57139 réponses à ce sujet

[Jadebaby]

oh haha, didn't see the 'pretend' part lol...

I have something mind-blowing for you...

I can tell what you're thinking....

You're thinking, "yea right, this'll be good"... now you're thinking... "How does she know what I am thinking?"... "Now a single word has popped into your head"..... Speculation!

[Emperor_Ike]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

Assuming indoc is true what do you think the reapers final motivation would be for doing their 'cycle'?

I'd like to see it as them preserving organics because they need them to survive themselves.. It's like fuel to a car or something.... That would put them back in the book of being most evil and menacing.. instead of babysitters.

That's a tough one. I mean, Sovereign said their motivations, indeed that they themselves as beings, were beyond a simple organic's comprehension. That could be because they never tried explaining, pure hubris kind of thing, but even so... Even 'survival' in and of itself isn't inherently evil as a goal. And we already know they can survive thousands of years in dark space. They don't harvest resources that we know of except for genetic material, and if they did, no life would grow anyway, what with as long as this cycle has gone on. Needing fuel to continue the cycle simply to continue the cycle... That's pretty dark. Why do it? Guh. Does evil need a why, and could decent folk think of what that reason could possibly be?

Not a cop-out. Seriously. What the smell would have to be wrong with you to make you want to kill and paste-ify just to continue killing and paste-ifying?

"Where is everyone?"
"They have been consumed."
GUH.

[Big G13]

JadeBaby88 is assuming control.

[Emperor_Ike]

Big G13 wrote...

JadeBaby88 is assuming control.

Pure gold, combined with it being after 5 am, and lex0r11 and Jade's back-and-forth, ahhh it's good to laugh.

<3s all around

[Spectre-61]

Good day to you all!

Anything new in the last 20 hours?
Or the usual?

[BWSocial]

After all I have read and seen, I too believe the ending must be an indoctrination attempt. It has to be.

There are however some questions that keep bugging me and I can't find an answer to myself. Sorry if those have already been explained but I havent read ALL of the posts .

WHEN exactly, and WHY would Harbinger even try to do a fast emergency indoctrination?
Because if Shep is lying half-dead and unconscious in London, just killing Shep at this point seems far more effective, if not as effective.
Unless ofc, Harbinger being at the site is ALSO part of the indoctrination attempt. If it is not at the site in reality, I could understand why it is trying to indoctrinate as some sort of emergency longer distance defense. OR...Harbinger realizes he cannot get a clear shot on Shep and cannot stoop him with his guns and thus tries to fast-indoctrinate. WHICH would render Shep motionless for some time, enough to get a clear shot at him (???).
So why not just kill him instead? Are they afraid of martyrdom? Hmmmm.... Maybe that isn't too far-fetched at all. The united galactic forces still have a fair shot at destroying the reapers (they still have the crucible etc.).

Alternatively I can understand an indoctrination attempt (as a last resort defense) if Shep is physically present in the citadel and no Reaper can kill him anymore with big guns.
THIS however makes me ponder why Shep wakes up in London after destroying the Reapers (and all synthetic life??), including the mass-relays and the citadel itself, where Shep was on! How could he survive that and end up in London?

If anyone has an answer to any of this please post.

[lex0r11]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

oh haha, didn't see the 'pretend' part lol...

I have something mind-blowing for you...

I can tell what you're thinking....

You're
thinking, "yea right, this'll be good"... now you're thinking... "How
does she know what I am thinking?"... "Now a single word has popped into
your head"..... Speculation!

Big G13 wrote...

JadeBaby88 is assuming control.

Yeah, i saw that befo.. wait.

[Jadebaby]

Emperor_Ike wrote...

Big G13 wrote...

JadeBaby88 is assuming control.

Pure gold, combined with it being after 5 am, and lex0r11 and Jade's back-and-forth, ahhh it's good to laugh.

<3s all around

It's only 8:30pm here... I wish I had an excuse to act the way I do.. Oh wait, I forgot I was still in stage 1 denial over the ending... That's sufficient enough I think .

[RorickHuon]

BWSocial wrote...

After all I have read and seen, I too believe the ending must be an indoctrination attempt. It has to be.

There are however some questions that keep bugging me and I can't find an answer to myself. Sorry if those have already been explained but I havent read ALL of the posts .

WHEN exactly, and WHY would Harbinger even try to do a fast emergency indoctrination?
Because if Shep is lying half-dead and unconscious in London, just killing Shep at this point seems far more effective, if not as effective.
Unless ofc, Harbinger being at the site is ALSO part of the indoctrination attempt. If it is not at the site in reality, I could understand why it is trying to indoctrinate as some sort of emergency longer distance defense. OR...Harbinger realizes he cannot get a clear shot on Shep and cannot stoop him with his guns and thus tries to fast-indoctrinate. WHICH would render Shep motionless for some time, enough to get a clear shot at him (???).
So why not just kill him instead? Are they afraid of martyrdom? Hmmmm.... Maybe that isn't too far-fetched at all. The united galactic forces still have a fair shot at destroying the reapers (they still have the crucible etc.).

Alternatively I can understand an indoctrination attempt (as a last resort defense) if Shep is physically present in the citadel and no Reaper can kill him anymore with big guns.
THIS however makes me ponder why Shep wakes up in London after destroying the Reapers (and all synthetic life??), including the mass-relays and the citadel itself, where Shep was on! How could he survive that and end up in London?

If anyone has an answer to any of this please post.

"What greater weapon is there than to turn an enemy to your cause? To use their own knowledge against them?[/i]" -Bastilla Shan
By adding Shepard to their side *espically with a  high EMS* it will do more damage to the moral of the civilizations  than just killing him. The reapers have been interested in Shepard since ME1, they wouldn't let a prize go so easily. 

[lex0r11]

BWSocial wrote...

After all I have read and seen, I too believe the ending must be an indoctrination attempt. It has to be.

There are however some questions that keep bugging me and I can't find an answer to myself. Sorry if those have already been explained but I havent read ALL of the posts .

WHEN exactly, and WHY would Harbinger even try to do a fast emergency indoctrination?
Because if Shep is lying half-dead and unconscious in London, just killing Shep at this point seems far more effective, if not as effective.
Unless ofc, Harbinger being at the site is ALSO part of the indoctrination attempt. If it is not at the site in reality, I could understand why it is trying to indoctrinate as some sort of emergency longer distance defense. OR...Harbinger realizes he cannot get a clear shot on Shep and cannot stoop him with his guns and thus tries to fast-indoctrinate. WHICH would render Shep motionless for some time, enough to get a clear shot at him (???).
So why not just kill him instead? Are they afraid of martyrdom? Hmmmm.... Maybe that isn't too far-fetched at all. The united galactic forces still have a fair shot at destroying the reapers (they still have the crucible etc.).

Alternatively I can understand an indoctrination attempt (as a last resort defense) if Shep is physically present in the citadel and no Reaper can kill him anymore with big guns.
THIS however makes me ponder why Shep wakes up in London after destroying the Reapers (and all synthetic life??), including the mass-relays and the citadel itself, where Shep was on! How could he survive that and end up in London?

If anyone has an answer to any of this please post.

Think about it. Harbinger kept insisting thoughout ME2 Shepard had so stay alive. Imagine what would happen to the war if Shepard were to be indoctrinated and everyone would hear about it. The hero who united the galaxy now fighting against them? The despair would utterly destroy them. What hope can they have if the best of them is taken down? The reapers need an edge. Why else use sleeper agents? They did it with the protheans and the war took them centuries. And this time the whole galaxy is fighting them at once.

In addition, think about the indoctrination codex entry, talking about how devastating it can be if the reapers were to control politicians OR important figures.

Modifié par lex0r11, 03 avril 2012 - 10:45 .

[Big G13]

[quote]Jade8aby88 wrote...

[quote]Emperor_Ike wrote...

[quote]Big G13 wrote...

JadeBaby88 is assuming control. [/quote]

Pure gold, combined with it being after 5 am, and lex0r11 and Jade's back-and-forth, ahhh it's good to laugh.

<3s all around
[/quote]

It's only 8:30pm here... I wish I had an excuse to act the way I do.. Oh wait, I forgot I was still in stage 1 denial over the ending... That's sufficient enough I think [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/joyful.png[/smilie]what ever you have to tell yourself is fine. we support you.

Modifié par Big G13, 03 avril 2012 - 10:44 .

[BinaryHelix101]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

It's only 8:30pm here... I wish I had an excuse to act the way I do.. Oh wait, I forgot I was still in stage 1 denial over the ending... That's sufficient enough I think .

Still at one, eh. I breezed through all 5 phases in a week.

1) This can't be the ending

2) God **** it this is really the ending! RAAAARGH!

3) DLC, you say?

4) I can't believe they did this *sob*

5) It's just a game (but yeah, it's in the best series of all time so it's not quite that simple)

[Emperor_Ike]

BWSocial wrote...
After all I have read and seen, I too believe the ending must be an indoctrination attempt. It has to be.

There are however some questions that keep bugging me and I can't find an answer to myself. Sorry if those have already been explained but I havent read ALL of the posts .

WHEN exactly, and WHY would Harbinger even try to do a fast emergency indoctrination?
Because if Shep is lying half-dead and unconscious in London, just killing Shep at this point seems far more effective, if not as effective.
Unless ofc, Harbinger being at the site is ALSO part of the indoctrination attempt. If it is not at the site in reality, I could understand why it is trying to indoctrinate as some sort of emergency longer distance defense. OR...Harbinger realizes he cannot get a clear shot on Shep and cannot stoop him with his guns and thus tries to fast-indoctrinate. WHICH would render Shep motionless for some time, enough to get a clear shot at him (???).
So why not just kill him instead? Are they afraid of martyrdom? Hmmmm.... Maybe that isn't too far-fetched at all. The united galactic forces still have a fair shot at destroying the reapers (they still have the crucible etc.).

Alternatively I can understand an indoctrination attempt (as a last resort defense) if Shep is physically present in the citadel and no Reaper can kill him anymore with big guns.
THIS however makes me ponder why Shep wakes up in London after destroying the Reapers (and all synthetic life??), including the mass-relays and the citadel itself, where Shep was on! How could he survive that and end up in London?

If anyone has an answer to any of this please post.

The hasty attempt is due to a couple things.
One, they know their doom is at hand, haHA! No, really. It'd be really chancy to try it at this stage and stinks of last-ditch effort on the Reapers' part. That said.. Two, adrenaline is an enormous inroad for indoctrination. TIM's experiments proved that. If there's one chemical you've got coursing through your body as you're running toward a giant doom-laser-spitting robot, after having said goodbye to the crew you've come to love, and with the fate of an entire galaxy on the line, it's certainly adrenaline.
So yes, Harby really is there, he really is blasting at your general area, and it'd be silly to think he couldn't pick you out of a crowd when he's precision-blasting all those other poor sods and vehicles around you. He wants you vulnerable because this is the closest he's gotten to claiming the Great Shepard since his Collectors blew up SR1 and somehow botched either killing or picking up the body. He displayed great interest in capturing Shepard alive after or perhaps because of that incident, and hoo-boy what an opportunity now.

"The pest runs toward me, as if begging to become one with the Cycle. Victory is mine, if only I can curb-stomp that pesky apparent resistance to my shining figu-- I mean brain-beams!"

[Jadebaby]

BWSocial wrote...

After all I have read and seen, I too believe the ending must be an indoctrination attempt. It has to be.

There are however some questions that keep bugging me and I can't find an answer to myself. Sorry if those have already been explained but I havent read ALL of the posts .

WHEN exactly, and WHY would Harbinger even try to do a fast emergency indoctrination?

It's not a fast emergency indoctrination, it would have been happening for a while over the previous 6 months in between games... (maybe they'll release books later explaining). Or maybe it was always there "hidden" and now that all the stress of war is coming out in Shepard so is the presense of indoctrination.

BWSocial wrote...

Because if Shep is lying half-dead and unconscious in London, just killing Shep at this point seems far more effective, if not as effective.

Harbinger has always had a special affection to Shepard... It's cute really, like a crush. He wants superior victory through indoctrinating Shepard... More over, Shepard is a symbol of hope and faith for an entire galaxy... Indoctrination of such an entity could win the war in itself. Take Harbinger's "preserve shepards body" quote from ME2... It's clear they had it planned. Disregard "If I must tear you apart Shepard, I will" this is merely a threat.

BWSocial wrote...
Unless ofc, Harbinger being at the site is ALSO part of the indoctrination attempt. If it is not at the site in reality, I could understand why it is trying to indoctrinate as some sort of emergency longer distance defense.

This is interesting but I don't think it's plausible as you could never tell when it crossed from being real to a dream. Once the laser hits that's where the doubt starts.

BWSocial wrote...
THIS however makes me ponder why Shep wakes up in London after destroying the Reapers (and all synthetic life??), including the mass-relays and the citadel itself, where Shep was on! How could he survive that and end up in London?

Exactly, there's no way it's possible. Furthermore I don't think you've destroyed all synthetic life, I think that was a trick used by the catalyst to sued you from picking Destroy, note how he also says Shep will probably die too.

BWSocial wrote...
If anyone has an answer to any of this please post.

Hope this helped.

[Emperor_Ike]

Jade8aby88 wrote...
It's only 8:30pm here... I wish I had an excuse to act the way I do.. Oh
wait, I forgot I was still in stage 1 denial over the ending... That's
sufficient enough I think ../../../images/forum/emoticons/joyful.png.

That'll do; that'll do.

[Jadebaby]

BinaryHelix101 wrote...

Still at one, eh. I breezed through all 5 phases in a week.

1) This can't be the ending

2) God **** it this is really the ending! RAAAARGH!

3) DLC, you say?

4) I can't believe they did this *sob*

5) It's just a game (but yeah, it's in the best series of all time so it's not quite that simple)

lol yes I think I got to stage 2 about 2 weeks ago because all the jokes had run out... But then I found indoc and that pulled me from being angry to being ignorant. Which has kept me in denial... Although it could be argued whether this is acceptance or not.

[nightcobra]

Emperor_Ike wrote...

Jade8aby88 wrote...

Assuming indoc is true what do you think the reapers final motivation would be for doing their 'cycle'?

I'd like to see it as them preserving organics because they need them to survive themselves.. It's like fuel to a car or something.... That would put them back in the book of being most evil and menacing.. instead of babysitters.

That's a tough one. I mean, Sovereign said their motivations, indeed that they themselves as beings, were beyond a simple organic's comprehension. That could be because they never tried explaining, pure hubris kind of thing, but even so... Even 'survival' in and of itself isn't inherently evil as a goal. And we already know they can survive thousands of years in dark space. They don't harvest resources that we know of except for genetic material, and if they did, no life would grow anyway, what with as long as this cycle has gone on. Needing fuel to continue the cycle simply to continue the cycle... That's pretty dark. Why do it? Guh. Does evil need a why, and could decent folk think of what that reason could possibly be?

Not a cop-out. Seriously. What the smell would have to be wrong with you to make you want to kill and paste-ify just to continue killing and paste-ifying?

"Where is everyone?"
"They have been consumed."
GUH.

in nature, symmetry in a species is its doom, perhaps it's similar for the reapers with 50000 years being the time it takes for their species to become "symetric", similar to each other and not much different between individuals by their standards. so their answer to this problem would be to integrate new organic material onto their race (lest we forget that though they are machines they are also organic) and keep their race from becoming stagnant.  

[lex0r11]

BinaryHelix101 wrote...

Jade8aby88 wrote...

It's only 8:30pm here... I wish I had an excuse to act the way I do.. Oh wait, I forgot I was still in stage 1 denial over the ending... That's sufficient enough I think .

Still at one, eh. I breezed through all 5 phases in a week.

1) This can't be the ending

2) God **** it this is really the ending! RAAAARGH!

3) DLC, you say?

4) I can't believe they did this *sob*

5) It's just a game (but yeah, it's in the best series of all time so it's not quite that simple)

I won't allow anymore people getting to last stage until PAX where we get a final statement without any PR speak.



Or Marauder Shields will have died in vain.

Modifié par lex0r11, 03 avril 2012 - 10:54 .

[Emperor_Ike]

Jade8aby88 wrote...
A whooooole bunch, and prolly better than I

Yes, they've definitely been wearing down Shep's mental defenses for months now, presumably starting when leaving Earth. But I feel the actual honest-to-gozer attempt to break Shepard's mind, to take over and say, once and for all, "You mine, k?" is definitely just 'now,' for lack of a better word. Anti-divine Providence. Harby happens to be at the beam that you happen to be running for because you happen to think it's the light at the end of the happen tunnel.

As it happens, happen has lost all meaning and is now a random collection of letters that honestly look rather silly together.

[lex0r11]

Emperor_Ike wrote...

Jade8aby88 wrote...
A whooooole bunch, and prolly better than I

Yes, they've definitely been wearing down Shep's mental defenses for months now, presumably starting when leaving Earth. But I feel the actual honest-to-gozer attempt to break Shepard's mind, to take over and say, once and for all, "You mine, k?" is definitely just 'now,' for lack of a better word. Anti-divine Providence. Harby happens to be at the beam that you happen to be running for because you happen to think it's the light at the end of the happen tunnel.

As it happens, happen has lost all meaning and is now a random collection of letters that honestly look rather silly together.

You guys are making my head hurt. ^^'

[Big G13]

BWSocial wrote...

After all I have read and seen, I too believe the ending must be an indoctrination attempt. It has to be.

There are however some questions that keep bugging me and I can't find an answer to myself. Sorry if those have already been explained but I havent read ALL of the posts .

WHEN exactly, and WHY would Harbinger even try to do a fast emergency indoctrination?
Because if Shep is lying half-dead and unconscious in London, just killing Shep at this point seems far more effective, if not as effective.
Unless ofc, Harbinger being at the site is ALSO part of the indoctrination attempt. If it is not at the site in reality, I could understand why it is trying to indoctrinate as some sort of emergency longer distance defense. OR...Harbinger realizes he cannot get a clear shot on Shep and cannot stoop him with his guns and thus tries to fast-indoctrinate. WHICH would render Shep motionless for some time, enough to get a clear shot at him (???).
So why not just kill him instead? Are they afraid of martyrdom? Hmmmm.... Maybe that isn't too far-fetched at all. The united galactic forces still have a fair shot at destroying the reapers (they still have the crucible etc.).

Alternatively I can understand an indoctrination attempt (as a last resort defense) if Shep is physically present in the citadel and no Reaper can kill him anymore with big guns.
THIS however makes me ponder why Shep wakes up in London after destroying the Reapers (and all synthetic life??), including the mass-relays and the citadel itself, where Shep was on! How could he survive that and end up in London?

If anyone has an answer to any of this please post.

After all I've read here I look at it like a movie. Once Shep is hit by the laser, time is suspended. The story shifts focus from the physical battle to the mental battle. Which has been going on all along. Every thing that happens after the laser takes place in Shep's mind while she/he is in the rubble. And what ever you decide in your mind will affect what happens in the physical battle after the DLC comes out. Hope, Hope, Hope.

[Jadebaby]

nightcobra8928 wrote...

in nature, symmetry in a species is its doom, perhaps it's similar for the reapers with 50000 years being the time it takes for their species to become "symetric", similar to each other and not much different between individuals by their standards. so their answer to this problem would be to integrate new organic material onto their race (lest we forget that though they are machines they are also organic) and keep their race from becoming stagnant.  

This is awesome^ and it would add to both their sophisticated technology trait and to Sovereign's whole speech about them being evil-ass mofo's trait.

[Jadebaby]

Emperor_Ike wrote...

Jade8aby88 wrote...
A whooooole bunch, and prolly better than I

Yes, they've definitely been wearing down Shep's mental defenses for months now, presumably starting when leaving Earth. But I feel the actual honest-to-gozer attempt to break Shepard's mind, to take over and say, once and for all, "You mine, k?" is definitely just 'now,' for lack of a better word. Anti-divine Providence. Harby happens to be at the beam that you happen to be running for because you happen to think it's the light at the end of the happen tunnel.

As it happens, happen has lost all meaning and is now a random collection of letters that honestly look rather silly together.

This^  [----------------------------->
|
|
|
|
My head [------------------------------]

lol now it feels like it's 5am here.

[Big G13]

lex0r11 wrote...

Emperor_Ike wrote...

Jade8aby88 wrote...
A whooooole bunch, and prolly better than I

Yes, they've definitely been wearing down Shep's mental defenses for months now, presumably starting when leaving Earth. But I feel the actual honest-to-gozer attempt to break Shepard's mind, to take over and say, once and for all, "You mine, k?" is definitely just 'now,' for lack of a better word. Anti-divine Providence. Harby happens to be at the beam that you happen to be running for because you happen to think it's the light at the end of the happen tunnel.

As it happens, happen has lost all meaning and is now a random collection of letters that honestly look rather silly together.

You guys are making my head hurt. ^^'

Just look at your baby picture post. It'll make it all better.

[Emperor_Ike]

nightcobra8928 wrote...
in nature, symmetry in a species is its doom, perhaps it's similar for the reapers with 50000 years being the time it takes for their species to become "symetric", similar to each other and not much different between individuals by their standards. so their answer to this problem would be to integrate new organic material onto their race (lest we forget that though they are machines they are also organic) and keep their race from becoming stagnant.

My kind transcends your very understanding. We are each a nation. Independent, free of all weakness. You cannot even grasp the nature of our existence. We have no beginning. We have no end. We are infinite. Millions of years after your civilization has been eradicated and forgotten, we will endure. We impose order on the chaos of organic evolution. You exist because we allow it. And you will end because we demand it.

Also, each Reaper is a specie-specific.. shell, like the human larva at the end of ME2, residing in one of those space-faring ships that look like bugs. They're organic, but they have no need of reproduction beyond harvesting to create more shell-larvae.

Consumed.

Edit: comment from youtube vid of the convo with Sovereign: "Sovereign was probably rolling over in his grave as the god child explained the Reaper's true reasoning."

Gracious me, how true.

Modifié par Emperor_Ike, 03 avril 2012 - 11:08 .