such as the "hunchback walk".  The sloooooooooooooooooow combat, for another.  The (incredibly dated) mute protagonist problem.

Thing is, again, DA2 was not supposed to be Origins 2.  Before you even let the words "reused areas" move from your brain to your fingertips to your keyboard, go replay ME1.  Fantastic game, right?  Reused more areas than DA2.  At least DA2 had the decency to rearrange the doors, accessible areas.  Every single underground base in ME1 is identical.  Every single mineshaft is identical.  Every single internal above-ground building?  Yep, you guessed it.  Identical.

I cannot even begin to count how many times the same three areas (mine, underground facility, aboveground building) were reused in ME1, but I guarantee you, more times than you saw reused areas in DA2.

90% of the hate for DA2 is manufactured bandwagoning.  If you went into it expecting another game in the same world as DA:O, you had no problem with it.  If you went into it expecting Baldur's Gate 3 1/2, or DA:O2, you got disappointed.

[DogmeatPryde]

seriously still no fix huh? seen a few sales on ME3 too. teaches me to never buy first day for a buggy product.

[QuickGaming]

What's taking so long?

[Corma]

attack via twitter people, they just keep us here, we need to get out and DO somenthing

[Scam_poo]

Sinnerous wrote...

This really sucks. It's been weeks and no fix. I don't remember any other game developers taking this long for a patch. Multiple ones at that. I hope this patch isn't only for this issue but a bunch of them.

So, have you even read the update? They have finished it a while ago, we are just waiting EA, Microsoft and Sony to approve stuff. Please read, then comment.

[sixthnewkid]

ThomasDW wrote...

I am sure that in a month or two we will get a patch ... by then most will have lost interest in playing the game, but lets looks at the bright side, they already have our money.

This made me smile... but now that I think of it, its just sad...

[sixthnewkid]

Corma wrote...

attack via twitter people, they just keep us here, we need to get out and DO somenthing

Sounds good, I however am not a twitter guy, could you post up some twitter links?

[DoctorEss]

Scam_poo wrote...

Sinnerous wrote...

This really sucks. It's been weeks and no fix. I don't remember any other game developers taking this long for a patch. Multiple ones at that. I hope this patch isn't only for this issue but a bunch of them.

So, have you even read the update? They have finished it a while ago, we are just waiting EA, Microsoft and Sony to approve stuff. Please read, then comment.

False.  They said they have fixed the import issue, not that they have finished the patch.  Stop disseminating false information and getting people's hopes up.