57139 réponses à ce sujet

[Tirian Thorn]

waldstr18 wrote...

Tirian Thorn wrote...
 
On my first play through I picked destroy then got involved with IDT.
Any new times I play through I have decided to stop before assaulting TIM’s base. And then I will adjust my ending decisions after the DLC.
Certain characters I have made are created with a roleplaying aspect. Like picking renegade just to be a dick or a sociopath, etc.

i wish i could play renegade. from what ive heart the jennifer hales voice acting must be superb as renegade shepard, but i cant bear taking a renegade option for some reason. hmm.. i blame nintendo.

Why blame Nintendo?  Did they hurt you?  Did someone hit you?  Do you have bruises? 

[balance5050]

waldstr18 wrote...

Tirian Thorn wrote...
 
On my first play through I picked destroy then got involved with IDT.
Any new times I play through I have decided to stop before assaulting TIM’s base. And then I will adjust my ending decisions after the DLC.
Certain characters I have made are created with a roleplaying aspect. Like picking renegade just to be a dick or a sociopath, etc.

i wish i could play renegade. from what ive heart the jennifer hales voice acting must be superb as renegade shepard, but i cant bear taking a renegade option for some reason. hmm.. i blame nintendo.

So, assuming control of a slave race of monstrosities, that have killed millions of different races for a billion years, because starbrat offered them up in return for you not killing him, which was both Paragon and Renegade Shepard goal for the past 3 games, is a Paragon decision?


Just because the reapers make it shine blue doesn't mean it's the Paragon ending. The actual file for that asset actually says "bad_end".

[Eli Parker]

EpyonX3 wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Eli Parker wrote...

I'm replaying Mass Effect 3 and during the dream sequences I thought of a theory.

The shadows represent the souls of the fallen and/or the souls that depends on Shepard. The shadows tries to surround the child in order to save Shepard from the child and to try to stop Harbinger from taking over Shepard's mind.

This might have been said, and if so my bad.

I don't know about the Shadows keeping him away from the child, but I agree that the shadows are basically faceless people that shepard let die while he's out playing politics.

The child retains his form because Shepard actual had contact with him. Everyone in the dream is dead. The last dream with Shepard holding the child is a bad sign, telling Shepard that he was going to die.

Almost all the whispers you hear are from people that you "actually" had contact with, why wasn't the boy Kaiden or Ashley? someone you had WAY MORE contact with. 

It just had to be that kid playing with a model Normandy, (faux reality beginning).

As much as Shepard didn't want to lose Ashley or Kaiden, they are soldiers. ar and they died protecting lives.

The boy was innocent and died for no reason. Shepard also had a chance to save him but failed. This event was also much more recent and during the heavy threat of a reaper invasion. Kaiden/Ashley died 3 years before.

Even though they are soldiers, that doesn't mean they have to die because they are soldiers. 

Edit - Still the kid to me never made since, to me it should have been Shep as a child.

Modifié par Eli Parker, 26 avril 2012 - 05:57 .

[EpyonX3]

balance5050 wrote...

This cycle already had laws in place to prevent AI creation before the reapers, it didn't stop them before and it won't stop them now.

People are going to keep advancing technology because that just how evolution works. We're still going to create full synthetics to be our servants and do our bidding again.

"this cycle will remember the reapers", eventually they will become the stuff of legend and society will forget.

You don't think that anyone will just replace they organic parts with synthetic parts?

Again, wars started because people have free will and other peopel want to stifle  that, There will never be peace.

The Krogans can already live for a 1000 years.

Synthesis literally solves nothing, and is a silly idea to begin with because it would only be possible through space magic. Out of all the billions of undiscovered planets, not every organic in the galaxy would have been touched.

This cycle also denied the reapers existence until now. But you're right, laws will be broken eventually.

If we take the Catalysts words as truth, then there is no further evolution after Synthesis. The need for advancing technology is gone. Also, it's possible that the material we'd use for making synthetics would be made of this hybrid dna.

The reapers won't be forgotten since they're still around. I don't see them just leaving the galaxy and never returning. Especially if they want to keep the peace.

It might not be as simple. It's not really about being half organs and half robotics. The DNA itself is synthetic and organic. Each part of the dna is dependent on each other.

The Krogan living 1000 years before synthesis were already a problem then. Synthesis wouldn't change much.


I agree that Synthesis is stupid. I don't think any technology in the universe ever can dynamically change DNA of living creatures to something completely different, but leaving the old form in tact. They should have all been killed during the process or went through serious mind breaking pain. But it makes the reapers go away without killing everyone in the process and allows the possibility of the relays to be rebuilt.

[MarkasLin]

Earthborn_Shepard wrote...

estebanus wrote...

Earthborn_Shepard wrote...

Mal an alle Deutschen hier: Woher genau kommt ihr denn

Flensburg!

Alle aus so großen Städten...

naja ich aus der Nähe von Minden/Bielefeld

Mein austausch bruder ist aus Bielefeld!
Ich bin aus Dänemark

[Earthborn_Shepard]

Another, maybe very subtle hint: What does Shep do in the last dream? Right, he embraces the kid and then smiles (creepily. Wait, does that word exist?). And what is one of Harbingers favourite lines?

"EMBRACE PERFECTION."

[MegumiAzusa]

balance5050 wrote...

waldstr18 wrote...

Tirian Thorn wrote...
 
On my first play through I picked destroy then got involved with IDT.
Any new times I play through I have decided to stop before assaulting TIM’s base. And then I will adjust my ending decisions after the DLC.
Certain characters I have made are created with a roleplaying aspect. Like picking renegade just to be a dick or a sociopath, etc.

i wish i could play renegade. from what ive heart the jennifer hales voice acting must be superb as renegade shepard, but i cant bear taking a renegade option for some reason. hmm.. i blame nintendo.

So, assuming control of a slave race of monstrosities, that have killed millions of different races for a billion years, because starbrat offered them up in return for you not killing him, which was both Paragon and Renegade Shepard goal for the past 3 games, is a Paragon decision?


Just because the reapers make it shine blue doesn't mean it's the Paragon ending. The actual file for that asset actually says "bad_end".

It's blue because lights on reaper technology is usually blue and destroy is red as explosions are usually yellow/red for us

[Simon_Says]

EpyonX3 wrote...

I agree that Synthesis is stupid. I don't think any technology in the universe ever can dynamically change DNA of living creatures to something completely different, but leaving the old form in tact. They should have all been killed during the process or went through serious mind breaking pain. But it makes the reapers go away without killing everyone in the process and allows the possibility of the relays to be rebuilt.

It probably would have made more sense for them to have skipped the word "DNA" and just say, I dunno, nanoaugmentation.

Still, people would compare it even more to the helios ending in IW. Which I'm still not sure is worse than synthesis or not.

Modifié par Simon_Says, 26 avril 2012 - 06:03 .

[EpyonX3]

Eli Parker wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Eli Parker wrote...

I'm replaying Mass Effect 3 and during the dream sequences I thought of a theory.

The shadows represent the souls of the fallen and/or the souls that depends on Shepard. The shadows tries to surround the child in order to save Shepard from the child and to try to stop Harbinger from taking over Shepard's mind.

This might have been said, and if so my bad.

I don't know about the Shadows keeping him away from the child, but I agree that the shadows are basically faceless people that shepard let die while he's out playing politics.

The child retains his form because Shepard actual had contact with him. Everyone in the dream is dead. The last dream with Shepard holding the child is a bad sign, telling Shepard that he was going to die.

Almost all the whispers you hear are from people that you "actually" had contact with, why wasn't the boy Kaiden or Ashley? someone you had WAY MORE contact with. 

It just had to be that kid playing with a model Normandy, (faux reality beginning).

As much as Shepard didn't want to lose Ashley or Kaiden, they are soldiers. ar and they died protecting lives.

The boy was innocent and died for no reason. Shepard also had a chance to save him but failed. This event was also much more recent and during the heavy threat of a reaper invasion. Kaiden/Ashley died 3 years before.

Even though they are soldiers, that doesn't mean they have to die because they are soldiers. 

Edit - Still the kid to me never made since, to me it should have been Shep as a child.

I agree but in this case their deaths were three years ago and they chose, somewhat, to do what it took to keep the reapers from winning.

At first when I played the demo, I thought the kid was part of Shepards imagination. This is what led me to believe IT when I first say it. I thought this was Shepard as a child, since he may have been recreating his checkered past due to the reaper invasion.

I was hoping before ME3 was released that this was the case and he was going crazy or have PTSD symptoms. That clearly wasn't the case.

[Simon_Says]

Earthborn_Shepard wrote...

Another, maybe very subtle hint: What does Shep do in the last dream? Right, he embraces the kid and then smiles (creepily. Wait, does that word exist?). And what is one of Harbingers favourite lines?

"EMBRACE PERFECTION."

"WE ARE YOUR GENETIC DESINTY" anyone?

[balance5050]

EpyonX3 wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

This cycle already had laws in place to prevent AI creation before the reapers, it didn't stop them before and it won't stop them now.

People are going to keep advancing technology because that just how evolution works. We're still going to create full synthetics to be our servants and do our bidding again.

"this cycle will remember the reapers", eventually they will become the stuff of legend and society will forget.

You don't think that anyone will just replace they organic parts with synthetic parts?

Again, wars started because people have free will and other peopel want to stifle  that, There will never be peace.

The Krogans can already live for a 1000 years.

Synthesis literally solves nothing, and is a silly idea to begin with because it would only be possible through space magic. Out of all the billions of undiscovered planets, not every organic in the galaxy would have been touched.

This cycle also denied the reapers existence until now. But you're right, laws will be broken eventually.

If we take the Catalysts words as truth, then there is no further evolution after Synthesis. The need for advancing technology is gone. Also, it's possible that the material we'd use for making synthetics would be made of this hybrid dna.

The reapers won't be forgotten since they're still around. I don't see them just leaving the galaxy and never returning. Especially if they want to keep the peace.

It might not be as simple. It's not really about being half organs and half robotics. The DNA itself is synthetic and organic. Each part of the dna is dependent on each other.

The Krogan living 1000 years before synthesis were already a problem then. Synthesis wouldn't change much.


I agree that Synthesis is stupid. I don't think any technology in the universe ever can dynamically change DNA of living creatures to something completely different, but leaving the old form in tact. They should have all been killed during the process or went through serious mind breaking pain. But it makes the reapers go away without killing everyone in the process and allows the possibility of the relays to be rebuilt.

Saren was wrong about that pinnacle of evolution stuff and so is starbrat, evolution doesn't just stop, or that synthesis is some kind of "pinnacle"

Evolution never stops, period. Why would the need for furthing technology go away? It won't, there will always be science and research and curiostiy. If you take that away we are all just husks, machines and there is no more free will.

Synthesis is evil.

[waldstr18]

@tirian thorn

i grew up playing nintendo. and what did they teach me? save the princess, save the kingdom, save, save, rescue, rescue, self sacrife and so on.

i really thought about the decisions. so there we have red. kill. would be not that bad, but all synthetics? geth, edi? (no matter if edi dies or not, he said all synthetics and thats the information i have to work with). then green, rewriting all being. pretentious. what gives me the right to do that? im not god (if there is one), i cant decide which direction evolution should take. so, that leaves me with blue. control. since they are already controlled in the first place, i dont find it that unethical to take control myself and tell them do not kill. since im a nintendo kid im pretty sure i wont turn to the dark side. and if i do maybe the next shepard will visit me in the next citadel and i let him decide then.

if all options are bad you have to choose the lesser evil. (thats also what i liked about the choices. they all suck.)

[Simon_Says]

waldstr18 wrote...

@tirian thorn

i grew up playing nintendo. and what did they teach me? save the princess, save the kingdom, save, save, rescue, rescue, self sacrife and so on.

i really thought about the decisions. so there we have red. kill. would be not that bad, but all synthetics? geth, edi? (no matter if edi dies or not, he said all synthetics and thats the information i have to work with). then green, rewriting all being. pretentious. what gives me the right to do that? im not god (if there is one), i cant decide which direction evolution should take. so, that leaves me with blue. control. since they are already controlled in the first place, i dont find it that unethical to take control myself and tell them do not kill. since im a nintendo kid im pretty sure i wont turn to the dark side. and if i do maybe the next shepard will visit me in the next citadel and i let him decide then.

if all options are bad you have to choose the lesser evil. (thats also what i liked about the choices. they all suck.)

LISTEN TO YOURSELF! YOU'RE-YOU'RE INDOCTRINATED!

[EpyonX3]

balance5050 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

This cycle already had laws in place to prevent AI creation before the reapers, it didn't stop them before and it won't stop them now.

People are going to keep advancing technology because that just how evolution works. We're still going to create full synthetics to be our servants and do our bidding again.

"this cycle will remember the reapers", eventually they will become the stuff of legend and society will forget.

You don't think that anyone will just replace they organic parts with synthetic parts?

Again, wars started because people have free will and other peopel want to stifle  that, There will never be peace.

The Krogans can already live for a 1000 years.

Synthesis literally solves nothing, and is a silly idea to begin with because it would only be possible through space magic. Out of all the billions of undiscovered planets, not every organic in the galaxy would have been touched.

This cycle also denied the reapers existence until now. But you're right, laws will be broken eventually.

If we take the Catalysts words as truth, then there is no further evolution after Synthesis. The need for advancing technology is gone. Also, it's possible that the material we'd use for making synthetics would be made of this hybrid dna.

The reapers won't be forgotten since they're still around. I don't see them just leaving the galaxy and never returning. Especially if they want to keep the peace.

It might not be as simple. It's not really about being half organs and half robotics. The DNA itself is synthetic and organic. Each part of the dna is dependent on each other.

The Krogan living 1000 years before synthesis were already a problem then. Synthesis wouldn't change much.


I agree that Synthesis is stupid. I don't think any technology in the universe ever can dynamically change DNA of living creatures to something completely different, but leaving the old form in tact. They should have all been killed during the process or went through serious mind breaking pain. But it makes the reapers go away without killing everyone in the process and allows the possibility of the relays to be rebuilt.

Saren was wrong about that pinnacle of evolution stuff and so is starbrat, evolution doesn't just stop, or that synthesis is some kind of "pinnacle"

Evolution never stops, period. Why would the need for furthing technology go away? It won't, there will always be science and research and curiostiy. If you take that away we are all just husks, machines and there is no more free will.

Synthesis is evil.

Good point.

But this is why I still believe Synthesis is a blend of Paragon and Renegade.

The reapers stop killing people stop dieing and everyone can live happily ever after as cyborgs. But there are implications like the ones you mentioned and the fact that it was done against their will, much like what the reapers were doing in the first place.

[Eli Parker]

EpyonX3 wrote...

*snip*

I agree but in this case their deaths were three years ago and they chose, somewhat, to do what it took to keep the reapers from winning.

At first when I played the demo, I thought the kid was part of Shepards imagination. This is what led me to believe IT when I first say it. I thought this was Shepard as a child, since he may have been recreating his checkered past due to the reaper invasion.

I was hoping before ME3 was released that this was the case and he was going crazy or have PTSD symptoms. That clearly wasn't the case.

Yea I understand that Kaidan/Ash chose their deaths for the greater good. 

When I first played the demo, I played as a Male Shep and I thought the kid was Shep when he was young and it was a way for him to lose his mind. I then played with femShep and the kid was there, then I was wondering why is the kid there and is he messing with Shep's mind.

[waldstr18]

Simon_Says wrote...

waldstr18 wrote...

@tirian thorn

i grew up playing nintendo. and what did they teach me? save the princess, save the kingdom, save, save, rescue, rescue, self sacrife and so on.

i really thought about the decisions. so there we have red. kill. would be not that bad, but all synthetics? geth, edi? (no matter if edi dies or not, he said all synthetics and thats the information i have to work with). then green, rewriting all being. pretentious. what gives me the right to do that? im not god (if there is one), i cant decide which direction evolution should take. so, that leaves me with blue. control. since they are already controlled in the first place, i dont find it that unethical to take control myself and tell them do not kill. since im a nintendo kid im pretty sure i wont turn to the dark side. and if i do maybe the next shepard will visit me in the next citadel and i let him decide then.

if all options are bad you have to choose the lesser evil. (thats also what i liked about the choices. they all suck.)

LISTEN TO YOURSELF! YOU'RE-YOU'RE INDOCTRINATED!

i would have loved for your theory to be real - no, really. cause like you guys said before, it would have been ingenious. also i dont mind getting fooled.

[Unschuld]

Unschuld wrote...

Funny thing is that Indoc theory is built on a litany of circumstantial evidence collected from clues given in all three games. Its opponents constantly claim that the theorists are grasping at straws, interpreting bugs and irrelevant information as proof for the theory that isn't really there. Whenever they find any tiny bit of circumstantial evidence that *might* contradict it, they vehemently claim that Indoc theory has been "blown out of the water" and "proven false" yet again. Yet, when some Bioware employee posts something that might support Indoctrination, they say that Bioware is just lying again. Does anyone else see the hypocrisy in this?

What Gamble said in the tweet is not concrete evidence either way. He stated an opinion. Depending on how you interpret it, Gamble himself might be "indoctrinated" and actually helping the theory. All of this, on both sides, is still just conjecture at this point and BOTH camps would be foolish to take it as otherwise.

Personally, I think it would be brilliant if the entire Bioware staff had been "indoctrinated". We'll see.

[Tirian Thorn]

Simon_Says wrote...

waldstr18 wrote...

@tirian thorn

i grew up playing nintendo. and what did they teach me? save the princess, save the kingdom, save, save, rescue, rescue, self sacrife and so on.

i really thought about the decisions. so there we have red. kill. would be not that bad, but all synthetics? geth, edi? (no matter if edi dies or not, he said all synthetics and thats the information i have to work with). then green, rewriting all being. pretentious. what gives me the right to do that? im not god (if there is one), i cant decide which direction evolution should take. so, that leaves me with blue. control. since they are already controlled in the first place, i dont find it that unethical to take control myself and tell them do not kill. since im a nintendo kid im pretty sure i wont turn to the dark side. and if i do maybe the next shepard will visit me in the next citadel and i let him decide then.

if all options are bad you have to choose the lesser evil. (thats also what i liked about the choices. they all suck.)

LISTEN TO YOURSELF! YOU'RE-YOU'RE INDOCTRINATED!

LOL.  Except not by the Reapers.  Nintendo has him.... 

[Jadebaby]

I took a break from this thread for a couple of weeks, and it's grown 500+ pages lol..

Just thought I'd chime in and shout "INDOCTRINATION FTW!"

Youtube the 2nd dream, Shepard is not sleeping and is IN FACT standing up with a datapad in his/her hand... Dream 2 is a hallucination, not a dream.

[waldstr18]

@tirian thorn

they really do. i cant help it. i cant.. i cant!! .. picking up the wii mote hitting myself in the head.

[MaximizedAction]

Unschuld wrote...

Unschuld wrote...

Funny thing is that Indoc theory is built on a litany of circumstantial evidence collected from clues given in all three games. Its opponents constantly claim that the theorists are grasping at straws, interpreting bugs and irrelevant information as proof for the theory that isn't really there. Whenever they find any tiny bit of circumstantial evidence that *might* contradict it, they vehemently claim that Indoc theory has been "blown out of the water" and "proven false" yet again. Yet, when some Bioware employee posts something that might support Indoctrination, they say that Bioware is just lying again. Does anyone else see the hypocrisy in this?

What Gamble said in the tweet is not concrete evidence either way. He stated an opinion. Depending on how you interpret it, Gamble himself might be "indoctrinated" and actually helping the theory. All of this, on both sides, is still just conjecture at this point and BOTH camps would be foolish to take it as otherwise.

Personally, I think it would be brilliant if the entire Bioware staff had been "indoctrinated". We'll see.

Implications...intriguing!

This sounds far fetched...what would Bioware gain from acting that way? It's not like ME3 is an ... interactive ... story... 'motherofgod.jpg'

Modifié par MaximizedAction, 26 avril 2012 - 06:15 .

[Tirian Thorn]

Simon_Says wrote...

Earthborn_Shepard wrote...

Another, maybe very subtle hint: What does Shep do in the last dream? Right, he embraces the kid and then smiles (creepily. Wait, does that word exist?). And what is one of Harbingers favourite lines?

"EMBRACE PERFECTION."

"WE ARE YOUR GENETIC DESINTY" anyone?

The reapers say a lot of things.
Like
 “we are each a nation unto ourselves.”
“We have no beginning and no end.”
“You cannot fathom of purpose.” 
“You represent chaos. We represent order.” 
 
Then star brat comes across and says he controls the reapers (effectively saying he created them) and explains their purpose in two sentences. 
Either the reapers are dumb as **** and didn’t realize organics could think or something’s fishy with that kid.   

[Earthborn_Shepard]

Jade8aby88 wrote...
Youtube the 2nd dream, Shepard is not sleeping and is IN FACT standing up with a datapad in his/her hand... Dream 2 is a hallucination, not a dream.

Another weird thing about the dreams.. why would the star child sometimes be laughing/look menacing (in the 3rd dream)? If it was just a nightmare induced by feelings of guilt, wouldn't Shep just see the child die again and again? But in the 3rd dream, at the ending the kid looks really - satisfied.. in an evil way...

[Tirian Thorn]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

I took a break from this thread for a couple of weeks, and it's grown 500+ pages lol..

Just thought I'd chime in and shout "INDOCTRINATION FTW!"

Youtube the 2nd dream, Shepard is not sleeping and is IN FACT standing up with a datapad in his/her hand... Dream 2 is a hallucination, not a dream.

Looks to me like Shepard was sitting in bed and dozzed off. 

[IronSabbath88]

Alright, this has to be said.

BioWare is doing everything possible to make the ending seem literal while NEVER outright denying the IT. They mentioned it once and they haven't mentioned it again. Here they are giving us all these little hints that literal ending is the way to go.

Well, that kinda spoils the EC doesn't it?

I think it's clear what's happening here. They're trying to get people to avoid IT at all costs, and it's working in a lot of cases.