57139 réponses à ce sujet

[Jadebaby]

GBGriffin wrote...

Yes, that is my point. IT is not true, and the game as it stands came about as a combination of a rushed product and bad writing/design. They're defense of the endings as is, and their reaction overall, confirms this for me.

I actually agree with you on this, but that's what led me to believe in Indoctrination. The evidence supporting it, just as I believed it was a rushed product based on the evidence supporting that. Think about it, if it was such a rushed product and shotty writing, why would they give the starchild layers with shep/femshep voices when they could just add tweeks?
Their view of the ending as a company was always going to support their product.
But you have to remember that Indoc is based off what they gave us, a lot of it is suspect. Mainly because of their promises.
Also the ending, they said, had been planned for years.

If you look around enough you might be surprised.

GBGriffin wrote...

Again, the evidence for IT came about after the theory was formed. The evidence did not form the theory.

 
No it didn't, because the first piece of evidence that formed the theory, was Shepard waking up in London.

GBGriffin wrote...
People proposed the idea and then went back to twist game elements to make it work, while simultaneously discarding any evidence to the contrary.

Maybe you could elaborate on discarding the contrary?

[UrgedDuke]

GBGriffin wrote...

DashingSplash wrote...


I'd hope that you would understand what both I, Jade and other told you.
Be the better man/woman and let it go. He made, according to you, a mistake. You know this, is it not enough?
Or do you enjoy "Humans on their knees." as EDI put it?

No, you're right. That is fair enough. He made a mistake, I caught him, and, while his admission of such would be nice, I can move on without it.

Sheesh, that was exhausting.

Thank God

[GBGriffin]

balance5050 wrote...


No, it leaves the other two endings open to incredible renegade "ruling the universe using the reapers" option and a truly bad ending where the reapers control shepard and win.
 

Unfortunately, this points to another issue with IT: there are multiple versions.

n some of my previous threads, people insisted that the other two choices would reward a game over only because Shep became indoctrinated. That, I disgaree with. If all three had approximately the same amount of content and didn't punish the player for choosing them...then I'd support that.

I like your interpretation because it sounds like there would be actual content, not just "Game Over. Reload and pick Destroy!"

[balance5050]

GBGriffin wrote...

DashingSplash wrote...


I'd hope that you would understand what both I, Jade and other told you.
Be the better man/woman and let it go. He made, according to you, a mistake. You know this, is it not enough?
Or do you enjoy "Humans on their knees." as EDI put it?

No, you're right. That is fair enough. He made a mistake, I caught him, and, while his admission of such would be nice, I can move on without it.

Sheesh, that was exhausting.

Ok, now I think your love for NooB is just getting embarassing for you. Watch yourself NooB, this one is sneaky <3:devil:

[Gilgamesh117]

I believe in IT

[n00bsauce2010]

GBGriffin wrote...

DashingSplash wrote...


I'd hope that you would understand what both I, Jade and other told you.
Be the better man/woman and let it go. He made, according to you, a mistake. You know this, is it not enough?
Or do you enjoy "Humans on their knees." as EDI put it?

No, you're right. That is fair enough. He made a mistake, I caught him, and, while his admission of such would be nice, I can move on without it.

Sheesh, that was exhausting.

I've explained it twice for you. Selective replying yes?

[DashingSplash]

GBGriffin wrote...

No, you're right. That is fair enough. He made a mistake, I caught him, and, while his admission of such would be nice, I can move on without it.

Sheesh, that was exhausting.

(:

[Jadebaby]

lex0r11 wrote...

All this hate is ruining my breakfast!



Now I need motivation. Imagine how that makes me feel. IMAGINE.

You know everytime I see this pic from now on I'm going to think, 'hey it's lex0r...'

Also if Stanley Woo patrolled this thread there would be SOO many...

*Violation of rule #6. Removed

[DashingSplash]

n00bsauce2010 wrote...
I've explained it twice for you. Selective replying yes?

No need to add fuel to the fire, and GB if you read this.
Ignore his statement, please.

[UrgedDuke]

If they made you reload and pick red option it would be like Broken Steel in Fallout

[balance5050]

GBGriffin wrote...

balance5050 wrote...


No, it leaves the other two endings open to incredible renegade "ruling the universe using the reapers" option and a truly bad ending where the reapers control shepard and win.
 

Unfortunately, this points to another issue with IT: there are multiple versions.

n some of my previous threads, people insisted that the other two choices would reward a game over only because Shep became indoctrinated. That, I disgaree with. If all three had approximately the same amount of content and didn't punish the player for choosing them...then I'd support that.

I like your interpretation because it sounds like there would be actual content, not just "Game Over. Reload and pick Destroy!"

Every ending has been valid in I.T. for the longest time. First in this thread, then in the 4chan leak (which showed the multiplayer expansion we saw today), and even in the "final hours" app it alluded to that ending. So it's not just my interpretation.

[UrgentArchengel]

Right now I am:
60%-Bioware failed and will try to clean up everything as best they can
30%-Indoctrination Theory
10%-Will cancel DLC extention because they prefer MP fans instead.

[GBGriffin]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

GBGriffin wrote...

Yes, that is my point. IT is not true, and the game as it stands came about as a combination of a rushed product and bad writing/design. They're defense of the endings as is, and their reaction overall, confirms this for me.

I actually agree with you on this, but that's what led me to believe in Indoctrination. The evidence supporting it, just as I believed it was a rushed product based on the evidence supporting that. Think about it, if it was such a rushed product and shotty writing, why would they give the starchild layers with shep/femshep voices when they could just add tweeks?
Their view of the ending as a company was always going to support their product.
But you have to remember that Indoc is based off what they gave us, a lot of it is suspect. Mainly because of their promises.
Also the ending, they said, had been planned for years.

If you look around enough you might be surprised.

GBGriffin wrote...

Again, the evidence for IT came about after the theory was formed. The evidence did not form the theory.

 
No it didn't, because the first piece of evidence that formed the theory, was Shepard waking up in London.

GBGriffin wrote...
People proposed the idea and then went back to twist game elements to make it work, while simultaneously discarding any evidence to the contrary.

Maybe you could elaborate on discarding the contrary?

To address your last point first, I've actually done so earlier in this thread, a few pages back. Sure enough, it was dimissed, but I do consider it to be evidence to the contrary.

Now, as for the rest:

Consider your second point: the theory was formed with the second to last video clip, Shepard waking up. That, by itself, formed the theory. People then went back through all 3 games to support that theory. If it was truly intended, why not make it more obvious so that the theory was formed during the game proper, not once it actually ended?

My point is this: People came up with the theory, then worked backwards to prove it. It's like Nostradamus's prophecies: they are only true in hindsight. This theory only works in hindsight; there was nothing leading up to the indoctrination theory before that scene, but once the scene happened, people went back to make it make sense. The theory predated the evidence; the evidence did not form the theory by itself. Fans had to make the evidence fit the theory.

[n00bsauce2010]

UrgedDuke wrote...

If they made you reload and pick red option it would be like Broken Steel in Fallout

He can only be reuinted with love interest if he lives (unless of course it was cortez) In reality making one choice more "correct" then others.

[GBGriffin]

n00bsauce2010 wrote...


I've explained it twice for you. Selective replying yes?

Again, I refuse to get back into this, so I'll simply say this much:

You do not present your arguments as clearly as you think they do. While they make sense to you, your point does not come across as soundly as it probably does in your head.

That being said, expect no future replies

[lex0r11]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

You know everytime I see this pic from now on I'm going to think, 'hey it's lex0r...'

Also if Stanley Woo patrolled this thread there would be SOO many...

*Violation of rule #6. Removed

Please, you can't compare me to legendary Cereal Guy.

And i would probably be already vaporized for all my pictures.



Or they are letting me do it.

[Jadebaby]

GBGriffin wrote...

UrgedDuke wrote...

IT is the best possible expatiation

Nope. It actually has several issues with it.

For one, as it stands, it invalidates the current endings and makes the other two options "incorrect".

NO! It does not! It makes them genius' because they just Indoctrinated you in real life! By presenting you with choices that seem like good ideas but have both been tested before "Saren and TIM".

GBGriffin wrote...

Without additional gameplay, two scenes would essentially be game overs because even the people who pick Control and Synthesis don't want their Shep to become indoctrinated.

IT only favors the people who pick Destroy. That isn't a balanced ending.

You seem to be hanging on to the no gameplay angle.. can you provide a link for evidence?

[UrgedDuke]

n00bsauce2010 wrote...

UrgedDuke wrote...

If they made you reload and pick red option it would be like Broken Steel in Fallout

He can only be reuinted with love interest if he lives (unless of course it was cortez) In reality making one choice more "correct" then others.

yea but you would be punishing players that picked green or blue

[Fhaarkas]

GBGriffin wrote...

balance5050 wrote...


No, it leaves the other two endings open to incredible renegade "ruling the universe using the reapers" option and a truly bad ending where the reapers control shepard and win.
 

Unfortunately, this points to another issue with IT: there are multiple versions.

n some of my previous threads, people insisted that the other two choices would reward a game over only because Shep became indoctrinated. That, I disgaree with. If all three had approximately the same amount of content and didn't punish the player for choosing them...then I'd support that.

I like your interpretation because it sounds like there would be actual content, not just "Game Over. Reload and pick Destroy!"

I think the only crux of IT that really matters is the question - was it real? The differing versions/expectations come after.

Edit: Of course, either way the players were indoctrinated all right. 

Modifié par Fhaarkas, 07 avril 2012 - 06:01 .

[balance5050]

GBGriffin wrote...

"Again, the evidence for IT came about after the theory was formed. The evidence did not form the theory"


I.T. has always been in the game... All three games... You must be confused... U thinking of Halo?

[n00bsauce2010]

GBGriffin wrote...

n00bsauce2010 wrote...


I've explained it twice for you. Selective replying yes?

Again, I refuse to get back into this, so I'll simply say this much:

You do not present your arguments as clearly as you think they do. While they make sense to you, your point does not come across as soundly as it probably does in your head.

That being said, expect no future replies
___________________________

To address your last point first, I've actually done so earlier in this
thread, a few pages back. Sure enough, it was dimissed, but I do
consider it to be evidence to the contrary.

Expects others to go back and look at older posts.. but won't do the same for others. I don't understand the logic in this one.

[lex0r11]

I think some here are just comparing.. well, you know what at this point to see who is better.












Please don't hurt me!

Modifié par lex0r11, 07 avril 2012 - 06:03 .

[n00bsauce2010]

UrgedDuke wrote...

n00bsauce2010 wrote...

UrgedDuke wrote...

If they made you reload and pick red option it would be like Broken Steel in Fallout

He can only be reuinted with love interest if he lives (unless of course it was cortez) In reality making one choice more "correct" then others.

yea but you would be punishing players that picked green or blue

Are we referring to the ending according to indoctrination theory? or what bioware has said about the extended cut?

[Lyria]

GBGriffin wrote...

UrgedDuke wrote...

IT is the best possible expatiation

Nope. It actually has several issues with it.

For one, as it stands, it invalidates the current endings and makes the other two options "incorrect". Without additional gameplay, two scenes would essentially be game overs because even the people who pick Control and Synthesis don't want their Shep to become indoctrinated.

IT only favors the people who pick Destroy. That isn't a balanced ending.

Not this S*** again?  Seriously, the same tired argument.  The other endings are invalidated?  No it just means the player failed.  And IT works with the other endings.  Control means you were controlled and a puppet of the Reapers, Sythesis means you messed with the Reapers and they had to trick you into something that was a win/win scenario since you had too much EMS. Understand what the endings mean in terms of IT before you try to troll.
The other two options are just as correct as destroy.  

Saying there is no balance in the ending if only one choice is correct is a straw man arguemnt if I've ever saw one.
There is no balance in any of the endings.  ME1 your choice of human council member was either what Bioware wanted, Udina, or the "incorrect" choice of Anderson.  If you picked Anderson, that choice was invalidated in ME3.
ME2 had several options that all depended on the player's ability.  If Shepard died it was because the Player failed.  If crew members died, it was because the player failed.  And the destroy the collector base option was the "incorrect" choice because regardless of the player's choice, The Illusiveman still got his reaper goodies.  He still won.  That choice was invalidated so the only real choice was to keep the Collector base.

So don't come in here, talking the same tired arguments without the basics of IT down and with an argument of balance when non of the endings were balanced and many of the players choices were invalidated as Bioware needed to make certain choices canon.

Modifié par protognosis, 07 avril 2012 - 06:04 .

[balance5050]

Fhaarkas wrote...

GBGriffin wrote...

balance5050 wrote...


No, it leaves the other two endings open to incredible renegade "ruling the universe using the reapers" option and a truly bad ending where the reapers control shepard and win.
 

Unfortunately, this points to another issue with IT: there are multiple versions.

n some of my previous threads, people insisted that the other two choices would reward a game over only because Shep became indoctrinated. That, I disgaree with. If all three had approximately the same amount of content and didn't punish the player for choosing them...then I'd support that.

I like your interpretation because it sounds like there would be actual content, not just "Game Over. Reload and pick Destroy!"

I think the only crux of IT that really matters is the question - was it real? The differing versions/expectations come after.

Edit: Of course, either way the players were indoctrinated all right. 

Indeed, all the endings could be "real" for the player that chose them. But what will the ending be for the player that gets the "Shep_Alive" ending. Was it real? only for those that are alive I guess:blush:.

Modifié par balance5050, 07 avril 2012 - 06:05 .