Just beat Mass Effect 3 - 100% Perfect and my thoughts - long post.
#51
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 03:12
Yes Frodo had to go away and was never able to enjoy the victory that he earned, but he did so knowing that his sacrifce mattered. With these endings, I actually think that the Reapers winning is the least bad because at least then the universe itself survives and a new civilization can start over with intact relays.
-Polaris
#52
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 03:15
I couldn't agree more. Well said.Templar Fox wrote...
Now by perfect, I don't mean I did every single aching probe side mission (although I did a fair amount of that) but I did get my galactic readiness level up in multiplayer to 100% and promoted my Infiltrator class as well when I got them to level 20.
My Military Level or whatever it was called was actually over 6000 - more than enough for the absolute threshold of perfect which is 5000.
It took me I'm guessing around 25 hours to beat, as I'm standing right before the final mission and it says 23 hours and 34 minutes - plus, add on 2-4 hours for multiplayer and you have I'm guessing a 29-30 hour gameplay to get this ending. Bear in mind I imported my Shepard who I built through the first two games, did all the dlc for both and nearly all the side missions. I was prepared for this.
I also went ahead and spoiled myself on the endings and some details about a week and a half before the 5th (which is when mine unlocked thanks to a VPN I used). Like many others, I was disappointed and at first pretty angry about the endings, and how they seemed to end on sour notes. As many of you are well aware, a good portion of fans are not pleased, or at least have mixed responses to the endings. At first, I didn't like them either. A galactic dark age for everyone? Shepard can only live if all the synthetics, including the geth and EDI, die? What a load of ****, this has to be made up!
But I found out after a few days they were very much NOT made up, so I was glad I got my anger out of the way. However, as I look back on it, I am incredibly depressed now. At first, I was prepared for the endings well in advance - I went through the five stages and accepted that this was reality, and there was no way to circumvent it. Now though, I feel such depression that while I'm not going to cry, it was almost a possibility for a moment.
I understand Bioware wanted emotions, but this wasn't the way to go about it, especailly on the 100% perfect "happy" ending that didn't even feel bittersweet.
I romanced Tali, and boy, did they go all out on it. Unlike many previous Bioware games, including Mass Effect 2, Romance wasn't just "talk to someone a lot, then flirt and get it on before the big finale" sort of deal. You felt like Shepard and his LI (in my case Tali) were really in love with one another, and that in spite of a galaxy on the brink of destruction, they wanted to hope for a better future. Alas, that is not the case here, as even though the Normandy crash landed on a seemingly well tropical planet, and despite the fact if we ignore Dextro-Amino incompatibilites that may or may not be there, there still remains the issue that Shepard and Tali will never get to build a home on Rannoch, or Earth, or merely spend time with one another.
I also felt like, in order to have the slimmest hope of my Shepard and Tali being together, I had to not only wipe out the Geth (whom I helped give sentience and had been defending all game long, nullyfying Legion's sacrifice) I also had to kill EDI, whom I had grown to enjoy as a character, sexbot claims be damned. So really, yes I understand Bioware wanted "difficult" decisions, but this seemed a little too grim for a "happy" ending.
The gameplay is wonderful, the character development and intereactions are great, the setpieces are cinematic and lovely... you feel really caught up in the story, and yet, the looming disappointment of the endings were still there.
Personally, I think it was an awful way to end a beloved trilogy such as this, and it will be a shame that it will more than likely be many years before Bioware touches Mass Effect again, with Dragon Age 3 and rumors of Baldurs Gate 3 both being on the horizon. I just wanted to see if my Shepard would ever get back together with his old friend Garrus, or live out the rest of his days peacefully with Tali, whom I swear that they made their romance INCREDIBLE. Tali fans are in for a major treat with this, but if you're of a weaker will than me you will probably cry at the end due to the incredibly sad note it ends on. You can tell they really want to be together, and Bioware decided "lolnope".
Personally, I'll be headcannoning that the Normandy sets off a distress beacon that years from there, Shepard arrives and gets all his old crew out of there. FTL still works, but it'll be limited. Hopefully that planet isn't too far from Earth.
#53
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 03:15
IanPolaris wrote...
Sorry Biotic Sage but I disagree strongly. This isn't a matter of not getting an ending I "liked". It's a matter that all the so-called different endings aren't actually any different! They all invalidate ALL the choices you made for the prior three games because by destroying the relay network, they effectively destroy the Mass Effect universe. That makes all your prior choices irrelefvant and that makes it a bad story for a ROLE PLAYING computer game and Mass Effect is supposed to be that (at least in part).
Yes Frodo had to go away and was never able to enjoy the victory that he earned, but he did so knowing that his sacrifce mattered. With these endings, I actually think that the Reapers winning is the least bad because at least then the universe itself survives and a new civilization can start over with intact relays.
-Polaris
Well we can disagree then. I don't like choose your own adventure books and I wouldn't like it if Bioware gave the player complete authority over the narrative. There has to be a basic narrative framework for the player to flavor and modify in order for the storytelling to be as good as it was in ME3. I'm happy with the amount of control they gave us when the narrative quality is this high. Games that completely adhere to "write your own story" are indeed empowering, but ME3 rose above being just an empowering "fun" game. It aspired to be an interactive, emotional, cinematic experience. And it completely succeeded.
Modifié par Biotic Sage, 08 mars 2012 - 03:17 .
#54
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 03:17
What I do mind is the synthesis ending makes absolutely zero sense. How would re-writing DNA modify full-grown organisms or even make circuit-tracings in the skin? It makes absolutely zero sense. It's the only ending I've seen, since I couldn't save once I realized this was the ending, and I'm not doing the slow-walk or the street fighting again, (my last save was before the base) especially now that I hear the other two endings are functionally identical.
The choices are ridiculous. Hmm, genocide of a friendly race along with pulling a Battlestar Galactica and bombing everyone back to the stone age . . . controlling everything, which the Illusive Man made into a really fine, upstanding solution . . . and something that made no sense. Which I took because I don't stab my allies in the back.
The entire game was well written, well executed, well animated, and frankly one of the best gaming experiences I've ever had, it was still worth every dollar and every minute, but I swear they fired the writers before they wrote the end, then stitched together scenes from Metal Gear Solid 4, Battlestar Galactica, and a half dozen other pieces of media, in order to get the least sensical, most cliched ending possible.
Seriously, hit the button to open the wings, bled out, roll credits. That's the way my game ended. Chop off the last few minutes and it's one of the greatest games ever made.
The bit after the credits was only awesome because I noticed Stargazer (the old man) was voiced by Buzz Aldrin, but his speech made me sad for real-world reasons, and not Mass Effect ones.
I guess I can take the game for what it is, but it seems so insane that in a Mass Effect game my decisions mean almost nothing at the end. Maybe I should just be happy my decisions made the main story what it was, but seriously, the ending added absolutely nothing over a simple text crawl or the old man telling the story with something along the lines of, "In one final, selfless act, Commander Shepard finished his mission, broke the cycle, and saved life in the galaxy from Reaper threat forever."
I'd still rate it well over 90%.
#55
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 03:18
#56
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 03:21
They all effectively destroy the ME universe we've all come to love. Saddening to see it go, atleast for a very long time. Reminded me of Termnator 3 a lot, which I despise.
T1: Coming back to change past/save future.
T2: There is no fate, change the future!
T3: We lied, there is fate. This is your destiny, sorry.
Seemed a very cerebral ending came out of nowhere in an action packed, exciting game series. It was just so out of it's element, totally blindsided everyone.
Modifié par Vatheras, 08 mars 2012 - 03:25 .
#57
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 03:24
Biotic Sage wrote...
IanPolaris wrote...
Sorry Biotic Sage but I disagree strongly. This isn't a matter of not getting an ending I "liked". It's a matter that all the so-called different endings aren't actually any different! They all invalidate ALL the choices you made for the prior three games because by destroying the relay network, they effectively destroy the Mass Effect universe. That makes all your prior choices irrelefvant and that makes it a bad story for a ROLE PLAYING computer game and Mass Effect is supposed to be that (at least in part).
Yes Frodo had to go away and was never able to enjoy the victory that he earned, but he did so knowing that his sacrifce mattered. With these endings, I actually think that the Reapers winning is the least bad because at least then the universe itself survives and a new civilization can start over with intact relays.
-Polaris
Well we can disagree then. I don't like choose your own adventure books and I wouldn't like it if Bioware gave the player complete authority over the narrative. There has to be a basic narrative framework for the player to flavor and modify in order for the storytelling to be as good as it was in ME3. I'm happy with the amount of control they gave us when the narrative quality is this high. Games that completely adhere to "write your own story" are indeed empowering, but ME3 rose above being just an empowering "fun" game. It aspired to be an interactive, emotional, cinematic experience. And it completely succeeded.
The entire selling point behind Mass Effect was that your choices had to really matter. Guess what? They didn't. As far as I'm concerned, we were lied to.
-Polaris
#58
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 03:26
But honestly, I'm a bit dismayed. The story ends, and there is no lasting impression of my existance other then tinted cyberpeople, and stories about "the shepard".
I'm going to have to say, as someone who owns all three of the games on 360 and PC. With the game in its existing state, having just finished it on PC, and was looking forward to clearing off a couple of odd choiced and romanced sheps on 360 as well, Im really not sure I even feel like doing it. I just have a bit of a dull gut ache really at having spent so much time, effort and well whatever... it is that kept me playing this particular series, when usually games hold my interest for at max eh 10 days.
Look Shep can die, hell the endings (for the most part with the exception of all the mass relays blowing and how that basically screws everything you tried to fix) can sit and stay as is really, I just want to see why it was worth it. I need some kind of epilogue. I need to see this brave new world that I have tried to usher in. Especially if Shep can't be there. Im not usually a utter geek fanboy, and the idea that a game has literally broken my heart is about the saddest thing I will ever have to admit.
I just saved the whole universe. I should be elated.
I just want to know who in my crew made it through alive on this impossible mission, and how the hell they are going to survive the existence I have just unleashed on them.
#59
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 03:27
IanPolaris wrote...
Biotic Sage wrote...
IanPolaris wrote...
Sorry Biotic Sage but I disagree strongly. This isn't a matter of not getting an ending I "liked". It's a matter that all the so-called different endings aren't actually any different! They all invalidate ALL the choices you made for the prior three games because by destroying the relay network, they effectively destroy the Mass Effect universe. That makes all your prior choices irrelefvant and that makes it a bad story for a ROLE PLAYING computer game and Mass Effect is supposed to be that (at least in part).
Yes Frodo had to go away and was never able to enjoy the victory that he earned, but he did so knowing that his sacrifce mattered. With these endings, I actually think that the Reapers winning is the least bad because at least then the universe itself survives and a new civilization can start over with intact relays.
-Polaris
Well we can disagree then. I don't like choose your own adventure books and I wouldn't like it if Bioware gave the player complete authority over the narrative. There has to be a basic narrative framework for the player to flavor and modify in order for the storytelling to be as good as it was in ME3. I'm happy with the amount of control they gave us when the narrative quality is this high. Games that completely adhere to "write your own story" are indeed empowering, but ME3 rose above being just an empowering "fun" game. It aspired to be an interactive, emotional, cinematic experience. And it completely succeeded.
The entire selling point behind Mass Effect was that your choices had to really matter. Guess what? They didn't. As far as I'm concerned, we were lied to.
-Polaris
Well I can see why you're upset then. I realized long ago, even before ME2 came out, that this was just marketing speak and not what Mass Effect really was. Like I said: interactive, emotional, cinematic experience. Not a player shaped narrative. If you approach it this way you will enjoy it much more.
And like I said before, all of your choices matter to the people that you made them for. Shepard touched many lives.
Modifié par Biotic Sage, 08 mars 2012 - 03:28 .
#60
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 03:36
#61
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 03:38
With DA:O and DA2, you can head canon what comes after. I don't need to go on playing my Hawkes or my Wardens. It's enough to know that lived or died; that they got the girl/guy (or not in some cases), and that they rode off into the sunset with the hope of more adventure.
In this case, there isn't any room for that. BioWare took that away. There is no more adventure. It's done, gone, no girl/guy, no sunset, barely even any chance of live/die. Thus, not really any room for head canon.
#62
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 03:44
Heads reapers win.... tails you lose. No matter what you do.
I'm not too bummed about Shepard being sacrificed. I'm more bummed that no matter what, everyone in the galaxy basically loses. You just get to decide if the reapers lose too.
#63
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 03:46
#64
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 03:56
Valtauran wrote...
I can see EA releasing a DLC that gives us the true endings. lol
I can see myself easily ponying up for that. Seriously fine, you want to go for cinematic? I WANT MY DIRECTORS CUT.
However if I have to BUY that DLC to get my special good uberhappy or just slightly LESS grimdarky extended edition ending, I'm sorry bioware, I never thought last week I would say this to you, but we are going to have to break up.
Its like the whole "Return" part of the heroes journey gets replaced with "HEY DUDES THANKS. FOR RESCUING ME. LETS GO FOR A BURGER.... HA! HA! HA! HA!"
#65
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 04:12
Is me or does it seem Bioware has fallen in love with fatalistic storytelling now days. Sure you can pick choices in the main game, but major plot points are always fixed in stone. Nothing you do in DA2 effects the outcome at all and now with ME3 while you still have meaningful choice in the main game, none of it matters in the end as all 3 ending destroy galactic civilization and your friends are basically castaways stuck on some planet with no hope of rescue.
Such a mess of an ending with so many jumps in logic.
Can someone explain to me why exactly is joker so bent on out running the wave? How would he even know to leave earth's orbit, much less get to the mass relay? Didn't we all agree we wanted the crucible to fire up and send out an energy wave to destroy the reapers? I mean on the slim chance Shepard lives in one of the ending wouldn't be better to been near earth?
Also doesn't the arrival show destroying a mass relay is really bad for the system its in? Do the relay suddenly not explode like supernovas now?
#66
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 05:19
thordreen wrote...
Hmm, that Lost ending doesn't seem that bad now...
Is me or does it seem Bioware has fallen in love with fatalistic storytelling now days. Sure you can pick choices in the main game, but major plot points are always fixed in stone. Nothing you do in DA2 effects the outcome at all and now with ME3 while you still have meaningful choice in the main game, none of it matters in the end as all 3 ending destroy galactic civilization and your friends are basically castaways stuck on some planet with no hope of rescue.
Such a mess of an ending with so many jumps in logic.
Can someone explain to me why exactly is joker so bent on out running the wave? How would he even know to leave earth's orbit, much less get to the mass relay? Didn't we all agree we wanted the crucible to fire up and send out an energy wave to destroy the reapers? I mean on the slim chance Shepard lives in one of the ending wouldn't be better to been near earth?
Also doesn't the arrival show destroying a mass relay is really bad for the system its in? Do the relay suddenly not explode like supernovas now?
It reeks of lazy writing, in my opinion.
#67
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 05:39
I was expecting videos of seeing the Krogans moving to another world, rebuilding and getting a seat on the council. I was expecting a video of Liara with Sheperd's child. I was expecting a video of all the main characters showing what happened to them, like Tali on her homeworld. I'm ok with Sheperd dying, but I expected closure.
A better ending would have had Sheperd activating the Crucible, and then dying from his injuries. Then having videos showing a funeral where 100,000+ people gathered, a Memorial being built and then some quick videos showing what happened to everyone else.
#68
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 06:43
The Mass Effect universe doesn't end with 3. The Shepard saga ends. That said, they would have to choose a canon ending for a Mass Efffect (4), simply because there has to be continuity. I'll give you this: if they included another ending, a happy one, complete with the sunset and your horse you're riding off on, it would be better for both sides.
But, as I said, they'd still have to pick a definitive ending so that next-Mass Effect has foundations to build onto. If they chose to pull a Gears of War 3, where the ending makes zero sense (finish it and you'll understand), a deus ex machina solved the situation, just so that the fans could have the "they lived happily ever after" ending. I absolutely abhored it. It was a tragically bad way to end the trilogy.
But for Mass Effect, I'd choose one of the available endings, a bit tweaked. I'd just make Shepard die after the whole battle - not during it, but maybe weeks, months after, from a planned assassination or something. Or even make him die during the battle. Or having him on the Normandy along with everyone else, but choosing to depart just after the battle. But I'm fine with the endings as they are. I absolutely prefer some kind of sad ending to a trilogy that never was "happy" to begin with. From the first game, the tone was dark and you always knew the odds were massively against you. The suicide mission in Mass Effect 2 couldn't have been named better. I actually played it many times over to find the perfect combination that would allow everyone to live. But I liked that you could even not save anyone and be the lone survivor, not even the Normandy crew. And now people are pissed because you can't ride off with your lovemate? Who honestly expected this, having taken into consideration everything that was dark and depressing throughout the series?
You cannot please everyone, and if you try to, you will fail miserably. BioWare decided to include one type of endings to the trilogy, that type being "sad/depressing", closing the trilogy in the tone it started. I, for one, am content with them, and I'm sure others are too. Others are not, and well, what can be done? At best, release DLC to add another batch of 3 "happy" endings. Looking at Fallout 3 and Broken Steel, I know it's possible, simply because people were complaining en masse about the endings. It's funny, they were complaining about sad endings in a series set post apocalypse, in a world where humans live underground and raiders and mutants inhabit the surface. A series which started with a game that had a clock counting down to your doom, in case you didn't finish the game in time. Yeh, I was absolutely expecting unicorns and flowery fields at the end of it. Same with Mass Effect. I'm content with it simply because I knew what I should expect.
#69
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 06:56
Biotic Sage wrote...
I just got done playing the game all the way through and checked on these boards. WOW do people these days have a problem with things ending. I seriously think people are mostly upset because they are sad that the status quo of Mass Effect has been disrupted; in other words, they're mad simply because it's over. All things end. Jesus, it's a 3 game epic, of COURSE the status quo should be disrupted! There should be no "perfect" ending that everyone aspires to get. They finally got it right with the tough choices.
Good stories that are of as grand of scope as Mass Effect don't end with "and they got married, had children, and lived happily ever after." That doesn't ring true for good sci-fi. That kind of stuff works for light hearted action adventure. I for one was in awe the entire game, all the way through the ending. Great imagery, fulfilled expectations, and truly significant ending. Not just a "we won!" Come on guys, you know that would undermine the entire trilogy and the grave seriousness of the Reapers.
I think I'm one of the few who actually agreed with your opinion. ME trilogy has been a great story, I don't understand why everyone is obsessed about getting a happy ending. I find it an appropriate and a grand finale to the series. The fact that I feel for the Shepard actually shows how good the story is.
In fact from the first dream sequence, Shepard's sacrifice was hinted/foreshadowed heavily, there's Thane's prayer, Shepard questioning his existence after watching the lazarus project vids, the final farewell between Shepard and his/her lover, and most obvious of all, the final dream sequence.
#70
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 07:16
Modifié par nitefyre410, 08 mars 2012 - 07:16 .
#71
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 07:22
Shepard dies Reapers leave - Control
Shepard dies all organics become half synthetics - Merge
Shepard lives and destroys synthetics - Destroy
Is there really a fourth or just an added cutscene to destroy?
#72
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 07:56
Bka27 wrote...
Templar Fox wrote...
Arlionis wrote...
I really like it, ending was bittersweet and I don't know how there could be a ME spin off after it, but at least they showed Joker, EDI, Liara and (I hope) Garrus alive at the end, which made me really happy.
I wonder if it's random as to who shows up with Joker. As I stated, I picked the Destroy ending which blew up EDI, so I had Joker, Tali and Jarik walk out.
What about mine, I picked the destory ending with Garrus and James in my squad guess who shows up with Joker? EDI and Garrus........ maybe a glitch.
Are you sure? You chose the Destroy (red) and EDI walked out of Normandy???
#73
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 08:59
So now you have to consider two things:
- How do these decisions affect the galaxy as a whole in the long run, over hundreds of thousands of years?
- How do these decisions affect my civilization, my friends, my people?
Personally, I chose the Destroy ending. My Shepard is attached to his people, his civilization. The whole driving point of the game is that people can change, and Shepard makes peace between several factions, including Geth and Quarians. And yet, Catalyst only postulates that if his solution was destroyed, war between synthetics and organics would occur again. In my opinion, Shepard would probably be of the belief that even so, these creatures have the right to decide for themselves, to live for themselves, to have war whichever way they like.
Eitherway, there are too many plotholes and Bioware could have done a better job explaining all of this..
#74
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 09:44
IronHam wrote...
I think the problem with the ending is that it magnifies your perspective x1000, different from the rest of the games. You've spent all this time in the three games with a set enemy, some twists in the story, but the same general idea overall. But in the last 10 minutes of this game, Shepard is asked to make a choice to do with the entire galaxy's continuum, not just this cycle's. So you've got attachments to the Normandy, to your squadmates, to the Alliance, to the allies you've collected.
So now you have to consider two things:
- How do these decisions affect the galaxy as a whole in the long run, over hundreds of thousands of years?
- How do these decisions affect my civilization, my friends, my people?
Personally, I chose the Destroy ending. My Shepard is attached to his people, his civilization. The whole driving point of the game is that people can change, and Shepard makes peace between several factions, including Geth and Quarians. And yet, Catalyst only postulates that if his solution was destroyed, war between synthetics and organics would occur again. In my opinion, Shepard would probably be of the belief that even so, these creatures have the right to decide for themselves, to live for themselves, to have war whichever way they like.
Eitherway, there are too many plotholes and Bioware could have done a better job explaining all of this..
Except the destroy ending kills all the Geth~ I choose the merge ending, personally my favorite. Everyone gets cool glowy green lines.
I actually like the endings alright, well at least the implications for the endings. , The people who say they are all the same are only partly correct. The issue isn't that they are all the same, the issue is you don't really get to see what difference your choice at the end makes. What effects exactly does synthesis give, how do things change, what is the fate of your crew, of your Love Interest, and what are they in comparasions to the other endings. I mean it would be nice if you could effect your personal story more though, live, die, destroy they relays, don't destroy the relays, etc etc. I would have settled for a slightly more fleshed out ending cut scene. I could give 2 craps about some old man and his kid chatting things in up in what is suscpicously like a Jesus allagory. All in all though I can agree with the endings being just plain lazy. This was a HUGE HUGE trilogy and to end it with three cut and paste scenes with only the most minor of changes in detail? Just pathetic.
All together though, I am not unhappy. I feel like the game sorta got the DA2 treatment where dialogue was more flavor text though rather than actual decisions with impact, though the what shepard actuallys says in the choices is far more subtle and realistic.
Gameplay was solid, although I felt like there was way way to much mapped to the activate/switch cover/take cover/vault over cover/interact button.
I digress though, I would love to know BioWare's take on the community's outcry though.
Modifié par Hexi-decimal, 08 mars 2012 - 09:47 .
#75
Posté 08 mars 2012 - 10:01
Spaceguy5 wrote...
Mass Effect 3 was like winning the lottery, buying a swimming pool full of kittens and chocolate pudding, finally getting that hot date you wanted.... but then as soon as she shows up, she throws a brick in your face and walks away.
Perfect analogy!





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