57139 réponses à ce sujet

[Unschuld]

IsaacShep wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

If IT turns out to be true

Urhm, yeah. IF. And most know it won't happen anyway

People who "know" IT is either true or false honestly don't know anything at all.

[DirtyPhoenix]

Wow I'm on the list too. I'm touched :s

[shepskisaac]

balance5050 wrote...

Actually most people don't KNOW anything concerning the EC, hence the speculation. So just sit back and watch history unfold, ok?

There won't be any history unfolding for this thread if EC comes out and confirms IT is just a fun fan conspiracy theory lol

Can't wait for EC

[balance5050]

Icinix wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

I do still feel like we are becoming part of video gaming history by being involved with this topic.

???

As it stands, this is already one of the biggest controversies in gaming history. If IT turns out to be Bioware's plan all along (and they can prove that it was), well...... (Councilor Valern, lol)

Needless to say, it will be talked about perhaps indefinitely and journalized into history, and this huge forum spectacle we have going on here (along with the Charity drive, retake movement, etc) is a big part of that, and will be mentioned in said journalization. If IT turns out to be true, we'll be able to take pride in the fact that we were part of the group that figured it out. 

It was also be a defining moment in video game history where the complete game can only be obtained through an internet connection months after the game has been completed. I don't believe any game has tried to do that before.

Complete game? Is any Mass Effect game "complete" without it's respective DLC? Not for me!

Also, Prince of Persia (2008), Final Fantasy 13-2, and Asura's Wrath are all games that have their endings/prologue in DLC form.


EDIT: Is Fallout 3 "complete" without Broken Steel?

Modifié par balance5050, 01 mai 2012 - 03:03 .

[balance5050]

IsaacShep wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Actually most people don't KNOW anything concerning the EC, hence the speculation. So just sit back and watch history unfold, ok?

There won't be any history unfolding for this thread if EC comes out and confirms IT is just a fun fan conspiracy theory lol

Can't wait for EC

ME TOO!

[shepskisaac]

balance5050 wrote...
ME TOO!

Glad we're on the same page Unfortunately one of us will be disappinted

[Arbalor4]

Arian Dynas wrote...

byne - Indoctrinationist 
lex0r11 - Indoctrinationist 
GBGriffin - Literalist Apologist
Ilbountyhunter - Indoctrinationist
estebanus - Indoctrinationist 
Earthborn_Shepard - Indoctrinationist
ExtendedCut - Indoctrinationist
Golferguy758 - Indoctrinationist
Simon_Says - Indoctrinationist
HellishFiend - Indoctrinationist
spotlessvoid - Indoctrinationist
Tirian Thorn - Indoctrinationist
Emperor_Ike - Indoctrinationist
Sero303 - Indoctrinationist
IronSabbath88 - Indoctrinationist
BatmanTurian - Indoctrinationist
Uncle Jo - Indoctrinationist Cynic
Rastlin Majare 1992 - Indoctrinationist
Dwailing - Indoctrinationist
MaximizedAction - Indoctrinationist
Balance5050 - Indoctrinationist
JadeBaby88 - Indoctrinationist
DJBare - Indoctrinationist Cynic
gunslinger_ruiz - Indoctrinationist
n00bsauce2012 - Indoctrinationist
Unschuld - Indoctrinationist
Big G13 - Indoctrinationist
Hawk227 - Indoctrinationist
protognosis - Indoctrinationist
Domanese - Indoctrinationist
schneeland - Indoctrinationist
Rifneno - Indoctrinationist
Nauks - Indoctrinationist Cynic
Asharad Hett - Indoctrinationist
Megumi Azusa - Indoctrinationist Cynic
NotAnotherDisplayName - Indoctrinationist Cynic
EpyonX3 - Indoctrinationist Cynic
Sammuthegreat - Indoctrinationist 
Vahilor - Indoctrinationist Cynic
marcelo_sdk - Nonpartisan
kyg_20X6 - Literalist
bigstig - Indoctrinationist
Big Bad - Indoctrinationist
Auralius Carolus - Indoctrinationist
TheConstantOne - Indoctrinationist
Gormane01 - Indoctrinationist
liggy002 - Indoctrinationist
Beast919 - Indoctrinationist
NeoDobby - Indoctrinationist
SubAstris - Literalist (get over it you hippie)
Arashi08 - Indoctrinationist
Phydeaux314 - Nonpartisan
MrRiadon - Indoctrinationist
Teddie Sage - Indoctrinationist
Eumerin - Indoctrinationist Cynic
AxisEvolve - Indoctrinationist
galaxy366 - Indoctrinationist
Dranume - Indoctrinationist
Revan67 - Nonpartisan
Sajuro - Nonpartisan
Luigitornado - Virtualist
Sereaph502 - Indoctrinationist
Nerana - Nonpartisan
Xellith - Nonpartisan
Foulpancake - Nonpartisan
Doomhams - Indoctrinationist
raeting - Literalist
KingNothin125 - Indoctrinationist
Serp86 - Indoctrinationist
AgentB406 - Indoctrinationist
Kirkknight - Indoctrinationist
Nobrandminda - Nonpartisan
AlCord - Nonpartisan
Aligalipe - Indoctrinationist
Gam3Ov3r - Indoctrinationist
ragewin - Indoctrinationist
movieguyabw - Literalist
Davnort - Indoctrinationist
Militarized - Literalist
FugitiveMind - Nonpartisan
Dr.Detective - Literalist
ibage - Literalist
M U P P 3 T Z - Nonpartisan
Asuka Bianchi - Indoctrinationist
Lord Nikon 001 - Indoctrinationist
SoulfulMiles - Indoctrinationist
Greed1914 - Indoctrinationist
Unender - Indoctrinationist
The Chosen Predator - Indoctrinationist
X-Frame - Indoctrinationist
kalamity116 - Nonpartisan
littleork - Indoctrinationist
XenoAlbedo - Indoctrinationist
John Locke N7 - Indoctrinationist
idunhaveaname - Nonpartisan
Adugan - Literalist
Odd Bet - Indoctrinationist
k8ee - Indoctrinationist
Stephanid98 - Indoctrinationist
CBGB - Indoctrinationist
RedDeadRemix
Manou1 - Indoctrinationist
iSpitfireee - Indoctrinationist
yummysoap - Literalist
Merc3ast - Indoctrinationist
Sundance31us - Indoctrinationist
Humanoid_Typhon - Literalist

And, in addition, heroes we've forgotten; Beast919, First compiler of evidence, Eumerin, first Cynic to present a solid argument, Dranume, first to add evidence to the argument, following byne.

There's the first wave of names, I managed to get to page 5, page 6 and beyond are being worked on, and will be expanded, als includes anyone whom popped into my head while I was working on this. This'll take a while for our memorial, but feel free to chip in if you like.

Dont forget me Ive been lurking in the shadows all this time:bandit:

[Icinix]

balance5050 wrote...

Icinix wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

I do still feel like we are becoming part of video gaming history by being involved with this topic.

???

As it stands, this is already one of the biggest controversies in gaming history. If IT turns out to be Bioware's plan all along (and they can prove that it was), well...... (Councilor Valern, lol)

Needless to say, it will be talked about perhaps indefinitely and journalized into history, and this huge forum spectacle we have going on here (along with the Charity drive, retake movement, etc) is a big part of that, and will be mentioned in said journalization. If IT turns out to be true, we'll be able to take pride in the fact that we were part of the group that figured it out. 

It was also be a defining moment in video game history where the complete game can only be obtained through an internet connection months after the game has been completed. I don't believe any game has tried to do that before.

Complete game? Is any Mass Effect game "complete" without it's respective DLC? Not for me!

Also, Prince of Persia (2008), Final Fantasy 13-2, and Asura's Wrath are all games that have their endings/prologue in DLC form.

Yeah complete game was probably the wrong term, I meant planned ending.

Didn't realise there were other games the had endings planned as seperate pieces! Well there you go! Not a defining moment for a video game then.

[balance5050]

IsaacShep wrote...

balance5050 wrote...
ME TOO!

Glad we're on the same page Unfortunately one of us will be disappinted

Even if it's not I.T. I'm sure Bioware will have something awesome lined up, I don't become dissapointed very easily. I'm a naturally happy dude.

[llbountyhunter]

HellishFiend wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

your basing your causualties on previous reaper confrontations, confrontations in which we were NOT organized and fighting as one. the battle of swords is the only such confrontation. it is also the only battle were we see that the majority of the causalties being on the reaper side.

Yes, I'm basing my casualties on previous reaper confrontations, but you're attacking one aspect of the problem when there is a far bigger picture going on (hence why I chose the bacteria/virus analogy instead of a tank/infantry analogy. I think our difference in analogies is very indicative of the difference in our mentality when approaching the issue).

Lets assume for a moment that you're right, that the Reaper capital ships can be defeated conventionally (and you'll never convince me that is possible based on the evidence we have available), what about the destroyers? What about indoctrinated agents? What about ground forces? What if the Reapers get smart, and resort to guerilla tactics or some other strategy that would capitalize on their technological superiority? What if they do what they did in previous cycles and deactivate the mass relays?

You get the idea....

Im not sure  I follow.... your asking me "what of the reapers keep doing what there already doing?"

and we have destroyed several capital ships conventionally... already. im not trying to "convince you" it has already happened.

[HellishFiend]

Icinix wrote...

Yeah complete game was probably the wrong term, I meant planned ending.

Didn't realise there were other games the had endings planned as seperate pieces! Well there you go! Not a defining moment for a video game then.

I dont know the full story behind those other DLC endings, but the impression I get from what I do know is that they were all paid DLC, none of them were planned (someone correct me if I'm wrong), and none of them involved any kind of significant twist that caused this much speculation and debate. 

[HellishFiend]

llbountyhunter wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

your basing your causualties on previous reaper confrontations, confrontations in which we were NOT organized and fighting as one. the battle of swords is the only such confrontation. it is also the only battle were we see that the majority of the causalties being on the reaper side.

Yes, I'm basing my casualties on previous reaper confrontations, but you're attacking one aspect of the problem when there is a far bigger picture going on (hence why I chose the bacteria/virus analogy instead of a tank/infantry analogy. I think our difference in analogies is very indicative of the difference in our mentality when approaching the issue).

Lets assume for a moment that you're right, that the Reaper capital ships can be defeated conventionally (and you'll never convince me that is possible based on the evidence we have available), what about the destroyers? What about indoctrinated agents? What about ground forces? What if the Reapers get smart, and resort to guerilla tactics or some other strategy that would capitalize on their technological superiority? What if they do what they did in previous cycles and deactivate the mass relays?

You get the idea....

Im not sure  I follow.... your asking me "what of the reapers keep doing what there already doing?"

and we have destroyed several capital ships conventionally... already. im not trying to "convince you" it has already happened.

You're trying to convince me that the allied forces stand a chance of outright winning the war against the Reapers through nothing but conventional means. And it sounds like we're at the point where we're just going to have to agree to disagree.....

[lex0r11]

Big G13 wrote...

lex0r11 wrote...

Hey guys, it's 04:40 over here and it's International Workers' Day.

Sooooo, just read my name on a list.. awesome! What happened in here?
Oh, second on the list.

*manly tears*

Sorry, I'm useless right now.

You Euros. Nothing but vacation for you guys. (got an extra room. I'd like to move)

Come on, I'm still an American!

[shepskisaac]

balance5050 wrote...

Even if it's not I.T. I'm sure Bioware will have something awesome lined up, I don't become dissapointed very easily. I'm a naturally happy dude.

On that I agree. I believe epilogue scenes (even if they're just slides), fixed Normandy plothole, expanded Catalyst convo with more clear answers + War Assets showed in the final mission would already make the ending good. And I expect to see all of the things I mentioned in it anyway.

[Arian Dynas]

 [quote]Big G13 wrote...

[quote]llbountyhunter wrote...

[quote]DJBare wrote...

[quote]Auralius Carolus wrote...

[quote]Big G13 wrote...

That and the new audio find. That was a good find. [/quote]

What audio file? I don't recall an audio file, except the one from this track: www.youtube.com/watch

I do believe I was being trolled with that one, but it's hard to be certain. [/quote]

I think they mean this audio www.youtube.com/watch

[/quote]

to be honest ididnt hear the gunshots.... actually  they remind of lightsabres.... [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/unsure.png[/smilie]

[/quote]True enough. But if you go with Arian Dynes version of a pro IDT cinematic I could defiantly see the use of an audio fade from that sound to gun fire as Shepard wakes up from the hallucination.[/quote]

Indeed, very cinematic 

[quote]Rifneno wrote...

[quote]balance5050 wrote...

Ok ok, the chances of the reapers being beat using conventional means are extremely small, but can we agree that the chances DO EXIST on some level?[/quote]

I don't see how. The difference in both offensive and defensive power is simply far, far too great to overcome with conventional means. Is it possible this cycle could cost them more Reapers than any previous cycle? Absolutely. But I don't see how victory is feasible.

People often cite cases like US vs. Vietnam or USSR vs. Afghanistan as examples of how a much weaker military can overcome a far superior one. Enough that I figure I should get this one out of the way immediately. It's not applicable here. Not just because the military power difference is many times greater but because the Reapers are fully in this. The US and USSR weren't destroyed in those wars, they simply got burned enough to take their hands off the stove. They did not throw their entire military into the effort and they certainly did not use every possible means to destroy their opposition. They could have simply dropped hydrogen bombs on those countries and completely annihilated them. But destruction wasn't the goal, conquest was, and that was a much taller order. The Reapers' goal is in fact destruction. They harvest when opportune but they don't hesitate to kill millions at a time when necessary.[/quote]

We doe have a hope, a VERY faint hope, conventionally, Guerilla warfare. Go Quarian Commando on them, build liveships for our people to live in, spread out across the galaxy and keep moving, killing a Reaper here, a Reaper there until it's too costly for them and they retreat. What people forget is no matter WHAT the Reaper's motivations are, they aren't going to endanger their military power, and by extension, the next cycle. A Pyrrhic victory is NOT a Victory for them.

Remember, our destruction isn't really the Reaper's goals (we're assuming Harbinger/the Guardian is lying through his luminescent teeth) reproduction is.

But the fact is, as you yourself cited, 4 dreadnoughts with heavy, kinetic mass accelerators CAN kill a Sovereign class Reaper, and they fare even better than that with Thanix series weapons. We've killed them with nukes, taken advantage of their hubris, outmanuvered them. The thing is, we're considerably better organized than the Afganis or the Viet Cong, which is something we can take advantage of, it's part of why they use indoctrination at all, they literally break apart militiaries with it. Thessia proved quite well, the Reapers can't really defeat Hit and Run geurilla warefare, in fact it inflicts telling losses, with minimal ones for ours.

Want a more relatable example? THE AMERICAN REVOLOUTIONARY WAR. Keep the enemy busy elsewhere, hit him hard here, hit him soft there, maybe you take a few losses, but eventually you just make it too costly for him to keep fighting, because in a CYCLE,  the loss of ONE (count them) ONE Sovereign class is a loss the Reapers cannot afford. We're clocking somehere around 50 already.


[quote]BatmanTurian wrote...

[quote]Arian Dynas wrote...

[quote]Dwailing wrote...
*snip*
Arian!  You're back! (obviously [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/wink.png[/smilie])  Would you kindly repost your new version of the after endings sequence?

[/quote]

Ye asketh and ye shall receive.

[quote]Arian Dynas wrote...

A brand new re-write, just for you people.
Here's with all my love to you guys. Credit to Rastlin and BatmanTurian for ideas.

*snip*
[/quote]
[/quote]

Wait, where did any of my ideas come in? I'm confused.[smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/pouty.png[/smilie]
[/quote] 

You inspired the Shepard Reality scenes, and the Control being an electical cable.

[quote]HellishFiend wrote...

Exactly. A lot of those things they just wouldnt do unless they were intentional. It's the same concept as the "law of conservation of detail" that gets brought up in this topic a lot. Even if the goal was to use as little manpower as possible to create those piles of corpses, the path of "least resistance" is still something far, far better than a low-res pile of ashley and kaiden corpses with jenkins' face!  [/quote]

Thank you.

[quote]HellishFiend wrote... 
Yep, the more you examine all the variables and contributing factors (literary devices, motivation, external factors like EA, fiscal years, etc), the more it makes sense that they would try/do something exactly like this. The only thing that makes it frustrating is that people who arent capable or willing to look beneath the surface just post a meme or make a generalized sarcastic remark in an attempt to make us look silly. 
[/quote]

"Remember, you cannot be both young and wise. Young people who pretend to be wise to the ways of the world are mostly just cynics. Cynicism masquerades as wisdom, but it is the farthest thing from it. Because cynics don't learn anything. Because cynicism is a self-imposed blindness, a rejection of the world, because we are afraid it will hurt us or disappoint us. Cynics always say no. But saying "yes" begins things. Saying "yes" is how things grow. Saying "yes" leads to knowledge. "Yes" is for young people. So for as long as you have the strength to, say "yes'."

-Stephen Colbert


[quote]HellishFiend wrote...  
It's getting to the point where I think some individuals in this topic enjoy going back and forth with the trolls as much as the trolls enjoy provoking them. I guess that makes it...mutual? Symbiotic? Either way I'm staying out of it....
[/quote]

It IS kinda fun...

[quote]Big G13 wrote...

[quote]llbountyhunter wrote...

soooo, who else just sits here hitting the reload button? [/quote]I do, I do. but only because I can't post fast enough. It would be great if time, distance,( and lets face it) safety would allow all of us to get in a room and discuss this face to face. That would be one hell of a party.[smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/happy.png[/smilie][/quote] 

I'd go, but all you ****ers better stay the hell away from my drink. I ain't gettin my short shorts run up no flagpole.

[quote]balance5050 wrote...

@Arian Dynas

Thanks for putting that list together! You are doing god's work sir.[/quote]

In that case, God had better get off his ass and do it himself. [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/happy.png[/smilie]

[quote]Icinix wrote...

[quote]HellishFiend wrote...

[quote]IsaacShep wrote...

[quote]HellishFiend wrote...

I do still feel like we are becoming part of video gaming history by being involved with this topic. [/quote]???
[/quote]

As it stands, this is already one of the biggest controversies in gaming history. If IT turns out to be Bioware's plan all along (and they can prove that it was), well...... (Councilor Valern, lol)

Needless to say, it will be talked about perhaps indefinitely and journalized into history, and this huge forum spectacle we have going on here (along with the Charity drive, retake movement, etc) is a big part of that, and will be mentioned in said journalization. If IT turns out to be true, we'll be able to take pride in the fact that we were part of the group that figured it out. 

[/quote]

It was also be a defining moment in video game history where the complete game can only be obtained through an internet connection months after the game has been completed. I don't believe any game has tried to do that before.

[/quote]

Plenty have, Asura's Wrath, most episode based games, ect.

But it WOULD mark the first time that it was used as a plot device, literally playing the player in an ARG. 

[quote]IsaacShep wrote...

[quote]balance5050 wrote...
ME TOO![smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/joyful.png[/smilie][/quote]Glad we're on the same page [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/devil.png[/smilie] Unfortunately one of us will be disappinted [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/devil.png[/smilie]
[/quote] 

Yes, I weep for how disappointed you will be Isaac.

[quote]Arbalor4 wrote...
*snip*
Dont forget me Ive been lurking in the shadows all this time[smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/bandit.png[/smilie]

[/quote] 

Don't worry, we won't forget ANYONE.

[quote]pirate1802 wrote...

Wow I'm on the list too. I'm touched :s[/quote]

Haven't gotten to you yet, but you'll get on there, give us time.  

[quote]lex0r11 wrote...

Hey guys, it's 04:40 over here and it's International Workers' Day. 

Sooooo, just read my name on a list.. awesome! What happened in here?
Oh, second on the list.

*manly tears*

Sorry, I'm useless right now. [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/lol.png[/smilie]
[/quote] 

No worries man, you deserve it. Going back form page 1911 I put every poster, as well as everyone from 1-5. I need help to do more of course.

Also, placement on the list (with the exception of byne.) does not indicate importance, but higher on the list DOES mean you are more regular here. And no, if you are above someone on the list it probably means I randomly shoved you into a roughly corresponding area to your regularity, not that you actually visit more often than the people on the list.

Oh, and the only poster whom I haven't added from those pages I listed, is me. I leave it to all of you to decide where I fit in.

[Unschuld]

IsaacShep wrote...There won't be any history unfolding for this thread if EC comes out and confirms IT is just a fun fan conspiracy theory lol

Can't wait for EC

Honestly even if Indoc theory turns out to be false, I'll still be much prouder knowing I was involved in calm, civil speculation about what the endings could have been (involving a central theme in all three games) rather than among the myriad of petulant children constantly spewing venom on the forums for months to no gain whatsoever.

[balance5050]

HellishFiend wrote...

Icinix wrote...

Yeah complete game was probably the wrong term, I meant planned ending.

Didn't realise there were other games the had endings planned as seperate pieces! Well there you go! Not a defining moment for a video game then.

I dont know the full story behind those other DLC endings, but the impression I get from what I do know is that they were all paid DLC, none of them were planned (someone correct me if I'm wrong), and none of them involved any kind of significant twist that caused this much speculation and debate. 

Prince of Persia had its prologue in DLC form, FF13-2 had "paradox endings" (The ending on disc created differing timelines or something) And Asura's Wrath purposefully  left their ending vague to sell the "true" ending at a later date.

The difference between Mass Effect and these is that Mass Effect did it in order to incorporate fan feedback, and that the EC DLC will be free.

[HellishFiend]

IsaacShep wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Even if it's not I.T. I'm sure Bioware will have something awesome lined up, I don't become dissapointed very easily. I'm a naturally happy dude.

On that I agree. I believe epilogue scenes (even if they're just slides), fixed Normandy plothole, expanded Catalyst convo with more clear answers + War Assets showed in the final mission would already make the ending good. And I expect to see all of the things I mentioned in it anyway.

Wait, so you think that what Bioware has said so far about the EC means theyre actually going to change the existing endings, but discounts the possibility of IT? *scratches head*

Lets get something straight. They have specifically said they will not confirm or deny IT. Thus, IT still stands a chance (a strong chance, IMO), of being true. They have also specifically said they will not change the existing endings. Thus, your idyllic EC stands no chance of being true.  No content added or subtracted to/from the scenes and dialog we already have. 

The only content we're getting will be taking place during, alongside, in addition to, or after the content we already have. It will not override or supercede what we already have. 

[Big G13]

lex0r11 wrote...

Big G13 wrote...

lex0r11 wrote...

Hey guys, it's 04:40 over here and it's International Workers' Day.

Sooooo, just read my name on a list.. awesome! What happened in here?
Oh, second on the list.

*manly tears*

Sorry, I'm useless right now.

You Euros. Nothing but vacation for you guys. (got an extra room. I'd like to move)

Come on, I'm still an American!

I know. But if you're working over there I assume you get the Euro styled mandatory vacation time. I'm just jealous, petty & jealous. Thats how I roll man.

[llbountyhunter]

HellishFiend wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

your basing your causualties on previous reaper confrontations, confrontations in which we were NOT organized and fighting as one. the battle of swords is the only such confrontation. it is also the only battle were we see that the majority of the causalties being on the reaper side.

Yes, I'm basing my casualties on previous reaper confrontations, but you're attacking one aspect of the problem when there is a far bigger picture going on (hence why I chose the bacteria/virus analogy instead of a tank/infantry analogy. I think our difference in analogies is very indicative of the difference in our mentality when approaching the issue).

Lets assume for a moment that you're right, that the Reaper capital ships can be defeated conventionally (and you'll never convince me that is possible based on the evidence we have available), what about the destroyers? What about indoctrinated agents? What about ground forces? What if the Reapers get smart, and resort to guerilla tactics or some other strategy that would capitalize on their technological superiority? What if they do what they did in previous cycles and deactivate the mass relays?

You get the idea....

Im not sure  I follow.... your asking me "what of the reapers keep doing what there already doing?"

and we have destroyed several capital ships conventionally... already. im not trying to "convince you" it has already happened.

You're trying to convince me that the allied forces stand a chance of outright winning the war against the Reapers through nothing but conventional means. And it sounds like we're at the point where we're just going to have to agree to disagree.....

can I try one last time? ok this is based on in-game evidence.

not unified= reapers win battle
unfied= we win battle
indoctrination= nobody gets unified.

this is all stuff we see with our own eyes- not making anything up here,

Modifié par llbountyhunter, 01 mai 2012 - 03:18 .

[DirtyPhoenix]

Well I saaw my name in the smaller list and got excited :|

[Rifneno]

Lokanaiya wrote...

I'm sure that if all races actually coordinated and were willing to do whatever's necessary to win, they'd have a fair chance of winning against the Reapers. Detonating mass relays, or at least the Earth one, would be a place to start. And didn't Thessia put up a pretty good fight because they used hit-and-run attacks instead of the standard "stay in one place and shoot" that we see in cutscenes? There are some possible methods of winning without the Crucible, but they'd be pretty difficult and would cost many lives.

I'm not saying the Crucible is the answer. In fact I'm fairly sure the damned thing is a Reaper trap. I posted my theory on means of defeating the Reapers a week or so ago, but it didn't seem too popular.

I'm not sure detonating mass relays would even kill the Reapers. It killed 300,000 batarians in a colony but batarians can't detect an explosion incoming and get the hell out of dodge at 500 times the speed of light. When characters in-game suggested destroying the relays, they merely suggested it as a means to slow down the Reapers' travel rather than to actually kill them in the blast. It's unlikely that the explosion would expand faster than Reapers can move at FTL. There's also the logistics of it. Ramming a plantoid into a relay takes a lot of set up and would be easy for the Reapers to stop. Honestly I think they'd be better off just building very high yield thermonuclear weapons. Reapers' best defenses are their kinetic barriers, which is why heat based weapons are the most effective against them. So there's a good reason Udina said that the Reapers' first targets on Earth were nuclear missile silos: nuclear weapons can kill Reapers.

llbountyhunter wrote...

to an extent. it wasnt so much about my anology as the idea behind it.

i mean why do the reapers seam so powerfull? because thats how they project themselvs, they WANT you to think theres no hope, that your facing an unstoppable enemy, to cause fractures from within. and while the reapers ARE very powerfull they do have there limits. the battle of swords proves that if you remaind organised and united the possiblity of a conveional win doesnt seem so remote anymore.

to sum up: to reapers seem unstoppable only because thats what they want you to think.

They use a myriad of tactics. Psychological warfare is just one of them. They really are overwhelmingly powerful on top of it. Sword proved nothing. Go watch it again. Even with the best setup, you see one capital ship lose a few tentacles. That's it. Hackett said himself that they cannot beat the Reapers in conventional warfare. It's simply not going to happen. Sword is only buying time to get the Crucible going. That's it. The task of holding an enemy off is very different than actually destroying that enemy. Also note that the bulk of the Reapers' forces are not at Earth. I don't know where that came from. Hell, we saw far more than that just in the shot at the end of ME2. The bulk of the galactic community's forces, however, may indeed be there. And just buying time is all they hope to do.

it is also the only battle were we see that the majority of the causalties being on the reaper side.

One capital ship losing a couple arms counts as a majority of casualties?!

[BatmanTurian]

Arian Dynas wrote...

BatmanTurian wrote...

Ye asketh and ye shall receive.

Arian Dynas wrote...

A brand new re-write, just for you people.
Here's with all my love to you guys. Credit to Rastlin and BatmanTurian for ideas.

*snip*

Wait, where did any of my ideas come in? I'm confused.[smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/pouty.png[/smilie]

 

You inspired the Shepard Reality scenes, and the Control being an electical cable.

oh! that makes sense. I'm glad you liked my idea! I wasn't sure anyone even read that because noone responded.

Modifié par BatmanTurian, 01 mai 2012 - 03:22 .

[HellishFiend]

llbountyhunter wrote...

can I try one last time? ok this is based on in-game evidence.

not unified= reapers win battle
unfied= we win battle
indoctrination= nobody gets unified.

this is all stuff we see with our own eyes- not making anything up here,

I think that unification gives the allied forces a chance to find *a way* to beat the Reapers. I will never be convinced that conventional warfare can become that means to total victory. Again you're using the word battle in a context where the only word that applies is "war". The allied forces are absolutely capable of winning battles, but I simply dont think that conventional victory in the war is a possibility, given all the circumstances. 

[shepskisaac]

HellishFiend wrote...

Wait, so you think that what Bioware has said so far about the EC means theyre actually going to change the existing endings, but discounts the possibility of IT? *scratches head*

None of the things I mentioned change the 3 existing endings (and their variations like Earth destroyed, devastated, intact etc)