57139 réponses à ce sujet

[llbountyhunter]

oooooh, look at this tweet...

https://twitter.com/...619323212070912

[DJBare]

llbountyhunter wrote...

oooooh, look at this tweet...

https://twitter.com/...619323212070912

Inb4 the sh*t storm.

[estebanus]

waldstr18 wrote...

StElmo wrote...

Has anyone examined star child (with photoshop) to see if he really smiles during the control and synthesis endings?

Curious because that could be some compelling evidence right there.

what would be so compelling about that? maybe he just likes shepard choosing the paragon option.

not that im saying he is smiling, which he isnt. but its no evidence either way.

I still don't see how embracing your worst enemy's philosophy and morals is paragon!

That's full-on renegade by definition!

[Lakeshow1986]

I thought she wasn't going to talk about the ending? I get the impression she really does but with the bombardment of tweets that will twist what she says it's really hard.

[llbountyhunter]

llbountyhunter wrote...

the thread is slowing down..... ok then.

does anyone think there might be a link in the reapers and the thorian? I mean they both have a sort of "indoctrination" thing going on, and when you go back to the colony you have to fight several waves of "thorian husks" also the thorian indoctrination lasts even after it died.

opinions?

[estebanus]

llbountyhunter wrote...

oooooh, look at this tweet...

https://twitter.com/...619323212070912

Oh... my god...

faith in indoctrination theory= HARDENED!!!

[Simon_Says]

Auralius Carolus wrote...

My first playthrough I was so stupified by what I was experiencing that I just gravitated toward Control because it was blue. I wanted to destroy, but by the time I was close enough to see what it was, Shepard went on autopilot and I couldn't get away, (an odd mechanic).

Remember what we heard about the original plans for indoctrination? They didn't implement it because it would have clashed too much?

Except that, in control and synthesis, you walk up to the choice and then you're placed on autopilot. In control however, you have to initiate the choice manually. Sure you can't move once the choice is 'locked in' but it's Shepard's/The Player's tigger/mouse clicks that actually trigger the destuction ending. Shepard also regains their strength and stride when they/the player starts taking action on their own.

HellishFiend wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

Is
it weird that any time I read the word "Besides," anywhere I
immediately start reading anything following in The Illusive Man's
voice? Too much ME2 I think o_o

Martin Sheen as the Illusive Man could be the narrator of my life and I'd never get tired of it. 

Also,
I'm eagerly awaiting the day when I'll be in a situation where I can dramatically gesture with my hand and exclaim "But I can!" to somebody. God I love that line. So much emotion and story in just those three words.

It's really only because of Sheen's performance that I'd be willing to let that final scene be canon and not a dream sequence. I'll be mighty pissed if that "But I can" line becomes some sort of meme. You know it has the potential.

And yes, I find the lack of TIM's theme or some twisted version of it playing during that scene to be mighty suspicious. Anyone care to analyze the track that actually plays and see if Bioware possibly pulled an Inception Bwom Bwom?

Dwailing wrote...

Well, it looks like waldstr18 has been gone for 13 hours.  I think I can return safely.  Anything happen while I was gone?

waldstr18 wrote...

nothing too interesting

Uh, I was there when you two had your thing, remember? Just get a room and work it out.

Modifié par Simon_Says, 27 avril 2012 - 03:59 .

[waldstr18]

estebanus wrote...

waldstr18 wrote...

StElmo wrote...

Has anyone examined star child (with photoshop) to see if he really smiles during the control and synthesis endings?

Curious because that could be some compelling evidence right there.

what would be so compelling about that? maybe he just likes shepard choosing the paragon option.

not that im saying he is smiling, which he isnt. but its no evidence either way.

I still don't see how embracing your worst enemy's philosophy and morals is paragon!

That's full-on renegade by definition!

actually it isnt. shepard never said controlling was bad, she only said: cant be done. now that it can be, its the best option.

[Uncle Jo]

Tirian Thorn wrote...



It was just something I was kicking around in my head. The Mule was explaining how the mental change was like a dial that he could set inside someone’s head. It didn’t affect their cognitive function, just their loyalty to the Mule. They could not turn against him. 
Now with Indoctrination, the individual could turn away but it is an extreme act of will that is brief. Benezia wanted to die rather than return to the Indoctrinated state. Saren & TIM will kill themselves if you’re able to get to that conversation point. 
Indoctrination is subtle and insidious. The Cerberus personnel on the derelict reaper are a great reference for how Indoctrination works on large groups at once.  

Indeed there's a lot to say about the Indoc process. Insidious is for me the best definition. It's like a cancer, once you discover it, it's in most of the case already too late.
It's different and more subtle from the Thorian who's using pain to control...
I'm far away from being the Indoc-expert, but I think the basical postulate of Indoc is to implement the simple idea that the Reapers are right (after weakening your ability to distinguish reality and illusion). The principle of Inception..
You have to follow them whatever they do, because it's for the greater good of everyone.... This can work for weak-minded people.
For the stronger ones they appeal to logic (Saren) or ego (TIM). They try slowly but steadily to either persuade them that any fight is futile with zero chance of winning or give the illusion that they actually be controlled if you're strong enough... It's a long run with chances of failure (organics are pretty unpredictable) but worth it...
If Shepard would side with them it would have made Earth an easy prey, not to talk about the cohesion of the Allied Forces...

Btw I really don't know if I'm wrong, but I recall that at some point in ME3 some one talked about the Reapers inviting the leaders of Earth to "discussions/negociations" in order to cease fire... Maybe I just hallucinated...

Modifié par Uncle Jo, 27 avril 2012 - 04:02 .

[DJBare]

estebanus wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

oooooh, look at this tweet...

https://twitter.com/...619323212070912

Oh... my god...

faith in indoctrination theory= HARDENED!!!

I would not really say that, but it does bring to question the synthesis ending which some players believe is the best ending.

[estebanus]

llbountyhunter wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

the thread is slowing down..... ok then.

does anyone think there might be a link in the reapers and the thorian? I mean they both have a sort of "indoctrination" thing going on, and when you go back to the colony you have to fight several waves of "thorian husks" also the thorian indoctrination lasts even after it died.

opinions?

Fact is: the thorian has been around since the protheans, I think, if not longer.

It would be pretty plausible that the thorian may have learned some of the reapers' tactics when they decided to attack Feros, it may even have learned through interaction with an indoctrinated prothean!

[Simon_Says]

estebanus wrote...

I still don't see how embracing your worst enemy's philosophy and morals is paragon!

That's full-on renegade by definition!

No it isn't. Both philosophies are based on sticking to your own principals.

Embracing your worst enemy's philosophy and morals? Hrm...

Codex: Reapers/Indoctrination

Reaper "indoctrination" is an insidious means of corrupting organic minds, "reprogramming" the brain through physical and psychological conditioning using electromagnetic fields, infrasonic and ultrasonic noise, and other subliminal methods. The Reaper's resulting control over the limbic system leaves the victim highly susceptible to its suggestions.

Organics undergoing indoctrination may complain of headaches and buzzing or ringing in their ears. As time passes, they have feelings of "being watched" and hallucinations of "ghostly" presences. Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signals, manifesting as "alien" voices in the mind.

Indoctrination can create perfect deep cover agents. A Reaper's "suggestions" can manipulate victims into betraying friends, trusting enemies, or viewing the Reaper itself with superstitious awe. Should a Reaper subvert a well-placed political or military leader, the resulting chaos can bring down nations.

Long-term physical effects of the manipulation are unsustainable. Higher mental functioning decays, ultimately leaving the victim a gibbering animal. Rapid indoctrination is possible, but causes this decay in days or weeks. Slow, patient indoctrination allows the thrall to last for months or years.

[waldstr18]

@simon_says

i have no problem with him. he just doesnt like me. i respect that.

[estebanus]

waldstr18 wrote...

estebanus wrote...

waldstr18 wrote...

StElmo wrote...

Has anyone examined star child (with photoshop) to see if he really smiles during the control and synthesis endings?

Curious because that could be some compelling evidence right there.

what would be so compelling about that? maybe he just likes shepard choosing the paragon option.

not that im saying he is smiling, which he isnt. but its no evidence either way.

I still don't see how embracing your worst enemy's philosophy and morals is paragon!

That's full-on renegade by definition!

actually it isnt. shepard never said controlling was bad, she only said: cant be done. now that it can be, its the best option.

You don't understand what I'm saying.

The illusive man wants to control the reapers. Your arch-nemesis in the 3rd game.
Those are his morals, that you refute during the whole game.

By choosing control, you embrace his philosophy and his morals, plus you betray your own motivations since the first game, which is to destroy the reapers.

using your enemies' own tactics= end justifies the means= renegade

refuting your enemies' tactics= end does NOT justify the means= paragon

See where I'm going?

[llbountyhunter]

estebanus wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

the thread is slowing down..... ok then.

does anyone think there might be a link in the reapers and the thorian? I mean they both have a sort of "indoctrination" thing going on, and when you go back to the colony you have to fight several waves of "thorian husks" also the thorian indoctrination lasts even after it died.

opinions?

Fact is: the thorian has been around since the protheans, I think, if not longer.

It would be pretty plausible that the thorian may have learned some of the reapers' tactics when they decided to attack Feros, it may even have learned through interaction with an indoctrinated prothean!

what if.... the thorian created the reapers!!?!?!?   

hear me out.... maybe it created the reapers by indoctrinaing gome organics th make them. also plants hate animals right? this could explain the vedetta....  

or not... but still.

[DJBare]

Forming an active link, select "... or use the standard form", then select "BBCode"
put links in the format shown below, (remove astericks)
[url*]https://twitter.com/#%21/JessicaMerizan/status/195619323212070912[/url*]
twitter.com/#%21/JessicaMerizan/status/195619323212070912

Modifié par DJBare, 27 avril 2012 - 04:03 .

[estebanus]

waldstr18 wrote...

@simon_says

i have no problem with him. he just doesnt like me. i respect that.

I have no personal quarrel with you. I just disagree with you.

I do however, respect your opinion.

If I made the assertion that I don't like you, I apologize, for that wasn't my intent.

[balance5050]

Does your save file record what choice you make at the end?

[estebanus]

llbountyhunter wrote...

estebanus wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

the thread is slowing down..... ok then.

does anyone think there might be a link in the reapers and the thorian? I mean they both have a sort of "indoctrination" thing going on, and when you go back to the colony you have to fight several waves of "thorian husks" also the thorian indoctrination lasts even after it died.

opinions?

Fact is: the thorian has been around since the protheans, I think, if not longer.

It would be pretty plausible that the thorian may have learned some of the reapers' tactics when they decided to attack Feros, it may even have learned through interaction with an indoctrinated prothean!

what if.... the thorian created the reapers!!?!?!?   

hear me out.... maybe it created the reapers by indoctrinaing gome organics th make them. also plants hate animals right? this could explain the vedetta....  

or not... but still.

Nah, I don't think so. The reapers have been in existence for at LEAST 37 million years, and I don't see how a plant could have lived that long.

[llbountyhunter]

estebanus wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

estebanus wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

the thread is slowing down..... ok then.

does anyone think there might be a link in the reapers and the thorian? I mean they both have a sort of "indoctrination" thing going on, and when you go back to the colony you have to fight several waves of "thorian husks" also the thorian indoctrination lasts even after it died.

opinions?

Fact is: the thorian has been around since the protheans, I think, if not longer.

It would be pretty plausible that the thorian may have learned some of the reapers' tactics when they decided to attack Feros, it may even have learned through interaction with an indoctrinated prothean!

what if.... the thorian created the reapers!!?!?!?   

hear me out.... maybe it created the reapers by indoctrinaing gome organics th make them. also plants hate animals right? this could explain the vedetta....  

or not... but still.

Nah, I don't think so. The reapers have been in existence for at LEAST 37 million years, and I don't see how a plant could have lived that long.

the the other thorians took in the reaper form or something and this one stayed behind? 

i dunno, Im just gessing here.

Modifié par llbountyhunter, 27 avril 2012 - 04:07 .

[Simon_Says]

balance5050 wrote...

Does your save file record what choice you make at the end?

I can't seem to find exactly where it was mentioned but yes. Someone found that three plot flags are triggered in the save file made after you've chosen destroy. But none if you picked either control or synthesis. The flags point to nowhere, yet, and I don't think anyone else confirmed this, but it's something.

[DJBare]

balance5050 wrote...

Does your save file record what choice you make at the end?

I assume it's the one called "LegendSave"; extension is ".pcsav" on the pc version.

[StElmo]

social.bioware.com/1968682/polls/32999/

[estebanus]

llbountyhunter wrote...

estebanus wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

estebanus wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

the thread is slowing down..... ok then.

does anyone think there might be a link in the reapers and the thorian? I mean they both have a sort of "indoctrination" thing going on, and when you go back to the colony you have to fight several waves of "thorian husks" also the thorian indoctrination lasts even after it died.

opinions?

Fact is: the thorian has been around since the protheans, I think, if not longer.

It would be pretty plausible that the thorian may have learned some of the reapers' tactics when they decided to attack Feros, it may even have learned through interaction with an indoctrinated prothean!

what if.... the thorian created the reapers!!?!?!?   

hear me out.... maybe it created the reapers by indoctrinaing gome organics th make them. also plants hate animals right? this could explain the vedetta....  

or not... but still.

Nah, I don't think so. The reapers have been in existence for at LEAST 37 million years, and I don't see how a plant could have lived that long.

the the other thorians took in the reaper form or something and this one stayed behind? 

i dunno, Im just gessing here.

I don't know, but that just seems like grasping after emergency induction ports rather than anything else.

[Humakt83]

DJBare wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

oooooh, look at this tweet...

https://twitter.com/...619323212070912

Inb4 the sh*t storm.

While I support IT, I do not think that proves anything in either way. Merizan is hardly a palpable source of information.