57139 réponses à ce sujet

[DirtyPhoenix]

Arian Dynas wrote...

spotlessvoid wrote...

Mordin is thoroughly paragon. I think that's why, along with plenty of other reasons, many of us love his character. He is the only one who seems as really selfless like a full paragon Shepard.

It seemed like he is of equal moral standing to Shepard

Mordin is... difficult.

He's motivated by noble goals, save as many people as possible, eliminate threats to them.

But at the same time he's also prone to takeing direct "pragmatic" and cynical routes, killing poeple to protect others as a first resort, the work he did on the genophage, ect.

He is firmly...

Paragade 

Paragade ftw!

[Legion109]

A whole Arian post devoted to me - blush - so honored.

[Sajuro]

byne wrote...

Big Bad wrote...


That definitely fits in with the bleak tone of the game, but damn it's harsh.  And Mordin too, that scene brought some (very manly) tears to my eyes!

I guess that even with how terrible the ending is (if IT isn't true), it's a testament to Bioware's skills that they can create characters that we care so deeply about.  There aren't many stories - in any medium - that can pull on the heartstrings like Mass Effect does.

Its actually possible for Mordin to live.

1: Kill Wrex in ME1.
2: Destroy Maelon's research in ME2.
3: Dont tell Wreav and Eve about the STG Sabotage
4: Have high enough reputation to persuade Mordin that curing the Krogan is wrong.

Gotta sacrifice an entire species, including having Wrex and Eve die, but you get to save Mordin.

you monster /jk not really

[Arian Dynas]

Legion109 wrote...

A whole Arian post devoted to me - blush - so honored.

Aww... I've not become that much of a celebrity that you are honored by this, am I?

[byne]

Arian Dynas wrote...

6) Showers with clothes on - yeah I guess it makes sense to Bioware.

Dafuq?

The Traynor Romance scene

[Arian Dynas]

byne wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

6) Showers with clothes on - yeah I guess it makes sense to Bioware.

Dafuq?

The Traynor Romance scene

Oh, well then in that case, 2 explanations.

Explanation 1: in the military it's usual practice to either wear bathing suits and sandals in public showers to avoid transmitting athelete's foot or various other fungi/parasites.

Or Explanation 2: The damn thing is rated M, not XO.

[byne]

Arian Dynas wrote...

byne wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

6) Showers with clothes on - yeah I guess it makes sense to Bioware.

Dafuq?

The Traynor Romance scene

Oh, well then in that case, 2 explanations.

Explanation 1: in the military it's usual practice to either wear bathing suits and sandals in public showers to avoid transmitting athelete's foot or various other fungi/parasites.

Or Explanation 2: The damn thing is rated M, not XO.

I dont see why they didnt just position the camera in a way that doesnt show anything naughty though. Liara is naked in her romance scene, they just dont show anything.

Also, its Shepard's private shower, not a public one.

Modifié par byne, 14 avril 2012 - 06:49 .

[spotlessvoid]

Coding underpants on a character is not a result of laziness.
Misguided and laughably hypocritical, yes.

Edit: Agree with byne, it's so silly. Even a sliver of creativity with camera angles would have been a simple solution.

Modifié par spotlessvoid, 14 avril 2012 - 06:53 .

[Legion109]

Arian Dynas wrote...

Legion109 wrote...

A whole Arian post devoted to me - blush - so honored.

Aww... I've not become that much of a celebrity that you are honored by this, am I?

I have fun with you guys, you are some of the best IDTers you ask to be proven wrong rather then just blandly acting superior (half of YouTube IDTers) and when we get a non trolling non believer you discuss the topic rationally this is cause for celebration EIP's for everyone

:O:O

[Legion109]

spotlessvoid wrote...

Coding underpants on a character is not a result of laziness.
Misguided and laughably hypocritical, yes.

I would say it is lazy or half-assed, why not position the camera differently and add a somewhat cloudy steamy effect to blur the intimate areas.


Stay frosty keep toasty EIP's all around :O:O

[Arian Dynas]

Legion109 wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

Legion109 wrote...

A whole Arian post devoted to me - blush - so honored.

Aww... I've not become that much of a celebrity that you are honored by this, am I?

I have fun with you guys, you are some of the best IDTers you ask to be proven wrong rather then just blandly acting superior (half of YouTube IDTers) and when we get a non trolling non believer you discuss the topic rationally this is cause for celebration EIP's for everyone

:O:O

Why thank you. I'd tip my hat to you, if I still had a hat. 

[Legion109]

Frickin slow loading didn't see the edit

[byne]

I swear these Premium Spectre Packs hate me.

I completely hate sniping.

What do I get in my pack?

Kishock Harpoon Gun V and Black Widow II. >.>

[Rifneno]

Arian Dynas wrote...

Hence my theory that they simply knew exactly where the SR 1 was ahead of time. On Palaven, they were more concerned with the invasion. I think, THINK, I agree with you about the Destroyer leaving the Normandy to go, figuring to take out easy targets now and figuring one of it's big brothers would take care of you themselves. Perhaps it simply didn't recognize the ship as the Normandy.

I don't think they knew where the SR-1 was. Not exactly anyway. Remember the dialogue. "Cruiser is changing course. Now on intercept trajectory." The Collector vessel was barely in range of the Normandy's long range scanners when they also picked up on the Normandy. If they knew where it was from a bug planted on it or something, they wouldn't have needed to change trajectory. But I'm assuming "long range scanners" are way the hell out of visual range, so the only thing that leaves is an unknown scanning mechanism that isn't fooled by the Normandy's stealth drive.

Part of why the IFF is paticularly interesting. I think the Normandy's stealth systems are infallible. Mostly because they are what the Reapers themselves use, and no one sees them coming. The only thing that gives you away is the act of scanning, which needles them into noticing you. Because of the IFF they see you as a Reaper until they get up close for a visual confirmation, trying to figure out why there is a Reaper where there shouldn't be, the scanning being what makes them suspicious.

Hmm. Excellent point. You're probably right on that.

And for the record, big breakthroughs DO come through every couple of years in the ME universe, in Mass Effect 1 L2 Biotic Human implants were all the rage, with the new L3s just coming out. Two years later in ME2 they're already working on L5s. Not to mention Cerberus spared no expense on the SR-2. Nor for that matter, did the Alliance during the re-fit. (though seriously, that is one DLC I'd like to see, a DLC where you can finish re-fitting the Normandy and see just what the hell is in where the old armory used to be, as well as what happened to the hallway. The Comm room is now the war room, with the meeting room being where the tech lab was but... jeez all those damn cables lying around. Cant we get anyone to clean up? Seriously.)

Those are, AFAIK, upgrades to known technology. I mean completely new technology.

Unrelated: I wonder if the Normandy's naming (SR-1/SR-2) is a reference to the SR-71 Blackbird. Would an odd pick though. The blackbird is mostly known for its wtfhax speed (nearly 40 years it's held the world record for speed). The Normandy's defining feature is its stealth.

Oh, I know for a fact it's the L5s in ME2, I remember a moment of confusion wondering what had happened to the L4s when last I had heard of L3s.

Yeah. And Jack's special research item is L5x implants.

spotlessvoid wrote...

Like many long time Mass Effect fans, my initial reaction to the ending of this trilogy was to stare blankly at my screen, stupefied, grasping at non-existent threads of logic. This was quickly followed by an explosion of words that can only be described as simultaneously eloquent and deeply profane. This was the ending? Dumbfounded and crestfallen, the more I thought things over, the more questions and plotholes came crashing down on me. I breathed in deep, exhaled slowly, quieted my wave of fury into a simmering rage and headed for the internet.

Over a hundred pages into Something Awful's Blasto killed Harbinger ME3 spoiler thread, and with the full weight of what a literal interpretation of the ending implied of Bioware gnawing at my psyche, I decided to start a new game on insanity importing my still recently completed me3 save. I couldn't get past Mars. So I returned to Something Awful, lurking for over a hundred more pages, trying to understand what Bioware had done to one of the three video game franchises I truly loved. Fallout, Half-life, and Mass Effect.

Then a lifeline appeared. A well reasoned plea and a link brought me to YouTube, where Acavyos deftly opened my eyes. Feeling rejuvinated, I promptly set out to share my thoughts on this fascinating theory. Something Awful was no longer of any use, they reviled the very mention of indoctrination, and their generally unwavering cynicism had long grown thin. I played my first few rounds of post release multiplayer, enjoying myself but with the ending still looming large in my mind.

Indoctrination theory had given me a new perspective, but I was admittedly skeptical enough to put down my controller, the disheartening sense of pointlessness still crushing my resolve continuing to beat me down with every line Liara spoke. Finishing my insanity run with a high enough EMS to get the destroy breathing scene was also still out of the question. Casting aside the dire warnings gainst entering the BSN by the Something Awful clan, I googled "indoctrination bsn."

Thank you byne, and everyone else that has been involved with keeping this theory alive and thoroughly researched. I have been reading daily, often for hours at a time, since before this thread hit 150 pages and truly feel a sense of solidarity with this group of users. I NEVER post on forums, but last night I decided I could no longer keep silent.

Genuinely, thank you.

I will hold the line.

Glad to hear we're helping. Welcome to the asylum.

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

So far as I know Legion ALWAYS has to sacrifice himself in order to properly transmit the Reaper code upgrades to all geth. Tali only commits suicide if you side with the geth, as you saw, but during that pivital choice theres a Paragon/Renegade dialogue option that I think has 3 requirements: high enough reputation, Tali must be an Admiral, and you must rescure Admiral Koris (haven't confirmed that last one myself but he adds his authority to yours).

Regardless of the reputation dialogue, paragon or renegade, there's peace between geth and quarians, tali lives, Legion sacrifices himself for geth intellect.

In order to save both sides, you MUST: keep both Tali and Legion alive through ME2, deal with the heretic geth, complete the geth fighter squadron mission.
If you meet those requirements, you must have 5 "points" from the following:
Complete "Rannoch: Admiral Koris" (1 point)
Save Admiral Koris in the above mission (1 point)
Save Tali from exile in ME2 (2 points)
Destroy rather than rewrite the heretics (2 points)
Use paragon or renegade option during Taliand Legions' dispute in ME2 (1 point)

Also, you need a lot of reputation. I think.

I'm with you on the crying Arian, even those who disliked the ending can't deny the impact this game has on the gamer's emotions. "Emotionally engaging" the term has never been used a better way by Bioware.

I completely agree. I never thought a video game could evoke the emotion ME3 did. It's hard to say what the most moving moment was because there were so many. Making peace between the quarians & geth, and curing the genophage were both just... wow. Simply incredible. Bittersweet moments as Mordin, then Thane (or Kirrahe), then Legion sacrificed themselves. But they went out heroes, accomplishing what they set out to do and making a galaxy-wide impact with their sacrifice.
A less talked about emotional response, maybe it was just me, but I felt they perfectly captured the feel of the Reaper invasion as Earth, Palaven, and later Thessia were shown under invasion and all you could do was watch helplessly. I've seen a lot of movies about threats to mankind's very existance but I never experience that "OMG... this is exactly what Armageddon would look like." Depending upon who you bring to Thessia, you get a different line as you near a capital ship simply exterminating people. The best one IMO was EDI's. She said with the perfect emotional inflection, "I am starting to understand what the word "nightmare" means to organics."

And in the end, I don't think Mordin would really want that.

If you heard Mordin sing in ME2, he sings as he's up there in the tower. I recommend against it. The dialogue when he's not singing that nonsensical if hilarious bit is quite touching. After he finishes his word he says in a lighthearted happy tone, "Genophage cured. New beginning. For us all." Then the tower explodes, killing him. I like to think it was a reference to his religious conversation during his ME2 loyalty mission. He talks about salarians believing in reincarnation. So he's fixed his greatest mistake in the greatest way possible and now he's on a new beginning in another life.

Arian Dynas wrote...

Explanation 2: The damn thing is rated M, not XO.

Witcher 2 is M rated and you see... a lot. As in, carpet doesn't match the drapes type of lot. As Byne said, they should have just not put the camera there if they didn't want to show anything. Nobody showers with a goddamn bra on.

[byne]

Rifneno wrote...



Unrelated: I wonder if the Normandy's naming (SR-1/SR-2) is a reference to the SR-71 Blackbird. Would an odd pick though. The blackbird is mostly known for its wtfhax speed (nearly 40 years it's held the world record for speed). The Normandy's defining feature is its stealth.

Well, the Blackbird was also designed with stealth in mind.

Plus, the Normandy is one of the fastest ships in the Alliance fleet.

Also, I went to the Wikipedia SR-71 Blackbird page and saw this: "If a surface-to-air missile launch was detected, the standard evasive action was simply to accelerate and outrun the missile"

Thats hilariously awesome.

[Rifneno]

byne wrote...

Well, the Blackbird was also designed with stealth in mind.

Plus, the Normandy is one of the fastest ships in the Alliance fleet.

Also, I went to the Wikipedia SR-71 Blackbird page and saw this: "If a surface-to-air missile launch was detected, the standard evasive action was simply to accelerate and outrun the missile"

Thats hilariously awesome.

True, but the blackbird isn't the plane you think of when you hear the word "stealth".  It's usually either the F-22 Raptor or the B-2 Spirit.  Sometimes the F-117 Nighthawk.  Which, BTW, is probably responsible for more UFO sightings than weather balloons.  Hehe.

And yeah, that "outrun the missile" thing is hilarious.  I've been wondering, that's the same tactic that's the reason an ICBM is damn near impossible to shoot down.  I wonder if they'll be interceptable when electromagnetic launchers get a bit better.  The Navy is already pulling off some awesome stuff with those.

[Arian Dynas]

[quote]Rifneno wrote...

[quote]Arian Dynas wrote...

Hence my theory that they simply knew exactly where the SR 1 was ahead of time. On Palaven, they were more concerned with the invasion. I think, THINK, I agree with you about the Destroyer leaving the Normandy to go, figuring to take out easy targets now and figuring one of it's big brothers would take care of you themselves. Perhaps it simply didn't recognize the ship as the Normandy.[/quote]

I don't think they knew where the SR-1 was. Not exactly anyway. Remember the dialogue. "Cruiser is changing course. Now on intercept trajectory." The Collector vessel was barely in range of the Normandy's long range scanners when they also picked up on the Normandy. If they knew where it was from a bug planted on it or something, they wouldn't have needed to change trajectory. But I'm assuming "long range scanners" are way the hell out of visual range, so the only thing that leaves is an unknown scanning mechanism that isn't fooled by the Normandy's stealth drive.
[/quote]

Or there is the far more likely option, the Collectors had the Shadowbroker in their back pocket, as well as as many damn spies and operatives as they wanted. They merely knew where the Normandy would be from the orders they were cut. Hence why it took a bit of finagling to find the Normandy's precise location.

[quote]
Those are, AFAIK, upgrades to known technology. I mean completely new technology.
[/quote]

Which improvements to the Normandy's stealth capabilities would not be. And for new tech, look at The Cain, the Avalanche, the Thanix Magnetic Hydromatic Cannon, Thermal Clips, Arc Pistols, 90% of the things designed in a Cerberus tech-lab, the Genophage cure...

[quote]
Unrelated: I wonder if the Normandy's naming (SR-1/SR-2) is a reference to the SR-71 Blackbird. Would an odd pick though. The blackbird is mostly known for its wtfhax speed (nearly 40 years it's held the world record for speed). The Normandy's defining feature is its stealth.
[/quote]

Check the codex. The Normandy is commonly acknowledged as the fastest ship of it's class due to the upgrades.

EDIT: Also, reading Byne's thoughts on the subject, two things, one, outrunning missles is rediculously awesome, and two, Bioware DOES like to be somewhat subtle on plenty of their references.

[quote]
[quote]spotlessvoid wrote...

*snip*

[/quote]

Glad to hear we're helping. Welcome to the asylum.
[/quote]

Or the peanut gallery, whichever you prefer.

[quote]I'm with you on the crying Arian, even those who disliked the ending can't deny the impact this game has on the gamer's emotions. "Emotionally engaging" the term has never been used a better way by Bioware.[/quote]
[quote]

A less talked about emotional response, maybe it was just me, but I felt they perfectly captured the feel of the Reaper invasion as Earth, Palaven, and later Thessia were shown under invasion and all you could do was watch helplessly. I've seen a lot of movies about threats to mankind's very existance but I never experience that "OMG... this is exactly what Armageddon would look like." Depending upon who you bring to Thessia, you get a different line as you near a capital ship simply exterminating people. The best one IMO was EDI's. She said with the perfect emotional inflection, "I am starting to understand what the word "nightmare" means to organics."

[/quote]

Oh HELL yes. I completely agree, the anxiety, the stress, the fear, all the more reason why IDT is likely too, I mean you even got JOKER freaking out about your stress levels, saying you're higher strung than you have EVER been.

[quote]If you heard Mordin sing in ME2, he sings as he's up there in the tower. I recommend against it. The dialogue when he's not singing that nonsensical if hilarious bit is quite touching. After he finishes his word he says in a lighthearted happy tone, "Genophage cured. New beginning. For us all." Then the tower explodes, killing him. I like to think it was a reference to his religious conversation during his ME2 loyalty mission. He talks about salarians believing in reincarnation. So he's fixed his greatest mistake in the greatest way possible and now he's on a new beginning in another life.[/quote]He also commented about how he saw the appeal; "Fix mistakes in next life."

I love Mordin's death. It was suitably fantastic, which is why the ending sticks out all the more, meaking it clearer and clearer that it was intentional.

[quote]Arian Dynas wrote...

Explanation 2: The damn thing is rated M, not XO.[/quote]

[quote]
Witcher 2 is M rated and you see... a lot. As in, carpet doesn't match the drapes type of lot. As Byne said, they should have just not put the camera there if they didn't want to show anything. Nobody showers with a goddamn bra on.[/quote]

I know, I've seen that scene. But you must remember. They're Norweigan... Europe has a very diffrent veiw on sex in well, just about anything. A better one IMO, goddamn fundies. And the simpler explanation as for why the underwear... well it stays in place and is alot easier to code than fog. And I kinda DID get the feeling that it was fanservice to some extent.

Modifié par Arian Dynas, 14 avril 2012 - 07:18 .

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

 Mordins death really made it clear to me how much I had come to love the characters in the ME. I was at tears as he ascended the tower and sang to himself while fixing the sabotage...it was just such a perfect scene and I sat back with tears running freely for a good 5 min I think. It was so beautiful. 

Before that seeing Palavan burning really set the mood for the game. "They want my advice on how to fight that?" yeah perfectly said Garrus.

[Arian Dynas]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

 Mordins death really made it clear to me how much I had come to love the characters in the ME. I was at tears as he ascended the tower and sang to himself while fixing the sabotage...it was just such a perfect scene and I sat back with tears running freely for a good 5 min I think. It was so beautiful. 

Before that seeing Palavan burning really set the mood for the game. "They want my advice on how to fight that?" yeah perfectly said Garrus.

Damn straight.

Modifié par Arian Dynas, 14 avril 2012 - 07:19 .

[byne]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

 Mordins death really made it clear to me how much I had come to love the characters in the ME. I was at tears as he ascended the tower and sang to himself while fixing the sabotage...it was just such a perfect scene and I sat back with tears running freely for a good 5 min I think. It was so beautiful. 

Before that seeing Palavan burning really set the mood for the game. "They want my advice on how to fight that?" yeah perfectly said Garrus.

I loved Mordin singing to himself.

I was SO disappointed when I did another playthrough importing a character who never heard Mordin sing in ME2 and got this scene instead. It seems much less emotional without the song.

Modifié par byne, 14 avril 2012 - 07:24 .

[Arian Dynas]

byne wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

 Mordins death really made it clear to me how much I had come to love the characters in the ME. I was at tears as he ascended the tower and sang to himself while fixing the sabotage...it was just such a perfect scene and I sat back with tears running freely for a good 5 min I think. It was so beautiful. 

Before that seeing Palavan burning really set the mood for the game. "They want my advice on how to fight that?" yeah perfectly said Garrus.

I loved Mordin singing to himself.

I was SO disappointed when I did another playthrough importing a character who never heard Mordin sing in ME2 and got this scene instead. It seems much less emotional without the song.

That one gave me chills, the other made me weep.

The worst part... he never got to finish.

Modifié par Arian Dynas, 14 avril 2012 - 07:32 .

[spotlessvoid]

Arian Dynas wrote...
Sure you can, you just need a pair of hooks and a thumper.

THE SLEEPER HAS AWAKENED!
.

The first time I saw a thresher maw, I immediately thought of Shai Hulud.

Dune and Asimov were my first exposure to science fiction. I was still really young, and they left a lasting imprint. I don't think my world view had been so suddenly and dramatically shifted since watching Wateship Down as a little kid. THAT is not a freaking kids movie.

[Arian Dynas]

spotlessvoid wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...
Sure you can, you just need a pair of hooks and a thumper.

THE SLEEPER HAS AWAKENED!
.

The first time I saw a thresher maw, I immediately thought of Shai Hulud.

Dune and Asimov were my first exposure to science fiction. I was still really young, and they left a lasting imprint. I don't think my world view had been so suddenly and dramatically shifted since watching Wateship Down as a little kid. THAT is not a freaking kids movie.

Sure it is. For really ****ed up kids.

As for Threser Maws, they are paractically a guy standing on a sand dune jumping and screaming "DUNE REFERENCE! DUNE REFERENCE!"

Seriously, when I realized they called those big krogan ground poundy-smashy thingies "Maw hammers" I just groaned and went, "REALLY!? YOU GUYS MADE THAT REFERENCE!?!" 

[spotlessvoid]

My mother had no idea what she had rented for me on that one.
Optimus Prime dying was sad, but I wasn't oblivious to death. Watership Down blew my mind like a Krogan Headbutt. (Shepard excluded)

[Arian Dynas]

spotlessvoid wrote...

My mother had no idea what she had rented for me on that one.
Optimus Prime dying was sad, but I wasn't oblivious to death. Watership Down blew my mind like a Krogan Headbutt. (Shepard excluded)

Speaking of Krogan headbutts, I am enjoying the wonderful voice of my favorite voice actor of all time;

Steve Blum