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Difficult to deal with it if the LI is involved


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#1
Lyrandori

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Spoilers Ahead

It's about the last moments and the ending I chose, but it included my Love Interest (see avatar), namely Liara. I romanced her in ME1, remained loyal to her in ME2 (wasn't difficult anyway), resumed the romance in Shadow Broker. I admit, in ME3 at the Citadel that discussion surprised me, I was troubled (the "I'd like to have more moments like this with you, like friends" part), but I replied that I really wanted to continue with her (phew we got that option, for a moment I thought Liara was about to... nah I won't even think about it). Then I got the Achievement, Paramour I think is the name... in fact that very discussion might have been added just because of the Achievement, otherwise it doesn't really make any sense since the romance was continued in Shadow Broker and pretty much confirmed as such on Mars in ME3. Maybe an oversight from the writers, could always happen heh.

Well, anyway, I'm a role-player (at this point I can imagine lots of people leaving the thread lol), not a "Talimancer" extremist though (lol joking guys, relax). I started playing ME1 back in 2008, it's been 4 years and between the development time of each following titles I just created my own off-screen, off-game events, in my mind (role-play oblige, but I'm saying this loosely, it wasn't obligation, just amusing). Stuff like imagining Liara and Shepard discussing different subjects, or having a dinner together on the Citadel, or Liara asking Shepard to go on leave somewhere calm after a mission, or Shepard inviting Liara on Mindoir... yeah colonist profile, side note, well things like that, kinda romance-related mostly, but not only. So I basically built some type of continuity in the form of non-cannon events between the end credits of ME1 and the start of ME2. Then I repeated that after I had completed ME2 originally, then continued and "added" details and story-related developments after finishing Shadow Broker (which I fully embraced as completely cannon).

Well anyway so what's the point of this?

Well I have created some type of attachment to the character of Liara AND the Shepard I built for that game as well. And when I play the Mass Effect games I do immerse myself a lot (but I immerse myself in many other games anyway, I'm kinda easy to immerse in a game if the atmosphere is right) during game-play and try to combine what cannon events I see on-screen with whatever can fit (and usually does) from my off-game ones, so that ultimately the experience is "complete", both in BioWare's views (well, the writers') and my own ones. It's very powerful when it works (doesn't always work though). Now the thing is I spent some time trying to decide which one of my teammates I'd bring with me for the last mission on Earth, London. There I was looking at the character selection screen and I remained focused on each one from left to right for a good five minutes, since this specific Shepard I was about to engage on that mission would lead to a cannon end (I have two other Shepard games in progress but they are done mostly as "extras", mostly to fill up my curiosity for different decisions or LI's).

So I chose to go with Liara and Javik in the end. I knew that the ending(s) wouldn't be happy ones somehow, I sensed it quite early in the game really. Am I one of those disappointed by the ending? Well "a little bit" I guess but ultimately the ending deceived me, that's the point of all this. Things pointing at one direction, only to be slapped to the face the moment later...

Near the end when Harbinger lands behind the beam (Conduit?) and I have to run at it to get to the Citadel (similarly to how we have to drive the Mako ASAP at the Conduit on Ilos in ME1, as a side note, although of course without a Reaper firing at you on your way at the same time, but the idea is similar and I thought it was cool), that's when I noticed that Liara and Javik were not on my screen anymore, nor anywhere to be seen. I was very immersed though and I thought (in my immersed in-game mind) "I MUST GET TO IT!!! GET GOING SHEPARD YOU CAN!!!", then... that one strike from Harbinger's beam got me. To be completely honest from that point I DID expect a "Resume, Load, Exit" UI to pop up, because I REALLY thought for a moment that the beam in question was some sort of a "last final ultimate boss attack" that I had to avoid at all cost or would otherwise die every time (with reason of course), and that I'd have to reload and retry until I "avoid it" to get to the beam. Well, to my utter shock it resumed, seeing myself (well, my Shepard) bloodied, barely able to limp my way to the beam... and then... it got to me, I thought about Liara...

I asked myself (still immersed, thinking like my Shepard basically) "...Liara?! NO! WHERE? THAT BEAM GOT HER?! You son of a- Harbinger you'll pay!!! REAPERS DIE NOW!!!". So as I made my way slowly to the beam I took that part as cannon (no problem with it really) and tried to role-play a Shepard that HONESTLY believed that Liara had just perished behind (along with Javik, the poor Prothean, dead, before seeing the whole thing ending for good, man that one sucked to be honest, I mean... that's what I thought, I thought they both died). Now, I find myself in the Citadel, all those bodies, and it was very difficult at that point to continue and role-play my Shepard, hearing Anderson but thinking about my love, my Liara... "but... what if she's injured and desperately yelling my name! I must go back, I have to! ...NO! I have to destroy them, they killed her, no one survived that last attack, expect Anderson... ok GO, continue!". That's... that's until the ending choices.

I didn't really pay much attention to the details (well the little there is anyway) concerning the consequences of any of the two choices (from most of the Catalyst's dialog). What I thought for that Shepard was basically the following...

º Go left, and control the Reapers, but die and join Liara in her death, that would really make my Shepard R.I.P (assuming she dies and her "soul" can "go somewhere", ya know)
º Go right, and apparently become semi organic and synthetic, still "live" but lose Liara, thus all reasons to exist (for that Shepard, that's what it comes down to)

So I decided to go left (happy ending for that Shepard, not necessarily for all species though, but for Shepard, yes), exactly because I thought something along the lines of:

"Ok... well Liara is dead, I'm sure, there's no way this Shepard is going to live happily even if the rest of the galaxy's species can continue to live regardless of Reapers being killed or not. If so, good of course, if not, doesn't matter, Liara is dead. I wanted to die with her no matter what if it had to come to that. It apparently does. So let's finish the job I was expected to do, let's kill those SOBs and let's die in the process since now that Liara is dead I'm fully committed to end this with my own life, happily so might I add. Let's hope for a moment thanks to belief and faith alone that I might have a chance to see Liara again somewhere else out of this crap hole of a galaxy".

From that mindset I started limping left on my way to the so called "Control" ending. Then the scenes followed and I thought it was going on too fast I guess, but overall to be honest from that moment even as the final scenes played out I still thought "Hmmm, yeah cool enough ending for this Shepard, romanced Liara, they both died as lovers, Shepard gets the job done ultimately, sacrificed but without regrets nor fear in doing so". Then, that scene with the Normandy crashed on a planet came...

Then... I saw Joker first, followed by...

Liara, and Javik, both perfectly healthy, no scars, no blood, no limping, nothing...

I THOUGHT LIARA DIED...

If there's a reason why I don't like the ending it's because I don't understand how Liara and Javik managed to survive that last Harbinger beam that apparently wiped out pretty much 98% (figurative) of the final assault's group. My own Shepard barely made it alive, nearly died for the second time right there, in fact had it not been for that pistol those few Husks on my way would have ended it in the most humiliating way possible. Even if they DID miraculously survived the beam, then WHY didn't they ran for it as well!!!??? IT WAS THE MISSION, you guys remember the whole "AT ALL COSTS" part? Liara where the hell where you?! JAVIK of all people the Prothean who wanted to spit some final Prothean words to the last Reapers as they died? No? Ok... ok let's pretend for a moment that it made sense, they survived but they... dunno, turned around including Liara who said "I love you" (at least hell I got to hear that one before sacrificing myself!) and then what... they told themselves "Shepard! There's no way she made it from that attack... there's no hope, let's go find the nearest safe zone for a pick up Joker is nearby surely", and certainly why not of all people Javik replying something like "The chance of a life time to end it all even if Shepard failed, 50,000 years of stasis for no reasons or do I run at it myself? Naaaaah... nah my back hurts that beam threw me a couple of meters away, I feel tired from this war, ok Liara you're right, let's get out of here".

Yeah sure, totally cool.

But above all, if they did survive thanks to the ending scene's confirmation of it, then not even a scar? Or did they have the time to take a nice shower (gosh, in MY CABIN?! Well, ok Liara can but Javik? NOT AT THE SAME TIME PLEASE) as the ship probably threw them around like dolls as Joker tried his best to escape that blast from my now ascended-awesomeness? "Hey Joker you see that energy behind you? It's ME, it's Shepard! Well, in a sense, but anyway sorry I CAN'T STOP it's out of my Control!". Then, oh yeah ok, it crashed (surely it must have been a soft ride in there) and, oh, they get out, take some fresh air, Liara doesn't even seem to think about me or anything, no flash backs, no sad face, no tears, nothing. Then the horror resumes, Liara can reproduce with any species and Javik is there, poor Joker might die in a few months on that planet. Well, that's it, Javik and Liara will party on and Liara will give birth to little Asari-Prothean pops, continuity goes on and the story of the previous Cycle can repeat itself in the next one?

Nah not under good ol' Shepard's watch now that "it" controls the whole thing! ALONE.

I feel bad. :(

I need to create a new Shepard, without a LI.

Modifié par Lyrandori, 09 mars 2012 - 02:41 .


#2
Kronner

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Well, it is your fault, really. You are free to think anything you want, so if you choose to imagine Liara + Prothy and their babies, new colony and whatnot, it is entirely your fault if you are sad about it. When I saw that scene, I saw a smile on her face, so my first reaction was that they called for a rescue and it was on the way, and in the Destroy ending, which my Shep survived, I see them together once again..in my head, obviously. That said, the whole Normandy crash scene makes no sense whatsoever and it pisses me off.

Modifié par Kronner, 09 mars 2012 - 03:18 .


#3
DraCZeQQ

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Actually the run to the beam went like this:
Sheppard starts running towards the beam, his two squadmates sit down and start cheering, taking bets whenever sheppard makes it or not and also they call Joker to pick them up ... after Sheppard gets hit by the Harbingers laser Liara pays Javik his bet winnings (ofc your LI voted for you, and gloomy Prothean bet against you) ... after that, they left you there and decide to take a trip through mass relay ... 

Modifié par DraCZeQQ, 09 mars 2012 - 03:28 .


#4
Lyrandori

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DraCZeQQ wrote...

Actually the run to the beam went like this:
Sheppard starts running towards the beam, his two squadmates sit down and start cheering, taking bets whenever sheppard makes it or not and also they call Joker to pick them up ... after Sheppard gets hit by the Harbingers laser Liara pays Javik his bet winnings (ofc your LI voted for you, and gloomy Prothean bet against you) ... after that, they left you there and decide to take a trip through mass relay ... 


Lol, something like that.

Seriously... poor ending especially if a LI is there I say, not just Liara. I bet anyone else who brought their LI with them probably had the same "surprise" too, I'm sure I'm not the only one who was convinced (100%) that they both (both party members you take) died, only to realize that it isn't the case at all at the very end.

In any case, I think that the worst part of all this is that someone out there got paid to create those endings.

#5
kevchy

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I like to think that Harbinger killed you and your squadmates.

Shepard then hallucinates about going into the beam, meeting the Catalyst and all that, as he slowly dies from his wounds.

#6
Gowienczyk

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Lyrandori wrote...

Well, anyway, I'm a role-player (at this point I can imagine lots of people leaving the thread lol)


I'm in this camp as well and I just finished my first playthrough and a lot of your extending post is something I feel so well. I decided to run through my female character (vanguard-adept, I'm wishywashy) who romanced Kaidan through the trilogy. But I think I'm at this point where I love this game, but every playthrough after this I'm going to end it pre-conduit charge and imagine what I wanted to happen, because the rather pretentious and insulting to my intelligence conclusions offered is just so emotionally devastating I just can't.

kevchy wrote...

I like to think that Harbinger killed you and your squadmates.

Shepard then hallucinates about going into the beam, meeting the Catalyst and all that, as he slowly dies from his wounds.

 

+1

This is what I exactly thought when the catalyst was being represented as the "child".

Modifié par Gowienczyk, 09 mars 2012 - 03:43 .


#7
Adugan

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Honestly I thought Shep died after Anderson died, when Hackett started yelling at him and the platform went up to the kid. I mean, how could Shep survive in space without a helmet, and walk around after passing out from blood loss?

#8
kevchy

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Precisely....I mean c'mon, when you see your squadmates back on the Normandy after it crashed, they are not scratched at all, I knew something was amiss.

#9
Davnort

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Adugan wrote...

Honestly I thought Shep died after Anderson died, when Hackett started yelling at him and the platform went up to the kid. I mean, how could Shep survive in space without a helmet, and walk around after passing out from blood loss?


thats how my game ended, everything else was imagination. the crucible failed to fire at the reapers(yes its still a cannon, not some Halo thing)the reapers win because they are the gods of the galaxy, and the cycle continues.

#10
Lyrandori

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Adugan wrote...

Honestly I thought Shep died after Anderson died, when Hackett started yelling at him and the platform went up to the kid. I mean, how could Shep survive in space without a helmet, and walk around after passing out from blood loss?


I admit guys I never thought about that one. It might... in fact, be what actually happened.

BUT...

If the endings (all three of them I mean) consists of... near-death or "after-death" hallucinations, or dreams of some sort, then it means that whatever we do from ME1 to ME3 then ultimately the ending is negative (for organics) and Reapers simply resume their Cycle, as "this Cycle" wasn't any different than all others that preceded it. It was all ultimately futile, and indeed, Shepard died during that last rush towards the beam OR effectively died from blood loss at Anderson's side and THEN what we saw from that point from ANY endings were all... errr... hard to imagine as being some kind of a near-death experience vision of some sort.

Wow, that would imply more than I thought but I admit yes, it could be the case. After all, the camera did focus on Shepard's blood loss for a moment and then Shepard clearly said "Can't see..." when Hackett tried talking to him/her, then Shepard collapsed...

:mellow:

...

:o

Omg...

Modifié par Lyrandori, 09 mars 2012 - 03:57 .


#11
Voidster

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i dont think we will know for many months. Maybe a DLC will add some light to the whole thing. Although, i dont think this is the end of the series. I know...the reapers are gone (well i hope) but...the ending was so...full of holes.

I mean...stranding a gigantic fleet of all types of aliens in the sol system? The dream sequences you go through..

Something doesnt add up here.