57139 réponses à ce sujet

[Earthborn_Shepard]

Ok.. I finally watched the child scream scene. And.. I gotta admit, to me it sounds just like some sound effect.. maybe not even a scream.

[DirtyPhoenix]

HellishFiend wrote...

Baldsake wrote...

pirate1802 wrote...

I find it funny how the music cuts away the exact moment shep spots the kid. before that everything was normal.

There was no music in the video, that was the whole point... There have been some very solid hints at the IDT in this thread... The scream is not one of them.

I think he meant to say the ambient sound effects cut away at that moment, not the music. 

Yeah I meant to say that. Apologies for the misunderstanding, english isn't my native languaage so mistakes may occur.

[Tirian Thorn]

HellishFiend wrote...

Tirian Thorn wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

I dont buy the "QA" or "coincidence" or "Bioware messed up" defense one bit. There are just too many things. Too many. I'm not talking about anyone specific, but in general, I almost roll my eyes every time someone says something we find is just a coincidence or QA issue.

We have dozens upon dozens of occurrences of varying degrees that can be considered evidence, and very compelling and logical speculation regarding each that supports IT. In order to completely refute (or debunk, as people like to call it) IT and support the face-value interpretation, you have to not only state that every single one of those occurrences are QA/coincidence (which is statistically unlikely), but also come up with reasonable answers for the multitude of plotholes and inconsistencies with the ending.

As Coates would say, "It's too much..."

The number of “mistakes” the amount of “laziness” and proclaimed “QA errors” that are present are too numerous to be just that. 

To me, it just seems like this was all done with a plan.  But, the Indoctrination had to be so subtle that there would be debate and discussion as to whether or not it was true. 

I’ve brought this up many many times on this thread but it deserves mention again.  Bioware wanted discussion, they wanted debate.  From day one they were saying stuff like “hold on to your save files” and “if you only knew what we had planned.”  Why say things like that if you have no future plans, other than side quest DLC?  Would a DLC about retaking Omega really draw people back if the ending sucked so bad? 

Bioware wanted this debate.  They wanted the press surrounding the ending.  They wanted it to be polarizing. 

Agreed 100%. 

So let’s take it a step further then. 

Since Bioware knew that the ending would be polarizing isn’t it reasonable to assume that the ending as it stands was fully planned out?  I guess it depends on whether you think Bioware was lazy and put out a hastily thrown together ending to make money and save time  OR that they are the game designers that that have put out great games like Baldur’s Gate, Neverwinter Nights, KOTOR, Jade Empire,  and Dragon Age?

They’ve made some tremendous games over the years.  And for those that played KOTOR, remember the major plot twist? Did anyone see that coming?  I’d call BS if anyone says they did.  But when they explained it, the clues were always there for everyone to see, that’s what made it even better – that they left clues. 

So do you really think that the same company that brought us – in my opinion –the best plot twist since Vader fathered Luke are a bunch of incompetent money-grubbing half-wits or a just pulling of a massive plot twist? 

[MadRabbit999]

SS2Dante wrote...

I find the notion that QA removed all the previous screams and somehow
missed this one FAR more unlikely than even the most far reaching IT
stuff. Also, you really think that that scene wasn't written, scripted
and storyboarded with care? It's the opening credits! You don't just
change stuff around willy-nilly (heh) in a game like that.

If you'll look back actually you'll find repeated clarifications of the words "proof" and "evidence" used in this thread.

You
seem to what definitive "proof", with literal as your fallback stance.
unfortunately this is something you cannot have until the DLC comes out,
so you must look at probabilities. To my mind, the probability of all
these odd occurences syncing up perfectly by accident is far far lower
than the probability that Bioware can make good games.

No, QA did not remove anything.... QA gets to do their daily tests, or however the test cut-scenes.. they do not get told "watch if you can hear screams" nope... they need to watch out for bugs and things that do not make sense, they get given the scene and test it to the death, then 4 months later, after hundreds of tests on this scene, they removed sounds and placed music instead... do you really think it is easy to spot? Nope, they are not told "Check we removed every single sound",  they still need to spot bugs and things that makes no sense.

And yes, you storybaord and create scenes, but you also edit and cut out because things on paper looked better than o nthe screen, or sometimes a new better idea comes to mind....also, have you seen the endings of the game? Do they look properly storyboarded to you? Jeff running away, and the whole "where did your friends suddenly dissapeared during the last run"?

Most people goes "Ah yes this is proof!" as soon as they see the most light glint of light in the character eyes or the slightest fart in the air.

Aslo ,sorry to dissapoint you but the extended cut will not prove or disproove IT, becaue they want you to talk over and over, making up stuff so the interest for ME does not die.

Also if IT is true, means that Shepard needs to wake up and the story is not over, which means it needs a new ending, which they already stated, they will not do so (Not changing of the current ones, nor adding they said). And do you really think they would finish a great saga without a real conclusion?

Modifié par MadRabbit999, 25 avril 2012 - 03:25 .

[Baldsake]

HellishFiend wrote...

Baldsake wrote...

pirate1802 wrote...

I find it funny how the music cuts away the exact moment shep spots the kid. before that everything was normal.

There was no music in the video, that was the whole point... There have been some very solid hints at the IDT in this thread... The scream is not one of them.

I think he meant to say the ambient sound effects cut away at that moment, not the music. 

Oh, alright then.. Well there are some sound effects being played prior to the scream.. But yeah I honestly think that was for dramatic effect.

[HellishFiend]

Tirian Thorn wrote...

So let’s take it a step further then. 

Since Bioware knew that the ending would be polarizing isn’t it reasonable to assume that the ending as it stands was fully planned out?  I guess it depends on whether you think Bioware was lazy and put out a hastily thrown together ending to make money and save time  OR that they are the game designers that that have put out great games like Baldur’s Gate, Neverwinter Nights, KOTOR, Jade Empire,  and Dragon Age?

They’ve made some tremendous games over the years.  And for those that played KOTOR, remember the major plot twist? Did anyone see that coming?  I’d call BS if anyone says they did.  But when they explained it, the clues were always there for everyone to see, that’s what made it even better – that they left clues. 

So do you really think that the same company that brought us – in my opinion –the best plot twist since Vader fathered Luke are a bunch of incompetent money-grubbing half-wits or a just pulling of a massive plot twist? 

I think people are angry and failing to give Bioware their well-deserved benefit of the doubt because the only two possibilities are that either the ending sucks or we have an incomplete game. In that regard, the anger is justified. In my humble opinion, having an incomplete game at this point in time is well worth the experience of having been fooled the way we were, and getting to unravel the mystery and unwrap the truth as it gets revealed.

That being said, I'm sure Bioware expected the ending as it stands to be polarizing, but I think they underestimated the amount of anger it would incite. I also think that wanting to buy themselves more time to craft the "real" ending was a major factor in doing it the way they did. 

Its common knowledge that they originally wanted the final indoctrination sequence to be a gameplay mechanic. If it was, however, they would have had no excuse to leave out the "real" ending and ensuing epilogue/closure scenes. It's possible that the lack of time to put those scenes together was a factor in deciding to drop the gameplay version of the Indoctrination sequence and go with the Player Indoctrination/Fake Ending sequence that we apparently have now. 

[Chris Readman]

HellishFiend wrote...

I dont buy the "QA" or "coincidence" or "Bioware messed up" defense one bit. There are just too many things. Too many. I'm not talking about anyone specific, but in general, I almost roll my eyes every time someone says something we find is just a coincidence or QA issue.

We have dozens upon dozens of occurrences of varying degrees that can be considered evidence, and very compelling and logical speculation regarding each that supports IT. In order to completely refute (or debunk, as people like to call it) IT and support the face-value interpretation, you have to not only state that every single one of those occurrences are QA/coincidence (which is statistically unlikely), but also come up with reasonable answers for the multitude of plotholes and inconsistencies with the ending.

As Coates would say, "It's too much..."

The problem with accepting the Indoctrination Theory as a whole is that it seems like a desperate attempts by fans of the series to put the writers on a pedastal. I'm sorry if this sounds blunt, but that's the way it seems to me.

Let's turn the chessboard around in this argument. See, what you've been doing is simply saying "there must be more to it" to dismiss the other end of the argument. It seems like what the Indoctrination Theory is doing to absorbing every single piece of evidence that people would associate with "coincidence, "bad writing" or "Bioware messing up", and then forcing them together in order to create a theory to say that Bioware must have planned it all along.

There are many many problems with the Indoctrination Theory, it is just an interesting possibility that has been proposed. It is a fallacy to say that  it holds water simply because people cannot disprove it. I can say that you cannot disprove the existence of the devil, but is this conclusive evidence that he exists?

[Rifneno]

MadRabbit999 wrote...

Not at all, check hundreds of posts back I was here almsot from the start and drop from week to week, I have both bashed and supported IT, I do not take sides, I rather see concrete proofs not speculations or I would go to a religion forum and discuss "beliefs" over facts, there.

Then get out. This place is for fans to discuss IT and related topics. We're free to speculate and theorize all we want. If we want to talk about a thought or idea that couldn't currently be proven in a court of law, we don't have to justify ourselves to people like you. If you don't like it, get out. I promise we won't miss one more self-superior quasi-troll that compares us to conspiracy nuts or zealots.

[HellishFiend]

Chris Readman wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

I dont buy the "QA" or "coincidence" or "Bioware messed up" defense one bit. There are just too many things. Too many. I'm not talking about anyone specific, but in general, I almost roll my eyes every time someone says something we find is just a coincidence or QA issue.

We have dozens upon dozens of occurrences of varying degrees that can be considered evidence, and very compelling and logical speculation regarding each that supports IT. In order to completely refute (or debunk, as people like to call it) IT and support the face-value interpretation, you have to not only state that every single one of those occurrences are QA/coincidence (which is statistically unlikely), but also come up with reasonable answers for the multitude of plotholes and inconsistencies with the ending.

As Coates would say, "It's too much..."

The problem with accepting the Indoctrination Theory as a whole is that it seems like a desperate attempts by fans of the series to put the writers on a pedastal. I'm sorry if this sounds blunt, but that's the way it seems to me.

Let's turn the chessboard around in this argument. See, what you've been doing is simply saying "there must be more to it" to dismiss the other end of the argument. It seems like what the Indoctrination Theory is doing to absorbing every single piece of evidence that people would associate with "coincidence, "bad writing" or "Bioware messing up", and then forcing them together in order to create a theory to say that Bioware must have planned it all along.

There are many many problems with the Indoctrination Theory, it is just an interesting possibility that has been proposed. It is a fallacy to say that  it holds water simply because people cannot disprove it. I can say that you cannot disprove the existence of the devil, but is this conclusive evidence that he exists?

You'll forgive me for pointing out that your post is very typical. It's full of hyperbole (putting the writers on a pedestal?), exaggeration, opinion, and failure to include any examples. To cap it off, you end with the inappropriate metaphor in a weak attempt to drive your "point" home. 

In the end, your post is one big opinion that has no meat behind it. That carries no weight with me. You're welcome to cite examples, make an argument for something tangible, or something like that, but if you're going to post in this topic, please contribute rather than making a pointless and unsubstantial opinion post. 

[SS2Dante]

MadRabbit999 wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

I find the notion that QA removed all the previous screams and somehow
missed this one FAR more unlikely than even the most far reaching IT
stuff. Also, you really think that that scene wasn't written, scripted
and storyboarded with care? It's the opening credits! You don't just
change stuff around willy-nilly (heh) in a game like that.

If you'll look back actually you'll find repeated clarifications of the words "proof" and "evidence" used in this thread.

You
seem to what definitive "proof", with literal as your fallback stance.
unfortunately this is something you cannot have until the DLC comes out,
so you must look at probabilities. To my mind, the probability of all
these odd occurences syncing up perfectly by accident is far far lower
than the probability that Bioware can make good games.

No, QA did not remove anything.... QA gets to do their daily tests, or however the test cut-scenes.. they do not get told "watch if you can hear screams" nope... they need to watch out for bugs and things that do not make sense, they get given the scene and test it to the death, then 4 months later, after hundreds of tests on this scene, they removed sounds and placed music instead... do you really think it is easy to spot? Nope, they are not told "Check we removed every single sound",  they still need to spot bugs and things that makes no sense.

And yes, you storybaord and create scenes, but you also edit and cut out because things on paper looked better than o nthe screen, or sometimes a new better idea comes to mind....also, have you seen the endings of the game? Do they look properly storyboarded to you? Jeff running away, and the whole "where did your friends suddenly dissapeared during the last run"?

Most people goes "Ah yes this is proof!" as soon as they see the most light glint of light in the character eyes or the slightest fart in the air.

Aslo ,sorry to dissapoint you but the extended cut will not prove or disproove IT, becaue they want you to talk over and over, making up stuff so the interest for ME does not die.

Also if IT is true, means that Shepard needs to wake up and the story is not over, which means it needs a new ending, which they already stated, they will not do so (Not changing of the current ones, nor adding they said). And do you really think they would finish a great saga without a real conclusion?

You stated that a reason for the scream is that you could originally hear the passengers scream as the shuttle is shot down, and that this was stripped out. This implies that every single person scream except this was stripped out and noone noticed. I'm saying that's incredibly unlikely.

See, this right here is the problem. You are using the endings to justify the Bad Writing argument which explains the ENDINGS. Circular logic, circular proof. Useless.

No, it would not need a "new ending", that's the ENTIRE point of IT. No new ending, just a continuation of it. Which I think you'll find is how the EC is phrased. Expand and clarify the ending.

[ExtendedCut]

HellishFiend wrote...

MadRabbit999 wrote...



To me it is done to enhance the dramatic moment, to you is IT proof, but neither of us has any real proofs.

Who said it was proof? Who ever says anything is "proof" in this topic? We are all just speculating and having fun finding tidbits that could be evidence or hints from bioware that support IT. If anyone ever uses the word proof, its all in good fun, or theyre just excited. 

Well said. 

I think people enjoy guessing and hoping that their own little "contribution" to the IT phenomenon is going to prove to be important. 

You are right - it's all in good fun, and I can't understand why posters come on here and say things like "what's wrong with all you people?  IT is the stupidest thing I have ever heard!"  (I was not referrring to MadRabbit in this case - he/she has not been trollish at all)

[Rksmithers]

MadRabbit999 wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

I find the notion that QA removed all the previous screams and somehow
missed this one FAR more unlikely than even the most far reaching IT
stuff. Also, you really think that that scene wasn't written, scripted
and storyboarded with care? It's the opening credits! You don't just
change stuff around willy-nilly (heh) in a game like that.

If you'll look back actually you'll find repeated clarifications of the words "proof" and "evidence" used in this thread.

You
seem to what definitive "proof", with literal as your fallback stance.
unfortunately this is something you cannot have until the DLC comes out,
so you must look at probabilities. To my mind, the probability of all
these odd occurences syncing up perfectly by accident is far far lower
than the probability that Bioware can make good games.

No, QA did not remove anything.... QA gets to do their daily tests, or however the test cut-scenes.. they do not get told "watch if you can hear screams" nope... they need to watch out for bugs and things that do not make sense, they get given the scene and test it to the death, then 4 months later, after hundreds of tests on this scene, they removed sounds and placed music instead... do you really think it is easy to spot? Nope, they are not told "Check we removed every single sound",  they still need to spot bugs and things that makes no sense.

And yes, you storybaord and create scenes, but you also edit and cut out because things on paper looked better than o nthe screen, or sometimes a new better idea comes to mind....also, have you seen the endings of the game? Do they look properly storyboarded to you? Jeff running away, and the whole "where did your friends suddenly dissapeared during the last run"?

Most people goes "Ah yes this is proof!" as soon as they see the most light glint of light in the character eyes or the slightest fart in the air.

Aslo ,sorry to dissapoint you but the extended cut will not prove or disproove IT, becaue they want you to talk over and over, making up stuff so the interest for ME does not die.

Also if IT is true, means that Shepard needs to wake up and the story is not over, which means it needs a new ending, which they already stated, they will not do so (Not changing of the current ones, nor adding they said). And do you really think they would finish a great saga without a real conclusion?

leave.... sieriously, your nothing more than a self pretencious ass hole, who seems to have nothing better to do than try and make them selves feel better by attempting to crush peoples hopes, you have no "proof" your self let alone any sufficient "evidence", so get out and stay out..... you cause nothing more than a battlefield everytime you come on this thread, we dont take kindly to you kind, so.....

[b]AHEM


get ouuuuuuuuuutttttttt

Modifié par Rksmithers, 25 avril 2012 - 03:47 .

[Chris Readman]

HellishFiend wrote...

You'll forgive me for pointing out that your post is very typical. It's full of hyperbole (putting the writers on a pedestal?), exaggeration, opinion, and failure to include any examples. To cap it off, you end with the inappropriate metaphor in a weak attempt to drive your "point" home. 

In the end, your post is one big opinion that has no meat behind it. That carries no weight with me. You're welcome to cite examples, make an argument for something tangible, or something like that, but if you're going to post in this topic, please contribute rather than making a pointless and unsubstantial opinion post. 

The point was that you've willingly accepted one side of an argument and started dismissing the other side of the argument. You are committing the same fallacy that you oppose. You say that people dismiss your Indoctrination Theory with "QA" and "Bioware messing up", but you are dismissing these claims with the Indoctrination Theory.

If you want something tangible, then bring up evidence from the Indoctrination Theory. I can try to address them from my point of view. But fair warning, because of the nature of this type of argument, it will be full of conjecture from both sides which will never have solid form.

[ExtendedCut]

Earthborn_Shepard wrote...

Ok.. I finally watched the child scream scene. And.. I gotta admit, to me it sounds just like some sound effect.. maybe not even a scream.

I agree.  Although it would be cool if it was some kind of child-scream in Shepard's head - and one of the first clues of indoctrination - I'm not convinced.

[SS2Dante]

Baldsake wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

Baldsake wrote...

pirate1802 wrote...

I find it funny how the music cuts away the exact moment shep spots the kid. before that everything was normal.

There was no music in the video, that was the whole point... There have been some very solid hints at the IDT in this thread... The scream is not one of them.

I think he meant to say the ambient sound effects cut away at that moment, not the music. 

Oh, alright then.. Well there are some sound effects being played prior to the scream.. But yeah I honestly think that was for dramatic effect.

Then why is it hidden? This is the key point. You played with your levels adjusted so ok, but on normal levels you do not hear the scream (that you shouldn't be able to hear anyway, over explosions and all the other stuff going on). Some dramatic effect it is.

[Golferguy758]

I'm going to need addresses of several people bhythe end of this thread to send a beer to. Regardless of it being right or not.

[Vahilor]

MadRabbit999 wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

I find the notion that QA removed all the previous screams and somehow
missed this one FAR more unlikely than even the most far reaching IT
stuff. Also, you really think that that scene wasn't written, scripted
and storyboarded with care? It's the opening credits! You don't just
change stuff around willy-nilly (heh) in a game like that.

If you'll look back actually you'll find repeated clarifications of the words "proof" and "evidence" used in this thread.

You
seem to what definitive "proof", with literal as your fallback stance.
unfortunately this is something you cannot have until the DLC comes out,
so you must look at probabilities. To my mind, the probability of all
these odd occurences syncing up perfectly by accident is far far lower
than the probability that Bioware can make good games.

No, QA did not remove anything.... QA gets to do their daily tests, or however the test cut-scenes.. they do not get told "watch if you can hear screams" nope... they need to watch out for bugs and things that do not make sense, they get given the scene and test it to the death, then 4 months later, after hundreds of tests on this scene, they removed sounds and placed music instead... do you really think it is easy to spot? Nope, they are not told "Check we removed every single sound",  they still need to spot bugs and things that makes no sense.

And yes, you storybaord and create scenes, but you also edit and cut out because things on paper looked better than o nthe screen, or sometimes a new better idea comes to mind....also, have you seen the endings of the game? Do they look properly storyboarded to you? Jeff running away, and the whole "where did your friends suddenly dissapeared during the last run"?

Most people goes "Ah yes this is proof!" as soon as they see the most light glint of light in the character eyes or the slightest fart in the air.

Aslo ,sorry to dissapoint you but the extended cut will not prove or disproove IT, becaue they want you to talk over and over, making up stuff so the interest for ME does not die.

Also if IT is true, means that Shepard needs to wake up and the story is not over, which means it needs a new ending, which they already stated, they will not do so (Not changing of the current ones, nor adding they said). And do you really think they would finish a great saga without a real conclusion?

If they make the ending DLC to fishy, ME will die faster than they want to.. cause than a bunch of the fanbase will not buy any DLC and I don't think a lot will buy any further ME games.
Most people want a conclusion what happens to their Shepard, cause like we learned from ME you play your story and therefore you want even to influence the ending so you can have your Shepards story... but atm you can influence nothing (ok you can chose a color and make a breathing SHep in one ending..).. you only can watch how your story goes down the toilet.

Modifié par Vahilor, 25 avril 2012 - 03:45 .

[SS2Dante]

Chris Readman wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

You'll forgive me for pointing out that your post is very typical. It's full of hyperbole (putting the writers on a pedestal?), exaggeration, opinion, and failure to include any examples. To cap it off, you end with the inappropriate metaphor in a weak attempt to drive your "point" home. 

In the end, your post is one big opinion that has no meat behind it. That carries no weight with me. You're welcome to cite examples, make an argument for something tangible, or something like that, but if you're going to post in this topic, please contribute rather than making a pointless and unsubstantial opinion post. 

The point was that you've willingly accepted one side of an argument and started dismissing the other side of the argument. You are committing the same fallacy that you oppose. You say that people dismiss your Indoctrination Theory with "QA" and "Bioware messing up", but you are dismissing these claims with the Indoctrination Theory.

If you want something tangible, then bring up evidence from the Indoctrination Theory. I can try to address them from my point of view. But fair warning, because of the nature of this type of argument, it will be full of conjecture from both sides which will never have solid form.

We accept that it is conjecture. However, I think the problem with your post is that it stated - as many do - that there are flaws in IT, yet you didn't cite any. People do this every day in this thread. it gets tiring.

Modifié par SS2Dante, 25 avril 2012 - 03:45 .

[Rksmithers]

SS2Dante wrote...

Baldsake wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

Baldsake wrote...

pirate1802 wrote...

I find it funny how the music cuts away the exact moment shep spots the kid. before that everything was normal.

There was no music in the video, that was the whole point... There have been some very solid hints at the IDT in this thread... The scream is not one of them.

I think he meant to say the ambient sound effects cut away at that moment, not the music. 

Oh, alright then.. Well there are some sound effects being played prior to the scream.. But yeah I honestly think that was for dramatic effect.

Then why is it hidden? This is the key point. You played with your levels adjusted so ok, but on normal levels you do not hear the scream (that you shouldn't be able to hear anyway, over explosions and all the other stuff going on). Some dramatic effect it is.

its probably nothing............ havent heard it my self, but if its that hard to hear it could be white noise

[ExtendedCut]

Tirian Thorn wrote...



So let’s take it a step further then. 

Since Bioware knew that the ending would be polarizing isn’t it reasonable to assume that the ending as it stands was fully planned out?  I guess it depends on whether you think Bioware was lazy and put out a hastily thrown together ending to make money and save time  OR that they are the game designers that that have put out great games like Baldur’s Gate, Neverwinter Nights, KOTOR, Jade Empire,  and Dragon Age?

They’ve made some tremendous games over the years.  And for those that played KOTOR, remember the major plot twist? Did anyone see that coming?  I’d call BS if anyone says they did.  But when they explained it, the clues were always there for everyone to see, that’s what made it even better – that they left clues. 

So do you really think that the same company that brought us – in my opinion –the best plot twist since Vader fathered Luke are a bunch of incompetent money-grubbing half-wits or a just pulling of a massive plot twist? 

At first, I thought that Bioware was absolutely imcompetent and clueless for not anticipating this "uproar" and backlash about their ending to the ME trilogy.

But now, like you said, I have completely changed my mind.  I am on other forums more-so than this one, and I can say almost certainly that Bioware, the company, has NEVER had as much publicity as they have gotten in the last two months.  And, as they say, any publicity is good publicity.

Bioware might just turn out to be a bunch of geniouses...

[SS2Dante]

ExtendedCut wrote...

Earthborn_Shepard wrote...

Ok.. I finally watched the child scream scene. And.. I gotta admit, to me it sounds just like some sound effect.. maybe not even a scream.

I agree.  Although it would be cool if it was some kind of child-scream in Shepard's head - and one of the first clues of indoctrination - I'm not convinced.

I'm confused over peoples stance on this. If it's not a scream, why does it occur when the shuttle is hit? And if it is, why/how can Shepard hear it? And if it's for dramatic effect, why is it deliberately drowned out by the music so that 98% of players will never hear it?

[SS2Dante]

ExtendedCut wrote...

Tirian Thorn wrote...



So let’s take it a step further then. 

Since Bioware knew that the ending would be polarizing isn’t it reasonable to assume that the ending as it stands was fully planned out?  I guess it depends on whether you think Bioware was lazy and put out a hastily thrown together ending to make money and save time  OR that they are the game designers that that have put out great games like Baldur’s Gate, Neverwinter Nights, KOTOR, Jade Empire,  and Dragon Age?

They’ve made some tremendous games over the years.  And for those that played KOTOR, remember the major plot twist? Did anyone see that coming?  I’d call BS if anyone says they did.  But when they explained it, the clues were always there for everyone to see, that’s what made it even better – that they left clues. 

So do you really think that the same company that brought us – in my opinion –the best plot twist since Vader fathered Luke are a bunch of incompetent money-grubbing half-wits or a just pulling of a massive plot twist? 

At first, I thought that Bioware was absolutely imcompetent and clueless for not anticipating this "uproar" and backlash about their ending to the ME trilogy.

But now, like you said, I have completely changed my mind.  I am on other forums more-so than this one, and I can say almost certainly that Bioware, the company, has NEVER had as much publicity as they have gotten in the last two months.  And, as they say, any publicity is good publicity.

Bioware might just turn out to be a bunch of geniouses...

The banner they released a few weeks ago intrigued me. 

"Mass Effect 3 - the most talked about game ending in years"

A lot of people were angry at PR for spinning it, but it strikes me as if they're proud of this.

[HellishFiend]

Chris Readman wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

You'll forgive me for pointing out that your post is very typical. It's full of hyperbole (putting the writers on a pedestal?), exaggeration, opinion, and failure to include any examples. To cap it off, you end with the inappropriate metaphor in a weak attempt to drive your "point" home. 

In the end, your post is one big opinion that has no meat behind it. That carries no weight with me. You're welcome to cite examples, make an argument for something tangible, or something like that, but if you're going to post in this topic, please contribute rather than making a pointless and unsubstantial opinion post. 

The point was that you've willingly accepted one side of an argument and started dismissing the other side of the argument. You are committing the same fallacy that you oppose. You say that people dismiss your Indoctrination Theory with "QA" and "Bioware messing up", but you are dismissing these claims with the Indoctrination Theory.

If you want something tangible, then bring up evidence from the Indoctrination Theory. I can try to address them from my point of view. But fair warning, because of the nature of this type of argument, it will be full of conjecture from both sides which will never have solid form.

I dismiss nothing. If you go back and read previous posts of mine you will see that I am very objective and even carefully choose my words so as not to imply that I am not willing to entertain both sides of the story. The post you're referring to was just venting, borne out of fatigue and frustration. I'm sorry if it rubbed you the wrong way. 

At least I made that post in here instead of deliberately going into someones "pro-ender" topic and posting it there. Many people of the opposing viewpoint dont do us the same kindness. 

[SS2Dante]

Rksmithers wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

Baldsake wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

Baldsake wrote...

pirate1802 wrote...

I find it funny how the music cuts away the exact moment shep spots the kid. before that everything was normal.

There was no music in the video, that was the whole point... There have been some very solid hints at the IDT in this thread... The scream is not one of them.

I think he meant to say the ambient sound effects cut away at that moment, not the music. 

Oh, alright then.. Well there are some sound effects being played prior to the scream.. But yeah I honestly think that was for dramatic effect.

Then why is it hidden? This is the key point. You played with your levels adjusted so ok, but on normal levels you do not hear the scream (that you shouldn't be able to hear anyway, over explosions and all the other stuff going on). Some dramatic effect it is.

its probably nothing............ havent heard it my self, but if its that hard to hear it could be white noise

  

Here ya go.

EDIT - it's only hard to hear with the music on.

Modifié par SS2Dante, 25 avril 2012 - 03:50 .

[DJBare]

Chris Readman wrote...

The problem with accepting the Indoctrination Theory as a whole is that it seems like a desperate attempts by fans of the series to put the writers on a pedastal. I'm sorry if this sounds blunt, but that's the way it seems to me.

Some of us are far from placing them on a pedastal, they attempted something and it failed, hence the backlash, control of Shepard through IT was a Bioware idea, it's in the Final Hours App.