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[balance5050]

EpyonX3 wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

byne wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...


Or Shepard lives in the destroy option and leads the fight to eliminate remaining indoctrinated forces around the galaxy including some reapers who managed to escape the red space magic.

>Around the galaxy
>No Mass Relays

good luck with that

Relays can be rebuilt, especially with all of the spare parts laying around from all of the dead reapers. Also, who's to say that these civilizations can't build a new method of travel that's similar to the relays? They built the crucible in such a short amount of time. I'm sure relays won't be a problem.

That would take years.... Shep would be an old man by then.

It didn't take years for them to build for them to build the crucible. If they really need it they'll build it fast. Those scientists that built it are most likely still alive and spread out. With quantum entaglers, they can share info and build whatever they want.

That's because they had the best resources in the galaxy working on it, Considering the chaos that would be taking place on earth, I doubt it would be a smooth process.

Also, if the red wave destroyed the Normandy, it seems we now have to rebuild all our normal ships anyway...

Modifié par balance5050, 17 avril 2012 - 05:30 .

[byne]

EpyonX3 wrote...


It didn't take years for them to build for them to build the crucible. If they really need it they'll build it fast. Those scientists that built it are most likely still alive and spread out. With quantum entaglers, they can share info and build whatever they want.

It took them months, during which they poured basically all their resources into building it, and needed all the smartest scientists in the galaxy to build it. Even with all that, Hackett describes the Crucible design as being elegant and simple to build.

I doubt Relays are elegant or simple. If they were, the Protheans would have built more than just a single miniature Relay.

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

OdanUrr wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...



The signal kills synthetics accroding to the child and is not reaper specific. Again it's a guess as the Space Magic itself is pretty strange.

But unexplainable technology doesn't always need to imply a dream sequence.

And how does "overloading" it cause it to send out a signal that only kills synthetics, seems more symbolic then literal.

And I should point out a slightly more literal problem with this.  Why the frak would you make it so that you have to SHOOT SOMETHING to trigger a weapon?  It just seems stupid.

This is pretty odd. It would seem to suggest that the Crucible was not intended to destroy the Reapers but possibly to control them. The fact that with Low EMS you only have the Destroy option could mean that you didn't have enough war assets to build it properly.

If you did not destroy the Collector base in ME2 the only choice at low EMS is Control.

Logically the low EMS choices could be reflections of where Shepard leans as a Shepard who destroyed the Collector base would be more inclined to destroy and a Shepard who spared the base might lean more towards using the Reapers technology aka Control.

[EpyonX3]

balance5050 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

n00bsauce2010 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

n00bsauce2010 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Not really. The only thing I can't tell for sure is the smooth object in the middle. I know where the grooves in the stone come from and that those are reaper cables. I even caught a fourth item last night that looks similar to the an object near the destroy option.

I'm about to start exploring the possibility that some items in the scene are from the crucible.

That would mean you think either shepard is still on the citadel and survived the explosion.. or he is back on earth and survived the explosion as well as the fall back to earth. Both are rather insane if you ask me.

IT would mean the reapers are still alive, the crucible never docked and shepard is half burried on the earth near a beam that has been disabled. Meaning no one will get to the citadel to open the arms and the reapers win in every scenerio.

Then bioware tells you the reaper threat was ended by shepard. A contradiction of massive proportions. I think that's worse than Shepard somehow surviving.

Not really.. the message also tells us to enjoy "DLC".. a bigger f*ck you than everything. They could put a message saying: Obama is the best president ever... and it would ****** me off less than their dlc pitch.

Yeah it says expand his story through DLC. Meaning extra missions before the events leading to his death or MIA. Anyone who didn't expect DLC shouldn't be complaining.

Besides, they did this with Mass Effect 2. Why is it a problem now?

skip to 6:30.

It doesn't specifically say that it won't be post ending DLC. This is a moot point.

Doesn't say it will either but the point is that DLC isn't an indication of IT. Especially since they did the same in a past game.

[ExtendedCut]

SS2Dante wrote...

ExtendedCut wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

ExtendedCut wrote...

paxxton wrote...

You know what, I think that playing through the whole game and then sending your copy back and demanding a refund because you don't like the ending seems highly unfair on the part of the customer.

Although I vehemently support IT, your comment above is the biggest reason I still have lingering doubts about it. 

If IT is true, and this whole issue was a "grand scheme" by Bioware, then I would guarantee that they didn't anticipate the anger and backlash and refund demands that people made. 

If that had been planned by my company, and we had gotten the outcome that Bioware is experiencing, then a whole bunch of marketing guys would be getting fired.

Actually, I don't see a problem. I agree that it's a risky move, but what I mean is that if Bioware admit to releasing as incomplete game while people are still mad, it will only make them madder. Give them some hope, a chance to cool down. Wait a few months, then release, and suddenly you have lots of free press and people grateful for an ending they would have crucified you for before.

I totally agree with you here, but if this does turn out to be the case, then almost every impartial person with any sense of financal acumen will consider this move to be a huge marketing blunder. 

In other words, since Bioware is dependent on gamers buying their games for their income, then (financially) it makes no sense to try some "grand artistic twist" for the sake if being artistic, when it results in loss of profit. So therefore, if they didn't expect the backlash/anger and game refunds and stuff like that due to this move, then it has to be considered a marketing blunder.

If IT is true, then I will consider it one of the coolest moves ever done by a video game company.  But I'm not sure that Bioware will think that way, since it seems like it's blown up in their face, and ultimately resulted in some profit loss.

I'd love to see the numbers. Particularly since...did people really not get the game cos of the last 15 mins? I don't think that actually happened. Every person who's complaining about it has played it, and it outsold ME2. Plus, in the third of a trilogy your aim is to keep the fanbase, not grow it hugely, so as long as it looked awesome until release they were fine.

Well, you're right - I have no idea what the actual numbers are, but the bad press/bad media attention has to account for something that Bioware doesn't want to happen. 

Even if only one person actually did return their game for a refund because they didn't like the ending, EVERYONE in the gaming world has heard about it - which is still poor publicity/marketing in Bioware's point-of-view.

And, I'm not trying to start a fight - please don't take this that way, but your comment about not trying to grow the fanbase for the third installment directly contradicts the "most accepted" reason that Vega was created - to relate to noobs just starting the ME series with ME3.

[EpyonX3]

byne wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...


It didn't take years for them to build for them to build the crucible. If they really need it they'll build it fast. Those scientists that built it are most likely still alive and spread out. With quantum entaglers, they can share info and build whatever they want.

It took them months, during which they poured basically all their resources into building it, and needed all the smartest scientists in the galaxy to build it. Even with all that, Hackett describes the Crucible design as being elegant and simple to build.

I doubt Relays are elegant or simple. If they were, the Protheans would have built more than just a single miniature Relay.

Perhaps they ran out of time before they could. Remember the reaper threat is over for the most part.

[balance5050]

EpyonX3 wrote...

Doesn't say it will either but the point is that DLC isn't an indication of IT. Especially since they did the same in a past game.

Well, it, kinda does. The past games have content that went beyond the end of the disc so...

[EpyonX3]

Ok I went on a speculation run and I'd like to stop before it gets too crazy. If you guys don't mind I'd like to shift back to the game itself rather than what might happen in the future.

[OdanUrr]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

If you did not destroy the Collector base in ME2 the only choice at low EMS is Control.

Logically the low EMS choices could be reflections of where Shepard leans as a Shepard who destroyed the Collector base would be more inclined to destroy and a Shepard who spared the base might lean more towards using the Reapers technology aka Control.

Interesting, that would make the Collector Base the key to getting the Crucible operational.

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

EpyonX3 wrote...

byne wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...


It didn't take years for them to build for them to build the crucible. If they really need it they'll build it fast. Those scientists that built it are most likely still alive and spread out. With quantum entaglers, they can share info and build whatever they want.

It took them months, during which they poured basically all their resources into building it, and needed all the smartest scientists in the galaxy to build it. Even with all that, Hackett describes the Crucible design as being elegant and simple to build.

I doubt Relays are elegant or simple. If they were, the Protheans would have built more than just a single miniature Relay.

Perhaps they ran out of time before they could. Remember the reaper threat is over for the most part.

Mass Relays are still near impossible technology for the current cycle form all accounts we know. If they blow up it is gonna be even harder to create new as they wont even have existing ones to ry and copy.

[byne]

EpyonX3 wrote...

byne wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...


It didn't take years for them to build for them to build the crucible. If they really need it they'll build it fast. Those scientists that built it are most likely still alive and spread out. With quantum entaglers, they can share info and build whatever they want.

It took them months, during which they poured basically all their resources into building it, and needed all the smartest scientists in the galaxy to build it. Even with all that, Hackett describes the Crucible design as being elegant and simple to build.

I doubt Relays are elegant or simple. If they were, the Protheans would have built more than just a single miniature Relay.

Perhaps they ran out of time before they could. Remember the reaper threat is over for the most part.

We also dont have any plans for Mass Relays like we did for the Crucible.

Hell, we dont even have any intact ones to study and use to replicate the design.

[EpyonX3]

balance5050 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Doesn't say it will either but the point is that DLC isn't an indication of IT. Especially since they did the same in a past game.

Well, it, kinda does. The past games have content that went beyond the end of the disc so...

Not exactly. You could do the arrival dlc before you take out the collector base.

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

OdanUrr wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

If you did not destroy the Collector base in ME2 the only choice at low EMS is Control.

Logically the low EMS choices could be reflections of where Shepard leans as a Shepard who destroyed the Collector base would be more inclined to destroy and a Shepard who spared the base might lean more towards using the Reapers technology aka Control.

Interesting, that would make the Collector Base the key to getting the Crucible operational.

So the Crucible automatically functions if a Reaper brain is part of it (the asset for the crucible recovered from the Cerberus base if you spared the Collector Base) but dosent if a Reaper heart is (from destroying the Collector base) unless you have high EMS?

Sorry, but if that is whats needed to get the Crucible operational I am trusting that piece of machinery even less.

[EpyonX3]

byne wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

byne wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...


It didn't take years for them to build for them to build the crucible. If they really need it they'll build it fast. Those scientists that built it are most likely still alive and spread out. With quantum entaglers, they can share info and build whatever they want.

It took them months, during which they poured basically all their resources into building it, and needed all the smartest scientists in the galaxy to build it. Even with all that, Hackett describes the Crucible design as being elegant and simple to build.

I doubt Relays are elegant or simple. If they were, the Protheans would have built more than just a single miniature Relay.

Perhaps they ran out of time before they could. Remember the reaper threat is over for the most part.

We also dont have any plans for Mass Relays like we did for the Crucible.

Hell, we dont even have any intact ones to study and use to replicate the design.

Last peice of speculation.

If Shepard is alive on the citadel. then the citadel is still in tact. It'll be repaired by the keepers and then we can study it even further. Doesn't the Citadel act as a relay in Mass Effect 1?

[byne]

EpyonX3 wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Doesn't say it will either but the point is that DLC isn't an indication of IT. Especially since they did the same in a past game.

Well, it, kinda does. The past games have content that went beyond the end of the disc so...

Not exactly. You could do the arrival dlc before you take out the collector base.

You can, but you're not really supposed to. LotSB and Arrival were both described as being DLC that bridged the gap between ME2 and ME3, not as something taking place during the middle of the ME2 storyline.

[EpyonX3]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

OdanUrr wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

If you did not destroy the Collector base in ME2 the only choice at low EMS is Control.

Logically the low EMS choices could be reflections of where Shepard leans as a Shepard who destroyed the Collector base would be more inclined to destroy and a Shepard who spared the base might lean more towards using the Reapers technology aka Control.

Interesting, that would make the Collector Base the key to getting the Crucible operational.

So the Crucible automatically functions if a Reaper brain is part of it (the asset for the crucible recovered from the Cerberus base if you spared the Collector Base) but dosent if a Reaper heart is (from destroying the Collector base) unless you have high EMS?

Sorry, but if that is whats needed to get the Crucible operational I am trusting that piece of machinery even less.

It does make sense. It's the peice of the crucible you will always get no matter what.

[SS2Dante]

EpyonX3 wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

EpyonX3 I get that a lot of the stuff seems weird or coincidental, but what about all the stuff that took extra time for Bioware to do? like the trees and shrubs when you wake up? Someone was told by their boss specifically to go into that level and add a whole bunch of shrubs and 3 trees behind the player. It wasn't for fun that they did that. So why?

The trees and shrubs were there before you get hit by the beam. The shrubs are also entirely new to the scene and aren't identical to the ones in you dreams and neither are the trees.

They are different assests. Why can't there be trees therer anyway? Is earth supposed to be void of trees?

I saw your video and checked for myself. There is one tree, high up and off to the right (if you're facing the beam). The shrubs on the ground where you wake up are not there, neither are the three trees directly behind you. The point is that they aren't there, then they are. it's supposed to be the same map. So why the change?

[SS2Dante]

EpyonX3 wrote...

Ok I went on a speculation run and I'd like to stop before it gets too crazy. If you guys don't mind I'd like to shift back to the game itself rather than what might happen in the future.

Yeah, think everyone is runningaway with it right now

[byne]

EpyonX3 wrote...

Last peice of speculation.

If Shepard is alive on the citadel. then the citadel is still in tact. It'll be repaired by the keepers and then we can study it even further. Doesn't the Citadel act as a relay in Mass Effect 1?

Except we see the arms start to fly away from the Citadel after the explosion, so its not intact.

[EpyonX3]

byne wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Doesn't say it will either but the point is that DLC isn't an indication of IT. Especially since they did the same in a past game.

Well, it, kinda does. The past games have content that went beyond the end of the disc so...

Not exactly. You could do the arrival dlc before you take out the collector base.

You can, but you're not really supposed to. LotSB and Arrival were both described as being DLC that bridged the gap between ME2 and ME3, not as something taking place during the middle of the ME2 storyline.

I know and I agree, but if you replay the story with the DLC installed you can do that mission at any time. So whatever they plan on doing it can't be after the fact since Shepard dies for sure in two of the endings. They'd have to make three versions of the same dlc.

[EpyonX3]

byne wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Last peice of speculation.

If Shepard is alive on the citadel. then the citadel is still in tact. It'll be repaired by the keepers and then we can study it even further. Doesn't the Citadel act as a relay in Mass Effect 1?

Except we see the arms start to fly away from the Citadel after the explosion, so its not intact.

So? It's not pulverized. It can be repaired.

[byne]

EpyonX3 wrote...

byne wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Last peice of speculation.

If Shepard is alive on the citadel. then the citadel is still in tact. It'll be repaired by the keepers and then we can study it even further. Doesn't the Citadel act as a relay in Mass Effect 1?

Except we see the arms start to fly away from the Citadel after the explosion, so its not intact.

So? It's not pulverized. It can be repaired.

Except we dont know how to repair it. We dont know anything about the Citadel. Thats the entire point of the Keepers: to stop us from actually learnign about the Citadel, by making sure we never try to take care of repairs and stuff on our own.

[n00bsauce2010]

EpyonX3 wrote...

byne wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

byne wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...


It didn't take years for them to build for them to build the crucible. If they really need it they'll build it fast. Those scientists that built it are most likely still alive and spread out. With quantum entaglers, they can share info and build whatever they want.

It took them months, during which they poured basically all their resources into building it, and needed all the smartest scientists in the galaxy to build it. Even with all that, Hackett describes the Crucible design as being elegant and simple to build.

I doubt Relays are elegant or simple. If they were, the Protheans would have built more than just a single miniature Relay.

Perhaps they ran out of time before they could. Remember the reaper threat is over for the most part.

We also dont have any plans for Mass Relays like we did for the Crucible.

Hell, we dont even have any intact ones to study and use to replicate the design.

Last peice of speculation.

If Shepard is alive on the citadel. then the citadel is still in tact. It'll be repaired by the keepers and then we can study it even further. Doesn't the Citadel act as a relay in Mass Effect 1?

So wait a minute.. the citadel was blown to bits... but it is still intact?

[balance5050]

EpyonX3 wrote...

I know and I agree, but if you replay the story with the DLC installed you can do that mission at any time. So whatever they plan on doing it can't be after the fact since Shepard dies for sure in two of the endings. They'd have to make three versions of the same dlc.

No one version that changes based on your ending decision.

[DreamTension]

byne wrote...
Also, I love how the main justification I've seen for why the Relays needed to be destroyed was that we needed to break away from relying on any Reaper tech at all, but then when asked how we'll travel the galaxy now, people are all 'We'll just use Reaper tech to rebuild the Relays, its no problem!'

I dont even

Thank you.  This has been overlooked so much by people. Thematically Bioware destroyed the relays to 'rid us' of Reapers, but the solution to all the problems this causes is to use Reaper tech to survive...
What?  What...no...