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95 on Metacritic? Please.


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#26
Faraborne

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titusrsoooooo1337 wrote...

It's a dark sci-fi trilogy. Ending was in perfect taste imho...and the rest of the game was amazing. Their 95 was spot on. Flame-on fellow BSNers


Bioware, critics, etc have stated multiple times that Mass Effect is a space opera...not a dark sci-fi.

#27
SLonergan

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chuckles471 wrote...

I would wait for other people who didn't get an early review copy before you see the actual score i.e the people EA/Bioware know will give a crappy score and hard to please critics. Probably even out to a solid 88-90.


That's not any better. It doesn't deserve that high a score.

#28
JalenTigh

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Odds are, like most games.. the reviewers only played parts of it before writing the reviews...Most reviews done prior to a games release are like that, and half the rating is hype.

#29
girres42

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"If a movie has a bad ending, it's a bad movie. If a book has a bad ending, it's a bad book."
This isn't true.

"You have to look at the game as a whole. Mass Effect 3 made the MAJORITY of it's fans despise the entire series"
I really doubt this is true.

#30
Nick.Chabby

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titusrsoooooo1337 wrote...

SLonergan wrote...

I'll give you an example. Instead of the ending that Return of the Jedi had, when the Death Star 2.0 explodes, so does the galaxy. EVERYONE dies. The entire fleet is decimated. Everyone you've grown invested in is dead. Yeah, the Empire is gone, but it doesn't matter because everyone else is gone too. Then you see C-3PO on a planet with R2-D2, no one else around.

Credits.

Oh, and this takes place over the course of 2 minutes.

The point is, the ending directly contradicts the entire plot, You're there to SAVE humanity, not destroy the infrastructure of the Galaxy.



You, along with 95% of BSN, miss the theme of the series ENTIRELY. It is a DARK sci-fi trilogy, not a hollywood fairytale land like starwars. Ending on the note it did was exactly what I was expecting it to do. Sure...the game could use an added ending or 2 giving some glimmer of hope to those who can't comprehend grief, sorrow, and depression in a time of extinction...but saying that ALL the endings need to be scrapped and replaced would be a mockery to what the series stood for.


I wouldn't replace all the endings, but build them like ME2.

In ME2, if you worked hard, you were rewarded: everyone survived.
In ME3, whatever you do, you get depressed lol. Dark =/= everybody must die. I don't care about the loss, what I care about is if these loss are because of me or because the game decided so. There's a difference between those. I lost Wrex because of my choices, not because the game decided so. I lost Shepard/the Mass Relay/The crew because the game decided so, not because I made a wrong decision sometime.

#31
SLonergan

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titusrsoooooo1337 wrote...

You, along with 95% of BSN, miss the theme of the series ENTIRELY. It is a DARK sci-fi trilogy, not a hollywood fairytale land like starwars. Ending on the note it did was exactly what I was expecting it to do. Sure...the game could use an added ending or 2 giving some glimmer of hope to those who can't comprehend grief, sorrow, and depression in a time of extinction...but saying that ALL the endings need to be scrapped and replaced would be a mockery to what the series stood for.


Mass Effect, at its core, is about making meaningful decisions. That's the base of the game. The combat, plot, setting, etc. are all secondary.

The 3 endings are the same, with a slight color swap. That's not a meaningful decision.

Oh, and the theme of the series? Try this on for size: Fighting back against a destiny that you cannot change. Making the impossible possible. Looking into the face of your destiny, and fighting it until you change it. 

ME1 and 2 follow this theme. In the end of ME3, you are forced into a decision with no right answer. That contradicts the theme completely.

So who's misunderstanding the theme now?

#32
SLonergan

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girres42 wrote...

"If a movie has a bad ending, it's a bad movie. If a book has a bad ending, it's a bad book."
This isn't true.

"You have to look at the game as a whole. Mass Effect 3 made the MAJORITY of it's fans despise the entire series"
I really doubt this is true.


Look at the front page of these forums dude. These forums used to be filled with fanboys, and now it's filled with haters. I haven't seen an audience turn on a franchise like this since Star Wars.

#33
chuckles471

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SLonergan wrote...

chuckles471 wrote...

I would wait for other people who didn't get an early review copy before you see the actual score i.e the people EA/Bioware know will give a crappy score and hard to please critics. Probably even out to a solid 88-90.


That's not any better. It doesn't deserve that high a score.



Just being realistic looking at other AAA games and critics.  I hate the endings aswell, would have takin about 20% off my review if I was a critic just for that.  The game apart from the ending is solid, if a bit dumbed down.....  sorry streamlined in bioware speak.

#34
titusrsoooooo1337

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Nick.Chabby wrote...

titusrsoooooo1337 wrote...

SLonergan wrote...

I'll give you an example. Instead of the ending that Return of the Jedi had, when the Death Star 2.0 explodes, so does the galaxy. EVERYONE dies. The entire fleet is decimated. Everyone you've grown invested in is dead. Yeah, the Empire is gone, but it doesn't matter because everyone else is gone too. Then you see C-3PO on a planet with R2-D2, no one else around.

Credits.

Oh, and this takes place over the course of 2 minutes.

The point is, the ending directly contradicts the entire plot, You're there to SAVE humanity, not destroy the infrastructure of the Galaxy.



You, along with 95% of BSN, miss the theme of the series ENTIRELY. It is a DARK sci-fi trilogy, not a hollywood fairytale land like starwars. Ending on the note it did was exactly what I was expecting it to do. Sure...the game could use an added ending or 2 giving some glimmer of hope to those who can't comprehend grief, sorrow, and depression in a time of extinction...but saying that ALL the endings need to be scrapped and replaced would be a mockery to what the series stood for.


I wouldn't replace all the endings, but build them like ME2.

In ME2, if you worked hard, you were rewarded: everyone survived.
In ME3, whatever you do, you get depressed lol. Dark =/= everybody must die. I don't care about the loss, what I care about is if these loss are because of me or because the game decided so. There's a difference between those. I lost Wrex because of my choices, not because the game decided so. I lost Shepard/the Mass Relay/The crew because the game decided so, not because I made a wrong decision sometime.


From what I've seen on this forum for the past couple days, I can tell you that the majority of anger towards the game strains from the fact that you can't save everybody. FFS people...its a game about a mass extinction. To think there won't be some deaths of close friends is simply stupid....and imho, the death scenes of Mordin, Thane, and Grunt (almost), brought me to tears. 

I will agree that the given endings (seen so far) are all very similar, but you are supposed to use something called an IMAGINATION. Here's an example: choosing the control option gives you control of the reapers--who built the mass relays, and who certainly could again. Thus, hope emerges for the continuity of the mass effect universe we know, and of the survivors of the normandy.

Open ended/cliff hanger stories are always in better taste to me personally because you get to hypothesize things for yourself.

#35
girres42

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"Look at the front page of these forums dude. These forums used to be filled with fanboys, and now it's filled with haters. I haven't seen an audience turn on a franchise like this since Star Wars."
These forums are a very limited and extremely biased sampling of the audience...

Maybe.. the point of these series is that destiny is one tough mother but if you try REALLY REALLY hard and make some tough decisions then you have SOME choice. (Changing the color of the fire that kills you.)

#36
SLonergan

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chuckles471 wrote...

SLonergan wrote...

chuckles471 wrote...

I would wait for other people who didn't get an early review copy before you see the actual score i.e the people EA/Bioware know will give a crappy score and hard to please critics. Probably even out to a solid 88-90.


That's not any better. It doesn't deserve that high a score.



Just being realistic looking at other AAA games and critics.  I hate the endings aswell, would have takin about 20% off my review if I was a critic just for that.  The game apart from the ending is solid, if a bit dumbed down.....  sorry streamlined in bioware speak.


I agree with you that the rest of the game is good. EVERYTHING except for the endings and Tali's photoshopped face is damn near perfect in my opinion.

But the ending ruins the game. I know that I will never be playing through ME3 again, and I probably won't be playing through ME2 or ME1 ever again. The lack of replay value alone is enough to take off more than 5 points.

#37
GothamLord

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SLonergan wrote...

girres42 wrote...

"If a movie has a bad ending, it's a bad movie. If a book has a bad ending, it's a bad book."
This isn't true.

"You have to look at the game as a whole. Mass Effect 3 made the MAJORITY of it's fans despise the entire series"
I really doubt this is true.


Look at the front page of these forums dude. These forums used to be filled with fanboys, and now it's filled with haters. I haven't seen an audience turn on a franchise like this since Star Wars.



Well Lucas went fruit loops and tried to change stuff therefore ruining a lot of what was loved about the Universe.  By that same point Bioware just shot themselves in the foot. When you take a highly loved and lucrative IP and do something stupid its bound to get people flipping out.

#38
SLonergan

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girres42 wrote...

"Look at the front page of these forums dude. These forums used to be filled with fanboys, and now it's filled with haters. I haven't seen an audience turn on a franchise like this since Star Wars."
These forums are a very limited and extremely biased sampling of the audience...

Maybe.. the point of these series is that destiny is one tough mother but if you try REALLY REALLY hard and make some tough decisions then you have SOME choice. (Changing the color of the fire that kills you.)


Even if these forums contain a small section of ME fans, I'd argue that it contains the most rabid fanboys. I was a total fanboy until I beat this game. This forum should be filled with defenders of the game, not covered in Hate Threads.

#39
SLonergan

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GothamLord wrote...

SLonergan wrote...

girres42 wrote...

"If a movie has a bad ending, it's a bad movie. If a book has a bad ending, it's a bad book."
This isn't true.

"You have to look at the game as a whole. Mass Effect 3 made the MAJORITY of it's fans despise the entire series"
I really doubt this is true.


Look at the front page of these forums dude. These forums used to be filled with fanboys, and now it's filled with haters. I haven't seen an audience turn on a franchise like this since Star Wars.



Well Lucas went fruit loops and tried to change stuff therefore ruining a lot of what was loved about the Universe.  By that same point Bioware just shot themselves in the foot. When you take a highly loved and lucrative IP and do something stupid its bound to get people flipping out.


Exactly. Which is why it doesn't deserve a 95. I'd rate it a 6 out of 10. With the multiplayer giving it a big boost. 

The end ruins the rest of the game, and made me regret the time I spent on it. It's bad.

#40
girres42

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Question: If you think that a silly ending can knock down its score by 20% then what games would you score a 9.5 out of 10?

#41
girres42

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"The end ruins the rest of the game, and made me regret the time I spent on it. It's bad."

Man.. I definitely disagree with how you feel about this game but your description is EXACTLY how I felt after watching The Departed.

#42
SLonergan

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girres42 wrote...

Question: If you think that a silly ending can knock down its score by 20% then what games would you score a 9.5 out of 10?


Let me make a distinction here. There is a difference between a bad ending, and an ending that violates the very core of the game you just played. Mass Effect is a game about decisions. Tough decisions that have a major effect on the universe. Hell, the name of the game is a play on this concept. 

We get 3 endings that are almost identical. Different fire, different number of skeletons on earth.

Also, I don't think that the game should even get an 80. I'd put it at a 60-65. The multiplayer is the only part with any replay value, and the single player holds your interest on your first playthrough. 

Now, onto the real question. I'd give Mass Effect 2 a 9, and Mass Effect 1 an 8. I don't think any games deserve a 10, as I've never played a perfect game. The professional rating system is flawed, and scores are cushioned to a ridiculous degree.

What we need, is for professional game reviewers to take a stand. The 10 out of 10 game is something to reach for, but it hasn't been obtained. EVER. Any game that has a 10 out of 10 has problems. Problems which are even listed in the review. 

Mass Effect 2 is (was) my favorite game of all time. And I'd only give that a 9.

TL;DR, I wouldn't give anything a 9.5, but I'm okay with good games receiving that score.

#43
GothamLord

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SLonergan wrote...

GothamLord wrote...

SLonergan wrote...

girres42 wrote...

"If a movie has a bad ending, it's a bad movie. If a book has a bad ending, it's a bad book."
This isn't true.

"You have to look at the game as a whole. Mass Effect 3 made the MAJORITY of it's fans despise the entire series"
I really doubt this is true.


Look at the front page of these forums dude. These forums used to be filled with fanboys, and now it's filled with haters. I haven't seen an audience turn on a franchise like this since Star Wars.



Well Lucas went fruit loops and tried to change stuff therefore ruining a lot of what was loved about the Universe.  By that same point Bioware just shot themselves in the foot. When you take a highly loved and lucrative IP and do something stupid its bound to get people flipping out.


Exactly. Which is why it doesn't deserve a 95. I'd rate it a 6 out of 10. With the multiplayer giving it a big boost. 

The end ruins the rest of the game, and made me regret the time I spent on it. It's bad.


I guess I'm a little more forgiving than you in that aspect.  I still enjoyed ME3 up until the end. The gameplay/graphics were good. Neither does the ending of ME3 take away from the joy and memories for me of 1 or 2.  The new Star Wars prequels dont ruin the original trilogy for me. The edits the Lucas has tried to force into them on the other hand is another matter.  So far BioWare hasnt tried to remake the first two Mass Effect games with massive changes.

#44
SLonergan

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girres42 wrote...

"The end ruins the rest of the game, and made me regret the time I spent on it. It's bad."

Man.. I definitely disagree with how you feel about this game but your description is EXACTLY how I felt after watching The Departed.


See? There you go. The ending of The Departed ruined the rest of the movie right? Would you give that a 95/100?

If you were okay with the Mass Effect 3 endings, I'm seriously happy for you. I wish I was okay with them.

#45
OblivionDawn

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The ending is a crapshoot, that goes without say.

You're basically doing the Reapers' job for them in a matter of minutes rather than a century or so.

That being said, it doesn't ruin the game as a whole. It just ruins the ending. The rest of the game is awesome until that point.

#46
SLonergan

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GothamLord wrote...

I guess I'm a little more forgiving than you in that aspect.  I still enjoyed ME3 up until the end. The gameplay/graphics were good. Neither does the ending of ME3 take away from the joy and memories for me of 1 or 2.  The new Star Wars prequels dont ruin the original trilogy for me. The edits the Lucas has tried to force into them on the other hand is another matter.  So far BioWare hasnt tried to remake the first two Mass Effect games with massive changes.


The prequels didn't ruin the original trilogy for me either. I actually did an in depth write up on my thoughts about this game. The thread got closed, but you can still read it here: http://social.biowar...5/index/9708406.

I totally enjoyed ME3 up until the end. I was raving about how amazing it was! In fact, my Facebook wall is covered in praise for ME3. But the end ruined the whole thing. 

Please don't think I'm trying to flame this game because I'm a hater...it pains me to write this. I spend hours trying to convince myself that I liked the ending, but the more I thought about it, the more upset I got. I was an absolute Mass Effect fanboy from November 2007, until tonight.

#47
titusrsoooooo1337

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Look...we all have different tastes. I personally believe the ending, regardless of how little choice you had, was perfect. You, as well as many others, would disagree. Having your opinions is what defines us as different people...but trying to insist that you speak for everyone based on what YOU think is just plain retarded.

#48
SLonergan

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titusrsoooooo1337 wrote...

Look...we all have different tastes. I personally believe the ending, regardless of how little choice you had, was perfect. You, as well as many others, would disagree. Having your opinions is what defines us as different people...but trying to insist that you speak for everyone based on what YOU think is just plain retarded.


Don't call me retarded.

Second, even if you like the ending, which I respect, you have to recognize that it violates Mass Effect's core concept. That can't be denied. 

And I never said I was speaking for everyone. All I'm saying is that the fact that this game is getting universal praise from professional reviewers, and is being nearly universally panned by people who aren't on a payroll is ridiculous.

The reviews are misleading, and in the end, ME3 will be remembered as a near perfect game, which it's not.

#49
Axelstall

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titusrsoooooo1337 wrote...

SLonergan wrote...

I'll give you an example. Instead of the ending that Return of the Jedi had, when the Death Star 2.0 explodes, so does the galaxy. EVERYONE dies. The entire fleet is decimated. Everyone you've grown invested in is dead. Yeah, the Empire is gone, but it doesn't matter because everyone else is gone too. Then you see C-3PO on a planet with R2-D2, no one else around.

Credits.

Oh, and this takes place over the course of 2 minutes.

The point is, the ending directly contradicts the entire plot, You're there to SAVE humanity, not destroy the infrastructure of the Galaxy.



You, along with 95% of BSN, miss the theme of the series ENTIRELY. It is a DARK sci-fi trilogy, not a hollywood fairytale land like starwars. Ending on the note it did was exactly what I was expecting it to do. Sure...the game could use an added ending or 2 giving some glimmer of hope to those who can't comprehend grief, sorrow, and depression in a time of extinction...but saying that ALL the endings need to be scrapped and replaced would be a mockery to what the series stood for.


I don't think we're asking for that, as much as vary the endings so they at least seem like one can be a little nicer. 

It wasn't even the dark ending that pissed me off, it was the way it seemed like they went. 

"Ok so Shepard enters the Citadel and kills the elusive man, speaks with Anderson one last time and Boom, the kid from the beginning is now the evil mastermind and the three options he gives you are pretty much the same. "

It gave me the feeling like all my decisions were unmeaningful, killing the awesome feeling the games had given me before.

#50
LilyasAvalon

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Story is still a large part of video games on this scale. If it wasn't for that, I might as well be more inclined to play the shooters at the arcade. I wouldn't go as far as to give ME3 a 0%, but 70 - 80 sounds more fair to me than 95%