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Rifneno wrote...
paxxton wrote...
I have answered it many times. There is a clear explanation on Sanctuary in one of the PDAs why TIM is able to control Shepard and Anderson (nanides and adrenaline rush are technical means of indoctrination). Also, it is implied that TIM underwent some form of augmentation to be able to do that (the vid log on Cronos Station just before TIM's office).
You didn't understand those video logs.
paxxton wrote...
Rifneno wrote...
balance5050 wrote...
Black shadows never showed up when you used that power in ME2. I strongly doubt he is using reave. Usually if a bioticis being used, there is a graphical effect on the body. stasis has the victim covered in white, reave had them covered in dark blue.
All we see from Shepard is him rubbing his temple as if he has a headache. The head ache indicates to me that TIM is using a mind control power rather then a biotic power, which controls matter.
Yeah. That same effect is also used in the dreams. Hmm, I wonder there's anything telling in the pcc files.
... BioVFX_Plc_ReaperIndoc? Nah, I'm sure it's not what it looks like.
I have answered it many times. There is a clear explanation on Sanctuary in one of the PDAs why TIM is able to control Shepard and Anderson (nanides and adrenaline rush are technical means of indoctrination). Also, it is implied that TIM underwent some form of augmentation to be able to do that (the vid log on Cronos Station just before TIM's office).
BatmanTurian wrote...
Spartas Husky wrote...
Black shadows never showed up when you used that power in ME2. I strongly doubt he is using reave. Usually if a bioticis being used, there is a graphical effect on the body. stasis has the victim covered in white, reave had them covered in dark blue.
All we see from Shepard is him rubbing his temple as if he has a headache. The head ache indicates to me that TIM is using a mind control power rather then a biotic power, which controls matter.I dont remember how you get it, but it involves doing mostly paragon and 1 renegade. Reason why I believe in the IT above everything else is that alluding to your point. At one instance shepard simply states:
"if you canc ontrol them why waste your time with us?"
TIM:
"....because I need you to believe"
That makes no sense from TIM point. If he can contorl them and if he is there he would have control them, and done his thing, not waste his time tryingt o convince you of something. Is just ridiculous and bad writting if he is in fact there.
Just playing Devil's Advocate here to be fair to the Anti-IT's BUT TIM might want Shepherd to believe so that Shepherd will come around to his way of thinking. If Shepherd comes around to his way of thinking, Shepherd can convince the other races that what TIM believes is true. I can objectively see how this could be interpreted two ways, even though I lean toward one of them.
SS2Dante wrote...
paxxton wrote...
Rifneno wrote...
balance5050 wrote...
Black shadows never showed up when you used that power in ME2. I strongly doubt he is using reave. Usually if a bioticis being used, there is a graphical effect on the body. stasis has the victim covered in white, reave had them covered in dark blue.
All we see from Shepard is him rubbing his temple as if he has a headache. The head ache indicates to me that TIM is using a mind control power rather then a biotic power, which controls matter.
Yeah. That same effect is also used in the dreams. Hmm, I wonder there's anything telling in the pcc files.
... BioVFX_Plc_ReaperIndoc? Nah, I'm sure it's not what it looks like.
I have answered it many times. There is a clear explanation on Sanctuary in one of the PDAs why TIM is able to control Shepard and Anderson (nanides and adrenaline rush are technical means of indoctrination). Also, it is implied that TIM underwent some form of augmentation to be able to do that (the vid log on Cronos Station just before TIM's office).
Isn't that physical indoctrination though? How does TIM administer it?
(physical as opposed to the wave based indoctrination the codex describes)
ExtendedCut wrote...
paxxton wrote...
Rifneno wrote...
balance5050 wrote...
Black shadows never showed up when you used that power in ME2. I strongly doubt he is using reave. Usually if a bioticis being used, there is a graphical effect on the body. stasis has the victim covered in white, reave had them covered in dark blue.
All we see from Shepard is him rubbing his temple as if he has a headache. The head ache indicates to me that TIM is using a mind control power rather then a biotic power, which controls matter.
Yeah. That same effect is also used in the dreams. Hmm, I wonder there's anything telling in the pcc files.
... BioVFX_Plc_ReaperIndoc? Nah, I'm sure it's not what it looks like.
I have answered it many times. There is a clear explanation on Sanctuary in one of the PDAs why TIM is able to control Shepard and Anderson (nanides and adrenaline rush are technical means of indoctrination). Also, it is implied that TIM underwent some form of augmentation to be able to do that (the vid log on Cronos Station just before TIM's office).
Could you elaborate please? If it has to do with nanides, then when did Shepard get injected with them? Everything we know about Lazarus says that they did NOT change "who Shepard was". Am I missing something here?
ExtendedCut wrote...
paxxton wrote...
I have answered it many times. There is a clear explanation on Sanctuary in one of the PDAs why TIM is able to control Shepard and Anderson (nanides and adrenaline rush are technical means of indoctrination). Also, it is implied that TIM underwent some form of augmentation to be able to do that (the vid log on Cronos Station just before TIM's office).
Could you elaborate please? If it has to do with nanides, then when did Shepard get injected with them? Everything we know about Lazarus says that they did NOT change "who Shepard was". Am I missing something here?
Modifié par paxxton, 18 avril 2012 - 07:08 .
balance5050 wrote...
BatmanTurian wrote...
Spartas Husky wrote...
Black shadows never showed up when you used that power in ME2. I strongly doubt he is using reave. Usually if a bioticis being used, there is a graphical effect on the body. stasis has the victim covered in white, reave had them covered in dark blue.
All we see from Shepard is him rubbing his temple as if he has a headache. The head ache indicates to me that TIM is using a mind control power rather then a biotic power, which controls matter.I dont remember how you get it, but it involves doing mostly paragon and 1 renegade. Reason why I believe in the IT above everything else is that alluding to your point. At one instance shepard simply states:
"if you canc ontrol them why waste your time with us?"
TIM:
"....because I need you to believe"
That makes no sense from TIM point. If he can contorl them and if he is there he would have control them, and done his thing, not waste his time tryingt o convince you of something. Is just ridiculous and bad writting if he is in fact there.
Just playing Devil's Advocate here to be fair to the Anti-IT's BUT TIM might want Shepherd to believe so that Shepherd will come around to his way of thinking. If Shepherd comes around to his way of thinking, Shepherd can convince the other races that what TIM believes is true. I can objectively see how this could be interpreted two ways, even though I lean toward one of them.
The best way to prove something is to show it, I knew and Shep knew that he couldn't control them. When you say "then do it! open up the arms!" TIM says, "I will" but he doesn't. TIM didn't care what Shep thought in this game anyway.
paxxton wrote...
ExtendedCut wrote...
paxxton wrote...
I have answered it many times. There is a clear explanation on Sanctuary in one of the PDAs why TIM is able to control Shepard and Anderson (nanides and adrenaline rush are technical means of indoctrination). Also, it is implied that TIM underwent some form of augmentation to be able to do that (the vid log on Cronos Station just before TIM's office).
Could you elaborate please? If it has to do with nanides, then when did Shepard get injected with them? Everything we know about Lazarus says that they did NOT change "who Shepard was". Am I missing something here?
Nanides do not have to be injected. It is sufficient that you inhale them - the point is they are in Shepard's body. Through the lungs they come into the blood stream and travel to every cell of his body.
ExtendedCut wrote...
Leto_Galt wrote...
ExtendedCut wrote...
I don't remember anything about Morinth being able to control people in ME2. Can someone remind me?
If that is true, then their may be a precedent for biotic control of people, and TIM's control over Shepard and Anderson wouldn't be quite so inexplicable without IT.
I responded to you last night on this topic.
See page 1533 to 1534
Thanks - just read your thoughts from last night - very informative and I guess it may explain TIM's "powers". The only problem that I see is that there are at least, what, about 10 or 12 banshees that Shepard fights in ME3 and (other than when they grab you and kill you) they do not exhibit any organic control - so I'm not sure we can assume all Ardat-Yakshi have the Dominate power. And I'm also not sure we can assume that TIM can gain biotic powers from the Reapers either. Still, granted, your explanation is very, very plausible. Thanks.
paxxton wrote...
Nanides do not have to be injected. It is sufficient that you inhale them - the point is they are in Shepard's body. Through the lungs they come into the blood stream and travel to every cell of his body.ExtendedCut wrote...
Could you elaborate please? If it has to do with nanides, then when did Shepard get injected with them? Everything we know about Lazarus says that they did NOT change "who Shepard was". Am I missing something here?paxxton wrote...
I have answered it many times. There is a clear explanation on Sanctuary in one of the PDAs why TIM is able to control Shepard and Anderson (nanides and adrenaline rush are technical means of indoctrination). Also, it is implied that TIM underwent some form of augmentation to be able to do that (the vid log on Cronos Station just before TIM's office).
paxxton wrote...
ExtendedCut wrote...
paxxton wrote...
I have answered it many times. There is a clear explanation on Sanctuary in one of the PDAs why TIM is able to control Shepard and Anderson (nanides and adrenaline rush are technical means of indoctrination). Also, it is implied that TIM underwent some form of augmentation to be able to do that (the vid log on Cronos Station just before TIM's office).
Could you elaborate please? If it has to do with nanides, then when did Shepard get injected with them? Everything we know about Lazarus says that they did NOT change "who Shepard was". Am I missing something here?
Nanides do not have to be injected. It is sufficient that you inhale them - the point is they are in Shepard's body. Through the lungs they come into the blood stream and travel to every cell of his body.
balance5050 wrote...
paxxton wrote...
ExtendedCut wrote...
paxxton wrote...
I have answered it many times. There is a clear explanation on Sanctuary in one of the PDAs why TIM is able to control Shepard and Anderson (nanides and adrenaline rush are technical means of indoctrination). Also, it is implied that TIM underwent some form of augmentation to be able to do that (the vid log on Cronos Station just before TIM's office).
Could you elaborate please? If it has to do with nanides, then when did Shepard get injected with them? Everything we know about Lazarus says that they did NOT change "who Shepard was". Am I missing something here?
Nanides do not have to be injected. It is sufficient that you inhale them - the point is they are in Shepard's body. Through the lungs they come into the blood stream and travel to every cell of his body.
I don't know if nanites would be airborn
Modifié par llbountyhunter, 18 avril 2012 - 07:15 .
balance5050 wrote...
paxxton wrote...
ExtendedCut wrote...
paxxton wrote...
I have answered it many times. There is a clear explanation on Sanctuary in one of the PDAs why TIM is able to control Shepard and Anderson (nanides and adrenaline rush are technical means of indoctrination). Also, it is implied that TIM underwent some form of augmentation to be able to do that (the vid log on Cronos Station just before TIM's office).
Could you elaborate please? If it has to do with nanides, then when did Shepard get injected with them? Everything we know about Lazarus says that they did NOT change "who Shepard was". Am I missing something here?
Nanides do not have to be injected. It is sufficient that you inhale them - the point is they are in Shepard's body. Through the lungs they come into the blood stream and travel to every cell of his body.
I don't know if nanites would be airborn
Modifié par paxxton, 18 avril 2012 - 07:15 .
I always thought he wanted him to believe so that he could use Shepard to control them. He knows Shepard isn't under reaper control and wouldn't be influenced by them trying to stop him.BatmanTurian wrote...
balance5050 wrote...
BatmanTurian wrote...
Spartas Husky wrote...
Black shadows never showed up when you used that power in ME2. I strongly doubt he is using reave. Usually if a bioticis being used, there is a graphical effect on the body. stasis has the victim covered in white, reave had them covered in dark blue.
All we see from Shepard is him rubbing his temple as if he has a headache. The head ache indicates to me that TIM is using a mind control power rather then a biotic power, which controls matter.I dont remember how you get it, but it involves doing mostly paragon and 1 renegade. Reason why I believe in the IT above everything else is that alluding to your point. At one instance shepard simply states:
"if you canc ontrol them why waste your time with us?"
TIM:
"....because I need you to believe"
That makes no sense from TIM point. If he can contorl them and if he is there he would have control them, and done his thing, not waste his time tryingt o convince you of something. Is just ridiculous and bad writting if he is in fact there.
Just playing Devil's Advocate here to be fair to the Anti-IT's BUT TIM might want Shepherd to believe so that Shepherd will come around to his way of thinking. If Shepherd comes around to his way of thinking, Shepherd can convince the other races that what TIM believes is true. I can objectively see how this could be interpreted two ways, even though I lean toward one of them.
The best way to prove something is to show it, I knew and Shep knew that he couldn't control them. When you say "then do it! open up the arms!" TIM says, "I will" but he doesn't. TIM didn't care what Shep thought in this game anyway.
I know just, like I said, playing Devil's Advocate.
EpyonX3 wrote...
Here's a clue.
When we see the Wavy Black lines on the screen, we usually know who they're targeting. If it's Shepard, he rubs his head and gut. Anderson, being stuck in on position, just grunts at the pain and even TIM is effected by it when he admits they're too strong.
The Wavy lines aren't indicative of Shepard being indoctrinated by reapers, they're just there to illustrate that the attempt is being done on one of the parties in the room.
I'll upload pics or a video showing what I mean if you guys are interested in debating this.
Bezmon9 wrote...
One more thing to add to this. Is that Harbinger is there with you right at the portal! Think about it. Harbinger THE MASTER OF INDOCTRINATING people. The main Culprit behind the poisoned influence of Saren, the rapid possession of any and all Collectors, TIM, even some of the scientist that turned on you in the Arrival DLC. This is all HARBINGER, he is the leader, he is Sheppard's rival. Harbinger can control anything and anyone. Even all of us as the players.We did not fight a leader in ME3! I have a feeling that the true battle with Harbinger will be DLC. I hope because if it goes down like this. Then i have lost all hopes for Video Games. All the final conclusion games that came out this year have had terrible endings with questions left unanswered or answered without any thought. Gears of War 3 and ACR. WTF kind of endings were those? One can tell they just rushed it. Ok ya the Locust were always there??! What that's all we get to do with Altair? Ezio dies from a heart attack with some unknown character at the end of Embers. We just kill all the Geth and Quarians then for the best possible outcome? WTF Losing faith quick guys. Work on the ENDING 2ND after the INTRO PLEEEEASE! All that stuff in the middle will come in time. JEESH GUYS!
balance5050 wrote...
EpyonX3 wrote...
Here's a clue.
When we see the Wavy Black lines on the screen, we usually know who they're targeting. If it's Shepard, he rubs his head and gut. Anderson, being stuck in on position, just grunts at the pain and even TIM is effected by it when he admits they're too strong.
The Wavy lines aren't indicative of Shepard being indoctrinated by reapers, they're just there to illustrate that the attempt is being done on one of the parties in the room.
I'll upload pics or a video showing what I mean if you guys are interested in debating this.
*grabs popcorn*
Those lines appear when TIM applies his power on to Shep and Anderson.
paxxton wrote...
balance5050 wrote...
I don't know if nanites would be airborn
The so-called "oily shadows" in the Citadel scene are swarms of nanides. Oily shadows is just a poetic name for technical means of indoctrination. Ever saw dust under the microscope? There are billions of tiny discrete elements but still with an unarmed eye you see dust as a cloud.
The dream sequences are more poetic so the oily shadows are use there literally as figures of people.
EpyonX3 wrote...
I always thought he wanted him to believe so that he could use Shepard to control them. He knows Shepard isn't under reaper control and wouldn't be influenced by them trying to stop him.BatmanTurian wrote...
balance5050 wrote...
BatmanTurian wrote...
Spartas Husky wrote...
Black shadows never showed up when you used that power in ME2. I strongly doubt he is using reave. Usually if a bioticis being used, there is a graphical effect on the body. stasis has the victim covered in white, reave had them covered in dark blue.
All we see from Shepard is him rubbing his temple as if he has a headache. The head ache indicates to me that TIM is using a mind control power rather then a biotic power, which controls matter.I dont remember how you get it, but it involves doing mostly paragon and 1 renegade. Reason why I believe in the IT above everything else is that alluding to your point. At one instance shepard simply states:
"if you canc ontrol them why waste your time with us?"
TIM:
"....because I need you to believe"
That makes no sense from TIM point. If he can contorl them and if he is there he would have control them, and done his thing, not waste his time tryingt o convince you of something. Is just ridiculous and bad writting if he is in fact there.
Just playing Devil's Advocate here to be fair to the Anti-IT's BUT TIM might want Shepherd to believe so that Shepherd will come around to his way of thinking. If Shepherd comes around to his way of thinking, Shepherd can convince the other races that what TIM believes is true. I can objectively see how this could be interpreted two ways, even though I lean toward one of them.
The best way to prove something is to show it, I knew and Shep knew that he couldn't control them. When you say "then do it! open up the arms!" TIM says, "I will" but he doesn't. TIM didn't care what Shep thought in this game anyway.
I know just, like I said, playing Devil's Advocate.
TIM still has some sort of control to still believe he can defeat the reapers by controlling them. Unlike Saren who wanted everyone to lay down and accept what's coming.
paxxton wrote...
balance5050 wrote...
paxxton wrote...
ExtendedCut wrote...
paxxton wrote...
I have answered it many times. There is a clear explanation on Sanctuary in one of the PDAs why TIM is able to control Shepard and Anderson (nanides and adrenaline rush are technical means of indoctrination). Also, it is implied that TIM underwent some form of augmentation to be able to do that (the vid log on Cronos Station just before TIM's office).
Could you elaborate please? If it has to do with nanides, then when did Shepard get injected with them? Everything we know about Lazarus says that they did NOT change "who Shepard was". Am I missing something here?
Nanides do not have to be injected. It is sufficient that you inhale them - the point is they are in Shepard's body. Through the lungs they come into the blood stream and travel to every cell of his body.
I don't know if nanites would be airborn
The so-called "oily shadows" in the Citadel scene are swarms of nanides. Oily shadows is just a poetic name for technical means of indoctrination. Ever saw dust under the microscope? There are billions of tiny discrete elements but still with an unarmed eye you see dust as a cloud.
The dream sequences are more poetic so the oily shadows are use there literally as figures of people.
balance5050 wrote...
EpyonX3 wrote...
Here's a clue.
When we see the Wavy Black lines on the screen, we usually know who they're targeting. If it's Shepard, he rubs his head and gut. Anderson, being stuck in on position, just grunts at the pain and even TIM is effected by it when he admits they're too strong.
The Wavy lines aren't indicative of Shepard being indoctrinated by reapers, they're just there to illustrate that the attempt is being done on one of the parties in the room.
I'll upload pics or a video showing what I mean if you guys are interested in debating this.
*grabs popcorn*
Those lines appear when TIM applies his power on to Shep and Anderson.
SS2Dante wrote...
balance5050 wrote...
EpyonX3 wrote...
Here's a clue.
When we see the Wavy Black lines on the screen, we usually know who they're targeting. If it's Shepard, he rubs his head and gut. Anderson, being stuck in on position, just grunts at the pain and even TIM is effected by it when he admits they're too strong.
The Wavy lines aren't indicative of Shepard being indoctrinated by reapers, they're just there to illustrate that the attempt is being done on one of the parties in the room.
I'll upload pics or a video showing what I mean if you guys are interested in debating this.
*grabs popcorn*
Those lines appear when TIM applies his power on to Shep and Anderson.
Actually we all seem to be ignoring the fact that indoctrination is not usually visible. or am i forgetting something?
SS2Dante wrote...
balance5050 wrote...
EpyonX3 wrote...
Here's a clue.
When we see the Wavy Black lines on the screen, we usually know who they're targeting. If it's Shepard, he rubs his head and gut. Anderson, being stuck in on position, just grunts at the pain and even TIM is effected by it when he admits they're too strong.
The Wavy lines aren't indicative of Shepard being indoctrinated by reapers, they're just there to illustrate that the attempt is being done on one of the parties in the room.
I'll upload pics or a video showing what I mean if you guys are interested in debating this.
*grabs popcorn*
Those lines appear when TIM applies his power on to Shep and Anderson.
Actually we all seem to be ignoring the fact that indoctrination is not usually visible. or am i forgetting something?
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