57139 réponses à ce sujet

[Cucobr]

Terimtetim wrote...

Well i bet it got posted already but :

3:05



"Struggle,if you wish.Your mind will be mine"

Modifié par Cucobr, 31 mars 2012 - 04:26 .

[Jadebaby]

Rifneno wrote...

I don't think you understand the difference between "a joke" and "trolling".  Which is odd because they really have very little in common.
And I didn't even know about the Aria/bench scene.  No speculation on my part.  Again, I was just kidding.

sorry it's late here, bad choice of words...

All this speculation is stopping me from sleeping, and the neighbours are having a party with loud music lol.

[Gilgamesh117]

BinaryHelix101 wrote...

Gilgamesh117 wrote...

The possibility of EDI being the indoctrinater on board the Normandy is certainly a creative thought, the problem is why wasn't Shepard Indoc in the second game since EDI was on the ship?

Indoctrination happens over a long period of time. It may have started during ME2, and then continued in ME3.

But it also depends how much adrenaline is pumping thru Shepard throughout the game,I think that is significant. But you could be right. 

[Golferguy758]

Gilgamesh117 wrote...

BinaryHelix101 wrote...

Gilgamesh117 wrote...

The possibility of EDI being the indoctrinater on board the Normandy is certainly a creative thought, the problem is why wasn't Shepard Indoc in the second game since EDI was on the ship?

Indoctrination happens over a long period of time. It may have started during ME2, and then continued in ME3.

But it also depends how much adrenaline is pumping thru Shepard throughout the game,I think that is significant. But you could be right. 

They make it a point to mention that adrenaline is a big factor in the speed of indoctrination. Think adrenaline might be pumping during that run to the beam? Uhh...yes. Hell, my adrenaline was probably pumping IRL during that. Came crashing down about 10 minutes later though 

[Jadebaby]

Terimtetim wrote...

Well i bet it got posted already but :

3:05



"Struggle,if you wish.Your mind will be mine"

Watched it and more evidence... also, watch this at 6:50..... It's because your indoctrination process has already begun.

Remember this:  Even if you survive all the waves of the battle for Object Rho, it still emits a pulse and knocks you out. Maybe this is the way you perceive the presence it's already having over you for resisting...

[Jadebaby]

Golferguy758 wrote...

They make it a point to mention that adrenaline is a big factor in the speed of indoctrination. Think adrenaline might be pumping during that run to the beam? Uhh...yes. Hell, my adrenaline was probably pumping IRL during that. Came crashing down about 10 minutes later though 

Just like Shepards.

[Hacedor1566]

Dwailing wrote...

Hacedor1566 wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

schneeland wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

OK, as much as I absolutely LOVE this line of thought, remember that if you didn't import a game from ME2 that Shepard didn't complete Arrival.  Although honestly, are ANY of us Indoc Theory supporters people who DIDN'T import from ME2?

Are you sure about that? I didn't really try, but I assumed they were making the Arrival events canon.

Arrival did happen, but Shepard wasn't the one who launched the asteroid into the relay.  Hackett sent the 103rd Marine Division, or whatever they're called, to rescue Kenson instead and THEY were the ones who launched the asteroid.  I learned this by checking this page: 
http://masseffect.wi...Assets/Alliance 
It shows that the 103rd asset loses strength because they were the ones who were sent to deal with that situation in you didn't import.

Nope, I'm sorry, but, I played Arrival, and i can see this too in my imported game on ME3 (and I'm 100% sure, i only have 1 game and 1 Commander Shepard soldier class, i made it everything good at the first play in ME and ME2B), and never replayed) . The indoctrinated soldiers you fight against on Arrival are Alliance soliders... Maybe they are that 103rd Marine Division man and woman? 

Weird, because I ALSO have an import where I completed Arrival and I DON'T see that.  Given that the wiki says the loss in strength only occurs if you didn't play Arrival, I think your save must be bugged.

Great... Just one game, and it's bugged...  

But, anyway... In Arrival Shepard is knocked for two days, alone, in a lab full of indoctrinated mad soldiers and scientist... Even technicians... They can made her/him anything... 

[nyrocron]

Adrenaline increasing indoc. is only for the huskification as that is done via nanites which profit from it. As far as I remember.

[McGlone16]

Dwailing wrote...

mrs.N7 wrote...

Hingjon wrote...

I've got some very weird sounds of the dream sequences, which I think that are proof of the Indoctrination theory.

after you hear the boy laughing, I heard something that seems electronic laugh... the reapers are laughing at you?? 
ok now I'm really scared:unsure:

OMG, so creepy.  That Reaper laughing in particular.  I don't know how people can still say that the endings are just because Bioware are bad writers.  There is so much evidence that there is something else going on that you just can't take them at face value.

If this video is legit and that reaper laughing is real god damn that is creepy 

[Stigweird85]

Spiderman_2028 wrote...

The more I think about it, the more I think it could be significant that after completing the game, you are returned to the point before the assault on the Cerberus base.

What if you hit the Cerberus HQ... But never left? We know they are holding Reaper Tech- including whatever is left of the Human-Reaper-Abortion... You cross all those walkways- over a 'chasm', referenced by 'Anderson' in the confrontation scene...also, look at the walls as you leave that section of Cerberus HQ. if you stand in the doorway and look at where a doorframe would normally be... the walls are hollow- they look as if they've been faked, or that they can be changed/replaced or something... Then you have the big ramp to get to TIM's office... Similar to the ramp you walk up to get to the confrontation on the citadel...

I'm not saying any of this is definitive proof of anything... But what if the indoctrination isn't the work of the Reapers, but Cerberus?

Another goofy theory... What if the Shep we play as in ME2 and ME3 isn't the only one out there?
What if YOUR Shep gets zapped by Harby...

... And then we see TIM's indoctrination of the Anti-Shep... A clone he had made while Miranda was working on Project Lazarus- that he DID fit with a control chip, and reaper tech... Tim's upgrades give him complete control of this Anti-Shep... The Citadel scenes are TIM testing his new toy... The weird videos we get shown post choice are memories implanted to make anti-Shep more compliant... The tests allow TIM to see how malleable his new Shep is, how effective his control will be...

If the junk written above doesn't earn me my tin-foil hat, nothing will! Again- I don't believe either of those proposals are fact... And they aren't as well thought out as IT... Just killing time till PAX(!)

Interesting, very interesting.

Certainly a new slant on things.  

[Martukis]

bigstig wrote...

Spiderman_2028 wrote...

The more I think about it, the more I think it could be significant that after completing the game, you are returned to the point before the assault on the Cerberus base.

What if you hit the Cerberus HQ... But never left? We know they are holding Reaper Tech- including whatever is left of the Human-Reaper-Abortion... You cross all those walkways- over a 'chasm', referenced by 'Anderson' in the confrontation scene...also, look at the walls as you leave that section of Cerberus HQ. if you stand in the doorway and look at where a doorframe would normally be... the walls are hollow- they look as if they've been faked, or that they can be changed/replaced or something... Then you have the big ramp to get to TIM's office... Similar to the ramp you walk up to get to the confrontation on the citadel...

I'm not saying any of this is definitive proof of anything... But what if the indoctrination isn't the work of the Reapers, but Cerberus?

Another goofy theory... What if the Shep we play as in ME2 and ME3 isn't the only one out there?
What if YOUR Shep gets zapped by Harby...

... And then we see TIM's indoctrination of the Anti-Shep... A clone he had made while Miranda was working on Project Lazarus- that he DID fit with a control chip, and reaper tech... Tim's upgrades give him complete control of this Anti-Shep... The Citadel scenes are TIM testing his new toy... The weird videos we get shown post choice are memories implanted to make anti-Shep more compliant... The tests allow TIM to see how malleable his new Shep is, how effective his control will be...

If the junk written above doesn't earn me my tin-foil hat, nothing will! Again- I don't believe either of those proposals are fact... And they aren't as well thought out as IT... Just killing time till PAX(!)

Interesting, very interesting.

Certainly a new slant on things.  

 I've actually been thinking of this myself, to some extent. As Shep mentions, s/he isn't sure s/he isn't just a highly advanced VI made to think he is Shep. And, as the Cerberus logs indicate, he was essentially a superheated helmet of brain. Though the body could be regrown, there was no known way of reviving him. The one who worked the "miracle" of actually reviving him was Wilson, who showed his technical prowess in programming all the mechs in the lazarus base site to attack organics on site. Let us not forget TIM's original explanation that Miranda wanted to implant a control chip, but he responds "but we needed the Sheperd that defeated Sovereign." Seems an odd phrasing, though it may be coincidental. Then consider that if he had allowed Miranda to go tinkering, maybe she would have realized how much machine Shep is and how little organic.
 So how would this be rectified with the Destroy ending and breath scene? Well, if he is a/n VI/AI, he could still be approached/indoc'd, like the geth. Also, the parameters of the Crucible's "synthetic/organic" distinction are unknown - maybe the evolved geth would pass for organic, as they are individual, highly developed, and integrating with the Quarians.
  Of course, it would seem Legion might realize all of this when hooking you up to the consensus - but maybe that is why he insists on only Sheperd doing it. Maybe Legion does know, but like with the reaper code bit, doesn't know how the others might react to the knowledge. Or maybe there isn't clear enough a distinction - after all, Shep is the blue print for snythesis between organic and synthetic.

 Anyway, that is just my thoughts.

[Tim Skijwalker]

 really impressive thread!
good job!
*can't wait for Pax! 

[Golferguy758]

Liara confirms that it really is Shepard in TIM's base. Pretty much any LI will, but Liara's is the most assured imo.

[Dendio1]

Will we get a live video stream of bioware answering questions?
We at BSN should give them a question sheet to go down

[Turbotanden]

nyrocron wrote...

Adrenaline increasing indoc. is only for the huskification as that is done via nanites which profit from it. As far as I remember.

2 different things. Adrenalin speeds up indoctrination process. Also, nanites can abuse the spread of adrenalin to move throughout the body to speed up huskification.


Henry Lawson: Using the addictive drug "red sand" to break down the will was inspired, but proved unreliable for general application. We've proven that adrenalin--and it's cross-species equivalents--is moste effective and efficient. The pursuit of efficiency has revealed an important fact: The Reaper's use of "dragon's teeth" to create husks is ingenious. The Reaper nanites attach themselves to the adrenaline released and quickly move through the body to speed conversion to the final husk state.
Miranda: Some refugees are turned into husks. Some are indoctrinated and shipped to the Illusive man.

[nyrocron]

Those speculations about Shep not actually being himself would go in "Revanish" directions, something BioWare could certainly pull off. I don't think that is anything near realistic, but an interesting thought nevertheless. However, I trust Liara when she tells me that I'm "real".

But that it could have something to do with Cerberus, in the base or with something on the Normandy is not too unlikely. Although the alliance checked the Normandy it could be possible for Cerberus to infiltrate it later or something like that. Or even part of the Crew is indoctrinated.

Modifié par nyrocron, 31 mars 2012 - 05:32 .

[Martukis]

Well, I can see the impracticality of it, but I don't find "you are real" all that concrete an answer - especially considering some lines like "You saved my people. You're real enough for me." I don't mean to stray off topic, but I could see Shep being "real" and "alive," but also being a somewhat different entity - mayhaps with the same memories - as the man who survived Feros, Noveria and Virmire. Anyway, I've probably been influenced by watching Videodome recently. But yeah, most likely case is this is a side effect of indoc's toll on Shep, along with the restless nights and such perhaps causing disassociation. That, and the two years lost between ME and ME2.

 Also, in regards to the crew, I certainly felt a chill when I heard the cerberus logs read back the SR-2's crew manifest - I wondered how many of them TIM/cerberus may have done more than contact and brief or persuade to work with Shep. After all, they presumably contacted Ash/Kaiden, yet for some reason they rejected it - maybe on principle, like they said, or maybe because TIM insisted on some other directive or control measure.

Modifié par Martukis, 31 mars 2012 - 05:50 .

[Jadebaby]

Turbotanden wrote...

2 different things. Adrenalin speeds up indoctrination process. Also, nanites can abuse the spread of adrenalin to move throughout the body to speed up huskification.

Miranda: Some refugees are turned into husks. Some are indoctrinated and shipped to the Illusive man.

Though this is true, the last stage of indoctrination is usually huskification.

Adrenaline would have no baring on Indoctrination.

[Quahtli]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

Turbotanden wrote...

2 different things. Adrenalin speeds up indoctrination process. Also, nanites can abuse the spread of adrenalin to move throughout the body to speed up huskification.

Miranda: Some refugees are turned into husks. Some are indoctrinated and shipped to the Illusive man.

Though this is true, the last stage of indoctrination is usually huskification.

Adrenaline would have no baring on Indoctrination.

saren didn't huskificate.

[Quahtli]

DuskRose wrote...

Quahtli wrote...

Jade8aby88 wrote...

Turbotanden wrote...

2 different things. Adrenalin speeds up indoctrination process. Also, nanites can abuse the spread of adrenalin to move throughout the body to speed up huskification.

Miranda: Some refugees are turned into husks. Some are indoctrinated and shipped to the Illusive man.

Though this is true, the last stage of indoctrination is usually huskification.

Adrenaline would have no baring on Indoctrination.

saren didn't huskificate.

Then what did you fight at the end of ME1?

I did not mean it like that. Saren was indoctrinated before he became what he became at the end of ME 1.
(Though imo, he resembled a geth much more than a husk)

[Martukis]

DuskRose wrote...

Quahtli wrote...

Jade8aby88 wrote...

Turbotanden wrote...

2 different things. Adrenalin speeds up indoctrination process. Also, nanites can abuse the spread of adrenalin to move throughout the body to speed up huskification.

Miranda: Some refugees are turned into husks. Some are indoctrinated and shipped to the Illusive man.

Though this is true, the last stage of indoctrination is usually huskification.

Adrenaline would have no baring on Indoctrination.

saren didn't huskificate.

Then what did you fight at the end of ME1?

 The codex and cerberus logs describe two extremes of indoctrination - a relatively quick method, that, while overpowering and effect, leaves little more than a mindless drone capable of simple tasks (a husk) which deteriorates quickly, and a slow, progressive indoctrination. This slower process allows the victim to maintain much more of their higher brain functions and can even be convincingly aware and active - thus incidents like the woman from Virmire, only being realized as indoc'd years later. This also causes a slower deterioration, which can be mitigated with implants and surgery. TIM is an extreme example of this latter part, as he was exposed to reaper tech during the first contact war, whereas the husks climbing down from dragon's teeth are an extreme of the quick form (which is confirmed to be all the quicker in living victims if adrenaline and such are flowing). From what I can tell, Saren, at the end of ME1, if he kills himself, is Sovereign assuming direct control of the massive network of implants and nanides in Saren's body.

[Either.Ardrey]

Quahtli wrote...

How are all of you so blind? The indoctrination theory is completely off.
You see, what really happened is the following:

The Intoxication Theory

Shepard was drunk.
Look at the evidence: whenever possible, Shepard goes to the citadel and starts drinking. But he does not even have to go to the citadel, he will make "yearly traditions" with his doctor (of all people ! ) to drink more alcohol. Also, he actually added a bar after leaving Cerberus, where he keeps hundreds of emergency induction ports.

The evidence is all there.

Then how do you explain my sober, never-drank-alcohol-ever Shepard getting the same ending(s)?