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[ExtendedCut]

Leto_Galt wrote...

Anyone else notice that the first time you see Starkid the building he is on top of doesn't appear to have any why to access it?
I guess there could be ladder on the far side of the building that we cant see, he could have climbed up there.
But that leads me to my second question. Why is a child playing unsupervised on top of a building in the middle of alliance HQ in the first place? Was daycare full that day?

Of course these are rhetorical question if you believe IT. (which I do)
I’m just throwing them out there since I haven't run across any discussion about them.

You're right, there's lots of things that are weird about that little kid.  Such as why is he so obsessed with Shepard on Earth?  I don't know about anyone else, but if I were that kid and was hauling-ass to get to a rescue shuttle, I wouldn't be standing around, staring up at a soldier (Shepard) in a different ship that was flying away - I'd have more important things to worry about. 

[Eli Parker]

SS2Dante wrote...

Eli Parker wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

Huh. Just looked up object Rho and it apparently takes it's energy from Dark Matter. Now, a lot of people think that they simply dropped that storyline (even though it was heavily hinted to be important), but listen to what the Prothean VI says the catalyst does

http://www.youtube.c...aMFZGwHs#t=458s

Odd.

I never liked the Dark Matter and Reaper twist, it made the reapers "good" to a degree. To me the Reapers are evil, expect to the Keepers (as they can keep their form).

If that's referring to the leaked script, I didn't read it (and still won't). But I have no trouble with the Reapers being "good" to a degree, I mean, even if they're simply doing this to reproduce then they aren't evil. Emotional complexity isn't such a terrible thing in a game like this.

I understand where you are coming from. To me I never wanted the reapers to be good, I do think that their cycle of 50,000 years is to increase their numbers and recharge their batteries. Still at the end of the day to me the reapers needed to be the evil force that will be there.

The way I see the ending is the Unitied Forces destroy Harbinger, and with his death the other reapers feel fear and retreat back through the mass rely. Afterwards the glaxy will always be ready for them.

[balance5050]

ExtendedCut wrote...

Leto_Galt wrote...

Anyone else notice that the first time you see Starkid the building he is on top of doesn't appear to have any why to access it?
I guess there could be ladder on the far side of the building that we cant see, he could have climbed up there.
But that leads me to my second question. Why is a child playing unsupervised on top of a building in the middle of alliance HQ in the first place? Was daycare full that day?

Of course these are rhetorical question if you believe IT. (which I do)
I’m just throwing them out there since I haven't run across any discussion about them.

You're right, there's lots of things that are weird about that little kid.  Such as why is he so obsessed with Shepard on Earth?  I don't know about anyone else, but if I were that kid and was hauling-ass to get to a rescue shuttle, I wouldn't be standing around, staring up at a soldier (Shepard) in a different ship that was flying away - I'd have more important things to worry about. 

"You can't help me." *disappears*

Later...

Kid looks up at you as if to say "Why didn't you help me?"

I hate that kid so much...

[SS2Dante]

Ahahaha sorry guys, just saw this. It's the map of citadel tower from ME1

http://guides.gamepr...-2060212578.jpg

Funny, or funny?

[Eli Parker]

SS2Dante wrote...

Ahahaha sorry guys, just saw this. It's the map of citadel tower from ME1

http://guides.gamepr...-2060212578.jpg

Funny, or funny?

I guess they are vein.

[balance5050]

I just have to say... if I.T. is true; LONGEST. BOSS FIGHT. EVER.

[ExtendedCut]

balance5050 wrote...

ExtendedCut wrote...

I apologize for being the one to bring this up again (for the hundredth time in this thread) but to me, the biggest plot hole is the "control" the TIM has over Shepard and Anderson in the Citadel. I realize that Joker and Shep's squadmates running away after somehow teleporting to the Normandy is also major plot-hole, but to me, that COULD be explained away by some "convenient" and/or lazy writing.

So, is there any precedent for "body control" in any ME outlet that I am unaware of? AFAIK, no human (even if indoctrinated) has ever been able to control the body of another being.

Therefore, if IT is NOT true, then how will BW possibly explain this part? Saren was obviously indoctrinated, but never showed any ability to control people's motor-skills. So how does TIM suddenly have the ability to make Shepard shoot Anderson, for example?

Sorry, I realize that this is a thread in support of IT, but I think if we TRY to find ways to explain some of the plot-holes without IT, and can't do it, it makes IT more likely to be the only logical alternative. Other than the "all-of-the-sudden-horrible-writing-at-the-end" excuse that some anti-IT'ers are using.

My best guess for the body control is enhanced biotics. but then why does Shep rub his temple as if it IS indocrination of the mind? I don't know.

Yeah, that's a good idea -  the biotics idea is possible - it may explain the weird black lines around the edges of the screen, kind of like the blue lines around a biotic's body, I guess. 

It still seems like a poor explanation if that is true, since biotics haven't really worked that way in the game up to that point - the black lines aren't emanating from TIM, for example, and also, TIM has never shown any signs of being a biotic up to that point.

[Abram730]

balance5050 wrote...

Also, These pylons appear in MP as well, but they don't have backwards writing on them.

 

kind of looks like mako wheels in the image behind shepard.

[Eli Parker]

balance5050 wrote...

I just have to say... if I.T. is true; LONGEST. BOSS FIGHT. EVER.

Old-school RPGs had you fight the final boss that had two or three times forms before you can beat the game.

[Spartas Husky]

SS2Dante wrote...

Eli Parker wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

Huh. Just looked up object Rho and it apparently takes it's energy from Dark Matter. Now, a lot of people think that they simply dropped that storyline (even though it was heavily hinted to be important), but listen to what the Prothean VI says the catalyst does

http://www.youtube.c...aMFZGwHs#t=458s

Odd.

I never liked the Dark Matter and Reaper twist, it made the reapers "good" to a degree. To me the Reapers are evil, expect to the Keepers (as they can keep their form).

If that's referring to the leaked script, I didn't read it (and still won't). But I have no trouble with the Reapers being "good" to a degree, I mean, even if they're simply doing this to reproduce then they aren't evil. Emotional complexity isn't such a terrible thing in a game like this.

Never liked it probably coz you just realized what it was originally meant to be. I like either ones. Implying there isn't a reason for something so old and powerful that isn't just "we are evil aliens coming to eat you" is a better argument.

Simplicity in argument leads to lazyness of thought. Lazyness of thought leads to stupidity.

[ExtendedCut]

balance5050 wrote...

ExtendedCut wrote...

Leto_Galt wrote...

Anyone else notice that the first time you see Starkid the building he is on top of doesn't appear to have any why to access it?
I guess there could be ladder on the far side of the building that we cant see, he could have climbed up there.
But that leads me to my second question. Why is a child playing unsupervised on top of a building in the middle of alliance HQ in the first place? Was daycare full that day?

Of course these are rhetorical question if you believe IT. (which I do)
I’m just throwing them out there since I haven't run across any discussion about them.

You're right, there's lots of things that are weird about that little kid.  Such as why is he so obsessed with Shepard on Earth?  I don't know about anyone else, but if I were that kid and was hauling-ass to get to a rescue shuttle, I wouldn't be standing around, staring up at a soldier (Shepard) in a different ship that was flying away - I'd have more important things to worry about. 

"You can't help me." *disappears*

Later...

Kid looks up at you as if to say "Why didn't you help me?"

I hate that kid so much...

Yeah, I agree, he does look up at Shep as if to say "Why didn't you help me?" - but he "conveniently" forgets that there is a ship-ful of marines in the shuttle directly behind him that are probably willing to help him? 

Or, is that kid just an embodiement of Shep's guilt over Earth being wiped-out by the Reapers?

[Eli Parker]

Spartas Husky wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

Eli Parker wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

Huh. Just looked up object Rho and it apparently takes it's energy from Dark Matter. Now, a lot of people think that they simply dropped that storyline (even though it was heavily hinted to be important), but listen to what the Prothean VI says the catalyst does

http://www.youtube.c...aMFZGwHs#t=458s

Odd.

I never liked the Dark Matter and Reaper twist, it made the reapers "good" to a degree. To me the Reapers are evil, expect to the Keepers (as they can keep their form).

If that's referring to the leaked script, I didn't read it (and still won't). But I have no trouble with the Reapers being "good" to a degree, I mean, even if they're simply doing this to reproduce then they aren't evil. Emotional complexity isn't such a terrible thing in a game like this.

Never liked it probably coz you just realized what it was originally meant to be. I like either ones. Implying there isn't a reason for something so old and powerful that isn't just "we are evil aliens coming to eat you" is a better argument.

Simplicity in argument leads to lazyness of thought. Lazyness of thought leads to stupidity.

Cool way to say stupid.

Also I wan't having an argument, it was my opinion not to like the Dark Matter twist, as the reapers were shown to be nothing but evil.

[ExtendedCut]

Eli Parker wrote...

ExtendedCut wrote...

I apologize for being the one to bring this up again (for the hundredth time in this thread) but to me, the biggest plot hole is the "control" the TIM has over Shepard and Anderson in the Citadel. I realize that Joker and Shep's squadmates running away after somehow teleporting to the Normandy is also major plot-hole, but to me, that COULD be explained away by some "convenient" and/or lazy writing.

So, is there any precedent for "body control" in any ME outlet that I am unaware of? AFAIK, no human (even if indoctrinated) has ever been able to control the body of another being.

Therefore, if IT is NOT true, then how will BW possibly explain this part? Saren was obviously indoctrinated, but never showed any ability to control people's motor-skills. So how does TIM suddenly have the ability to make Shepard shoot Anderson, for example?

Sorry, I realize that this is a thread in support of IT, but I think if we TRY to find ways to explain some of the plot-holes without IT, and can't do it, it makes IT more likely to be the only logical alternative. Other than the "all-of-the-sudden-horrible-writing-at-the-end" excuse that some anti-IT'ers are using.

I got no answer, but I can give you my theories.

TIM lied to Shep in ME2 and has a control chip that can be used once against Shep (yea I got nothing).

Yeah, my first thought was something to do with Lazarus as well, but then I remembered that TIM controlled Anderson too, who had never been around TIM before.  Unless TIM was actually real in the end-scene, but Anderson was only in Shepard's mind .

Okay, that was a dumb joke, since we know that Anderson and TIM interact, so they must either both be real, or both be in Shep's mind, or both be projections by Harbinger, or.., or...

[MaximizedAction]

balance5050 wrote...

I just have to say... if I.T. is true; LONGEST. BOSS FIGHT. EVER.

True, but even more: This one has taken me through way more different states of (in)sanity than the old school ones where you didn't have save and had to restart the whole level ...

[balance5050]

Eli Parker wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

I just have to say... if I.T. is true; LONGEST. BOSS FIGHT. EVER.

Old-school RPGs had you fight the final boss that had two or three times forms before you can beat the game.

OH GAWD. I miss my oldschool rpg's.

I'm kinda counting this entire wait for the EC as the bossfight for ME3 though is what i was trying to say.

[Eli Parker]

ExtendedCut wrote...

Eli Parker wrote...

ExtendedCut wrote...

I apologize for being the one to bring this up again (for the hundredth time in this thread) but to me, the biggest plot hole is the "control" the TIM has over Shepard and Anderson in the Citadel. I realize that Joker and Shep's squadmates running away after somehow teleporting to the Normandy is also major plot-hole, but to me, that COULD be explained away by some "convenient" and/or lazy writing.

So, is there any precedent for "body control" in any ME outlet that I am unaware of? AFAIK, no human (even if indoctrinated) has ever been able to control the body of another being.

Therefore, if IT is NOT true, then how will BW possibly explain this part? Saren was obviously indoctrinated, but never showed any ability to control people's motor-skills. So how does TIM suddenly have the ability to make Shepard shoot Anderson, for example?

Sorry, I realize that this is a thread in support of IT, but I think if we TRY to find ways to explain some of the plot-holes without IT, and can't do it, it makes IT more likely to be the only logical alternative. Other than the "all-of-the-sudden-horrible-writing-at-the-end" excuse that some anti-IT'ers are using.

I got no answer, but I can give you my theories.

TIM lied to Shep in ME2 and has a control chip that can be used once against Shep (yea I got nothing).

Yeah, my first thought was something to do with Lazarus as well, but then I remembered that TIM controlled Anderson too, who had never been around TIM before.  Unless TIM was actually real in the end-scene, but Anderson was only in Shepard's mind .

Okay, that was a dumb joke, since we know that Anderson and TIM interact, so they must either both be real, or both be in Shep's mind, or both be projections by Harbinger, or.., or...

Freddy Kruger messing with Shepard's mind.

or

Dancing monkies??

[ExtendedCut]

balance5050 wrote...

Eli Parker wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

I just have to say... if I.T. is true; LONGEST. BOSS FIGHT. EVER.

Old-school RPGs had you fight the final boss that had two or three times forms before you can beat the game.

OH GAWD. I miss my oldschool rpg's.

I'm kinda counting this entire wait for the EC as the bossfight for ME3 though is what i was trying to say.

So, we all thought the boss was TIM or the Reapers, but it actually turned out the the Final Boss Battle of Mass Effect was us against Bioware?

[Eli Parker]

balance5050 wrote...

Eli Parker wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

I just have to say... if I.T. is true; LONGEST. BOSS FIGHT. EVER.

Old-school RPGs had you fight the final boss that had two or three times forms before you can beat the game.

OH GAWD. I miss my oldschool rpg's.

I'm kinda counting this entire wait for the EC as the bossfight for ME3 though is what i was trying to say.

Some ppl already lost, by trading in their games.

Also about old-school games I try to just overlevel as most of those bossfights kicks my ****, but I did beat down Ultimecia in Final Fantasy 8.

[Eli Parker]

ExtendedCut wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Eli Parker wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

I just have to say... if I.T. is true; LONGEST. BOSS FIGHT. EVER.

Old-school RPGs had you fight the final boss that had two or three times forms before you can beat the game.

OH GAWD. I miss my oldschool rpg's.

I'm kinda counting this entire wait for the EC as the bossfight for ME3 though is what i was trying to say.

So, we all thought the boss was TIM or the Reapers, but it actually turned out the the Final Boss Battle of Mass Effect was us against Bioware?

All of the above.

[Golferguy758]

balance5050 wrote...

I just have to say... if I.T. is true; LONGEST. BOSS FIGHT. EVER.

And speaking of old school RPGs

one of the biggest one that truly DID have various alternate endings. You may have heard of it

Modifié par Golferguy758, 17 avril 2012 - 11:47 .

[balance5050]

Eli Parker wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Eli Parker wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

I just have to say... if I.T. is true; LONGEST. BOSS FIGHT. EVER.

Old-school RPGs had you fight the final boss that had two or three times forms before you can beat the game.

OH GAWD. I miss my oldschool rpg's.

I'm kinda counting this entire wait for the EC as the bossfight for ME3 though is what i was trying to say.

Some ppl already lost, by trading in their games.

Also about old-school games I try to just overlevel as most of those bossfights kicks my ****, but I did beat down Ultimecia in Final Fantasy 8.

Yeah, grinding for hours is usually the best way to handle those things, remember that little cactus guy in FF7? so..much...exp.

[ExtendedCut]

Eli Parker wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Eli Parker wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

I just have to say... if I.T. is true; LONGEST. BOSS FIGHT. EVER.

Old-school RPGs had you fight the final boss that had two or three times forms before you can beat the game.

OH GAWD. I miss my oldschool rpg's.

I'm kinda counting this entire wait for the EC as the bossfight for ME3 though is what i was trying to say.

Some ppl already lost, by trading in their games.

Also about old-school games I try to just overlevel as most of those bossfights kicks my ****, but I did beat down Ultimecia in Final Fantasy 8.

Too bad those games seem to be going away.  I think Zelda was one of the first that I can remember.

[balance5050]

Golferguy758 wrote...

Definitely one of my top ten games of all time right here.

[Eli Parker]

balance5050 wrote...

Eli Parker wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Eli Parker wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

I just have to say... if I.T. is true; LONGEST. BOSS FIGHT. EVER.

Old-school RPGs had you fight the final boss that had two or three times forms before you can beat the game.

OH GAWD. I miss my oldschool rpg's.

I'm kinda counting this entire wait for the EC as the bossfight for ME3 though is what i was trying to say.

Some ppl already lost, by trading in their games.

Also about old-school games I try to just overlevel as most of those bossfights kicks my ****, but I did beat down Ultimecia in Final Fantasy 8.

Yeah, grinding for hours is usually the best way to handle those things, remember that little cactus guy in FF7? so..much...exp.

I got to the party of FF 7 late, as I couldn't get new FF until FFIX. When I played it I just went fast-forward to beat the game and I got my **** handed to me by  sephiroth.

FYI I did to beat 1,2,3,4,6,7,8,9,10,12,13 and some of the other spin-offs and side stories.

[Eli Parker]

Golferguy758 wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

I just have to say... if I.T. is true; LONGEST. BOSS FIGHT. EVER.

And speaking of old school RPGs

one of the biggest one that truly DID have various alternate endings. You may have heard of it

I don't want to admit this, but I haven't beat it yet. I never had the SNES growing up, but my DS version is somewhere in my room.